Memo to Posters Who Want Ellsbury beyond 2013: Provide your specifice FA contract Offer

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    Re: Memo to Posters Who Want Ellsbury beyond 2013: Provide your specifice FA contract Offer

    In response to softlaw2's comment:

    This isn't fantasy baseball where you wait until after the fact.



    you right, this is an internet forum where what we say has no bearing on what takes place on the field. who cares?

     
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    Re: Memo to Posters Who Want Ellsbury beyond 2013: Provide your specifice FA contract Offer

    In response to softlaw2's comment:

    Spaceman advocates for the return of Ellsbury beyond 2013.

    The specifics of my FA offer:  Contract offer will be based on performance in 2013, relative to 2014 FA market value, with variables including the 2013 performance of Jackie Bradley Jr. 

    You are avoiding the issue, for which you are not prepared. You are simply reacting, waiting for after the fact.

    The business is about specfifics, Space. It's not about "with variables included the 2013 performance".

    If you advocate for the return of Ellsbury beyond 2013, you are incompetent if you don't put a pre-free agency contract extension on the table for Ellsbury. If he turns down your top extension offer, you have to know the specifics of what you will offer if he has a big year, average year or poor year. You are incompetent if you "wiat on Bradley's performance while you wait for a couple of months of minor league ball" (which is a joke on evaluatiing the plans for him long term).

    If you want Ellsbury beyond 2013, you do not wait to see what happens with Bardley. Bradley can be traded, either way, regardless of what he does. Ellsbury's now in the last few months of the current incomptent GM deciding if he is going to anticipate and plan or simply react at the end. That's why he's incompetent, and why the Red Sox are in the state they are in with 150 million a year and low expecations.

    And to the numnut who says "Bradley in RF and Ellsbury in CF for 2014", that's not going to happen. But, provide your specific contract offer to Ellsbury, if he has a big 2013, good, fair, poor or embarrasing like last year. This isn't fantasy baseball where you wait until after the fact.



    Uh, no.  Actually, and specifically, the business is about waiting and seeing what is going to happen with Ellsbury and Bradley in 2013.   No one has ever in the history of baseball or any other sport for that matter, offered a player a free agent contract before said player hit free agency.  

    Free agency, though, as you say, very much unlike fantasy baseball, is entirely about waiting until after the fact.  The fact that you wish to sucker someone into laying out a huge FA figure for Ellsbury based on impossible projection does not change the actual business.

    If you would like me to take a specific shot at laying out an extension offer, I will gladly do that. 

     

     
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    Re: Memo to Posters Who Want Ellsbury beyond 2013: Provide your specifice FA contract Offer

    In response to softlaw2's comment:

    Reasonable qualifications for a difference between values and morals, if a distinction must be made.  

    Your problem is in thinking that there is no distinction, but if one "must be made".



    And yours is making that distinction so clearly, yet not understanding that what you call one is really the other.

     
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    Re: Memo to Posters Who Want Ellsbury beyond 2013: Provide your specifice FA contract Offer

    In response to softlaw2's comment:

    Uh, no.  Actually, and specifically, the business is about waiting and seeing what is going to happen with Ellsbury and Bradley in 2013.   No one has ever in the history of baseball or any other sport for that matter, offered a player a free agent contract before said player hit free agency.  

    If that were the case, owners wouldn't need to hire general managers. I just got through repeating, over and over, what extension offer would you make him. I then said to provide the details of what your offer would be if he has a big year, good year, fair year, poor year, or embarrassing year.

    Bradley has nothing to do with Ellsbury, If you advocate signing Ellsbury. Which you just did.

    Space, you are incompetent. What you are doing is saying "I advocate signing Ellsbury beyond 2013, but I want to wait and see what Bradley does in AAA and a month or two of MLB, and what Ellsbury does and then I'll base my offer to Ellsbury on the outcome of that".



    Hahahahahaha.  You are hilariously cute today Softy.  

    First, you have asked nothing about extensions.  Not one thing.  Never mind over and over.

    Second, there is not one GM in the business who would decide on any size FA offer to ellsbury before seeing how he perofroams in 2013.  So I guess everyone is incompetent.  

    And, as usual, you are making up your own position as you go.  Nowhere in this thread, prior to your claim that you did, have you said anything about "details of what your offer would be if he has a big year, good year, fair year, poor year, or embarrassing year".

