Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    Okay, enough is enough. Hill pitched another scoreless innings today with 2 K's, Middlebrooks went 2-5 with his 9th HR and 27th RBI, and Cook has had excellent starts.

    I know Youk is going nowhere, but the Red Sox can't waste these guys down in Pawtucket. Cook has to be brought up or he's gone. What are the changes?

    1. Hill for Thomas - This is a no brainer
    2. Cook into rotation - If Buchholz has a stinker tonight, does he go on the DL? Bard stays in the bullpen?
    3. Middlebrooks up and Anderson down - This guy can give the team a break with Youk and Gonzo getting an occasional day off. Snakeoil stated that if has 12 HR's by July, they will have to have him up. He's going to have 12 HR's by the first week of May.

    What are your thoughts?
     
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  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    I want Middlebrooks up and Cook up.  But I do not underestmimate the complicated nature of Middlebrooks vis-a-vis Youkilis.  Very tricky.  
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from JB-3. Show JB-3's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    Cook and Hill, absolutely.  They have set timeframes (opt out date and rehab assignment end date).  MIddlebrooks, have patience.  Might as well give Youk a chance to rebound while also avoiding super 2 status for Middlebrooks.  If Youk gets hurt though, Middlebrooks should get the call immediately.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from harv53. Show harv53's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    But then they will make the league minimum.....Ben can't afford it. It will make him look fiscally irresponsible.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from fivekatz. Show fivekatz's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    Sorry, Cook = Wakefield, not the savior. They aren't going to lose him but I think people are expecting too much. Look at his stats from 2009-2011. I do not think the RS are going to bail on the Bard conversion to a starting pitcher and hope that Buchholz isn't as bad as he was in his first 3 starts because Cook doesn't have the potential to be anywhere near close to what Clay could be.

    I am sure they want to be sure Hill's strength is built up and he will be here soon. Dumping Thomas is a no brainer.

    I don't know it serves a lot to have Middlebrooks here until the RS are prepared to play him pretty much every day.

    To me the RS big issue isn't offensive firepower, it is pitching. If Lester and Buch don't pitch better Cook is far from being anecdote for that ill but I agree Hill replacing Thomas is a great idea.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    I think bringing up Middlebrooks right now would be insane even if Youk was disabled;  in about 3/4 weeks he'll pass the Super 2 line so this year won't count against his service time.  I'd rather have Punto play 3rd for a few weeks then bring up Middlebrooks when it makes long term sense.

    No way will the Sox do it, nor should they.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    ...Hill?  I'm sure the Sox are just monitoring his recovery and he will be in Boston as soon as they think it's medically safe.

    Cook?  I have very little confidence that he will perform well (and I'm the king of optimism!), but with Bard in the 'pen he seems a logical choice to try.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from 111SoxFan111. Show 111SoxFan111's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    Cook may = Wakefield  ... or he may be a bit better than Wake using standard measures (assuming his injury issues are behind him).  But whether he is "equal to" or "slightly better" using standard stats, you also have to account for Wake's unearned runs due to pass ball / wild pitches.  If you look at the data, you will see that Wake's ERA doesn't tell the whole story.  He consistently had significantly more unearned runs than the average pitcher.  I forget the %'s and I am too lazy to do the math again, but it was significant enough.

    I suspect Cook is going to be an above average #5-6 starter and/or long reliever ... not the second coming of Pedro.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from mef429. Show mef429's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    mcClure was the pitching coach that really refined cooks mechanics. Cook was a pretty good pitcher before the injure issues. If they are behind him and in combination with having mcClure as his coach again i think he will open some eyes.

    definitely hill for thomas but i'm on the waiting train with middlebrooks.. I don't think youk is done, hes just off to a slow start. also by the time middlebrooks is past the super 2 we should know for sure if youk is just in a slump or not.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from JB-3. Show JB-3's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    In Response to Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook:
    I don't know it serves a lot to have Middlebrooks here until the RS are prepared to play him pretty much every day. To me the RS big issue isn't offensive firepower, it is pitching. If Lester and Buch don't pitch better Cook is far from being anecdote for that ill but I agree Hill replacing Thomas is a great idea.
    Posted by fivekatz


