Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    If he feels great and isn't hurt, then we have a very poor #2 starter.

     
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  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    Jon Lester is realizing that hes not a Power arm now and has to make the transition into a "pitcher", not a "thrower". That is usually not a smooth transition. He has 4 pitches and can make the transformation, but I wouldnt expect him to fully make it this year but I expect him to be better than he is right now. Pick up his option and see how it goes through next year and then make the decision on an extension. Lester still has it in him as he shut down the Jays potent lineup with a CG 1 hitter, so some patience will be needed.

    We will most likely be in the market for a starter this year regardless.

     
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  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    In response to darrylfries' comment:

    Lester is a tough cookie and looked better today than in his last outing.

    Looked to me like he threw too many strikes over the plate and his ball movement wasn't great . Didn't walk a batter and struck out 8 not all bad.   Consistantly hit 94 on the gun.

    For the folks who expcted him to be the Ace that's not likely.

    I agree some paitence is needed and I'm sure we'll be looking for another starter regardless.

     



    I agree.  It's hard to be happy over 5 ERs, but the 8/0 K/W is a vast improvement over the 22/18 K/W he gave us over the past 5 games.

     
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  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    In response to ConanObrien's comment:

    How many more players will ADG whine about?




    How many are left on the roster that he hast started a thread about?

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from RSF4Life234. Show RSF4Life234's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    In response to ConanObrien's comment:

     

    How many more players will ADG whine about?

     




    How many are left on the roster that he hast started a thread about?

     



    Hmmmmm................... probably carp

     
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  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    In response to ADG's comment:

    If he feels great and isn't hurt, then we have a very poor #2 starter.




    I believe him. John Lesster surrendered five ER in five innings, even worse than I though he would do. His ERA now stands at 4.37, right where I think he will end up at the end of the season. He is not hurt; he is just a mediocre to poor pitcher who lost whatever excellence he had a year and a half ago. I am happy he feels great and is not hurt. I don't wish illness or injury on anyone. There is nothing wrong with Lesster at all, only with the expectations some have about his performances. This IS the John "Big Game" Lesster we will see for the remainder of the year: lots of lemons, a few roses, and mostly just mediocre performance characteristic of a serviceable #4 SP.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from seabeachfred. Show seabeachfred's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    In response to Joebreidey's comment:

    In response to darrylfries' comment:

     

    Lester is a tough cookie and looked better today than in his last outing.

    Looked to me like he threw too many strikes over the plate and his ball movement wasn't great . Didn't walk a batter and struck out 8 not all bad.   Consistantly hit 94 on the gun.

    For the folks who expcted him to be the Ace that's not likely.

    I agree some paitence is needed and I'm sure we'll be looking for another starter regardless.

     

     



    I agree.  It's hard to be happy over 5 ERs, but the 8/0 K/W is a vast improvement over the 22/18 K/W he gave us over the past 5 games.

     




    Well for me it's hard to be happy about Lester period.  Today Jim Palmer became the second Hall of Fame pitcher to berate Lester for his overuse of his shi@ty cutter.  Eck did the same in a Red Sox TV broadcast last week.  It appears Jon is cut in the same mold as the departed Beckett, stubborn to a fault.  Sooner or later he has to realize that when you throw the cutter you do NOT throw it for fat strikes but to get batter to think it's going to be one before it drops out of the zone.  Andy Pettitte made a career of doing just that and I'm surprised neither Farrell or Nievas has told Lester to barfcan that pitch and concentrate on his three other pitches.  Either that or they have and he has shined them on.  Today he ruined my Father' Day.

     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    In response to darrylfries' comment:

    Lester is a tough cookie and looked better today than in his last outing.

    Looked to me like he threw too many strikes over the plate and his ball movement wasn't great . Didn't walk a batter and struck out 8 not all bad.   Consistantly hit 94 on the gun.

    For the folks who expcted him to be the Ace that's not likely.

    I agree some paitence is needed and I'm sure we'll be looking for another starter regardless.

