Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from jaytftwofive. Show jaytftwofive's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    Jack Morris will and should get in. And not just for his post season success. Didn't he have the most wins in the 1980's?

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    In response to jaytftwofive's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Jack Morris will and should get in. And not just for his post season success. Didn't he have the most wins in the 1980's?

    [/QUOTE]

    That sounds about right

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from redsoxdirtdog. Show redsoxdirtdog's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    In response to Softlaw1's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Schilling was the leader of the 2004 and 2007 title teams. Good citizen who is not part of the current slim national majority of entitlment demanding idiots. Red Sox fans did not deserve a leader like Curt Schilling. They deserve a career loser like Ellsbury.

    [/QUOTE]

    Wow!  Stiffy takes yet another shot at Boston???  Go figure!  & he pretends to be a Sox fan!!!

     

    As for Schilling???  I will agree that he was the last TRUE LEADER this team had.  Say what you will about him being a big mouth (with which I agree), or making poor business decisions (with which I agree), but another SP in the mold of Schilling is exactly what this team needs!!!!!!! 

    How many of our current young studs, i.e. Lester, Buch, Dubby, lackey..... et. al. study tapes like Schill???  Study tapes AT ALL?  You sure as shillt never hear about it!  We desperately need JF & a veteran pitcher to get in a few faces!  Shame these mama's boys into doing a little bit of preparation.

    As for the HOF, he will be there soon enough!

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from LeftyGrove. Show LeftyGrove's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    In response to prknsdnld's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to jaytftwofive's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I know in some of my previous posts I have been critical of Curt. Never as a pitcher or a great compettitor. Just at times he can be a big mouth and so self promoting. But he showed a lot of class when his friend Randy Johnson tweeted him and told him don't be offended by not being voted in the HOF on your first time. He said you're a Hall of Famer and your time will come. Schill tweeted Randy back and told him I'm not a first ballot Hall of Famer like you (Johnson) but he will love the chance some day. Then this big mouth former long time talk show host in Philadelphia named Howard Eskin tweeted Curt back and told him that he was a very good pitcher but not a hall of Famer. Curt tweeted back and called him a dumb a_ _. LOL. Curt also told him just because he insulted him years ago is no reason to post something so mean spirited. This guy Eskin is one of the biggest haters in talk sports. He is a kiss butt of Andy Reid, Mike Schmidt, Pete Rose, Charles Barkley and others, but if you didn't side with him he didn't like you. Way to go Curt. I'm with you all the way on this one.

    [/QUOTE]


    216 wins does not a Hall Of Famer make- sorry. As far as post season heroics, then vote in Dusty Rhodes, Gene Tenace, Mickey Lolich, Bobby Richardson, Chuck Essegian, Joe Black, Lew Burdette, and a billion more marginal players who had good post seasons.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    There are the strikeout totals, strike out to walk ratios, career era, and other stats you fail to include that will lead to his eventual Hall invite. His overall career numbers in categories, plus his impact in 2004 are what will get hiwe enshrined.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Helloitsmeagain. Show Helloitsmeagain's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    One thing is for sure, schilling and class should never be mentioned in the same sentence unless we are referring to his lack of.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    In response to LeftyGrove's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to prknsdnld's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to jaytftwofive's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I know in some of my previous posts I have been critical of Curt. Never as a pitcher or a great compettitor. Just at times he can be a big mouth and so self promoting. But he showed a lot of class when his friend Randy Johnson tweeted him and told him don't be offended by not being voted in the HOF on your first time. He said you're a Hall of Famer and your time will come. Schill tweeted Randy back and told him I'm not a first ballot Hall of Famer like you (Johnson) but he will love the chance some day. Then this big mouth former long time talk show host in Philadelphia named Howard Eskin tweeted Curt back and told him that he was a very good pitcher but not a hall of Famer. Curt tweeted back and called him a dumb a_ _. LOL. Curt also told him just because he insulted him years ago is no reason to post something so mean spirited. This guy Eskin is one of the biggest haters in talk sports. He is a kiss butt of Andy Reid, Mike Schmidt, Pete Rose, Charles Barkley and others, but if you didn't side with him he didn't like you. Way to go Curt. I'm with you all the way on this one.

    [/QUOTE]


    216 wins does not a Hall Of Famer make- sorry. As far as post season heroics, then vote in Dusty Rhodes, Gene Tenace, Mickey Lolich, Bobby Richardson, Chuck Essegian, Joe Black, Lew Burdette, and a billion more marginal players who had good post seasons.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    There are the strikeout totals, strike out to walk ratios, career era, and other stats you fail to include that will lead to his eventual Hall invite. His overall career numbers in categories, plus his impact in 2004 are what will get hiwe enshrined.

