Middlebrooks

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    Where is LaVarnway? Last I knew his average was below the mendoza line, and two years older than Montero correct?

    Lavarnway has hit at every level of competition that he has been given a chance at. I do not consider a little over 100 PAs/yr over two years at the ML level as being given a chance. However, at the AAA level he has a career OPS of .891, at the AA level .878, and at the A level .901-each with a sample size of over 400 PAs. But don't let the facts interfere with your inability to stop badmouthing the Red Sox. Why change now, right?

     It wasn't me who the comparison with Montero and LaVarnway it was Tom from UK.

    I responded to it in a logical way. Maybe that's why you have problem with it.

    Catcher's typically take longer to develope because of the skills required at the MLB level.

    And why I pointed out LaVarnway was 2 years older than Montero.

    Which is a lot at this stage of young catchers developement.

    Look at the ages of some of the catchers when they were ultimately brought up to stay.

    I think Posada was 24, I think Carlton Fiske was 23.

    Not all are freaks like Johnny Bench or Joe Mauer, two of the games greatest.

    As far as I know Lavarnway was just demoted and hasn't hit well this season, if the truth hurts don't read my posts.

    As I said-in response to your badmouthing of Lavarnway as being "below the Mendoza line", he has not yet been given a chance to play in the majors because he is blocked by our current two catchers. IMO its not a wise course, to let him rot in the minors. Given the chance he will likely be a far more productive player than Montero who IS in the majors but can't win a starting catcher job from a journeyman catcher. The "truth" is that your posts frequently contain inaccuracies. I feel free to correct them.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    Pumpsie calls me a troll, yeah I was here all last season when the Sox were floundering ripping them everyday, gloating.

    That's what a troll does, that wasn't what I was doing.

    I was here talking baseball.

     

     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hingham Hammer. Show Hingham Hammer's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to tom-uk's comment:

     

    Neither Lava or Montero have progressed as expected.

     

    Simplifying Jesus Montero Jeff Sullivan · April 18, 2013 · 

    .. between 2009 and 2010, Baseball America ranked Jesus Montero as the fourth-best prospect in the league. That was one slot behind Giancarlo Stanton, and a few slots above Buster Posey. The next year, BA ranked him as the third-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot behind Mike Trout. The year after that, BA ranked him as the sixth-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot ahead of Jurickson Profar. Scouting is scouting, and prospects are prospects, but nobody does the business better than Baseball America does, and for at least three years in a row, they absolutely loved Jesus Montero. They loved his skillset and they loved his future. It wasn’t a straight Yankees hype job — other sources, objective sources, saw Montero and saw his promise. Montero, if nothing else, was going to be a hell of a bat.

    .....Montero can’t be written off, not at this age and not after just 666 big-league plate appearances. 

    Is Montero going to stay as a catcher?

    • Almost certainly not, because he isn’t very good. It’s always been a question whether Montero could stick behind the plate, and while the Mariners seemed to make a commitment to him in 2013, they did so with an understanding that Mike Zunino shouldn’t be far off. If Zunino develops, he’s the guy. He’s the guy who can actually catch. Montero might be able to catch somewhere else, but he’s never going to be a good defensive catcher, and the reality is that his time at the position is probably just about up.

    Is Montero athletic?

    • lol no. Even after an offseason of learning how to run, Montero still can’t run, and he might be the least athletic player on the team. 

    Is Montero ever going to walk?

    • Jesus Montero isn’t programmed to draw walks. Over the equivalent of one full season, Montero has drawn unintentional walks in less than 5% of his plate appearances. 

    Is Montero ever going to hit for tremendous contact?

    • Montero’s career contact rate is 79%. That’s a little below average. There’s obvious room for improvement, and Montero should improve, probably, but the league’s best contact hitters tend to have been contact hitters all along. If things really break Montero’s way, he’ll eventually settle somewhere in the mid-80s or so. So far this year, he’s been worse than he was last year. A big part of making contact is pitch recognition. That’s the most difficult thing to teach, and Montero hasn’t yet learned it.

    Is Montero ever going to hit for big power?

    • And there’s the thing that made Montero such a super prospect. Scouts loved his power, or his power potential. We’ve seen occasional flashes of incredible strength, so we know for a fact that there’s a major power hitter in there. Montero’s ISO ceiling is at the level of a league elite.Montero keeps mis-hitting baseballs, even when he hits them, so he’s done a lousy job of barreling up. He hasn’t been able to tap into his power reserve, because he hasn’t had the recognition and timing right.

    http://www.ussmariner.com/2013/04/18/simplifying-jesus-montero/#comments

     

     

          3 years ago I thought Montero's future in MLB was that of a DH.

     

          I've seen nothing in his game to change that opinion concerning his defensive abilities.

          What has changed is his downward spiral at the plate.

          DH'ing isn't a position where you want a singles hitter batting less than his weight.

          He's still young enough where he might progress at the plate.

          Behind the plate is a loss cause.

          At least Middlebrooks has some athletic ability. So there's hope for him.

     




     

    I'd be willing to bet you have not seen one Seattle game this season with Montero catching.

    Johnny Bench he isn't but neither is Buster Posey nor was Jorge Posada.

    I watched him catch King Felix's last outing, where he also had a hr and 2 rbis.

    He looked good. Tell me Miquel Cabrera is a good 3rd baseman or Prince a good defensive first baseman.

    Mike Piazza was another catcher who was in the line up primarily for his bat.

    Only a stooge would write off a young prospect this early into their career.

     

     

               "write off"

             Appears Seattle has lost whatever confidence they had in him.

             Why else would they give a journeyman like Kelly S. so much playing time.

            

     




     

    Must be why Montero caught King Felix the last few times out.

    Or why he caught Saturday and then DHed Sunday.

     

    That's an easy one Pop's.

                    With Felix on the mound they can cover Montero's shortcomings and win.

                    When Felix isn't pitching Seattle needs contributions from everyone. Enter Kelly S.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to pumpsie-green's comment:

     

    Where is LaVarnway? Last I knew his average was below the mendoza line, and two years older than Montero correct?

    Lavarnway has hit at every level of competition that he has been given a chance at. I do not consider a little over 100 PAs/yr over two years at the ML level as being given a chance. However, at the AAA level he has a career OPS of .891, at the AA level .878, and at the A level .901-each with a sample size of over 400 PAs. But don't let the facts interfere with your inability to stop badmouthing the Red Sox. Why change now, right?

     It wasn't me who the comparison with Montero and LaVarnway it was Tom from UK.

    I responded to it in a logical way. Maybe that's why you have problem with it.

    Catcher's typically take longer to develope because of the skills required at the MLB level.

    And why I pointed out LaVarnway was 2 years older than Montero.

    Which is a lot at this stage of young catchers developement.

    Look at the ages of some of the catchers when they were ultimately brought up to stay.

    I think Posada was 24, I think Carlton Fiske was 23.

    Not all are freaks like Johnny Bench or Joe Mauer, two of the games greatest.

    As far as I know Lavarnway was just demoted and hasn't hit well this season, if the truth hurts don't read my posts.

    As I said-in response to your badmouthing of Lavarnway as being "below the Mendoza line", he has not yet been given a chance to play in the majors because he is blocked by our current two catchers. IMO its not a wise course, to let him rot in the minors. Given the chance he will likely be a far more productive player than Montero who IS in the majors but can't win a starting catcher job from a journeyman catcher. The "truth" is that your posts frequently contain inaccuracies. I feel free to correct them.

