Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    Was there a limit as to how long they could have kept Carp in minors? The next three nights the Red Sox will face three lefthanders meaning the following:


    1. Carp most likely won't play.


    2. Drew most definitely won't play.


    3. Holt will be playing SS


    4. Big Johnny Gomes will be in LF with Bradley in CF and Mookie in RF.


    Couldn't they wait until after the White Sox series?


    And lastly, unless they are trying to "showcase" Carp, he should have been DFA'd and then try and work a trade out with anyone over the next 10 days.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoUconn13. Show GoUconn13's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    In response to ADG's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Was there a limit as to how long they could have kept Carp in minors? The next three nights the Red Sox will face three lefthanders meaning the following:

     

     

    Carp is due to come off of DL anyway.  Hererra have an option and can be call up later.   Guess Ben C. is trying to tell Farrell to use him often so he can be trade asap!!

     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    In response to GoUconn13's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to ADG's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Was there a limit as to how long they could have kept Carp in minors? The next three nights the Red Sox will face three lefthanders meaning the following:

     

     

    Carp is due to come off of DL anyway.  Hererra have an option and can be call up later.   Guess Ben C. is trying to tell Farrell to use him often so he can be trade asap!!

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Agree, but Farrell said on the pre-game show that he probably won't be used over the next three games because of the lefties and that Holt will be playing SS and OF will be Gomes, JBJ and Mookie. Holt will be playing SS.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    In response to GoUconn13's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to ADG's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Was there a limit as to how long they could have kept Carp in minors? The next three nights the Red Sox will face three lefthanders meaning the following:

     

     

    Carp is due to come off of DL anyway.  Hererra have an option and can be call up later.   Guess Ben C. is trying to tell Farrell to use him often so he can be trade asap!!

     

    [/QUOTE]


    And if that was the case, why wasn't he in the lineup tonight?

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheExaminer. Show TheExaminer's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    He began to get game winning hits. We CANNOT have that around here. What is wrong with you?

     

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from DaysofYaz. Show DaysofYaz's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    Herrera was a bright spot lately.  Too blinding for larry so down he goes. You hit you sit...they don't want that type of behavior this year. Goes against the grain and most likely upset the entire clubhouse. 

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheExaminer. Show TheExaminer's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    In response to DaysofYaz's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Herrera was a bright spot lately.  Too blinding for larry so down he goes. You hit you sit...they don't want that type of behavior this year. Goes against the grain and most likely upset the entire clubhouse. 

    [/QUOTE]


    [object HTMLDivElement]

    Hitting is a clubhouse cancer. We need fish. Fish and beer this year instead of chicken. Carp = Pike.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    Oh jeez -- we're complaining that a .233 hitter with a .596 OPS, a guy who is batting .176 (3-for-17) in his last seven game is being sent down. The baseball acumen on this thread is simply astounding.

     

     

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Kingface12. Show Kingface12's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    WHY?!?!?!?!  For the love of EVERYTHING that is holy in this world...Do you honestly think that &^%$# Jonathan &^%$&'n Herrera is going to be the difference maker in this blown season!?!?!?!  Face facts....the Sox are in 're-building' mode now......deal with it and go away.  I swear some of you just have NO CLUE AND DO NOT GET IT!!!!!

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from dgalehouse. Show dgalehouse's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    Some are missing the point here. Why bring up Carp to showcase him if he is not even going to play? Why pay 10 mil to Drew if he cannot play against lefties? There does seem to be a disconnect here. It really looks like there is confusion and panic in what we are seeing. Rational decision making is not on display. It is pretty hard to dispute that, although some will no doubt try. 

    Stabbed by Foulke.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    In response to dgalehouse's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Some are missing the point here. Why bring up Carp to showcase him if he is not even going to play? Why pay 10 mil to Drew if he cannot play against lefties? There does seem to be a disconnect here. It really looks like there is confusion and panic in what we are seeing. Rational decision making is not on display. It is pretty hard to dispute that, although some will no doubt try. 

    Stabbed by Foulke.

    [/QUOTE]

    Just because things don't work out, it doesn't mean a rationale decision process wasn't being used.

    Take the Drew signing. Drew was signed when Middlebrooks went out with the injury. At that point, the Sox had no other obvious options on the left side. Holt at that point had barely played 3B. Taking a look at what was out there, Drew was the best option on the left side because there really wasn't a 3B out there and he would improve the defense. Unfortunately, the hitting was too slow to come around regardless of who he faced.