    [/QUOTE]

    Yes

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from prknsdnld. Show prknsdnld's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    In response to jaytftwofive's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Jack Morris will and should get in. And not just for his post season success. Didn't he have the most wins in the 1980's?

    [/QUOTE]


    Tommy John belongs in the HOF.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from ampoule. Show ampoule's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    In response to nhsteven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to slomag's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Jack Morris got twice the the votes as Schilling.  Nobody can make a rational argument that Morris was a better pitcher than Schilling.  These guys might be baseball writers, but there is a lot of ignorance in the voting.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    This was Morris's 14 try, Schilling's 1st. Add to that Schilling's personality. It's the HOF process, like it or not.

    [/QUOTE]


    Concerning Schilling, it's incredible how people unfairly comingle personality and political view to fit their agenda.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    In response to prknsdnld's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to jaytftwofive's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Jack Morris will and should get in. And not just for his post season success. Didn't he have the most wins in the 1980's?

    [/QUOTE]


    Tommy John belongs in the HOF.

    [/QUOTE]


    Disagree

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    In response to ampoule's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to nhsteven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to slomag's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Jack Morris got twice the the votes as Schilling.  Nobody can make a rational argument that Morris was a better pitcher than Schilling.  These guys might be baseball writers, but there is a lot of ignorance in the voting.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    This was Morris's 14 try, Schilling's 1st. Add to that Schilling's personality. It's the HOF process, like it or not.

    [/QUOTE]


    Concerning Schilling, it's incredible how people unfairly comingle personality and political view to fit their agenda.

    [/QUOTE]


    I don't think he would have gotten in this time anyway

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    In response to nhsteven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to slomag's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to nhsteven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to slomag's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Jack Morris got twice the the votes as Schilling.  Nobody can make a rational argument that Morris was a better pitcher than Schilling.  These guys might be baseball writers, but there is a lot of ignorance in the voting.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    This was Morris's 14 try, Schilling's 1st. Add to that Schilling's personality. It's the HOF process, like it or not.

    [/QUOTE]

    Maybe, but it's usually a case of the older guys looking better in retrospect, and nobody ridiculously obviously better joining the ballot for the first time.  Eckersley leaped over Sutter, Gossage & Blyleven, and the talent there was pretty comparable.  The SF Giants won the world series - what would Jack Morris in his prime be on that team.  Their #4 starter? 

    Another thing annoying me is that Mike Piazza seems to be getting a pass on the whole steroid issue - this guy should get zero votes.  He would not have even been a major-leaguer if he hadn't been a juicer. 

    Edgar Martinez is another one - the guy adds .160 points to his slugging at age 32, and everybody gives him a pass on the juice issue?  PLEASE!  

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Calling Jack Morris a #4 starter for any team  is foolish. Many experts feel he's been gipped for not getting in. I agree with them. He was a stud, an ace, and is the poster child for why W-L record matters. And who can forget Game 7 of the 1991 WS, when he was past his prime? That was typical Morris.

    While Piazza is suspicious, it is possible he's innocent, although that's doubtful. IMO, most of them took something at one time or another anyway, many perhaps on just a trial basis. In some cases, it was probably like a crook; they may stop at some point becuase they may be scared they'll get caught.

    As a result nobody's beyond reproach, especially with all the BS we've been subjected to.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    You make out the rotation - you have the SF Giants rotation, plus Jack Morris in his prime - years 25 - 32, WHIP of 1.25, ERA of 3.5.  You going to start him before Matt Cain?  Bumgarner?  Lincecum (I would this year, but year's prior?)?  I wouldn't even start him before Vogelsong.  You're going to put this guy in the hall of fame, but in his best years, he would barely crack the rotation of this year's champ.

     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from carnie. Show carnie's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    In response to redsoxdirtdog's comment:

    Wow!  Stiffy takes yet another shot at Boston???  Go figure!  & he pretends to be a Sox fan!!