     




     

    Speculating what LaVarnway can do if given the chance can't compare to what Montero is doing and at 2 years younger.

    Not to say LaVarnway isn't a good prospect.

    You could be right he might advance his game quicker playing with a smaller organization who would bring him and let him play.

    But the numbers are what they are.

    Like you keep reminding us.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

    Pumpsie calls me a troll, yeah I was here all last season when the Sox were floundering ripping them everyday, gloating.

    That's what a troll does, that wasn't what I was doing.

    I was here talking baseball.

     

     




    Show me the post where I called you a troll. Trolls are like that guy FrankfromGL. You were discussing baseball, as you said, but since you inaccurately denigrated Lavarnway, I posted what Lav's stats really are. He is a very good prospect and should get a shot at making the club-or be traded for a good pitching prospect. He is a much better prospect now than Montero, who, after over 600 PAs, has a career OPS of just .706. At one time Montero looked good, but he is a defensive liability behind the plate and has not produced offensively in the majors.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hingham Hammer. Show Hingham Hammer's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

    Pumpsie calls me a troll, yeah I was here all last season when the Sox were floundering ripping them everyday, gloating.

    That's what a troll does, that wasn't what I was doing.

    I was here talking baseball.

     

     



     "TALKING BASEBALL"

             My advise would be to stick to a subjest you understand.

             Baseball appears to be a foreign language for you.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Drewski5. Show Drewski5's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to notin's comment:

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

     

    Too early to put labels on any player. Some are performing well, some over their head, and some not up to their potential. Its only April. WMB will probably have his good share of K's every year. He also has the 30HR potential with a good average. Typical #5 hitter stuff. I think he'll figure it out.

     




    The issue really is not the K's.  The issue is the K's with the lack of walks.

     

     

    A hitter who strikes out alot because he sees a lot of pitches and works the count is one thing.  But a hacker who simply takes 3-4 p[itches and U-turns to the dugout is another.   Middlebrooks strikes out 26% of the time, which is not an alrming number.  But he only walks 4% of the time.

     

    The active King of K's, Mark Reynolds, strikes out 32% of the time, but at least he walks 11% of the time, or roughly 3 times as often as Middlebrooks.

     

    Before Middlebrooks came up, I compared him to Butch Hobson.  Unless he does something to change his overly aggressive approach at the plate, this comp is not looking all that bad in some respects...



    Exactly.  Right now, pitchers are taking advantage of his aggressive approach by throwing him curveballs in the dirt.  He needs to learn how to stay off those and wait for the fastball.

    I also would have included him in a trade for JUPP, by the way.  I was saying that last year.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to tom-uk's comment:

     

    Neither Lava or Montero have progressed as expected.

     

    Simplifying Jesus Montero Jeff Sullivan · April 18, 2013 · 

    .. between 2009 and 2010, Baseball America ranked Jesus Montero as the fourth-best prospect in the league. That was one slot behind Giancarlo Stanton, and a few slots above Buster Posey. The next year, BA ranked him as the third-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot behind Mike Trout. The year after that, BA ranked him as the sixth-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot ahead of Jurickson Profar. Scouting is scouting, and prospects are prospects, but nobody does the business better than Baseball America does, and for at least three years in a row, they absolutely loved Jesus Montero. They loved his skillset and they loved his future. It wasn’t a straight Yankees hype job — other sources, objective sources, saw Montero and saw his promise. Montero, if nothing else, was going to be a hell of a bat.

    .....Montero can’t be written off, not at this age and not after just 666 big-league plate appearances. 

    Is Montero going to stay as a catcher?

    • Almost certainly not, because he isn’t very good. It’s always been a question whether Montero could stick behind the plate, and while the Mariners seemed to make a commitment to him in 2013, they did so with an understanding that Mike Zunino shouldn’t be far off. If Zunino develops, he’s the guy. He’s the guy who can actually catch. Montero might be able to catch somewhere else, but he’s never going to be a good defensive catcher, and the reality is that his time at the position is probably just about up.

    Is Montero athletic?

    • lol no. Even after an offseason of learning how to run, Montero still can’t run, and he might be the least athletic player on the team. 

    Is Montero ever going to walk?

    • Jesus Montero isn’t programmed to draw walks. Over the equivalent of one full season, Montero has drawn unintentional walks in less than 5% of his plate appearances. 

    Is Montero ever going to hit for tremendous contact?

    • Montero’s career contact rate is 79%. That’s a little below average. There’s obvious room for improvement, and Montero should improve, probably, but the league’s best contact hitters tend to have been contact hitters all along. If things really break Montero’s way, he’ll eventually settle somewhere in the mid-80s or so. So far this year, he’s been worse than he was last year. A big part of making contact is pitch recognition. That’s the most difficult thing to teach, and Montero hasn’t yet learned it.

    Is Montero ever going to hit for big power?

    • And there’s the thing that made Montero such a super prospect. Scouts loved his power, or his power potential. We’ve seen occasional flashes of incredible strength, so we know for a fact that there’s a major power hitter in there. Montero’s ISO ceiling is at the level of a league elite.Montero keeps mis-hitting baseballs, even when he hits them, so he’s done a lousy job of barreling up. He hasn’t been able to tap into his power reserve, because he hasn’t had the recognition and timing right.

    http://www.ussmariner.com/2013/04/18/simplifying-jesus-montero/#comments

     

     

          3 years ago I thought Montero's future in MLB was that of a DH.

     

          I've seen nothing in his game to change that opinion concerning his defensive abilities.

          What has changed is his downward spiral at the plate.

          DH'ing isn't a position where you want a singles hitter batting less than his weight.

          He's still young enough where he might progress at the plate.

          Behind the plate is a loss cause.

          At least Middlebrooks has some athletic ability. So there's hope for him.

     




     

    I'd be willing to bet you have not seen one Seattle game this season with Montero catching.

    Johnny Bench he isn't but neither is Buster Posey nor was Jorge Posada.

    I watched him catch King Felix's last outing, where he also had a hr and 2 rbis.

    He looked good. Tell me Miquel Cabrera is a good 3rd baseman or Prince a good defensive first baseman.

    Mike Piazza was another catcher who was in the line up primarily for his bat.

    Only a stooge would write off a young prospect this early into their career.

     

     

               "write off"

             Appears Seattle has lost whatever confidence they had in him.

             Why else would they give a journeyman like Kelly S. so much playing time.

            

     




     

    Must be why Montero caught King Felix the last few times out.

    Or why he caught Saturday and then DHed Sunday.

     

     

    That's an easy one Pop's.

                    With Felix on the mound they can cover Montero's shortcomings and win.

     

                    When Felix isn't pitching Seattle needs contributions from everyone. Enter Kelly S.




    Oh is that what it is?

    Just throw a body out there although King Felix has a proclivity to throw a lot of balls into the dirt.

    Grasping for straws.

    Truth is that it pains you to see Montero behind the plate at all.

    Later.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    Pumpsie calls me a troll, yeah I was here all last season when the Sox were floundering ripping them everyday, gloating.

    That's what a troll does, that wasn't what I was doing.

    I was here talking baseball.

     

     

     



     "TALKING BASEBALL"

     

             My advise would be to stick to a subjest you understand.

             Baseball appears to be a foreign language for you.




    Why don't you buy some chickens?