    I might wrong, but I don't think Carp has any options and after a certain amount of rehab time, you have to bring him back. So you don't simply DFA him when you can send down a light-hitting UT infielder, who barely plays anyway. How much Carp plays is irrelevant. It keeps him around as another trade piece, and I'm sure he'll get some playing time against RH pitchers. 

    Pretty rational decision-making if you ask me.

     

     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from ampoule. Show ampoule's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    In response to TheExaminer's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to DaysofYaz's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Herrera was a bright spot lately.  Too blinding for larry so down he goes. You hit you sit...they don't want that type of behavior this year. Goes against the grain and most likely upset the entire clubhouse. 

    [/QUOTE]


    [object HTMLDivElement]

    Hitting is a clubhouse cancer. We need fish. Fish and beer this year instead of chicken. Carp = Pike.

    [/QUOTE]


    Too funny, my friend...LOL

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from dgalehouse. Show dgalehouse's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    In response to royf19's comment:


    In response to dgalehouse's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    Some are missing the point here. Why bring up Carp to showcase him if he is not even going to play? Why pay 10 mil to Drew if he cannot play against lefties? There does seem to be a disconnect here. It really looks like there is confusion and panic in what we are seeing. Rational decision making is not on display. It is pretty hard to dispute that, although some will no doubt try. 


    Stabbed by Foulke.




    Just because things don't work out, it doesn't mean a rationale decision process wasn't being used.


    Take the Drew signing. Drew was signed when Middlebrooks went out with the injury. At that point, the Sox had no other obvious options on the left side. Holt at that point had barely played 3B. Taking a look at what was out there, Drew was the best option on the left side because there really wasn't a 3B out there and he would improve the defense. Unfortunately, the hitting was too slow to come around regardless of who he faced.


    I might wrong, but I don't think Carp has any options and after a certain amount of rehab time, you have to bring him back. So you don't simply DFA him when you can send down a light-hitting UT infielder, who barely plays anyway. How much Carp plays is irrelevant. It keeps him around as another trade piece, and I'm sure he'll get some playing time against RH pitchers. 


    Pretty rational decision-making if you ask me.


     


     


    [/QUOTE]


    [object HTMLDivElement]. Roy,  Okay, but I do think you are kind of prone to go along with everything they do . I have no idea if Carp needed to be brought up immediately or DFAed. Maybe that was the case. I don't know. But if it was not, it makes no sense to bring him up when we are facing three games against lefties. You are not being showcased sitting on the bench. To pay Drew 10 mil for part time play over half a season is an incredible blunder, no matter how much you try to rationalize it. To me, rational decision making seemed to go out the window right after the corks were popped last fall , even before that if you consider our weak offer to Abreu. I think that is the reason for our current situation. Feel free to argue that everything was done right and our current plight is just due to some unforeseeable  circumstances. 

     
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  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    In response to dgalehouse's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    [/QUOTE]

    [object HTMLDivElement]. Roy,  Okay, but I do think you are kind of prone to go along with everything they do . I have no idea if Carp needed to be brought up immediately or DFAed. Maybe that was the case. I don't know. But if it was not, it makes no sense to bring him up when we are facing three games against lefties. You are not being showcased sitting on the bench. To pay Drew 10 mil for part time play over half a season is an incredible blunder, no matter how much you try to rationalize it. To me, rational decision making seemed to go out the window right after the corks were popped last fall , even before that if you consider our weak offer to Abreu. I think that is the reason for our current situation. Feel free to argue that everything was done right and our current plight is just due to some unforeseeable  circumstances. 

    [/QUOTE]

    There's a difference -- a huge difference -- between going along with what they do and understanding why they did what they did. Just because I don't hop on board every irrational analysis of moves they have made or didn't make, it doesn't mean I agree with all their decisions.

    In the Carp decision, if he was out of rehab time, it makes no sense to DFA him when having him or Herrera on the roster hardly is hardly any kind of make-or-break situation. It would be absolutely stupid to dump him when he can still be used in a trade.

    I've been on record all year for not wanting Drew back, so I am at a loss at how you can twist that stance into going along with what they do. Please enlighten me. I would have given Holt a shot at the get-go because he was going to be the option in the short term while Drew was getting ready, and I would have looked for another trade option at 3B, leaving Bogaerts at SS to develop.

    But some of you keep harping about playing the best players and in the middle of May when Middlebrooks got hurt, it was reasonable and rational to think a Bogaerts-Drew left side was better than a Holt-Bogaerts left side.'