    One of my old threads got bumped up recently by pike, one about how we became Sox fans. Stiffy admitted there that he's only a (alleged) Sox fan because his father was a Jimmy Foxx fan. Personally I think he just comes here to p!ss off real Sox fans.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    In response to nhsteven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to slomag's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to prknsdnld's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to jaytftwofive's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    I know in some of my previous posts I have been critical of Curt. Never as a pitcher or a great compettitor. Just at times he can be a big mouth and so self promoting. But he showed a lot of class when his friend Randy Johnson tweeted him and told him don't be offended by not being voted in the HOF on your first time. He said you're a Hall of Famer and your time will come. Schill tweeted Randy back and told him I'm not a first ballot Hall of Famer like you (Johnson) but he will love the chance some day. Then this big mouth former long time talk show host in Philadelphia named Howard Eskin tweeted Curt back and told him that he was a very good pitcher but not a hall of Famer. Curt tweeted back and called him a dumb a_ _. LOL. Curt also told him just because he insulted him years ago is no reason to post something so mean spirited. This guy Eskin is one of the biggest haters in talk sports. He is a kiss butt of Andy Reid, Mike Schmidt, Pete Rose, Charles Barkley and others, but if you didn't side with him he didn't like you. Way to go Curt. I'm with you all the way on this one.

    [/QUOTE]


    216 wins does not a Hall Of Famer make- sorry. As far as post season heroics, then vote in Dusty Rhodes, Gene Tenace, Mickey Lolich, Bobby Richardson, Chuck Essegian, Joe Black, Lew Burdette, and a billion more marginal players who had good post seasons.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Wins aren't everything - or even much of anything.  

    Schilling's 15th all time in Strikeouts, and his ERA+ is identical to Tom Seaver & Bob Gibson.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    ERA+ is misleading, since roughly speaking,  if the league average is 2.0, you would need a 1.0 ERA to have  an ERA+ similar to a player who had a 4.0 ERA when the league average is 5.0 (It was actually 5.1 one yr in the late 90s). To me, ERC# is a better measure.

    To a lesser degree Ks are also misleading, since there are many more now than years ago. I'm sure there's a few with more Ks who aren't in the HOF.

    Saying Wins don't mean much is also a misnomer; you hear that, Cy Young? No one with less than 300 Wins is not in the HOF.

    Having said that, and considering his PS exploits (which do count for something), I do believe he shall eventually get in.

    [/QUOTE]


    There are three guys on the strikeout list ahead of Schilling that are not in the HOF - Clemens, Randy Johnson & Pedro Martinez.

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    In response to slomag's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to nhsteven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to slomag's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to nhsteven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to slomag's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Jack Morris got twice the the votes as Schilling.  Nobody can make a rational argument that Morris was a better pitcher than Schilling.  These guys might be baseball writers, but there is a lot of ignorance in the voting.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    This was Morris's 14 try, Schilling's 1st. Add to that Schilling's personality. It's the HOF process, like it or not.

    [/QUOTE]

    Maybe, but it's usually a case of the older guys looking better in retrospect, and nobody ridiculously obviously better joining the ballot for the first time.  Eckersley leaped over Sutter, Gossage & Blyleven, and the talent there was pretty comparable.  The SF Giants won the world series - what would Jack Morris in his prime be on that team.  Their #4 starter? 

    Another thing annoying me is that Mike Piazza seems to be getting a pass on the whole steroid issue - this guy should get zero votes.  He would not have even been a major-leaguer if he hadn't been a juicer. 

    Edgar Martinez is another one - the guy adds .160 points to his slugging at age 32, and everybody gives him a pass on the juice issue?  PLEASE!  

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Calling Jack Morris a #4 starter for any team  is foolish. Many experts feel he's been gipped for not getting in. I agree with them. He was a stud, an ace, and is the poster child for why W-L record matters. And who can forget Game 7 of the 1991 WS, when he was past his prime? That was typical Morris.

    While Piazza is suspicious, it is possible he's innocent, although that's doubtful. IMO, most of them took something at one time or another anyway, many perhaps on just a trial basis. In some cases, it was probably like a crook; they may stop at some point becuase they may be scared they'll get caught.

    As a result nobody's beyond reproach, especially with all the BS we've been subjected to.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    You make out the rotation - you have the SF Giants rotation, plus Jack Morris in his prime - years 25 - 32, WHIP of 1.25, ERA of 3.5.  You going to start him before Matt Cain?  Bumgarner?  Lincecum (I would this year, but year's prior?)?  I wouldn't even start him before Vogelsong.  You're going to put this guy in the hall of fame, but in his best years, he would barely crack the rotation of this year's champ.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Disagree; he would be their ace, and that Pitcher's Park would make him even better, since he was a fly ball pitcher. (Let's see what those guys long term #s shall be as well.) Morris in a Hitters park, led the AL in WINS (a Stat I consider relevant) for the 1980s. He's the biggest reason the Tigers dominated BB in 1984. When you need 1 game, there was nobody bigger this side of Koufax and perhaps Whitey Ford (& Schilling).  He was unflappable & a horse. In the 1991 Game 7 WS, when past his prime, he threw a CG 10 Inning 1-0 Shutout. Can you tell me when was the last time ANYONE did that, even in the Regular Season?