     



    Thanks for the rose colored view. He looked better today? His last game, he lasted 4 2/3, gave up 8 hits, 7 runs and walked 7. Of course he looked better.

    So a major league pitcher who threw too many pitches over the plate, had 94 on the gun and didn't have good ball movement gives up 9 hits and 5 ERA in 5 IP, that says he currently doesn't have the stuff to get hitters out.

     
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  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from stan17. Show stan17's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    Jon Lester is realizing that hes not a Power arm now and has to make the transition into a "pitcher", not a "thrower". That is usually not a smooth transition. He has 4 pitches and can make the transformation, but I wouldnt expect him to fully make it this year but I expect him to be better than he is right now. Pick up his option and see how it goes through next year and then make the decision on an extension. Lester still has it in him as he shut down the Jays potent lineup with a CG 1 hitter, so some patience will be needed.

    We will most likely be in the market for a starter this year regardless.




    Stop being rational.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    Pitchers rarely lose 2-3 mph on their fastball without some sort of underlying issue. Sometimes it might be an injury that even the pitcher doesn't know he has, sometimes it might be a flaw in his mechanics, sometimes it might be "90% half mental".

    Lester is not the same guy as 2 years ago. It is very rare for a pitcher to regain velocity lost not by injury, so there are basically 2 way for Lester to get better:

    1) If it is a hidden injury, he has to get over it (discovered or not).

    2) If it is not an injury, he must re-invent himself by widening his variety of pitches, or perhaps pitching more to contact instead of trying to throw it by batters with an inferior FB.

    I wish him luck, but either way may take more time than we can spare.

    Sox4ever.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    he doesnt throw as hard as he once did and he over relies on his cutter....his slow delivery also prevents him from getting into a groove and he looks fat again....the guy is like 30 and his body is 40...get in shape and drop 25 pounds like lackey...then speed it up please

    we dont need a beckett redux

    As always - 100% correct!

     
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    In response to seabeachfred's comment:

     

    In response to Joebreidey's comment:

     

     

     

    In response to darrylfries' comment:

     

     

     

     

    Lester is a tough cookie and looked better today than in his last outing.

    Looked to me like he threw too many strikes over the plate and his ball movement wasn't great . Didn't walk a batter and struck out 8 not all bad.   Consistantly hit 94 on the gun.

    For the folks who expcted him to be the Ace that's not likely.

    I agree some paitence is needed and I'm sure we'll be looking for another starter regardless.

     

     

     

     



    I agree.  It's hard to be happy over 5 ERs, but the 8/0 K/W is a vast improvement over the 22/18 K/W he gave us over the past 5 games.

     

     

     

     

     




    Well for me it's hard to be happy about Lester period.  Today Jim Palmer became the second Hall of Fame pitcher to berate Lester for his overuse of his shi@ty cutter.  Eck did the same in a Red Sox TV broadcast last week.  It appears Jon is cut in the same mold as the departed Beckett, stubborn to a fault.  Sooner or later he has to realize that when you throw the cutter you do NOT throw it for fat strikes but to get batter to think it's going to be one before it drops out of the zone.  Andy Pettitte made a career of doing just that and I'm surprised neither Farrell or Nievas has told Lester to barfcan that pitch and concentrate on his three other pitches.  Either that or they have and he has shined them on.  Today he ruined my Father' Day.

     

     

     

     



    If that last sentence is true, I think you need to reevaluate your priorities. I heard from both of my kids in 2 different corners of the US (Cali. & FL.) and nothing could have ruined my day, especially a baseball game. Anyway....

    About the rest of your post, I think your spot on. He doesnt trust his FB now that it sits at 92-94 (mostly 92). He cant blow it by people anymore and is relying on his cutter way too much. Lester needs to realize what Beckett never did. Hes not the power pitcher he was 5 years ago and needs to adjust accordingly. The quicker he does that, the quicker he gets back on track. He still has it in him to be a TOTR starter. You dont have to throw 96-97 to be successful, but you have to learn to "pitch".