    I'm not going to get into it here, but as for the rest of what they did and didn't do in the offseason -- and I've been on record here agreeing with some and not agreeing with others -- just because you didn't agree with what they did, it doesn't mean there wasn't a rationale plan behind it. 

    But when creating a list of reasons on why the Sox are in their current state, I don't know how anyone an start a such a list w/o putting Pedroia's and Napoli's pathetic hitting w/RISP at the top. When your No. 3 and No. 5 hitters are that bad in such situations -- .200 or below, you're going to have major issues.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    Carp is coming off the D.L.


    Teams have got in trouble in the past for stashing guys off the D.L. in the minors.


    The Sox have multiple players who can play 3B. Bogaerts/Holt (both RHH) and multiple guys who can play SS (Drew/Bogaerts/Holt/Betts) and multiple guys who can play 2nd (Pedroia/Holt/Betts).  and ALL those guys are RHH, in a lineup against LHHP so Herrera is redundant, and Carp represents a LHH bat off the bench for the next 3 days.


    Herrera is not that good, and has zero future here in Boston with guys like Betts and Holt who can hit and play multiple positions.  All week I was actually thinking how this was one of the EASIEST moves to predict, and yet people are still surprised by it...lol.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    In response to dgalehouse's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Some are missing the point here. Why bring up Carp to showcase him if he is not even going to play? Why pay 10 mil to Drew if he cannot play against lefties? There does seem to be a disconnect here. It really looks like there is confusion and panic in what we are seeing. Rational decision making is not on display. It is pretty hard to dispute that, although some will no doubt try. 

    Stabbed by Foulke.

    [/QUOTE]


    dgale - Thank you for making my point. I wasn't backing up Herrera, but the rational in the move at this time.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from bosoxmal. Show bosoxmal's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    In response to ADG's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Was there a limit as to how long they could have kept Carp in minors? The next three nights the Red Sox will face three lefthanders meaning the following:

     

    1. Carp most likely won't play.

     

    2. Drew most definitely won't play.

     

    3. Holt will be playing SS

     

    4. Big Johnny Gomes will be in LF with Bradley in CF and Mookie in RF.

     

    Couldn't they wait until after the White Sox series?

     

    And lastly, unless they are trying to "showcase" Carp, he should have been DFA'd and then try and work a trade out with anyone over the next 10 days.

    [/QUOTE]

    Because this "gang at th top" is in a complete fog. Farrell thinks XB is going to snap out of it pretty soon and that Doubrant is a major league pitcher, and that---well, I could go on and on. I can think of at least 6 player, now on the roster, who should be dumped. DFA's whatever, just dumped. Among them are the obvious (Drew, AJ, etc.) but I would also say "good bye, thanks for 2013, to the likes of Napoli and a couple of pitchers. Thteam stinks as it is, and I don't think there is any leadership.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    In response to ADG's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Was there a limit as to how long they could have kept Carp in minors? The next three nights the Red Sox will face three lefthanders meaning the following:

     

    1. Carp most likely won't play.

     

    2. Drew most definitely won't play.

     

    3. Holt will be playing SS

     

    4. Big Johnny Gomes will be in LF with Bradley in CF and Mookie in RF.

     

    Couldn't they wait until after the White Sox series?

     

    And lastly, unless they are trying to "showcase" Carp, he should have been DFA'd and then try and work a trade out with anyone over the next 10 days.

    [/QUOTE]Carp will be part of the TRADE/S that are coming soooooon !!!


     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoUconn13. Show GoUconn13's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    Disabled list[edit]


    If a major league player cannot play because of a medical condition, he may be placed on the 15-day disabled list (DL). This removes the player from the 25-man roster, freeing up a space, but he is ineligible to play for at least 15 consecutive days. Players on the 15-day disabled list are still a part of the 40-man roster. An injured player may also be placed on the 60-day disabled list to remove the player from the 40-man roster as well, with the condition of being ineligible to play for 60 consecutive days.

    Players placed on the 15-day disabled list may be moved to the 60-day list at any time, but not vice versa. Players may be placed on either disabled list retroactively for a maximum of 10 inactive days and may remain on either list for as long as required to recover. During this 10-day period, a player's status is said to be day-to-day, indicating that the team is in the process of deciding whether the player must be placed on either DL or is healthy enough to return to active service. Injured players may not be traded without permission of the Commissioner nor may they be optioned to the minors, though they may be assigned to a minor league club for rehabilitation for a limited amount of time (30 days for pitchers, 20 for non-pitchers).

