Next up - # 200

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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : Agreed.  He hasn't been anything more than a 4 or 5 starter at best throughout his RS career but the stats he's built up warrants a spot in the RS HOF.  It would be a crime to leave him out.
    Posted by SoxPatsCelts1988


    Don't know about that, he might have been a #2 or 3 for a while; I recall one year where he entered Sep with a 1.66 ERA; then the weather pattern changed, and well, you know what that can do to a knuckler.
     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : LOL...almost all ballplayers are overpaid.  And, yes, Colon definitely got exposed today.....7 innings of 2 run ball. And wake isn't the comparison to AJ. That would be lackey.
    Posted by -The--Babe----------


    Colon gave up 8 hits to the lowly A's.
    Colon's last four outings vs. the poor Ray's offense, Toronto,  the Rays again, and the A's:  19.6 IP  29 H  18 runs (11 ER) one win and three losses.
    He is becoming exposed. Wait until he faces better line-ups.

    Wake is a great value against most FA pitchers. Lackey/Burnett/Dice are glaring examples. Wake could have hit the open market many times. He clearly has deeper priorities.
     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    As a Sox fan, even I will admit that Sox fans are in no position to harp on overpaid pitchers on the Yankees.  I'm not even joking when I say that John Lackey may go down as the biggest bust of a free agent signing in the history of MLB.  That's not even an exaggeration.  Barry Zito is currently in that discussion. Vernon Wells is currently in that discussion.  If Lackey doesn't turn things around then he may pass them.
    Posted by SoxPatsCelts1988


    Why do you project Lackey as "may go down as the biggest bust of a FA signing in the history of MLB"? He averaged 14 wins a season before his signing.
    He won 14 games last year.
    He could easily win 14 games this year.

    What do you think 17 mil a year brings on the open market? 
     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : Why do you project Lackey as " may go down as the biggest bust of a FA signing in the history of MLB" ? He averaged 14 wins a season before his signing. He won 14 games last year. He could easily win 14 games this year. What do you think 17 mil a year brings on the open market? 
    Posted by harness

    He doesn't average 14 wins a season, in fact he's hit that number three times in his career and exceeded it once.

     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : Why do you project Lackey as " may go down as the biggest bust of a FA signing in the history of MLB" ? He averaged 14 wins a season before his signing. He won 14 games last year. He could easily win 14 games this year. What do you think 17 mil a year brings on the open market? 
    Posted by harness


    You can't bring pitching wins into this.  Look at the guy's ERA.  I didn't do the math but I'm estimating his ERA is ~5.00 as a member of the Red Sox.  That's awful.  You've been watching the guy.  His WHIP was 1.40+ last year and 1.50+ this year.  That's horrendous. 

    I'm not counting this guy out just yet for turning his Red Sox career around, but he needs to start living up to the dollars and he needs to start doing it soon.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from -The--Babe----------. Show -The--Babe----------'s posts

    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : Colon gave up 8 hits to the lowly A's. Colon's last four outings vs. the poor Ray's offense, Toronto,  the Rays again, and the A's:  19.6 IP  29 H  18 runs (11 ER) one win and three losses. He is becoming exposed. Wait until he faces better line-ups. Wake is a great value against most FA pitchers. Lackey/Burnett/Dice are glaring examples. Wake could have hit the open market many times. He clearly has deeper priorities.
    Posted by harness

    LOL....Colon was coming off an injury and now is fully healthy again.