     

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    In response to stan17's comment:

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

     

    Jon Lester is realizing that hes not a Power arm now and has to make the transition into a "pitcher", not a "thrower". That is usually not a smooth transition. He has 4 pitches and can make the transformation, but I wouldnt expect him to fully make it this year but I expect him to be better than he is right now. Pick up his option and see how it goes through next year and then make the decision on an extension. Lester still has it in him as he shut down the Jays potent lineup with a CG 1 hitter, so some patience will be needed.

    We will most likely be in the market for a starter this year regardless.

     




    Stop being rational.

     




    Sorry, my badTongue Out

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    Pitchers rarely lose 2-3 mph on their fastball without some sort of underlying issue. Sometimes it might be an injury that even the pitcher doesn't know he has, sometimes it might be a flaw in his mechanics, sometimes it might be "90% half mental".

    Lester is not the same guy as 2 years ago. It is very rare for a pitcher to regain velocity lost not by injury, so there are basically 2 way for Lester to get better:

    1) If it is a hidden injury, he has to get over it (discovered or not).

    2) If it is not an injury, he must re-invent himself by widening his variety of pitches, or perhaps pitching more to contact instead of trying to throw it by batters with an inferior FB.

    I wish him luck, but either way may take more time than we can spare.

    Sox4ever.

     




    Theyve been doing in depth studies since about 2007-2008, and they have found At about 28-30yrs old most power pitchers start to rapidly lose velocity. By 32 they can lose up to 4-5 MPH on their FB. Its not rare at all, actually its just the natural progression of most power arms.

     

    They will gain MPH into their mid 20's and at a position players peak (28) can start declining because of throwing so many pitches up til then.

    IMHO, Lester is just experiencing this natural progression and needs to get out of his own way and accept it. Make the adjustments and reinvent himself. It might not help the team a lot this year, because making the adjustments is rarely seamless. Lester can still be a TOTR start with his 4 pitch rep, IF he can make the transition.

     

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from 37stories. Show 37stories's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    In response to pumpsie-green's comment:

    In response to ADG's comment:

     

    If he feels great and isn't hurt, then we have a very poor #2 starter.

     




    I believe him. John Lesster surrendered five ER in five innings, even worse than I though he would do. His ERA now stands at 4.37, right where I think he will end up at the end of the season. He is not hurt; he is just a mediocre to poor pitcher who lost whatever excellence he had a year and a half ago. I am happy he feels great and is not hurt. I don't wish illness or injury on anyone. There is nothing wrong with Lesster at all, only with the expectations some have about his performances. This IS the John "Big Game" Lesster we will see for the remainder of the year: lots of lemons, a few roses, and mostly just mediocre performance characteristic of a serviceable #4 SP.

     



    Arent you the guy that said the season was over a month ago?

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from 37stories. Show 37stories's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    Pitchers rarely lose 2-3 mph on their fastball without some sort of underlying issue. Sometimes it might be an injury that even the pitcher doesn't know he has, sometimes it might be a flaw in his mechanics, sometimes it might be "90% half mental".

    Lester is not the same guy as 2 years ago. It is very rare for a pitcher to regain velocity lost not by injury, so there are basically 2 way for Lester to get better:

    1) If it is a hidden injury, he has to get over it (discovered or not).

    2) If it is not an injury, he must re-invent himself by widening his variety of pitches, or perhaps pitching more to contact instead of trying to throw it by batters with an inferior FB.

    I wish him luck, but either way may take more time than we can spare.

    Sox4ever.

     




    Theyve been doing in depth studies since about 2007-2008, and they have found At about 28-30yrs old most power pitchers start to rapidly lose velocity. By 32 they can lose up to 4-5 MPH on their FB. Its not rare at all, actually its just the natural progression of most power arms.

     

    They will gain MPH into their mid 20's and at a position players peak (28) can start declining because of throwing so many pitches up til then.

    IMHO, Lester is just experiencing this natural progression and needs to get out of his own way and accept it. Make the adjustments and reinvent himself. It might not help the team a lot this year, because making the adjustments is rarely seamless. Lester can still be a TOTR start with his 4 pitch rep, IF he can make the transition.

