Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?

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    Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?

    Like everyone, I'm excited by Will Middlebrooks' potential. He certainly has the look of a fixture at 3B and potential All-Star one day.

    But let's tone down the hype just a bit. The kid's played 10 games and has 45 at-bats in the Majors.
     
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    Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?

    In Response to Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?:
    [QUOTE]He's already in the conversation for early ROY candidate.  There are only 2 players (Cabrera and Beltre) that are clearly ahead of him at this point for the AS Game.  Other than that he's in striking distance. Thoughts? Also, who was the last descent position player to come out of the Yankees farm system.  Was it Robinson Cano 7 years ago?
    Posted by SoxPatsCelts1988[/QUOTE] In response to your question concerning "decent" position player to come out of the Yankee farm system in recent years, Brett Gardner, Jesus Montero, Jose Tabata and Austin Jackson immediately come to mind.  There may be others, but all of those guys are starters for their respective teams and as such meet the standard of decent players.   

    In the not too distant future other position players who may be good enough some day to play regularly at the big league level include, but are not limited to, Austin Romine, Gary Sanchez, Eduardo Nunez and obviously the team has had more success developing young pitchers in recent years than most teams not named Tampa Bay.  Guys like David Robertson and Ian Kennedy are best in breed thus far, but other guys like Hughes, Phelps, Nova, Chamberlain, Aceves, Karstens, Melancon, Coke and Noesi are all, when healthy, on teams' 25 man rosters, performing adequately in most cases and there are other top prospects "supposedly" in the pipeline who are getting close to making it to the parent club.   
     
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    Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?

    In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game? : Gardner?  A fourth OF'er on most teams?  That's really scraping the bottom of the barrel, no?
    Posted by SoxPatsCelts1988[/QUOTE]

    Middlebrooks has had a terrific first two weeks and he's already better than Gardner, who has had a ton of stolen bases, is one of the best OFers, and gets OB plenty since 2008? I wouldn't expect anything less from this OP.
     
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    Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?

    In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game? : i'm a SOX fan, but i would trade CRAWFUL for GARDNER. of course, the YANK-EMS would have to take carl's obscene salary to complete the deal.
    Posted by mryazz[/QUOTE]You know I was actually surprised that the yankess didn't make a serious run at Crawford. I think that signing happened so fast ... (december 9th); it took everyone by surprise  -especially with him being a lefthander, and Bosoton  already having plenty of speed at the top of the lineup. I like Gardner too.
     
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    Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?

    In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game? : A high K rate is not necessarily unacceptable, if it comes with a lot of power and a decent average.  You were singing Granderson's praises earlier in this thred, and his k% is over 30 (this year).
    Posted by slomag[/QUOTE]
    What I wrote was: The Yankees used Austin Jackson to acquire Curtis Granderson, who finished fourth in the American League MVP voting last season.  

    Middlebrooks, Baseball America's 51st-ranked prospect this year, provides an interesting comparison to Curtis Granderson, BA's 57th-ranked prospect at a similar age in 2005.  Here are some minor league statistics:

    WM 1706 PA, .276/.333/.454/.787, 128 BB (7.5%), 449 K (26.3%)
    CG 1880 PA, .300/.382/.494/.877, 200 BB (10.6%), 355 K (18.9%)

    This season Middlebrooks has struck out in 11 of his small sample of 45 MLB plate appearances (24.4%) while Granderson has struck out in 39 of 152 plate appearances (25.7%). Granderson's career MLB strikeout rate stands at 22.1 percent.

    I understand the excitement about Middlebrooks, but his strikeout rate remains concerning.
     
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  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?

