Official Elias Free Agent rankings

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    In Response to Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings:
    [QUOTE]No, he's a Type F. Never too late for you to learn what 40 years old means. Learn your numbers.
    Posted by hankwilliams[/QUOTE]

    There is no Type F for free agents according to Elias and MLB.  For the elite players, they are type A, for the good players, they are type B, and for the average and below average, they have no ranking.

    Tek is a Type B and that indicates an above-average player.

    And this is where that cognitive dissonance kicks in.  I don't make the rules.  I don't pass judgement on them.  I live in Ameritocracy.  If the numbers say you are a Type B, then you're a type B.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from hankwilliams. Show hankwilliams's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    It is truly a bad forumula. I suspect that owners should lock out big labor until current performance is the major part of FA contracts.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    I suspect the new Collective Bargaining Agreement will come up with a new formula to rank free agents, perhaps something along the lines of Wins Above Replacement. Too many free agent relievers get hamstrung with a Type A designation because teams don't want to surrender a draft pick to sign most free agent relievers.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    False. I said he was a prima donna who should not be offered more than 3 years and 30M.

    You never even suggested an offer. You only commented afterwards. You liked the deal and now lie and distract to avoid being called wrong... again.

    I admit, I liked the signing, but never said $85.5M was right. I admit I was wrong. You never can, because you actually believe you are always right. Funny, since you're like 0h for 123 in a row now.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from fivekatz. Show fivekatz's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    In Response to Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings:
    [QUOTE]I suspect the new Collective Bargaining Agreement will come up with a new formula to rank free agents, perhaps something along the lines of Wins Above Replacement. Too many free agent relievers get hamstrung with a Type A designation because teams don't want to surrender a draft pick to sign most free agent relievers.
    Posted by hill55[/QUOTE]I don't think that holding down relievers movement via draft pick is going to fog a mirror with ownership. They probably like the fact that relievers are some what restricted in movement by draft compensation.

    From the player's perspective are they willing to trade hard draft slots, draft status for international players or other chips to improve free movement of relief pitchers?

    I don't see a lot of movement in CBA this year. It would require a protracted labor dispute and probably would only move with a lockout. Everybody is making money.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    Official Elias Sosa rankings?
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    In Response to Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings : I don't think that holding down relievers movement via draft pick is going to fog a mirror with ownership. They probably like the fact that relievers are some what restricted in movement by draft compensation. From the player's perspective are they willing to trade hard draft slots, draft status for international players or other chips to improve free movement of relief pitchers? I don't see a lot of movement in CBA this year. It would require a protracted labor dispute and probably would only move with a lockout. Everybody is making money.
    Posted by fivekatz[/QUOTE]

    Katz, I agree the owners will want to maintian compensation but it also works in their favor too. Knowing that they won't get hit with players accepting arbitration becasue they know that they're not likely to get signed...

    Many of the owners would also like to address the "multiple free agent compensation" When teams lose more than one and then sign multiple players see the Yanks in 2009 when they signed Tex, Sabathia and Burnett...The Angels ended up getting the Yanks #1 because Texiera was ranked higher...the Brewers got the Yanks second rounder and the Jays thier 3rd rounder in 2010...My take is that both sides will give a little but I don't see either side drawing a line in the sand...
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    The whole comp draft system was supposed to compensate low budget teams who kept losing FAs, instead it is the rich teams that are getting many picks (except for the masters of the rule: the Rays.) The Sox have played the system well...

    Fossum for losing Swindell (Fossum later traded for Schill)
    Ellsbury & Lowrie for Cabrera
    Hansen & Bowden for Lowe (Hansen was part of the Manny for JBay deal)
    Buchholtz for Pedro
    Bard & K. Johnson for Damon
    C. Clay & A. Bates for Mueller
    Hagadone for Alex Gonzo
    R. Dent for Foulke
    B. Price for Gagne
    S. Fife for Hunter Morris
    Vitek & Ranaudo for Billy Wagner
    Brentz & Workman for Jason Bay
    M. Barnes & H. Owens for VMart
    Swihart & Bradley Jr. for Beltre
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    In Response to Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings:
    [QUOTE]It is truly a bad forumula. I suspect that owners should lock out big labor until current performance is the major part of FA contracts.
    Posted by hankwilliams[/QUOTE]

    1-It doesn't matter if you don't like the formula.  You play the game according to the rules.