    If the Sox called up Middlebrooks, they would play him everyday.  The pitching staff would look better with a good defensive 3B replacing Youk iin the field.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    On this forum I've compared Will Middlebrooks to Seattle thirdbaseman Alex Liddi, who tonight hit his second homerun in seven games, lifting his batting average to .391 and his OPS to well over 1.000 (through six innings).
     
    Middlebrooks and Liddi are 6-foot-4 righthand-hitting thirdbasemen born 26 days apart (but separated by the Atlantic Ocean and then some). Each has been prone to high strikeouts and low walk rates, although the minor league numbers lean in Liddi's favor.
     
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  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from bt33. Show bt33's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    Agree with most of what's been said. Definitely Hill and Cook should be brought up right away. Justin Thomas and Vincent Padilla do not belong on this roster and never did. I'd wait on Middlebrooks and let him play everday for awhile. If he keeps playing the way he is now there will be no denying him at some point later in the season, and it'll allow Youk some more time to work out of his slump (or not). Unless it's at the end of the year, if Middlebrooks comes to Fenway it should be to start. I'd like to see McDonald also sent packing, but obviously Crawford and Ellsbury will likely eventually find their way back onto the roster (Byrd, Sweeney, Ross, Ellsbury, Crawford is actually not bad). Bard should close. Aviles should set up and (upon Bailey's return) go back to his all-purpose spot. Doubront obviously has been a bright spot, but if Cook can pitch reasonably, and Matusaka returns, and Doubront has to help bolster the bullpen (we'll see how it looks with Hill and eventually Bailey back, Bard's presence, etc.) it won't be the end of the world. What's most obvious is that none of this will matter if Becket, Bucholtz, and Lester don't get their act together. 
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    In Response to Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook:
    Okay, enough is enough. Hill pitched another scoreless innings today with 2 K's, Middlebrooks went 2-5 with his 9th HR and 27th RBI, and Cook has had excellent starts. I know Youk is going nowhere, but the Red Sox can't waste these guys down in Pawtucket. Cook has to be brought up or he's gone. What are the changes? 1. Hill for Thomas - This is a no brainer 2. Cook into rotation - If Buchholz has a stinker tonight, does he go on the DL? Bard stays in the bullpen? 3. Middlebrooks up and Anderson down - This guy can give the team a break with Youk and Gonzo getting an occasional day off. Snakeoil stated that if has 12 HR's by July, they will have to have him up. He's going to have 12 HR's by the first week of May. What are your thoughts?
    Posted by ADG


    Nah.

    Middlebrooks should never some up to be a utility player.  If he is not going to play everyday in Boston, he should play everyday in Pawtucket.

    I'm no big fan of Bard in the rotation, but that die is cast.  So if the Sox need bullpen arms from Pawtucket, I'd bring up Ohlendorf.   Rich Hill has thrown 2IP since surgery, and is getting by on only 8IP last season.  He is not such a sure thing that he needs to be rushed back at all costs. 

    And people wonder why I think Sox fans are crazy.  With one hand they type "WHY ARE ALL OUR PLAYERS INJURED?!!? FIRE THE STRENGTH AND CONDITIONING COACH?!!?" 