    In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game? : What I wrote was: The Yankees used Austin Jackson to acquire Curtis Granderson, who finished fourth in the American League MVP voting last season.   Middlebrooks, Baseball America's 51st-ranked prospect this year, provides an interesting comparison to Curtis Granderson, BA 's 57th-ranked prospect at a similar age in 2005.  Here are some minor league statistics: WM 1706 PA, .276/.333/.454/.787, 128 BB (7.5%), 449 K (26.3%) CG 1880 PA, .300/.382/.494/.877, 200 BB (10.6%), 355 K (18.9%) This season Middlebrooks has struck out in 11 of his small sample of 45 MLB plate appearances (24.4%) while Granderson has struck out in 39 of 152 plate appearances (25.7%). Granderson's career MLB strikeout rate stands at 22.1 percent. I understand the excitement about Middlebrooks, but his strikeout rate remains concerning.
    Posted by hill55[/QUOTE]

    I think it's a mistake to view all strikeouts equally.  There are situations when swinging for the fences is the correct approach.  The only time a strikeout is more damaging than a regular out is when a runner is in scoring position with less than two out, and of all of Middlebrooks K's (very small sample size, I know) none have come in that scenario.  If Middlebrooks is a smart hitter who strikes out a lot (a la Grady Sizemore) that's fine with me.  

    My bad on CGs K rate - I was looking at ABs instead of PAs.


     
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    Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?

    In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game? : I think it's a mistake to view all strikeouts equally.  There are situations when swinging for the fences is the correct approach.  The only time a strikeout is more damaging than a regular out is when a runner is in scoring position with less than two out, and of all of Middlebrooks K's (very small sample size, I know) none have come in that scenario.  If Middlebrooks is a smart hitter who strikes out a lot (a la Grady Sizemore) that's fine with me.   My bad on CGs K rate - I was looking at ABs instead of PAs.
    Posted by slomag[/QUOTE]
    We can compare minor league stats of Will Middelbrooks and Grady Sizemore:

    WM 1706 PA, .276/.333/.454/.787, 128 BB (7.5%), 449 K (26.3%)
    GS 2344 PA, .290/.387/.415/.791, 265 BB (11.3%), 337 K (14.4%)

    Sizemore has struck out in 20.2 percent of his MLB plate appearances.

    I suspect a player's strikeout rate rarely drops from the minor league level to the MLB level. Middlebrooks has struck out in 26.5 percent of his limited 49 MLB plate appearances despite a highly regarded start.
     
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    Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?

    In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game? : We can compare minor league stats of Will Middelbrooks and Grady Sizemore: WM 1706 PA, .276/.333/.454/.787, 128 BB (7.5%), 449 K (26.3%) GS 2344 PA, .290/.387/.415/.791, 265 BB (11.3%), 337 K (14.4%) Sizemore has struck out in 20.2 percent of his MLB plate appearances. I suspect a player's strikeout rate rarely drops from the minor league level to the MLB level. Middlebrooks has struck out in 26.5 percent of his limited 49 MLB plate appearances despite a highly regarded start.
    Posted by hill55[/QUOTE]I don't care how much he strikes out if he's putting up an ops around 1 and playing well in the field.
     
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    Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?

    In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game? : I don't care how much he strikes out if he's putting up an ops around 1 and playing well in the field.
    Posted by carnie[/QUOTE]
    His minor league numbers suggest that Will Middlebrooks won't maintain a 1.000 OPS at the MLB level.
     
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    Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?

    Back in the days I still lived in Canuckistan, Blue Jay George Bell was interviewed on TV. The Domiican outfielder hit for serious power and decent average, but struck out a lot and took very few pitches. Asked why he swung at anything close, he answered " Because walks don't get you off the island ! Without baseball , I'm cutting sugar cane in the fields".

    Maybe Middlebrooks becomes more selective and less strikeout prone now that he's been noticed ?
    I sure hope so, as long as his power isn't adversely affected.

    BTW, there were rumors in Toronto Bell seduced manager Cito Gaston's woman, even giving her a "dose" ; perhaps Bell might have fit in with the later Derek Lowe / Orlando Cabrera Red Sox.
     
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    Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?

    On this forum I've previously compared Will Middlebrooks to Seattle corner infielder Alex Liddi, another 6-foot-4 righthanded power hitter. Middlebrooks and Liddi, who were born less than a month apart, were the opposing starting thirdbasemen in last year's Futures Game.