    Give you something to do in the morning, and an audience who would buy your arguments.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hingham Hammer. Show Hingham Hammer's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to tom-uk's comment:

     

    Neither Lava or Montero have progressed as expected.

     

    Simplifying Jesus Montero Jeff Sullivan · April 18, 2013 · 

    .. between 2009 and 2010, Baseball America ranked Jesus Montero as the fourth-best prospect in the league. That was one slot behind Giancarlo Stanton, and a few slots above Buster Posey. The next year, BA ranked him as the third-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot behind Mike Trout. The year after that, BA ranked him as the sixth-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot ahead of Jurickson Profar. Scouting is scouting, and prospects are prospects, but nobody does the business better than Baseball America does, and for at least three years in a row, they absolutely loved Jesus Montero. They loved his skillset and they loved his future. It wasn’t a straight Yankees hype job — other sources, objective sources, saw Montero and saw his promise. Montero, if nothing else, was going to be a hell of a bat.

    .....Montero can’t be written off, not at this age and not after just 666 big-league plate appearances. 

    Is Montero going to stay as a catcher?

    • Almost certainly not, because he isn’t very good. It’s always been a question whether Montero could stick behind the plate, and while the Mariners seemed to make a commitment to him in 2013, they did so with an understanding that Mike Zunino shouldn’t be far off. If Zunino develops, he’s the guy. He’s the guy who can actually catch. Montero might be able to catch somewhere else, but he’s never going to be a good defensive catcher, and the reality is that his time at the position is probably just about up.

    Is Montero athletic?

    • lol no. Even after an offseason of learning how to run, Montero still can’t run, and he might be the least athletic player on the team. 

    Is Montero ever going to walk?

    • Jesus Montero isn’t programmed to draw walks. Over the equivalent of one full season, Montero has drawn unintentional walks in less than 5% of his plate appearances. 

    Is Montero ever going to hit for tremendous contact?

    • Montero’s career contact rate is 79%. That’s a little below average. There’s obvious room for improvement, and Montero should improve, probably, but the league’s best contact hitters tend to have been contact hitters all along. If things really break Montero’s way, he’ll eventually settle somewhere in the mid-80s or so. So far this year, he’s been worse than he was last year. A big part of making contact is pitch recognition. That’s the most difficult thing to teach, and Montero hasn’t yet learned it.

    Is Montero ever going to hit for big power?

    • And there’s the thing that made Montero such a super prospect. Scouts loved his power, or his power potential. We’ve seen occasional flashes of incredible strength, so we know for a fact that there’s a major power hitter in there. Montero’s ISO ceiling is at the level of a league elite.Montero keeps mis-hitting baseballs, even when he hits them, so he’s done a lousy job of barreling up. He hasn’t been able to tap into his power reserve, because he hasn’t had the recognition and timing right.

    http://www.ussmariner.com/2013/04/18/simplifying-jesus-montero/#comments

     

     

          3 years ago I thought Montero's future in MLB was that of a DH.

     

          I've seen nothing in his game to change that opinion concerning his defensive abilities.

          What has changed is his downward spiral at the plate.

          DH'ing isn't a position where you want a singles hitter batting less than his weight.

          He's still young enough where he might progress at the plate.

          Behind the plate is a loss cause.

          At least Middlebrooks has some athletic ability. So there's hope for him.

     




     

    I'd be willing to bet you have not seen one Seattle game this season with Montero catching.

    Johnny Bench he isn't but neither is Buster Posey nor was Jorge Posada.

    I watched him catch King Felix's last outing, where he also had a hr and 2 rbis.

    He looked good. Tell me Miquel Cabrera is a good 3rd baseman or Prince a good defensive first baseman.

    Mike Piazza was another catcher who was in the line up primarily for his bat.

    Only a stooge would write off a young prospect this early into their career.

     

     

               "write off"

             Appears Seattle has lost whatever confidence they had in him.

             Why else would they give a journeyman like Kelly S. so much playing time.

            

     




     

    Must be why Montero caught King Felix the last few times out.

    Or why he caught Saturday and then DHed Sunday.

     

     

    That's an easy one Pop's.

                    With Felix on the mound they can cover Montero's shortcomings and win.

     

                    When Felix isn't pitching Seattle needs contributions from everyone. Enter Kelly S.

     




     

    Oh is that what it is?

    Just throw a body out there although King Felix has a proclivity to throw a lot of balls into the dirt.

    Grasping for straws.

    Truth is that it pains you to see Montero behind the plate at all.

    Later.

     



                Short lived pain considering he only catches 50% of the games.

                Glad you were wrong again when early in the season you posted that Seattle had committed to Montero behind the plate.

                50% isn't much of a commitment.

     

                

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to tom-uk's comment:

     

    Neither Lava or Montero have progressed as expected.

     

    Simplifying Jesus Montero Jeff Sullivan · April 18, 2013 · 

    .. between 2009 and 2010, Baseball America ranked Jesus Montero as the fourth-best prospect in the league. That was one slot behind Giancarlo Stanton, and a few slots above Buster Posey. The next year, BA ranked him as the third-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot behind Mike Trout. The year after that, BA ranked him as the sixth-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot ahead of Jurickson Profar. Scouting is scouting, and prospects are prospects, but nobody does the business better than Baseball America does, and for at least three years in a row, they absolutely loved Jesus Montero. They loved his skillset and they loved his future. It wasn’t a straight Yankees hype job — other sources, objective sources, saw Montero and saw his promise. Montero, if nothing else, was going to be a hell of a bat.

    .....Montero can’t be written off, not at this age and not after just 666 big-league plate appearances. 

    Is Montero going to stay as a catcher?

    • Almost certainly not, because he isn’t very good. It’s always been a question whether Montero could stick behind the plate, and while the Mariners seemed to make a commitment to him in 2013, they did so with an understanding that Mike Zunino shouldn’t be far off. If Zunino develops, he’s the guy. He’s the guy who can actually catch. Montero might be able to catch somewhere else, but he’s never going to be a good defensive catcher, and the reality is that his time at the position is probably just about up.

    Is Montero athletic?

    • lol no. Even after an offseason of learning how to run, Montero still can’t run, and he might be the least athletic player on the team. 

    Is Montero ever going to walk?

    • Jesus Montero isn’t programmed to draw walks. Over the equivalent of one full season, Montero has drawn unintentional walks in less than 5% of his plate appearances. 

    Is Montero ever going to hit for tremendous contact?

    • Montero’s career contact rate is 79%. That’s a little below average. There’s obvious room for improvement, and Montero should improve, probably, but the league’s best contact hitters tend to have been contact hitters all along. If things really break Montero’s way, he’ll eventually settle somewhere in the mid-80s or so. So far this year, he’s been worse than he was last year. A big part of making contact is pitch recognition. That’s the most difficult thing to teach, and Montero hasn’t yet learned it.

    Is Montero ever going to hit for big power?

    • And there’s the thing that made Montero such a super prospect. Scouts loved his power, or his power potential. We’ve seen occasional flashes of incredible strength, so we know for a fact that there’s a major power hitter in there. Montero’s ISO ceiling is at the level of a league elite.Montero keeps mis-hitting baseballs, even when he hits them, so he’s done a lousy job of barreling up. He hasn’t been able to tap into his power reserve, because he hasn’t had the recognition and timing right.

    http://www.ussmariner.com/2013/04/18/simplifying-jesus-montero/#comments

     

     

          3 years ago I thought Montero's future in MLB was that of a DH.