     



    Lester will probably win 13 to 16 games and have an ErA a bit below 4. He wasnt as good as he looked early in the year and he isnt as bad as he looks now.

    The panic on these boards is unreal.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    In response to 37stories' comment:

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

     

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    Pitchers rarely lose 2-3 mph on their fastball without some sort of underlying issue. Sometimes it might be an injury that even the pitcher doesn't know he has, sometimes it might be a flaw in his mechanics, sometimes it might be "90% half mental".

    Lester is not the same guy as 2 years ago. It is very rare for a pitcher to regain velocity lost not by injury, so there are basically 2 way for Lester to get better:

    1) If it is a hidden injury, he has to get over it (discovered or not).

    2) If it is not an injury, he must re-invent himself by widening his variety of pitches, or perhaps pitching more to contact instead of trying to throw it by batters with an inferior FB.

    I wish him luck, but either way may take more time than we can spare.

    Sox4ever.

     




    Theyve been doing in depth studies since about 2007-2008, and they have found At about 28-30yrs old most power pitchers start to rapidly lose velocity. By 32 they can lose up to 4-5 MPH on their FB. Its not rare at all, actually its just the natural progression of most power arms.

     

    They will gain MPH into their mid 20's and at a position players peak (28) can start declining because of throwing so many pitches up til then.

    IMHO, Lester is just experiencing this natural progression and needs to get out of his own way and accept it. Make the adjustments and reinvent himself. It might not help the team a lot this year, because making the adjustments is rarely seamless. Lester can still be a TOTR start with his 4 pitch rep, IF he can make the transition.

     

     



    Lester will probably win 13 to 16 games and have an ErA a bit below 4. He wasnt as good as he looked early in the year and he isnt as bad as he looks now.

     

    The panic on these boards is unreal.



    13 games is an unacceptable amount of wins for a guy like lester...a total failure

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    In response to 37stories' comment:

    Lester will probably win 13 to 16 games and have an ErA a bit below 4. He wasnt as good as he looked early in the year and he isnt as bad as he looks now.

    The panic on these boards is unreal.



    I agree that there can be a lot of needless panic on the boards.  However, I think we've reached the point with Lester where it's rational to be worried about him.  Yes he's had good patches and bad ones, but over 52 starts he has a 4.90 ERA and less than half of his starts have even met the minimum for a Quality Start.  52 starts is getting to be a pretty big sample, about 1.5 seasons.  

     

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Jon Lester Said he feels great and isn't hurt

    In response to ConanObrien's comment:

    In response to seabeachfred's comment:

     

    In response to Joebreidey's comment:

     

     

    In response to darrylfries' comment:

     

     

     

    Lester is a tough cookie and looked better today than in his last outing.

    Looked to me like he threw too many strikes over the plate and his ball movement wasn't great . Didn't walk a batter and struck out 8 not all bad.   Consistantly hit 94 on the gun.

    For the folks who expcted him to be the Ace that's not likely.

    I agree some paitence is needed and I'm sure we'll be looking for another starter regardless.

     

     

     

     



    I agree.  It's hard to be happy over 5 ERs, but the 8/0 K/W is a vast improvement over the 22/18 K/W he gave us over the past 5 games.

     

     

     

     




    Well for me it's hard to be happy about Lester period.  Today Jim Palmer became the second Hall of Fame pitcher to berate Lester for his overuse of his shi@ty cutter.  Eck did the same in a Red Sox TV broadcast last week.  It appears Jon is cut in the same mold as the departed Beckett, stubborn to a fault.  Sooner or later he has to realize that when you throw the cutter you do NOT throw it for fat strikes but to get batter to think it's going to be one before it drops out of the zone.  Andy Pettitte made a career of doing just that and I'm surprised neither Farrell or Nievas has told Lester to barfcan that pitch and concentrate on his three other pitches.  Either that or they have and he has shined them on.  Today he ruined my Father' Day.

     

     

     




     

     

     

    Palmer is a bigger blow hard than you.



    And you Conan continue to add no value to this forum. Congratulations on your multi-day 'Non-contribution streak'.

     
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