    One thing I'm fairly certain of; if he doesn't get in next yr, the Veterans Commitee shall put him in.

     

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    In response to nhsteven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to slomag's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to nhsteven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to slomag's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to nhsteven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to slomag's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Jack Morris got twice the the votes as Schilling.  Nobody can make a rational argument that Morris was a better pitcher than Schilling.  These guys might be baseball writers, but there is a lot of ignorance in the voting.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    This was Morris's 14 try, Schilling's 1st. Add to that Schilling's personality. It's the HOF process, like it or not.

    [/QUOTE]

    Maybe, but it's usually a case of the older guys looking better in retrospect, and nobody ridiculously obviously better joining the ballot for the first time.  Eckersley leaped over Sutter, Gossage & Blyleven, and the talent there was pretty comparable.  The SF Giants won the world series - what would Jack Morris in his prime be on that team.  Their #4 starter? 

    Another thing annoying me is that Mike Piazza seems to be getting a pass on the whole steroid issue - this guy should get zero votes.  He would not have even been a major-leaguer if he hadn't been a juicer. 

    Edgar Martinez is another one - the guy adds .160 points to his slugging at age 32, and everybody gives him a pass on the juice issue?  PLEASE!  

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Calling Jack Morris a #4 starter for any team  is foolish. Many experts feel he's been gipped for not getting in. I agree with them. He was a stud, an ace, and is the poster child for why W-L record matters. And who can forget Game 7 of the 1991 WS, when he was past his prime? That was typical Morris.

    While Piazza is suspicious, it is possible he's innocent, although that's doubtful. IMO, most of them took something at one time or another anyway, many perhaps on just a trial basis. In some cases, it was probably like a crook; they may stop at some point becuase they may be scared they'll get caught.

    As a result nobody's beyond reproach, especially with all the BS we've been subjected to.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    You make out the rotation - you have the SF Giants rotation, plus Jack Morris in his prime - years 25 - 32, WHIP of 1.25, ERA of 3.5.  You going to start him before Matt Cain?  Bumgarner?  Lincecum (I would this year, but year's prior?)?  I wouldn't even start him before Vogelsong.  You're going to put this guy in the hall of fame, but in his best years, he would barely crack the rotation of this year's champ.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Disagree; he would be their ace, and that Pitcher's Park would make him even better, since he was a fly ball pitcher. (Let's see what those guys long term #s shall be as well.) Morris in a Hitters park, led the AL in WINS (a Stat I consider relevant) for the 1980s. He's the biggest reason the Tigers dominated BB in 1984. When you need 1 game, there was nobody bigger this side of Koufax and perhaps Whitey Ford (& Schilling).  He was unflappable & a horse. In the 1991 Game 7 WS, when past his prime, he threw a CG 10 Inning 1-0 Shutout. Can you tell me when was the last time ANYONE did that, even in the Regular Season?

    One thing I'm fairly certain of; if he doesn't get in next yr, the Veterans Commitee shall put him in.

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Selective memory - the very next year he was a disaster, losing three post-season games, giving up 19 runs in 22 PS innings.  His overall PS numbers were almost identical to his regular season averages - he doesn't deserve a bump for being a 'big game pitcher'.

    Center field in the old Tigers stadium was endless - I'd say it was a better pitcher's park than AT&T.  I'd say the NL factor and the era cancel each other out.  Morris on his best day was not in the same league as Matt Cain.

     

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Wolfpack13. Show Wolfpack13's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    The big mouth talk show host crossed the line by saying Curt is a great pitcher, but not a HOF. How dare he?!? Glad to see Curt showing "class" by calling him a name.

    Here are other people this guy thinks are classy: Bobby Knight, Mel Gibson and Butthead.

     
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  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from susan250. Show susan250's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    In response to jaytftwofive's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to Sheriff-Rojas' comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Curt probably will get into the Hall of Fame eventually, and that Philly talk show host may be an a--, but I don't see where the "showing class" part comes in, unless you have a strange idea of what showing class is.

    [/QUOTE]


    He showed class towards Randy Johnson. Curt basically said he's not an elite HOF like Johnson but would be grateful for the opportunity to be in Coopesrtown. And wasn't that one of the greatest moments in baseball history when Johnson (On no days rest) relieved Curt in game 7 of the 2001 WS to protect the game and help the Diamondbacks beat the evil empire?