     

          I've seen nothing in his game to change that opinion concerning his defensive abilities.

          What has changed is his downward spiral at the plate.

          DH'ing isn't a position where you want a singles hitter batting less than his weight.

          He's still young enough where he might progress at the plate.

          Behind the plate is a loss cause.

          At least Middlebrooks has some athletic ability. So there's hope for him.

     




     

    I'd be willing to bet you have not seen one Seattle game this season with Montero catching.

    Johnny Bench he isn't but neither is Buster Posey nor was Jorge Posada.

    I watched him catch King Felix's last outing, where he also had a hr and 2 rbis.

    He looked good. Tell me Miquel Cabrera is a good 3rd baseman or Prince a good defensive first baseman.

    Mike Piazza was another catcher who was in the line up primarily for his bat.

    Only a stooge would write off a young prospect this early into their career.

     

     

               "write off"

             Appears Seattle has lost whatever confidence they had in him.

             Why else would they give a journeyman like Kelly S. so much playing time.

            

     




     

    Must be why Montero caught King Felix the last few times out.

    Or why he caught Saturday and then DHed Sunday.

     

     

    That's an easy one Pop's.

                    With Felix on the mound they can cover Montero's shortcomings and win.

     

                    When Felix isn't pitching Seattle needs contributions from everyone. Enter Kelly S.

     




     

    Oh is that what it is?

    Just throw a body out there although King Felix has a proclivity to throw a lot of balls into the dirt.

    Grasping for straws.

    Truth is that it pains you to see Montero behind the plate at all.

    Later.

     



                Short lived pain considering he only catches 50% of the games.

     

                




    Oh I see.

    Before you said Montero couldn't catch at this level, now the standard has changed to only 50% of the time.

    Desperado time.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

    In response to pumpsie-green's comment:

     

    Where is LaVarnway? Last I knew his average was below the mendoza line, and two years older than Montero correct?

    Lavarnway has hit at every level of competition that he has been given a chance at. I do not consider a little over 100 PAs/yr over two years at the ML level as being given a chance. However, at the AAA level he has a career OPS of .891, at the AA level .878, and at the A level .901-each with a sample size of over 400 PAs. But don't let the facts interfere with your inability to stop badmouthing the Red Sox. Why change now, right?

     It wasn't me who the comparison with Montero and LaVarnway it was Tom from UK.

    I responded to it in a logical way. Maybe that's why you have problem with it.

    Catcher's typically take longer to develope because of the skills required at the MLB level.

    And why I pointed out LaVarnway was 2 years older than Montero.

    Which is a lot at this stage of young catchers developement.

    Look at the ages of some of the catchers when they were ultimately brought up to stay.

    I think Posada was 24, I think Carlton Fiske was 23.

    Not all are freaks like Johnny Bench or Joe Mauer, two of the games greatest.

    As far as I know Lavarnway was just demoted and hasn't hit well this season, if the truth hurts don't read my posts.

    As I said-in response to your badmouthing of Lavarnway as being "below the Mendoza line", he has not yet been given a chance to play in the majors because he is blocked by our current two catchers. IMO its not a wise course, to let him rot in the minors. Given the chance he will likely be a far more productive player than Montero who IS in the majors but can't win a starting catcher job from a journeyman catcher. The "truth" is that your posts frequently contain inaccuracies. I feel free to correct them.

     




     

    Speculating what LaVarnway can do if given the chance can't compare to what Montero is doing and at 2 years younger.

    Not to say LaVarnway isn't a good prospect.

    You could be right he might advance his game quicker playing with a smaller organization who would bring him and let him play.

    But the numbers are what they are.

    Like you keep reminding us.




    When a player only has 100 PAs per year, thats not a fair sample size on which to judge him. Lavarnway at the AAA level has an OPS about 50 points higher than Montero had at the same level-.843 v .891, both with enough PAs to be able to draw some conclusions. Personally, I would trade Salty and give Lavarnway a chance. Salty is likely to bring a higher return since he is an established player. I would package him with other prospects to get more pitching.

     
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  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hingham Hammer. Show Hingham Hammer's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

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    In response to tom-uk's comment:

     

    Neither Lava or Montero have progressed as expected.

     

    Simplifying Jesus Montero Jeff Sullivan · April 18, 2013 · 

    .. between 2009 and 2010, Baseball America ranked Jesus Montero as the fourth-best prospect in the league. That was one slot behind Giancarlo Stanton, and a few slots above Buster Posey. The next year, BA ranked him as the third-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot behind Mike Trout. The year after that, BA ranked him as the sixth-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot ahead of Jurickson Profar. Scouting is scouting, and prospects are prospects, but nobody does the business better than Baseball America does, and for at least three years in a row, they absolutely loved Jesus Montero. They loved his skillset and they loved his future. It wasn’t a straight Yankees hype job — other sources, objective sources, saw Montero and saw his promise. Montero, if nothing else, was going to be a hell of a bat.

    .....Montero can’t be written off, not at this age and not after just 666 big-league plate appearances. 

    Is Montero going to stay as a catcher?

    • Almost certainly not, because he isn’t very good. It’s always been a question whether Montero could stick behind the plate, and while the Mariners seemed to make a commitment to him in 2013, they did so with an understanding that Mike Zunino shouldn’t be far off. If Zunino develops, he’s the guy. He’s the guy who can actually catch. Montero might be able to catch somewhere else, but he’s never going to be a good defensive catcher, and the reality is that his time at the position is probably just about up.

    Is Montero athletic?

    • lol no. Even after an offseason of learning how to run, Montero still can’t run, and he might be the least athletic player on the team. 

    Is Montero ever going to walk?

    • Jesus Montero isn’t programmed to draw walks. Over the equivalent of one full season, Montero has drawn unintentional walks in less than 5% of his plate appearances. 

    Is Montero ever going to hit for tremendous contact?

    • Montero’s career contact rate is 79%. That’s a little below average. There’s obvious room for improvement, and Montero should improve, probably, but the league’s best contact hitters tend to have been contact hitters all along. If things really break Montero’s way, he’ll eventually settle somewhere in the mid-80s or so. So far this year, he’s been worse than he was last year. A big part of making contact is pitch recognition. That’s the most difficult thing to teach, and Montero hasn’t yet learned it.

    Is Montero ever going to hit for big power?

    • And there’s the thing that made Montero such a super prospect. Scouts loved his power, or his power potential. We’ve seen occasional flashes of incredible strength, so we know for a fact that there’s a major power hitter in there. Montero’s ISO ceiling is at the level of a league elite.Montero keeps mis-hitting baseballs, even when he hits them, so he’s done a lousy job of barreling up. He hasn’t been able to tap into his power reserve, because he hasn’t had the recognition and timing right.

    http://www.ussmariner.com/2013/04/18/simplifying-jesus-montero/#comments

     

     

          3 years ago I thought Montero's future in MLB was that of a DH.

     

          I've seen nothing in his game to change that opinion concerning his defensive abilities.

          What has changed is his downward spiral at the plate.

          DH'ing isn't a position where you want a singles hitter batting less than his weight.

          He's still young enough where he might progress at the plate.

          Behind the plate is a loss cause.

          At least Middlebrooks has some athletic ability. So there's hope for him.

     




     

    I'd be willing to bet you have not seen one Seattle game this season with Montero catching.

    Johnny Bench he isn't but neither is Buster Posey nor was Jorge Posada.