    2-Locking out the players for current performance makes no sense.  It is a -0- sum game.  Just like the average record in BB is .500, the average player in the league will still be the average player.  If you take money away from A for under-performance, you have to give it back to B for over-performance.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    Speaking of Beltre, the current hitting-oriented Elias formula hurts a hitter who plays in a pitcher-friendly ballpark. The Seattle Mariners got only a sandwich-round pick when the Red Sox signed Beltre, who then was a Type B free agent. Beltre is a solid Type A player after two seasons in hitter-friendly ballparks.

    That's why Wins Above Replacement might be a more-encompassing measure.

    By the way, the Mariners fared well with Beltre's sandwich-round pick in the June 2010 draft, taking pitcher Taijuan Walker, who made at least two Top 50 prospect lists before his 19th birthday this past August.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from hankwilliams. Show hankwilliams's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    1-It doesn't matter if you don't like the formula. You play the game according to the rules.

    The rules are getting ready to expire, oh most wise poster.

    2-Locking out the players for current performance makes no sense.

    Reading comprehension lacking on your part. It is allowing ownership to put performance based provisions in all contracts. This allows younger players to make more and Vernon Wells and Carl Crawford to paid the going rate for minor league level performance.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    Columnist Jeff Passan of Yahoo! Sports offers his own ranking the 182 free agents:

    http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=jp-passan_ultimate_free_agent_tracker_baseball_110211
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    In Response to Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings:
    [QUOTE]1-It doesn't matter if you don't like the formula. You play the game according to the rules. The rules are getting ready to expire, oh most wise poster. 2-Locking out the players for current performance makes no sense. Reading comprehension lacking on your part. It is allowing ownership to put performance based provisions in all contracts. This allows younger players to make more and Vernon Wells and Carl Crawford to paid the going rate for minor league level performance.
    Posted by hankwilliams[/QUOTE]

    1-Can't comment on the rules changes.  I think Elias falls short for defensive purposes, but at the end of the day, you'll still be basing your strategy on who you think will be an A, B, etc.

    2-Changes how you divvy up the salaries will mean nothing to me.  Crawford has to give back $15M.  Guess who gets his $15M?

    That's right!  Ellsbury gets it.  Ellsbury had by far the highest WAR, but transferring money from Crawford to Ellsbury doesn't mean a whole lot to me.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Ice-Cream. Show Ice-Cream's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings



    The Red Sox should go after Roy Oswalt (depending on the years and amount he and his agent wants).

    Boston's offense is fine (even if Ortiz walks away).  They need pitching.  

     
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from SinceYaz. Show SinceYaz's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    Good post, Mojo.

      I was struck by Aramis Ramirez' position as a Type B.

      He's fallen off quite a bit.  I know/guess injuries have taken their toll.  But it wasn't too long ago some of us were having get Ramram fits ....

     
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from SinceYaz. Show SinceYaz's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    The whole comp draft system was supposed to compensate low budget teams who kept losing FAs, instead it is the rich teams that are getting many picks (except for the masters of the rule: the Rays.) The Sox have played the system well...

    Fossum for losing Swindell (Fossum later traded for Schill)
    Ellsbury & Lowrie for Cabrera
    Hansen & Bowden for Lowe (Hansen was part of the Manny for JBay deal)
    Buchholtz for Pedro
    Bard & K. Johnson for Damon
    C. Clay & A. Bates for Mueller
    Hagadone for Alex Gonzo
    R. Dent for Foulke
    B. Price for Gagne
    S. Fife for Hunter Morris
    Vitek & Ranaudo for Billy Wagner
    Brentz & Workman for Jason Bay
    M. Barnes & H. Owens for VMart
    Swihart & Bradley Jr. for Beltre


      Moon,

       A great post!  I was thoroughly - uh - entertained by the memories that the trades helped paint!  To be honest, there are some I didn't realize or remember, so it's like enjoying a re-run that's new to you ... so it's new!

       A lot of decent wheeling and dealing there ....
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    That's right!  Ellsbury gets it.  Ellsbury had by far the highest WAR, but transferring money from Crawford to Ellsbury doesn't mean a whole lot to me.