    [/QUOTE]
    Agree with you.  Curt was a good regular season pitcher but better in the playoffs.  I hope that he eventually gets selected to the HOF.  

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from jaytftwofive. Show jaytftwofive's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    In response to Wolfpack13's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    The big mouth talk show host crossed the line by saying Curt is a great pitcher, but not a HOF. How dare he?!? Glad to see Curt showing "class" by calling him a name.

    Here are other people this guy thinks are classy: Bobby Knight, Mel Gibson and Butthead.

    [/QUOTE]


    I said Curt was classy towards Randy Johnson, not the talk show idiot.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Kudos to Curt Schilling for showing class and sticking it to a Philly big mouth.

    In response to slomag's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to nhsteven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to slomag's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to nhsteven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to slomag's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to nhsteven's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to slomag's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Jack Morris got twice the the votes as Schilling.  Nobody can make a rational argument that Morris was a better pitcher than Schilling.  These guys might be baseball writers, but there is a lot of ignorance in the voting.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    This was Morris's 14 try, Schilling's 1st. Add to that Schilling's personality. It's the HOF process, like it or not.

    [/QUOTE]

    Maybe, but it's usually a case of the older guys looking better in retrospect, and nobody ridiculously obviously better joining the ballot for the first time.  Eckersley leaped over Sutter, Gossage & Blyleven, and the talent there was pretty comparable.  The SF Giants won the world series - what would Jack Morris in his prime be on that team.  Their #4 starter? 

    Another thing annoying me is that Mike Piazza seems to be getting a pass on the whole steroid issue - this guy should get zero votes.  He would not have even been a major-leaguer if he hadn't been a juicer. 

    Edgar Martinez is another one - the guy adds .160 points to his slugging at age 32, and everybody gives him a pass on the juice issue?  PLEASE!  

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Calling Jack Morris a #4 starter for any team  is foolish. Many experts feel he's been gipped for not getting in. I agree with them. He was a stud, an ace, and is the poster child for why W-L record matters. And who can forget Game 7 of the 1991 WS, when he was past his prime? That was typical Morris.

    While Piazza is suspicious, it is possible he's innocent, although that's doubtful. IMO, most of them took something at one time or another anyway, many perhaps on just a trial basis. In some cases, it was probably like a crook; they may stop at some point becuase they may be scared they'll get caught.

    As a result nobody's beyond reproach, especially with all the BS we've been subjected to.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    You make out the rotation - you have the SF Giants rotation, plus Jack Morris in his prime - years 25 - 32, WHIP of 1.25, ERA of 3.5.  You going to start him before Matt Cain?  Bumgarner?  Lincecum (I would this year, but year's prior?)?  I wouldn't even start him before Vogelsong.  You're going to put this guy in the hall of fame, but in his best years, he would barely crack the rotation of this year's champ.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Disagree; he would be their ace, and that Pitcher's Park would make him even better, since he was a fly ball pitcher. (Let's see what those guys long term #s shall be as well.) Morris in a Hitters park, led the AL in WINS (a Stat I consider relevant) for the 1980s. He's the biggest reason the Tigers dominated BB in 1984. When you need 1 game, there was nobody bigger this side of Koufax and perhaps Whitey Ford (& Schilling).  He was unflappable & a horse. In the 1991 Game 7 WS, when past his prime, he threw a CG 10 Inning 1-0 Shutout. Can you tell me when was the last time ANYONE did that, even in the Regular Season?

    One thing I'm fairly certain of; if he doesn't get in next yr, the Veterans Commitee shall put him in.

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Selective memory - the very next year he was a disaster, losing three post-season games, giving up 19 runs in 22 PS innings.  His overall PS numbers were almost identical to his regular season averages - he doesn't deserve a bump for being a 'big game pitcher'.

    Center field in the old Tigers stadium was endless - I'd say it was a better pitcher's park than AT&T.  I'd say the NL factor and the era cancel each other out.  Morris on his best day was not in the same league as Matt Cain.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    You had to hit to DEAD center, otherwise it was a hitter's haven,'shaped akin to the Polo Grounds, and you can go look at the historical park #s for evidence. As far as '92 is concerned, I believe he was crisp by then. And if I have selective memory regarding those events, so does 99% of the populace that follows the sport.

    For some reason you have this hard on for Morris. I'm not sure why, beyond some homerish instinct toward Schilling & the HOF that you're somehow transposing to him; no matter; I believe Schilling shall get in eventually, and it has little to no effect on Morris's candidacy or visa versa, since he'll likely get in via the Veteran's Committee. 

     

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