    I watched him catch King Felix's last outing, where he also had a hr and 2 rbis.

    He looked good. Tell me Miquel Cabrera is a good 3rd baseman or Prince a good defensive first baseman.

    Mike Piazza was another catcher who was in the line up primarily for his bat.

    Only a stooge would write off a young prospect this early into their career.

     

     

               "write off"

             Appears Seattle has lost whatever confidence they had in him.

             Why else would they give a journeyman like Kelly S. so much playing time.

            

     




     

    Must be why Montero caught King Felix the last few times out.

    Or why he caught Saturday and then DHed Sunday.

     

     

    That's an easy one Pop's.

                    With Felix on the mound they can cover Montero's shortcomings and win.

     

                    When Felix isn't pitching Seattle needs contributions from everyone. Enter Kelly S.

     




     

    Oh is that what it is?

    Just throw a body out there although King Felix has a proclivity to throw a lot of balls into the dirt.

    Grasping for straws.

    Truth is that it pains you to see Montero behind the plate at all.

    Later.

     



                Short lived pain considering he only catches 50% of the games.

     

                

     




     

    Oh I see.

    Before you said Montero couldn't catch at this level, now the standard has changed to only 50% of the time.

    Desperado time.



             Not at all.

             The point is Montero is sharing catching duties with a journeyman while the organization waits for their catcher of the future to arrive.

             When that happens he might not even be their DH if he continues to bat .217 with little power.

             You really don't grasp the game very well Pop's.

             Everyone but you see's it.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hingham Hammer. Show Hingham Hammer's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    Pumpsie calls me a troll, yeah I was here all last season when the Sox were floundering ripping them everyday, gloating.

    That's what a troll does, that wasn't what I was doing.

    I was here talking baseball.

     

     

     



     "TALKING BASEBALL"

     

             My advise would be to stick to a subjest you understand.

             Baseball appears to be a foreign language for you.

     




     

    Why don't you buy some chickens?

    Give you something to do in the morning, and an audience who would buy your arguments.



              "something to do in the morning"

                   Just filling time waiting on a favorable tide.

                   Great day to be outside.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

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    In response to tom-uk's comment:

     

    Neither Lava or Montero have progressed as expected.

     

    Simplifying Jesus Montero Jeff Sullivan · April 18, 2013 · 

    .. between 2009 and 2010, Baseball America ranked Jesus Montero as the fourth-best prospect in the league. That was one slot behind Giancarlo Stanton, and a few slots above Buster Posey. The next year, BA ranked him as the third-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot behind Mike Trout. The year after that, BA ranked him as the sixth-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot ahead of Jurickson Profar. Scouting is scouting, and prospects are prospects, but nobody does the business better than Baseball America does, and for at least three years in a row, they absolutely loved Jesus Montero. They loved his skillset and they loved his future. It wasn’t a straight Yankees hype job — other sources, objective sources, saw Montero and saw his promise. Montero, if nothing else, was going to be a hell of a bat.

    .....Montero can’t be written off, not at this age and not after just 666 big-league plate appearances. 

    Is Montero going to stay as a catcher?

    • Almost certainly not, because he isn’t very good. It’s always been a question whether Montero could stick behind the plate, and while the Mariners seemed to make a commitment to him in 2013, they did so with an understanding that Mike Zunino shouldn’t be far off. If Zunino develops, he’s the guy. He’s the guy who can actually catch. Montero might be able to catch somewhere else, but he’s never going to be a good defensive catcher, and the reality is that his time at the position is probably just about up.

    Is Montero athletic?

    • lol no. Even after an offseason of learning how to run, Montero still can’t run, and he might be the least athletic player on the team. 

    Is Montero ever going to walk?

    • Jesus Montero isn’t programmed to draw walks. Over the equivalent of one full season, Montero has drawn unintentional walks in less than 5% of his plate appearances. 

    Is Montero ever going to hit for tremendous contact?

    • Montero’s career contact rate is 79%. That’s a little below average. There’s obvious room for improvement, and Montero should improve, probably, but the league’s best contact hitters tend to have been contact hitters all along. If things really break Montero’s way, he’ll eventually settle somewhere in the mid-80s or so. So far this year, he’s been worse than he was last year. A big part of making contact is pitch recognition. That’s the most difficult thing to teach, and Montero hasn’t yet learned it.

    Is Montero ever going to hit for big power?

    • And there’s the thing that made Montero such a super prospect. Scouts loved his power, or his power potential. We’ve seen occasional flashes of incredible strength, so we know for a fact that there’s a major power hitter in there. Montero’s ISO ceiling is at the level of a league elite.Montero keeps mis-hitting baseballs, even when he hits them, so he’s done a lousy job of barreling up. He hasn’t been able to tap into his power reserve, because he hasn’t had the recognition and timing right.

    http://www.ussmariner.com/2013/04/18/simplifying-jesus-montero/#comments

     

     

          3 years ago I thought Montero's future in MLB was that of a DH.

     

          I've seen nothing in his game to change that opinion concerning his defensive abilities.

          What has changed is his downward spiral at the plate.

          DH'ing isn't a position where you want a singles hitter batting less than his weight.

          He's still young enough where he might progress at the plate.

          Behind the plate is a loss cause.

          At least Middlebrooks has some athletic ability. So there's hope for him.

     




     

    I'd be willing to bet you have not seen one Seattle game this season with Montero catching.

    Johnny Bench he isn't but neither is Buster Posey nor was Jorge Posada.

    I watched him catch King Felix's last outing, where he also had a hr and 2 rbis.

    He looked good. Tell me Miquel Cabrera is a good 3rd baseman or Prince a good defensive first baseman.

    Mike Piazza was another catcher who was in the line up primarily for his bat.

    Only a stooge would write off a young prospect this early into their career.

     

     

               "write off"

             Appears Seattle has lost whatever confidence they had in him.

             Why else would they give a journeyman like Kelly S. so much playing time.

            

     




     

    Must be why Montero caught King Felix the last few times out.

    Or why he caught Saturday and then DHed Sunday.

     

     

    That's an easy one Pop's.

                    With Felix on the mound they can cover Montero's shortcomings and win.

     

                    When Felix isn't pitching Seattle needs contributions from everyone. Enter Kelly S.

     




     

    Oh is that what it is?

    Just throw a body out there although King Felix has a proclivity to throw a lot of balls into the dirt.

    Grasping for straws.

    Truth is that it pains you to see Montero behind the plate at all.

    Later.

     



                Short lived pain considering he only catches 50% of the games.

     

                

     




     

    Oh I see.

    Before you said Montero couldn't catch at this level, now the standard has changed to only 50% of the time.

    Desperado time.

     



             Not at all.

     

             The point is Montero is sharing catching duties with a journeyman while the organization waits for their catcher of the future to arrive.

             When that happens he might not even be their DH if he continues to bat .217 with little power.

             You really don't grasp the game very well Pop's.

             Everyone but you see's it.




    They do have a great catching prospect Mike Zunino that's why they signed Shoppach for only 1 season.

    Check out #3 on the list, you might learn something.

    http://www.scoutingbook.com/prospects/c

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    Pumpsie calls me a troll, yeah I was here all last season when the Sox were floundering ripping them everyday, gloating.

    That's what a troll does, that wasn't what I was doing.

    I was here talking baseball.

     

     

     



     "TALKING BASEBALL"

     

             My advise would be to stick to a subjest you understand.

