Positive Terry thread for ZILL

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    You make a great point ZILL, our fans rarely give credit to Terry for making the right moves but today was a perfect example.  We had a 5 nothing lead and Jenk's needed work but Terry pulled him quickly in favor of Pap because he struggled.  This could have turned out good or bad but it was still the correct move, even if Pap lost the game.

    Terry is the perfect manager for our team, he is well like and can only utilize the players Theo gives him and you never know how those players will perform.  In my opinion Terry plays the percentages and manages a good game overall.  Take the RF situation, Drew and McD have never played so badly so you can't blame Terry for playing them in hopes it works itself out.  Its ultimately Theo's move to give him a better option and this case it appears to now be Reddick.  How about our bullpen?  Terry's fault?  No, in many cases this season it didn't matter who we threw out there nobody was pitching well.  You can't even blame Terry for this road trip, or choosing not to keep playing Adrian in RF just so Papi can play.

    Terrys biggest fault in my opinion is being too nice of a guy and his loyalty to veterans who maybe shouldn't be playing as much, or kept in the game as long. Two "WC" is more than this fan has ever seen in Boston so hes doing a darn good job in my opinion.  If Terry had a bunch of losing seasons like Ozzie G. along with a quick temper and habit of arguing with players and management, I may think differently. 

    Be thankful for what we have!
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from attic-dan. Show attic-dan's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

      I'm a frequent second guessor of Francona in game to game situations,his getting pitchers up in the bullpen to late one example. I go back to pre-Williams Sox that's Dick not Jimy and Tito is far superior to anyone I've seen. His best trait is that his eyes are always on the big prize,which serves him well in the volitable stew of RSN.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    I'd like to add to this but if I do georom will be in here calling me a bootlicker LOL. 
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    HF..not true I gave props to our manager for sticking with Lester...check out the game thread
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from pinstripezac32. Show pinstripezac32's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL





    3 cheers for terry & zill







    3 cheers for terry & zill

    3 cheers for terry & zill

    3 cheers for terry & zill








     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Sheriff-Rojas. Show Sheriff-Rojas's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    In Response to Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL:
    [QUOTE]3 cheers for terry & zill 3 cheers for terry & zill 3 cheers for terry & zill 3 cheers for terry & zill
    Posted by pinstripezac32[/QUOTE]

    I expected a large lizard in that costume. 
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from pinstripezac32. Show pinstripezac32's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    LOL sheriff

    but I'm not about to mess with the big guy
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    In Response to Positive Terry thread for ZILL:
    [QUOTE]You make a great point ZILL, our fans rarely give credit to Terry for making the right moves but today was a perfect example.  We had a 5 nothing lead and Jenk's needed work but Terry pulled

    him quickly in favor of Pap
    because he struggled.  This could have turned out good or bad but it was still the correct move, even if Pap lost the game. Terry is the perfect manager for our team, he is well like and can only utilize the players Theo gives him and you never know how those players will perform.  In my opinion Terry plays the percentages and manages a good game overall.  Take the RF situation, Drew and McD have never played so badly so you can't blame Terry for playing them in hopes it works itself out.  Its ultimately Theo's move to give him a better option and this case it appears to now be Reddick.  How about our bullpen?   Terry's fault?  No, in many cases this season it didn't matter who we threw out there nobody was pitching well.  You can't even blame Terry for this road trip, or choosing not to keep playing Adrian in RF just so Papi can play. Terrys biggest fault in my opinion is being too nice of a guy and his loyalty to veterans who maybe shouldn't be playing as much, or kept in the game as long. Two "WC" is more than this fan has ever seen in Boston so hes doing a darn good job in my opinion.  If Terry had a bunch of losing seasons like Ozzie G. along with a quick temper and habit of arguing with players and management, I may think differently.  Be thankful for what we have!
    Posted by craze4sox[/QUOTE]

    Was Tito supposed to let a 5-0 lead slip thru Jenks hands? This wasn't a matter of a right move. It can be argued Jenks shouldn't have closed out such a game, but Paps seems to have issues with big leads. And it's wiser to use Pap as a back-up than Jenks. Jenks worked in game one vs. the Phils and threw 96-97, and was decent. Tito went off that. He didn't use Jenks "because he needed the work".
    He could have used other stale relievers if that were the case.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    In Response to Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Positive Terry thread for ZILL : Was Tito supposed to let a 5-0 lead slip thru Jenks hands? This wasn't a matter of a right move. It can be argued Jenks shouldn't have closed out such a game, but Paps seems to have issues with big leads. And it's wiser to use Pap as a back-up than Jenks. Jenks worked in game one vs. the Phils and threw 96-97, and was decent. Tito went off that. He didn't use Jenks "because he needed the work". He could have used other stale relievers if that were the case.
    Posted by harness[/QUOTE]

    I'm confused harness, are you blaming Terry for bringing in Jenks being up by five?  Jenks just came off the DL so he could use the work.  He also did well in the first game as you stated so was Terry wrong even if he went off that performance?