    And you want to point out Colon facing some weak lineups and then you praise wake. wake got shelled by the mariners today. Nobody is confusing the mariners with the 1931 Yankees. He also recently got lit up to the tune of 5 ER in six innings or less by both the pirates and the astros, neither of which are exactly offensive juggernauts

     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : Agreed.  He hasn't been anything more than a 4 or 5 starter at best throughout his RS career but the stats he's built up warrants a spot in the RS HOF.  It would be a crime to leave him out.
    Posted by SoxPatsCelts1988


    It would be nice if he could get that win @ Fenway, and I would expect there would be some kind of ceremony in that case when/if it happens there. 
     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : It would be nice if he could get that win @ Fenway, and I would expect there would be some kind of ceremony in that case when/if it happens there. 
    Posted by nhsteven


    He's 8 away.  You can tell that he wants that record.  I bet Wake gets another 4-5 wins before the end of the season.  I expect him to be back with the Sox next year and working out of the bullpen to start the season.  He'll be the first guy out once there's a DL trip.  If all goes well, I see him breaking the record around this time next season.
     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : LOL....Colon was coming off an injury and now is fully healthy again. And you want to point out Colon facing some weak lineups and then you praise wake. wake got shelled by the mariners today. Nobody is confusing the mariners with the 1931 Yankees. He also recently got lit up to the tune of 5 ER in six innings or less by both the pirates and the astros, neither of which are exactly offensive juggernauts
    Posted by -The--Babe----------



    Colon: 7-6
    Wake: 6-3

    Colon gets lit up by good competition. Check the game logs.
    His ERA is double vs. better.

    We'll see how long Colon stays healthy - and how legit it is - and what your excuse will be the next time he gets racked against legit competition.
     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : You can't bring pitching wins into this.  Look at the guy's ERA.  I didn't do the math but I'm estimating his ERA is ~5.00 as a member of the Red Sox.  That's awful.  You've been watching the guy.  His WHIP was 1.40+ last year and 1.50+ this year.  That's horrendous.  I'm not counting this guy out just yet for turning his Red Sox career around, but he

    needs to start living up to the dollars
    and he needs to start doing it soon.
    Posted by SoxPatsCelts1988


    Please define "living up to the dollars".
    What is your frame of reference?
     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    LOL, Babe doesn't watch any games whether they are Sox games or Yankee games. Instead his life revolves around coming here instead of a Yankee forum. He comes here because his passion is to annoy RS fans. Harness knows this but he gives Babe a pass since Babe increases hits to Harness's forum.

     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : He doesn't average 14 wins a season, in fact he's hit that number three times in his career and exceeded it once.
    Posted by -The--Babe----------


    I addressed this on another thread. Yes, he does average 14 wins a season.
    In fact, over a given 162 game season, he averages 15 wins, but no starter makes all his starts. His average M.L. season is 14 wins.

    Look up the term "average". 19 wins  14 wins  9 wins - what's the average?
    Then check out Baseball reference.com.
     
     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    LOL, Babedoesn't watch any games whether they are Sox games or Yankee games. Instead his life revolves around coming here instead of a Yankee forum. He comes here because his passion is to annoy RS fans. Harness knows this but he gives Babe a pass since Babe increases hits to Harness's forum.
    Posted by Your-Echo


    I welcome any baseball discussion. I don't care who the author of it is. You live by UR prejudice. It rules UR every thought.

    This is a baseball discussion. Take you face-painting elsewhere.
     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    Katz, Ram, Boomerang, Breidy, and others like them command my respect. Everyone is fine with Harness since he doesn't care as long as he has someone to chat with at 4 am.
     
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    Re: Next up - # 200



    Damn Tim Wakefield used to be teammates with Roger Clemens. 
     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : Please define " living up to the dollars". What is your frame of reference ?
    Posted by harness


    I don't know.  Maybe pitching somewhat like a guy that makes $15M a season?  Instead of pitching like one of the worst MLB pitchers statistically.
     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    Pike: If I had UR respect, I'd take 12 steps back.
    The respect of a nanny who tries to tell people if, where and when they can post on a forum that banned you for invasion of privacy...that I can gladly live without.