             Baseball appears to be a foreign language for you.

     




     

    Why don't you buy some chickens?

    Give you something to do in the morning, and an audience who would buy your arguments.

     



              "something to do in the morning"

     

                   Just filling time waiting on a favorable tide.

                   Great day to be outside.




    So was Gilligan.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hingham Hammer. Show Hingham Hammer's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to tom-uk's comment:

     

    Neither Lava or Montero have progressed as expected.

     

    Simplifying Jesus Montero Jeff Sullivan · April 18, 2013 · 

    .. between 2009 and 2010, Baseball America ranked Jesus Montero as the fourth-best prospect in the league. That was one slot behind Giancarlo Stanton, and a few slots above Buster Posey. The next year, BA ranked him as the third-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot behind Mike Trout. The year after that, BA ranked him as the sixth-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot ahead of Jurickson Profar. Scouting is scouting, and prospects are prospects, but nobody does the business better than Baseball America does, and for at least three years in a row, they absolutely loved Jesus Montero. They loved his skillset and they loved his future. It wasn’t a straight Yankees hype job — other sources, objective sources, saw Montero and saw his promise. Montero, if nothing else, was going to be a hell of a bat.

    .....Montero can’t be written off, not at this age and not after just 666 big-league plate appearances. 

    Is Montero going to stay as a catcher?

    • Almost certainly not, because he isn’t very good. It’s always been a question whether Montero could stick behind the plate, and while the Mariners seemed to make a commitment to him in 2013, they did so with an understanding that Mike Zunino shouldn’t be far off. If Zunino develops, he’s the guy. He’s the guy who can actually catch. Montero might be able to catch somewhere else, but he’s never going to be a good defensive catcher, and the reality is that his time at the position is probably just about up.

    Is Montero athletic?

    • lol no. Even after an offseason of learning how to run, Montero still can’t run, and he might be the least athletic player on the team. 

    Is Montero ever going to walk?

    • Jesus Montero isn’t programmed to draw walks. Over the equivalent of one full season, Montero has drawn unintentional walks in less than 5% of his plate appearances. 

    Is Montero ever going to hit for tremendous contact?

    • Montero’s career contact rate is 79%. That’s a little below average. There’s obvious room for improvement, and Montero should improve, probably, but the league’s best contact hitters tend to have been contact hitters all along. If things really break Montero’s way, he’ll eventually settle somewhere in the mid-80s or so. So far this year, he’s been worse than he was last year. A big part of making contact is pitch recognition. That’s the most difficult thing to teach, and Montero hasn’t yet learned it.

    Is Montero ever going to hit for big power?

    • And there’s the thing that made Montero such a super prospect. Scouts loved his power, or his power potential. We’ve seen occasional flashes of incredible strength, so we know for a fact that there’s a major power hitter in there. Montero’s ISO ceiling is at the level of a league elite.Montero keeps mis-hitting baseballs, even when he hits them, so he’s done a lousy job of barreling up. He hasn’t been able to tap into his power reserve, because he hasn’t had the recognition and timing right.

    http://www.ussmariner.com/2013/04/18/simplifying-jesus-montero/#comments

     

     

          3 years ago I thought Montero's future in MLB was that of a DH.

     

          I've seen nothing in his game to change that opinion concerning his defensive abilities.

          What has changed is his downward spiral at the plate.

          DH'ing isn't a position where you want a singles hitter batting less than his weight.

          He's still young enough where he might progress at the plate.

          Behind the plate is a loss cause.

          At least Middlebrooks has some athletic ability. So there's hope for him.

     




     

    I'd be willing to bet you have not seen one Seattle game this season with Montero catching.

    Johnny Bench he isn't but neither is Buster Posey nor was Jorge Posada.

    I watched him catch King Felix's last outing, where he also had a hr and 2 rbis.

    He looked good. Tell me Miquel Cabrera is a good 3rd baseman or Prince a good defensive first baseman.

    Mike Piazza was another catcher who was in the line up primarily for his bat.

    Only a stooge would write off a young prospect this early into their career.

     

     

               "write off"

             Appears Seattle has lost whatever confidence they had in him.

             Why else would they give a journeyman like Kelly S. so much playing time.

            

     




     

    Must be why Montero caught King Felix the last few times out.

    Or why he caught Saturday and then DHed Sunday.

     

     

    That's an easy one Pop's.

                    With Felix on the mound they can cover Montero's shortcomings and win.

     

                    When Felix isn't pitching Seattle needs contributions from everyone. Enter Kelly S.

     




     

    Oh is that what it is?

    Just throw a body out there although King Felix has a proclivity to throw a lot of balls into the dirt.

    Grasping for straws.

    Truth is that it pains you to see Montero behind the plate at all.

    Later.

     



                Short lived pain considering he only catches 50% of the games.

     

                

     




     

    Oh I see.

    Before you said Montero couldn't catch at this level, now the standard has changed to only 50% of the time.

    Desperado time.

     



             Not at all.

     

             The point is Montero is sharing catching duties with a journeyman while the organization waits for their catcher of the future to arrive.

             When that happens he might not even be their DH if he continues to bat .217 with little power.

             You really don't grasp the game very well Pop's.

             Everyone but you see's it.

     




     

    They do have a great catching prospect Mike Zunino that's why they signed Shoppach for only 1 season.

    Check out #3 on the list, you might learn something.

    http://www.scoutingbook.com/prospects/c



          Something tells me Shoppach might be back or they will find another backup to catch.

          Montero belongs in the minors.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from slomag. Show slomag's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

    In response to tom-uk's comment:

     

    Neither Lava or Montero have progressed as expected.

     

    Simplifying Jesus Montero Jeff Sullivan · April 18, 2013 · 

    .. between 2009 and 2010, Baseball America ranked Jesus Montero as the fourth-best prospect in the league. That was one slot behind Giancarlo Stanton, and a few slots above Buster Posey. The next year, BA ranked him as the third-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot behind Mike Trout. The year after that, BA ranked him as the sixth-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot ahead of Jurickson Profar. Scouting is scouting, and prospects are prospects, but nobody does the business better than Baseball America does, and for at least three years in a row, they absolutely loved Jesus Montero. They loved his skillset and they loved his future. It wasn’t a straight Yankees hype job — other sources, objective sources, saw Montero and saw his promise. Montero, if nothing else, was going to be a hell of a bat.

    .....Montero can’t be written off, not at this age and not after just 666 big-league plate appearances. 

    Is Montero going to stay as a catcher?

    • Almost certainly not, because he isn’t very good. It’s always been a question whether Montero could stick behind the plate, and while the Mariners seemed to make a commitment to him in 2013, they did so with an understanding that Mike Zunino shouldn’t be far off. If Zunino develops, he’s the guy. He’s the guy who can actually catch. Montero might be able to catch somewhere else, but he’s never going to be a good defensive catcher, and the reality is that his time at the position is probably just about up.

    Is Montero athletic?

    • lol no. Even after an offseason of learning how to run, Montero still can’t run, and he might be the least athletic player on the team. 

    Is Montero ever going to walk?

    • Jesus Montero isn’t programmed to draw walks. Over the equivalent of one full season, Montero has drawn unintentional walks in less than 5% of his plate appearances. 

    Is Montero ever going to hit for tremendous contact?