     
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    Re: Memo to Posters Who Want Ellsbury beyond 2013: Provide your specifice FA contract Offer

    In response to softlaw2's comment:

    In fact, you don't make any distinction. 



    I guess you could say I am distinction-less.

     
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    Re: Memo to Posters Who Want Ellsbury beyond 2013: Provide your specifice FA contract Offer

    In response to SpacemanEephus' comment:

    Spaceman advocates for the return of Ellsbury beyond 2013.

    The specifics of my FA offer:  Contract offer will be based on performance in 2013, relative to 2014 FA market value, with variables including the 2013 performance of Jackie Bradley Jr. 



    I agree with this..unless he has an mvp like yr again, catches lightning in a bottle and wants 30 mil per

     
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    Re: Memo to Posters Who Want Ellsbury beyond 2013: Provide your specifice FA contract Offer

    3 years 39 million.

     
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    Re: Memo to Posters Who Want Ellsbury beyond 2013: Provide your specifice FA contract Offer

    Noted: Softlaw wants Jacoby back in 2014 and beyond.

     
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    Re: Memo to Posters Who Want Ellsbury beyond 2013: Provide your specifice FA contract Offer

    In response to softlaw2's comment:

     

    Calm down, Space, you aren't paying attention to anything I write other than what ticks you off. Supra, is the comment I've made more than once, about an extension offer.. The entire point was to expose those who claim to "wait until FA", but who also fail to provide the details of his contract FA offer and provide the values for the obvious possible outcomes of his 2013 season.

     

    If you advocate for the return of Ellsbury beyond 2013, you are incompetent if you don't put a pre-free agency contract extension on the table for Ellsbury

     



    Ahhhhhhhh, now I see.  Please forgive me.  Silly me, I made this assumption that since the thread title is 'Provide your Specific(e) FA contract offer', and that because you kept asking for FA offers for Jitterbug, that we were supposed to take a stab at a free agent offer.

     

    Now, I see the error of my thinking.  By 'provide your specific free agenet contract offer', you actually meant ;'put a pre-free agency contract extension on the table'.

     
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    Re: Memo to Posters Who Want Ellsbury beyond 2013: Provide your specifice FA contract Offer

    In response to SpacemanEephus' comment:

    In response to softlaw2's comment:

     

    Calm down, Space, you aren't paying attention to anything I write other than what ticks you off. Supra, is the comment I've made more than once, about an extension offer.. The entire point was to expose those who claim to "wait until FA", but who also fail to provide the details of his contract FA offer and provide the values for the obvious possible outcomes of his 2013 season.

     

    If you advocate for the return of Ellsbury beyond 2013, you are incompetent if you don't put a pre-free agency contract extension on the table for Ellsbury

     



    Ahhhhhhhh, now I see.  Please forgive me.  Silly me, I made this assumption that since the thread title is 'Provide your Specific(e) contract offer', and that because you kept asking for FA offers for Jitterbug, that we were supposed to take a stab at a free agent offer.

     

    Now, I see the error of my thinking.  By 'provide your specific free agenet contract offer', you actually meant ;'put a pre-free agency contract extension on the table'.




    You would think an attorney would be more careful with his language. :-)

     
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    Re: Memo to Posters Who Want Ellsbury beyond 2013: Provide your specifice FA contract Offer

    In response to softlaw2's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Reasonable, Dividas. I want him traded, with my latest trade having he and Bailey and Carp go to the Rangers, now, for the Rangers top prospect and Moreland. See my other trade proposal thread.

    Just curiouis why you bashed me for mentioning several SPs we could go after this winter (along with very specific details on who I would give up), but it's OK for you to suggest Ellsbury trades left and right for over 3 years running.

     

    Because I don't value Ellsbury in the corner OF, I have Bradley already in CF. My extension value for Ellsbury is one year and 15 million, as insurance for Bradley. Needless to say, I won't waste my time making any offer.

    Sounds like you just made an extension offer, then said you won't "waste [your] time making any offer".

    I think we still find a trade before the season starts that will net us a better prospect than the projected prospect of the comp pick. If Jacoby is having a good year, we may do OK trading him at the deadline, but if he is not traded, I'd offer him the minimum qualifying offer for 1 year, take the draft pick when he walks, and never look back. 

    If he has a big year, I'd be OK with management offering him $42M/3 without a no trade clause, but that won't be enough to get him to stay, so it's hardly worth even making the offer except to net the comp pick and maybe save face with some fans.

     
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