    Middlebrooks has displayed more power than Liddi this season, but here are their MLB stats this year entering Monday's game:

    WM 10 G, 45 PA, .310/.356/.714/1.070, 1 SB, 3 BB (6.7%), 11 K (24.4%)
    AL 16 G, 59 PA, .296/.356/.444/.800, 1 SB, 5 BB (8.5%), 16 K (27.1%)

    Middlebrooks and Liddi each went 1-for-4 with two strikeouts in Monday's game.

    Entering Monday's game, Middlebrooks had three errors and a negative 9.4 UZR/150 rating in 10 games at thirdbase this season while Liddi had one error and a negative 5.0 UZR/150 rating in 11 games at thirdbase and one error and a negative 11.5 UZR/150 rating in four games at firstbase.

    Middlebrooks and Liddi displayed similar power in the minors, but Middlebrooks has shown more power in a small sample at the MLB level. Still, I see Middlebrooks and Liddi as similar players.
     
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    Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?

    In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game? : Ok.  There were many last year (including myself) who [rightfully] thought that Jeter was washed up.
    Posted by JB-3[/QUOTE]
     That's what I was joking about.....we heard all about it last year....

     
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    Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?

    In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also This season Middlebrooks has struck out in 11 of his small sample of 45 MLB plate appearances (24.4%) while Granderson has struck out in 39 of 152 plate appearances (25.7%). Granderson's career MLB strikeout rate stands at 22.1 percent. I understand the excitement about Middlebrooks, but his strikeout rate remains concerning.
    Posted by hill55[/QUOTE]

    There you go again Ned, raining on anything good for the Sox.  As if you can't be a productive hitter and strike out a lot.

    2010 - present   > 22% Ks  and wRC+ 
    Wright              131
    J Upton            122
    Willingham       134
    Uggla               122
    Werth              125
    Stanton            130
    C Pena              114
    Howard             124
    BJ Upton           114
    Napoli               141
    Kemp                143
    Granderson       132
    Weeks              122
    Bruce               123




     
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    Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?

    In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also making a run at the AS Game?:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Middlebrooks is already a top ROY candidate... Is he also This season Middlebrooks has struck out in 11 of his small sample of 45 MLB plate appearances (24.4%) while Granderson has struck out in 39 of 152 plate appearances (25.7%). Granderson's career MLB strikeout rate stands at 22.1 percent. I understand the excitement about Middlebrooks, but his strikeout rate remains concerning. Posted by hill55[/QUOTE] There you go again Ned, raining on anything good for the Sox.  As if you can't be a productive hitter and strike out a lot. 2010 - present   /> 22% Ks  and wRC+  Wright              131 J Upton            122 Willingham       134 Uggla               122 Werth              125 Stanton            130 C Pena              114 Howard             124 BJ Upton           114 Napoli               141 Kemp                143 Granderson       132 Weeks              122 Bruce               123
    Posted by tom-uk[/QUOTE]
    Tom, thanks for the list.

    With the exception of Mike Napoli, those 14 players have one thing in common: each experienced an increase in his strikeout rate in making the transition from minor league baseball to Major League Baseball. Here are their career strikeout rates (minor/major):

    17.9/18.6 -- David Wright
    19.7/23.9 -- Justin Upton
    19.9/20.9 -- Josh Willingham
    17.7/22.8 -- Dan Uggla
    20.1/24.5 -- Jayson Werth
    26.6/28.4 -- Giancarlo Stanton
    20.7/26.4 -- Carlos Pena
    27.2/27.4 -- Ryan Howard
    19.6/24.8 -- B.J. Upton
    25.9/24.7 -- Mike Napoli
    18.5/23.3 -- Matt Kemp
    18.9/22.1 -- Curtis Granderson
    18.7/22.8 -- Rickie Weeks
    22.6/22.9 -- Jay Bruce

    Those 14 players averaged a 2.8 percentage point increase in their strikeout rates from the minors to the majors. That does not bode well for Will Middlebrooks, who had a minor league strikeout rate of 26.3 percent.

    Of course, the Red Sox will be thrilled if Middlebrooks is a slightly older version of Giancarlo Stanton ...

    ... and I would not be unhappy, either.
     

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