    • Montero’s career contact rate is 79%. That’s a little below average. There’s obvious room for improvement, and Montero should improve, probably, but the league’s best contact hitters tend to have been contact hitters all along. If things really break Montero’s way, he’ll eventually settle somewhere in the mid-80s or so. So far this year, he’s been worse than he was last year. A big part of making contact is pitch recognition. That’s the most difficult thing to teach, and Montero hasn’t yet learned it.

    Is Montero ever going to hit for big power?

    • And there’s the thing that made Montero such a super prospect. Scouts loved his power, or his power potential. We’ve seen occasional flashes of incredible strength, so we know for a fact that there’s a major power hitter in there. Montero’s ISO ceiling is at the level of a league elite.Montero keeps mis-hitting baseballs, even when he hits them, so he’s done a lousy job of barreling up. He hasn’t been able to tap into his power reserve, because he hasn’t had the recognition and timing right.

    http://www.ussmariner.com/2013/04/18/simplifying-jesus-montero/#comments

     




     

    Where is LaVarnway? Last I knew his average was below the mendoza line, and two years older than Montero correct?




    The only thing I worry about with Lavarnway is that his power has dipped the last couple of years.  Is that permanent?  Hard to say.  But his defense has come a long way, he is great at throwing out runners (32% last year, 44% thus far this year) and he still gets on base 4 out of 10 trips to the plate.  I don't know how you can consider that a step down from what Montero has done thus far in his career.  More to the point, nobody ever ranked Lavarnway alongside Trout, Harper & Stanton.  

     

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to tom-uk's comment:

     

    Neither Lava or Montero have progressed as expected.

     

    Simplifying Jesus Montero Jeff Sullivan · April 18, 2013 · 

    .. between 2009 and 2010, Baseball America ranked Jesus Montero as the fourth-best prospect in the league. That was one slot behind Giancarlo Stanton, and a few slots above Buster Posey. The next year, BA ranked him as the third-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot behind Mike Trout. The year after that, BA ranked him as the sixth-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot ahead of Jurickson Profar. Scouting is scouting, and prospects are prospects, but nobody does the business better than Baseball America does, and for at least three years in a row, they absolutely loved Jesus Montero. They loved his skillset and they loved his future. It wasn’t a straight Yankees hype job — other sources, objective sources, saw Montero and saw his promise. Montero, if nothing else, was going to be a hell of a bat.

    .....Montero can’t be written off, not at this age and not after just 666 big-league plate appearances. 

    Is Montero going to stay as a catcher?

    • Almost certainly not, because he isn’t very good. It’s always been a question whether Montero could stick behind the plate, and while the Mariners seemed to make a commitment to him in 2013, they did so with an understanding that Mike Zunino shouldn’t be far off. If Zunino develops, he’s the guy. He’s the guy who can actually catch. Montero might be able to catch somewhere else, but he’s never going to be a good defensive catcher, and the reality is that his time at the position is probably just about up.

    Is Montero athletic?

    • lol no. Even after an offseason of learning how to run, Montero still can’t run, and he might be the least athletic player on the team. 

    Is Montero ever going to walk?

    • Jesus Montero isn’t programmed to draw walks. Over the equivalent of one full season, Montero has drawn unintentional walks in less than 5% of his plate appearances. 

    Is Montero ever going to hit for tremendous contact?

    • Montero’s career contact rate is 79%. That’s a little below average. There’s obvious room for improvement, and Montero should improve, probably, but the league’s best contact hitters tend to have been contact hitters all along. If things really break Montero’s way, he’ll eventually settle somewhere in the mid-80s or so. So far this year, he’s been worse than he was last year. A big part of making contact is pitch recognition. That’s the most difficult thing to teach, and Montero hasn’t yet learned it.

    Is Montero ever going to hit for big power?

    • And there’s the thing that made Montero such a super prospect. Scouts loved his power, or his power potential. We’ve seen occasional flashes of incredible strength, so we know for a fact that there’s a major power hitter in there. Montero’s ISO ceiling is at the level of a league elite.Montero keeps mis-hitting baseballs, even when he hits them, so he’s done a lousy job of barreling up. He hasn’t been able to tap into his power reserve, because he hasn’t had the recognition and timing right.

    http://www.ussmariner.com/2013/04/18/simplifying-jesus-montero/#comments

     

     

          3 years ago I thought Montero's future in MLB was that of a DH.

     

          I've seen nothing in his game to change that opinion concerning his defensive abilities.

          What has changed is his downward spiral at the plate.

          DH'ing isn't a position where you want a singles hitter batting less than his weight.

          He's still young enough where he might progress at the plate.

          Behind the plate is a loss cause.

          At least Middlebrooks has some athletic ability. So there's hope for him.

     




     

    I'd be willing to bet you have not seen one Seattle game this season with Montero catching.

    Johnny Bench he isn't but neither is Buster Posey nor was Jorge Posada.

    I watched him catch King Felix's last outing, where he also had a hr and 2 rbis.

    He looked good. Tell me Miquel Cabrera is a good 3rd baseman or Prince a good defensive first baseman.

    Mike Piazza was another catcher who was in the line up primarily for his bat.

    Only a stooge would write off a young prospect this early into their career.

     

     

               "write off"

             Appears Seattle has lost whatever confidence they had in him.

             Why else would they give a journeyman like Kelly S. so much playing time.

            

     




     

    Must be why Montero caught King Felix the last few times out.

    Or why he caught Saturday and then DHed Sunday.

     

     

    That's an easy one Pop's.

                    With Felix on the mound they can cover Montero's shortcomings and win.

     

                    When Felix isn't pitching Seattle needs contributions from everyone. Enter Kelly S.

     




     

    Oh is that what it is?

    Just throw a body out there although King Felix has a proclivity to throw a lot of balls into the dirt.

    Grasping for straws.

    Truth is that it pains you to see Montero behind the plate at all.

    Later.

     



                Short lived pain considering he only catches 50% of the games.

     

                

     




     

    Oh I see.

    Before you said Montero couldn't catch at this level, now the standard has changed to only 50% of the time.

    Desperado time.

     



             Not at all.

     

             The point is Montero is sharing catching duties with a journeyman while the organization waits for their catcher of the future to arrive.

             When that happens he might not even be their DH if he continues to bat .217 with little power.

             You really don't grasp the game very well Pop's.

             Everyone but you see's it.

     




     

    They do have a great catching prospect Mike Zunino that's why they signed Shoppach for only 1 season.

    Check out #3 on the list, you might learn something.

    http://www.scoutingbook.com/prospects/c

     



          Something tells me Shoppach might be back or they will find another backup to catch.

     

          Montero belongs in the minors.




    Contact the Mariners and air out your complaints and let us know how receptive they were.

    (206) 346 –4001

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to slomag's comment:

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to tom-uk's comment:

     

    Neither Lava or Montero have progressed as expected.

     

    Simplifying Jesus Montero Jeff Sullivan · April 18, 2013 · 

    .. between 2009 and 2010, Baseball America ranked Jesus Montero as the fourth-best prospect in the league. That was one slot behind Giancarlo Stanton, and a few slots above Buster Posey. The next year, BA ranked him as the third-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot behind Mike Trout. The year after that, BA ranked him as the sixth-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot ahead of Jurickson Profar. Scouting is scouting, and prospects are prospects, but nobody does the business better than Baseball America does, and for at least three years in a row, they absolutely loved Jesus Montero. They loved his skillset and they loved his future. It wasn’t a straight Yankees hype job — other sources, objective sources, saw Montero and saw his promise. Montero, if nothing else, was going to be a hell of a bat.