    And then with the other, they type "WE NEED HIM NOW!!! THIS IS A CRUCIAL APRIL GAME!! $%%#!&$% THE REHAB AND GET HIM BACK IN ACTION NOW!!!!
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    In Response to Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook:
    On this forum I've compared Will Middlebrooks to Seattle thirdbaseman Alex Liddi, who tonight hit his second homerun in seven games, lifting his batting average to .391 and his OPS to well over 1.000 (through six innings).   Middlebrooks and Liddi are 6-foot-4 righthand-hitting thirdbasemen born 26 days apart (but separated by the Atlantic Ocean and then some). Each has been prone to high strikeouts and low walk rates, although the minor league numbers lean in Liddi's favor.
    Posted by hill55


    But what was missing from your comparison was what was blocking each.  Liddi was behind Chone Figgins, an overpaid out machine who best attributes have been passed over by the game as he has aged himself into a utility role.  Middlebrooks is behind Youkilis, the oft-injured but still primary right-handed middle of the order bat in the heart of the Sox lineup.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from traven. Show traven's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    Does anybody realize that hitting is not the problem with this team?  Fielding is not the issue either.  P-I-T-C-H-I-N-G, and more pitching and more pitching.  Sox had a 7-1 lead after 5 innings and had to hang on to win 7-6!!!!  Look at the Sox hitting vs the rest of the AL - now look at the Sox pitching vs the entire MLB.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    In Response to Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook:
    Does anybody realize that hitting is not the problem with this team?  Fielding is not the issue either.  P-I-T-C-H-I-N-G, and more pitching and more pitching.  Sox had a 7-1 lead after 5 innings and had to hang on to win 7-6!!!!  Look at the Sox hitting vs the rest of the AL - now look at the Sox pitching vs the entire MLB.
    Posted by traven


    Actually, we could narrow down this problem even tighter.  It's not just "pitching."   It's "relief pitching".

    So unless Middlebrooks can nail down the 8th inning, there is no need to call him up right now...
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from traven. Show traven's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    In Response to Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook:
    In Response to Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook : Actually, we could narrow down this problem even tighter.  It's not just "pitching."   It's "relief pitching". So unless Middlebrooks can nail down the 8th inning, there is no need to call him up right now...
    Posted by notin


    Completely agree...
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from SinceYaz. Show SinceYaz's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    In Response to Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook:
    Cook and Hill, absolutely.  They have set timeframes (opt out date and rehab assignment end date).  MIddlebrooks, have patience.  Might as well give Youk a chance to rebound while also avoiding super 2 status for Middlebrooks.  If Youk gets hurt though, Middlebrooks should get the call immediately.
    Posted by JB-3


    Spaceman's post a yes and yours is a capital YES.

    I still think Youk will rebound.  But I am also aware that he isn't the tough nut he once was.  I pictured Youk as ironman material.  Instead, he's gotten a bit brittle.  Middlebrooks is going to have his day - maybe sooner than anyone
    in the organization really wants.

    Hill for Thomas. Yep.

    I'm thinking Cook will do good things.  If he keeps that sinker working in Fenway, that would be great!  Gives the pen two arms for one. Bard and Hill with Cook taking Bard's place in the rotation.  

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from sox4life2280. Show sox4life2280's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    Lets not forget we will have to unfortunately find a spot for Dice-K in about a month as well.  I hope not in the starting rotation, but I have a feeling that is whats planned. And at the expense of Doubront, in my opinion our most consistent starter thus far, to the bullpen unfortunately.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    In Response to Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook:
    In Response to Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook : Actually, we could narrow down this problem even tighter.  It's not just "pitching."   It's "relief pitching". So unless Middlebrooks can nail down the 8th inning, there is no need to call him up right now...
    Posted by notin


    Relief pitching is a huge problem but 2/5 of the rotation has been pretty bad with Lester and Buchholz.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from SinceYaz. Show SinceYaz's posts

    Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook

    In Response to Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook:
    In Response to Re: Pawtucket / Boston Swaps - Middlebrooks, Hill and Cook : Relief pitching is a huge problem but 2/5 of the rotation has been pretty bad with Lester and Buchholz.
    Posted by ADG


    Lester usually has a bad start then winds into top shape.  Clay is rebuilding his game in such a way that it doesn't hurt his back like last year.  I think he'll come around too.
     
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