    Tell me, who respects you on this board?
     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : I don't know.  Maybe pitching somewhat like a guy that makes $15M a
    season
    ?  Instead of pitching like one of the worst MLB pitchers statistically.
    Posted by SoxPatsCelts1988



    Tell me, what FA signing that makes 15-17 mil a season has averaged more wins?
    After all, that's the only legit frame of reference. His salary is a reflection of the market. Since that's your standard, use it.
     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : Actually you moron, I had lunch down by the beach today and watched both games. You are obviously the one who doesn't watch baseball because you are not a baseball fan. You only come here to complain about other posters, not talk baseball. Isn't there a home and gardens forum that you would find more to your speed?
    Posted by -The--Babe----------


    Babe, it would be nice if you were genuinely here to talk baseball.  Yet all you do here is bash the Red Sox and praise the Yankees.  You have nothing better to do but hang out on a fan board of your team's rival and talk crap about them all day, throw around childish insults, and never concede a point or compliment the Red Sox in any respect.  There are some classy, intelligent Yankee fans here who can offer a good discussion and debate.  You offer nothing but put-downs and Yankee spin.   
     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : Tell me, what FA signing that makes 15-17 mil a season has averaged more wins? After all, that's the only legit frame of reference. His salary is a reflection of the market. Since that's your standard, use it.
    Posted by harness


    You're really reaching on this one.  The guy has been awful since arriving in Boston and the contract adds to it. 
     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : You're really reaching on this one.  The guy has been awful since arriving in Boston and the contract adds to it. 
    Posted by SoxPatsCelts1988


    Fine. Let me reach. You are generalizing but not offering any examples.
    I am. A.J. Burnett signed a similar contract. He is averaging less wins than he did pitching in Florida, which was 13.

    Lackey won 14 games last year and kept him team in over 70% of his starts. That's what he's paid to do. This year he is 3rd in wins despite a DL stint and dealing with some rough personal issues.

    You said he may go down as one of the worst FA signings in the history of MLB.
    Prove it. Give me a list of FA pitchers with similar salary who have done better.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from -The--Babe----------. Show -The--Babe----------'s posts

    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : I addressed this on another thread. Yes, he does average 14 wins a season. In fact, over a given 162 game season, he averages 15 wins, but no starter makes all his starts. His average M.L. season is 14 wins. Look up the term "average". 19 wins  14 wins  9 wins - what's the average ? Then check out Baseball reference.com.  
    Posted by harness

    No, not including this season he has 116 wins in 9 seasons. Last I checked when you divide 116 by 9 you get 12.88. 12.88 is not 14.

     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : Do you mean kayaking? I know how much proper spelling means to you.
    Posted by MikeNagy


    He is digging me because I spelled it wrong previously.  He has spelled things incorrectly recently and I just let it go because it isn't worth the keystrokes.
     
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    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : No, not including this season he has 116 wins in 9 seasons. Last I checked when you divide 116 by 9 you get 12.88. 12.88 is not 14.
    Posted by -The--Babe----------



    You missed his rookie season, where he only got 18 starts, and won half of them.
    That's 8.5 seasons (n/i this year). Which comes out to 13.6 wins a year.
    In addition, he missed 15 starts over '08/'09. That gives him an average 14-15 wins over a full season. I went with 14 because it's not realistic to think any pitcher will make every start.

    A better way to gauge this is by pct. of wins per start. Lackey wins 44% of his career starts. (Same as Wake. A.J. wins just slightly under 40%).
    This year, it's 50%.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from -The--Babe----------. Show -The--Babe----------'s posts

    Re: Next up - # 200

    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200:
    In Response to Re: Next up - # 200 : You missed his rookie season, where he only got 18 starts, and won half of them. That's 8.5 seasons (n/i this year). Which comes out to 13.6 wins a year. In addition, he missed 15 starts over '08/'09. That gives him an average 14-15 wins over a full season. I went with 14 because it's not realistic to think any pitcher will make every start. A better way to gauge this is by pct. of wins per start. Lackey wins 44% of his career starts. (Same as Wake. A.J. wins just slightly under 40%). This year, it's 50%.
    Posted by harness

    That's exactly the point. He misses starts so he doesn't average 14 wins a season. And I included his rookie year. No matter how you slice it, 116 wins over 9 seasons is 12.88.

     
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