    .....Montero can’t be written off, not at this age and not after just 666 big-league plate appearances. 

    Is Montero going to stay as a catcher?

    • Almost certainly not, because he isn’t very good. It’s always been a question whether Montero could stick behind the plate, and while the Mariners seemed to make a commitment to him in 2013, they did so with an understanding that Mike Zunino shouldn’t be far off. If Zunino develops, he’s the guy. He’s the guy who can actually catch. Montero might be able to catch somewhere else, but he’s never going to be a good defensive catcher, and the reality is that his time at the position is probably just about up.

    Is Montero athletic?

    • lol no. Even after an offseason of learning how to run, Montero still can’t run, and he might be the least athletic player on the team. 

    Is Montero ever going to walk?

    • Jesus Montero isn’t programmed to draw walks. Over the equivalent of one full season, Montero has drawn unintentional walks in less than 5% of his plate appearances. 

    Is Montero ever going to hit for tremendous contact?

    • Montero’s career contact rate is 79%. That’s a little below average. There’s obvious room for improvement, and Montero should improve, probably, but the league’s best contact hitters tend to have been contact hitters all along. If things really break Montero’s way, he’ll eventually settle somewhere in the mid-80s or so. So far this year, he’s been worse than he was last year. A big part of making contact is pitch recognition. That’s the most difficult thing to teach, and Montero hasn’t yet learned it.

    Is Montero ever going to hit for big power?

    • And there’s the thing that made Montero such a super prospect. Scouts loved his power, or his power potential. We’ve seen occasional flashes of incredible strength, so we know for a fact that there’s a major power hitter in there. Montero’s ISO ceiling is at the level of a league elite.Montero keeps mis-hitting baseballs, even when he hits them, so he’s done a lousy job of barreling up. He hasn’t been able to tap into his power reserve, because he hasn’t had the recognition and timing right.

    http://www.ussmariner.com/2013/04/18/simplifying-jesus-montero/#comments

     




     

    Where is LaVarnway? Last I knew his average was below the mendoza line, and two years older than Montero correct?

     




     

    The only thing I worry about with Lavarnway is that his power has dipped the last couple of years.  Is that permanent?  Hard to say.  But his defense has come a long way, he is great at throwing out runners (32% last year, 44% thus far this year) and he still gets on base 4 out of 10 trips to the plate.  I don't know how you can consider that a step down from what Montero has done thus far in his career.  More to the point, nobody ever ranked Lavarnway alongside Trout, Harper & Stanton.  

     




    Point #1. Montero is catching at the MLB level LaVarnway isn't.

    Point#2. LaVarnway is two years older than Montero.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to slomag's comment:

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    In response to tom-uk's comment:

     

    Neither Lava or Montero have progressed as expected.

     

    Simplifying Jesus Montero Jeff Sullivan · April 18, 2013 · 

    .. between 2009 and 2010, Baseball America ranked Jesus Montero as the fourth-best prospect in the league. That was one slot behind Giancarlo Stanton, and a few slots above Buster Posey. The next year, BA ranked him as the third-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot behind Mike Trout. The year after that, BA ranked him as the sixth-best prospect in the league. That’s one slot ahead of Jurickson Profar. Scouting is scouting, and prospects are prospects, but nobody does the business better than Baseball America does, and for at least three years in a row, they absolutely loved Jesus Montero. They loved his skillset and they loved his future. It wasn’t a straight Yankees hype job — other sources, objective sources, saw Montero and saw his promise. Montero, if nothing else, was going to be a hell of a bat.

    .....Montero can’t be written off, not at this age and not after just 666 big-league plate appearances. 

    Is Montero going to stay as a catcher?

    • Almost certainly not, because he isn’t very good. It’s always been a question whether Montero could stick behind the plate, and while the Mariners seemed to make a commitment to him in 2013, they did so with an understanding that Mike Zunino shouldn’t be far off. If Zunino develops, he’s the guy. He’s the guy who can actually catch. Montero might be able to catch somewhere else, but he’s never going to be a good defensive catcher, and the reality is that his time at the position is probably just about up.

    Is Montero athletic?

    • lol no. Even after an offseason of learning how to run, Montero still can’t run, and he might be the least athletic player on the team. 

    Is Montero ever going to walk?

    • Jesus Montero isn’t programmed to draw walks. Over the equivalent of one full season, Montero has drawn unintentional walks in less than 5% of his plate appearances. 

    Is Montero ever going to hit for tremendous contact?

    • Montero’s career contact rate is 79%. That’s a little below average. There’s obvious room for improvement, and Montero should improve, probably, but the league’s best contact hitters tend to have been contact hitters all along. If things really break Montero’s way, he’ll eventually settle somewhere in the mid-80s or so. So far this year, he’s been worse than he was last year. A big part of making contact is pitch recognition. That’s the most difficult thing to teach, and Montero hasn’t yet learned it.

    Is Montero ever going to hit for big power?

    • And there’s the thing that made Montero such a super prospect. Scouts loved his power, or his power potential. We’ve seen occasional flashes of incredible strength, so we know for a fact that there’s a major power hitter in there. Montero’s ISO ceiling is at the level of a league elite.Montero keeps mis-hitting baseballs, even when he hits them, so he’s done a lousy job of barreling up. He hasn’t been able to tap into his power reserve, because he hasn’t had the recognition and timing right.

    http://www.ussmariner.com/2013/04/18/simplifying-jesus-montero/#comments

     




     

    Where is LaVarnway? Last I knew his average was below the mendoza line, and two years older than Montero correct?

     




     

    The only thing I worry about with Lavarnway is that his power has dipped the last couple of years.  Is that permanent?  Hard to say.  But his defense has come a long way, he is great at throwing out runners (32% last year, 44% thus far this year) and he still gets on base 4 out of 10 trips to the plate.  I don't know how you can consider that a step down from what Montero has done thus far in his career.  More to the point, nobody ever ranked Lavarnway alongside Trout, Harper & Stanton.  

     



    This must have been in the minors, because in the bigs he threw out a woeful 10% of baserunners with an OBP of .211 in 2012.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks


    Might add that is one of the reasons Montero is in the bigs is because of what is expected from him and who he has been compared to in the past.

    And again at age 22, sharing time with Kelly Shoppach who is playing his 11th year in the bigs.

    I don't know when Zunino's eta is.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    In response to pumpsie-green's comment:

    In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

     

    Pumpsie calls me a troll, yeah I was here all last season when the Sox were floundering ripping them everyday, gloating.

    That's what a troll does, that wasn't what I was doing.

    I was here talking baseball.

     

     

     




    Show me the post where I called you a troll. Trolls are like that guy FrankfromGL. You were discussing baseball, as you said, but since you inaccurately denigrated Lavarnway, I posted what Lav's stats really are. He is a very good prospect and should get a shot at making the club-or be traded for a good pitching prospect. He is a much better prospect now than Montero, who, after over 600 PAs, has a career OPS of just .706. At one time Montero looked good, but he is a defensive liability behind the plate and has not produced offensively in the majors.

     




    Yesterday you called me a troll a few times unless you edited your posts the comments should still there.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from ampoule. Show ampoule's posts

    Re: Middlebrooks

    The name of the book on Mickey Mantle is 'The Mick'.   It's very interesting reading.

     
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