    In 2011, a 7-day disabled list was added specifically for players who have suffered a concussion. This was instituted to allow players who may recover from their concussions quickly to be removed from the active roster and replaced for a shorter period of time than 15 days. A player who is still suffering from concussion symptoms at the 15-day mark is automatically transferred to the 15-day DL. Both the brain injury and the player's recovery need to be verified by team and league doctors; the list is not intended for non-concussion injuries.[10]

     

    Hopefully this DL article can explain you why players must be off of DL or cant play in minor league too long

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from jam789123. Show jam789123's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    Boras made this call.  Got to showcase his boy for his next big contract.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    In response to jam789123's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Boras made this call.  Got to showcase his boy for his next big contract.

    [/QUOTE]

    If his BOY plays well enough to get a good contract then he will be playing at a much higher level than Herrera ever will. 

     
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  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from illinoisredsox. Show illinoisredsox's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Carp is coming off the D.L.

     

    Teams have got in trouble in the past for stashing guys off the D.L. in the minors.

     

    The Sox have multiple players who can play 3B. Bogaerts/Holt (both RHH) and multiple guys who can play SS (Drew/Bogaerts/Holt/Betts) and multiple guys who can play 2nd (Pedroia/Holt/Betts).  and ALL those guys are RHH, in a lineup against LHHP so Herrera is redundant, and Carp represents a LHH bat off the bench for the next 3 days.

     

    Herrera is not that good, and has zero future here in Boston with guys like Betts and Holt who can hit and play multiple positions.  All week I was actually thinking how this was one of the EASIEST moves to predict, and yet people are still surprised by it...lol.

    [/QUOTE]


    Let's not go with the Betts can play short game.  He played 14 games there between the GCL and Lowell; he made 9 errors.  That does not translate to being able to play ss at the major league level.  If his future is as an outfielder, that's where he needs to play.  He does not have natural instincts in the OF and has already made 2 bad decisions in 5 games.  That's not going to change yanking him back and forth between the IF and the OF. 

    Holt has shown a very unique ability to shift between positions, let's not assume everyone can do it.  The truth is he's not that good an infielder.  He has looked very comfortable in the OF. 

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Jonathan Herrera Gets Sent Down Because?

    In response to illinoisredsox's comment:


    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    Carp is coming off the D.L.


     


    Teams have got in trouble in the past for stashing guys off the D.L. in the minors.


     


    The Sox have multiple players who can play 3B. Bogaerts/Holt (both RHH) and multiple guys who can play SS (Drew/Bogaerts/Holt/Betts) and multiple guys who can play 2nd (Pedroia/Holt/Betts).  and ALL those guys are RHH, in a lineup against LHHP so Herrera is redundant, and Carp represents a LHH bat off the bench for the next 3 days.


     


    Herrera is not that good, and has zero future here in Boston with guys like Betts and Holt who can hit and play multiple positions.  All week I was actually thinking how this was one of the EASIEST moves to predict, and yet people are still surprised by it...lol.





    Let's not go with the Betts can play short game.  He played 14 games there between the GCL and Lowell; he made 9 errors.  That does not translate to being able to play ss at the major league level.  If his future is as an outfielder, that's where he needs to play.  He does not have natural instincts in the OF and has already made 2 bad decisions in 5 games.  That's not going to change yanking him back and forth between the IF and the OF. 


    Holt has shown a very unique ability to shift between positions, let's not assume everyone can do it.  The truth is he's not that good an infielder.  He has looked very comfortable in the OF. 


    [/QUOTE]

    Please understand that I'm talking about "depth" options.  We are talking about replacing Herrera here...not replacing a starter.  And multiple scouts have said they would immediately plug Betts into SS, he's a second baseman by trade and I understand you have different angles and different responsibilities and positional shifts at the position and I'm in no way suggesting he plays there only that he is a depth option.  I will admit I was questioning myself when I put him there over anyone else, but he's 4th on the depth list there in the same sense that hypothetically Napoli could catch.  And lets remember, his only real knock as a SS was the weak arm, which I'm assuming is much stronger now as he's put on some muscle sense his highschool days.  If the Sox really really really wanted too, they would just throw him there the same way they threw Bogaerts in at 3B last year with less experience...but again I don't view that as a real option.  


    My whole point is Herrera is redundant at this point, that is what you should have taken away from my post. 

     

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