    No, Hank wants it all to go to the owners.

    He has no issues with CEOs pocketing millions while the company goes under. He'd never agree to restricting CEO pay. It's all about the poor kid making millions playing a boys game, and maybe not living up to what the contract led the owner to expect.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from LeftyGrove. Show LeftyGrove's posts

    Maddux, Buehrle and Jackson?

    If Maddux was hired as manager, and we got TYPE B Buehrle and Jackson to fill out the rotation. Do you think Maddux would be a key to helping the new pitchers and the rest of the staff perform at top level all season long?

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    Near impossible to know for sure.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from hankwilliams. Show hankwilliams's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    He'd never agree to restricting CEO pay. It's all about the poor kid making millions playing a boys game

    I would agree to have a postal worker restrict your pay, Moonslob. As for kids and baseball and millions, nothing stops the MLBPA from running their own league. Karl Marx would restrict CEO pay, too, Moonslob. 
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    Again, you misunderstand and distort my point. You clearly have absolutely no reading comprehension skills whatsoever. 

    Or, you are just a silly troll.

    Or, both.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from hankwilliams. Show hankwilliams's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    You don't have any salient points.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    http://bleacherreport.com/articles/912436-mlb-free-agency-2013-top-50-players-available-in-next-years-monster-crop

    That is the link for 2013 free agents -  players we will have a solid opportunity to acquire via trade in July 2012. It is an awesome list at present.

    Let Iglesias, Lavarnway, and Kalish show us what they can do until July, and then re-evaluate. This team is already built to win and can withstand the pressure of starting 3 rookies in the field for a couple of months. We will need another starter and deal with the closer situation prior to April but that should be it.

    It is the smart way to go -
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    In Response to Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings:
    [QUOTE]http://bleacherreport.com/articles/912436-mlb-free-agency-2013-top-50-players-available-in-next-years- monster-crop That is the link for 2013 free agents -  players we will have a solid opportunity to acquire via trade in July 2012. It is an awesome list at present. Let Iglesias, Lavarnway, and Kalish show us what they can do until July, and then re-evaluate. This team is already built to win and can withstand the pressure of starting 3 rookies in the field for a couple of months. We will need another starter and deal with the closer situation prior to April but that should be it. It is the smart way to go -
    Posted by BurritoT[/QUOTE]

    I have been for starting Iggy at SS for over a year now, but now that Scutty will be back at $6M, it won't happen save an injury.

    Lavarnway may DG close to FT if Papi walks, but I don't think he will be our FT catcher in 2012 if Papi stay. I don't see him being much worse than Salty with our staff or defensively, so maybe our new manager will let him play there.

    Kailish will fight it out with Reddick in ST to be the RF or 4th OF'er if we pick someone else. Perhaps they will platoon with a guy like Cody Ross, thereby saving money to spend on Paps, starting pitching and or Papi.

    We could also see Middlebrooks by season's end. Maybe some other dark horses may rise in time to help.

    I'm not counting on much from Tazawa, Doubront, Weiland, Bowden, Wilson, Ranaudo or others on the MLB team in 2012.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings

    In Response to Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Official Elias Free Agent rankings : I have been for starting Iggy at SS for over a year now, but now that Scutty will be back at $6M, it won't happen save an injury. Lavarnway may DG close to FT if Papi walks, but I don't think he will be our FT catcher in 2012 if Papi stay. I don't see him being much worse than Salty with our staff or defensively, so maybe our new manager will let him play there. Kailish will fight it out with Reddick in ST to be the RF or 4th OF'er if we pick someone else. Perhaps they will platoon with a guy like Cody Ross, thereby saving money to spend on Paps, starting pitching and or Papi. We could also see Middlebrooks by season's end. Maybe some other dark horses may rise in time to help. I'm not counting on much from Tazawa, Doubront, Weiland, Bowden, Wilson, Ranaudo or others on the MLB team in 2012.
    Posted by moonslav59[/QUOTE]

    If Doubront's not on the opening day roster I'll be surpised. Tazawa is also in the mix for the pen. Ranaundo might get a cup of coffee in September...the rest are simply organizational depth...
     

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