    I don't see the move putting Jenks in or taking him right out when he struggled being the wrong move.

     
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    It wasn't a matter of right or wrong. Tito went with Jenks as he looked decent in his last outing. His velocity was at a high. It had nothing to do with lack of work. You don't put stale pitchers in that situation. Jenks showed Tuesday he was ready.

    Nor was it right or wrong to get Jenks the hell out of there when he did. It was necessitated. I'm not blaming him or crediting him. My point is, you are using a poor analogy. Tito's made some good, gutty moves this year. But this one didn't exemplify them.

    I don't think Tito is as bad as his bashers claim.
    Nor is he as good as his supports think he is.
    Like his players, he has his attributes and his liabilities.
    He will always have his players' back. And doing that while connecting with the FO can be a tightrope he walks better than anybody I've seen in Boston since Ralph Houk.

    On the negative side, his player deployment is often weak. His loyalty to certain players blind-sides him. His in-game tactics are highly controversial.
    His bashers/supporters generally only wish to see one side of the coin.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    In Response to Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL:
    [QUOTE]It wasn't a matter of right or wrong. Tito went with Jenks as he looked decent in his last outing. His velocity was at a high. It had nothing to do with lack of work. You don't put stale pitchers in that situation. Jenks showed Tuesday he was ready. Nor was it right or wrong to get Jenks the hell out of there when he did. It was necessitated. I'm not blaming him or crediting him. My point is, you are using a poor analogy. Tito's made some good, gutty moves this year. But this one didn't exemplify them. I don't think Tito is as bad as his bashers claim. Nor is he as good as his supports think he is. Like his players, he has his attributes and his liabilities. He will always have his players' back. And doing that while connecting with the FO can be a tightrope he walks better than anybody I've seen in Boston since Ralph Houk. On the negative side, his player deployment is often weak. His loyalty to certain players blind-sides him. His in-game tactics are highly controversial. His bashers/supporters generally only wish to see one side of the coin.
    Posted by harness[/QUOTE]

    You are entitled to your opinion harness but unfortunately I completely disagree.  There was absolutely no problem with putting Jenks or another pitcher in with a five run lead.  Would I have put him in with a one run lead?  No, but I don't even feel comfortable with Pap in close games anymore.


     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    Again, UR missing the point. My issue isn't with the Jenk's decisions either way.
    It's with you using this to foothold your OP. The decisions either way are a no-brainer (for reasons beyond what you originally stated).

    Either Jenks decision doesn't make UR point that Tito made a good move.
    In fact, it's contradictory. It's not a good example to use.

    Using his pulling Jenks for Paps is like saying Tito made a good move hitting AGONE 3rd. What is his alternative? hit him 9th?
    Who else but Paps would he bring in?
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from BOSOX1941. Show BOSOX1941's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    In Response to Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL:
    [QUOTE]Again, UR missing the point. My issue isn't with the Jenk's decisions either way. It 's with you using this to foothold your OP . The decisions either way are a no-brainer (for reasons beyond what you originally stated). Either Jenks decision doesn't make UR point that Tito made a good move . In fact, it's contradictory. It's not a good example to use. Using his pulling Jenks for Paps is like saying Tito made a good move hitting AGONE 3rd. What is his alternative? hit him 9th? Who else but Paps would he bring in?
    Posted by harness[/QUOTE]

    Very well put, harness.It's as if his fans think any simple move by him is genius.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    In Response to Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL:
    [QUOTE]Again, UR missing the point. My issue isn't with the Jenk's decisions either way. It 's with you using this to foothold your OP . The decisions either way are a no-brainer (for reasons beyond what you originally stated). Either Jenks decision doesn't make UR point that Tito made a good move . In fact, it's contradictory. It's not a good example to use. Using his pulling Jenks for Paps is like saying Tito made a good move hitting AGONE 3rd. What is his alternative? hit him 9th? Who else but Paps would he bring in?
    Posted by harness[/QUOTE]

    You obviously hold a great deal of value in your bizarre logic on certain points so who am I to bust your bubble.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    Nothing Bizarre about it - only your failure to comprehend it.
    You are giving Tito credit for the obvious. That in itself doesn't bode well for your support of him.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    In Response to Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL:
    [QUOTE]Nothing Bizarre about it - only your failure to comprehend it. You are giving Tito credit for the obvious . That in itself doesn't bode well for your support of him.
    Posted by harness[/QUOTE]

    harness, it must kill you not to know as much about the organization as you wish.  The first night I posted here you went off on a rant.  I knew then you were a piece of work so don't mind me if I just ignore you after tonight.  There are too many good people here to let someone like you bother me.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    Doesn't take much for you to unravel...just an opposing viewpoint.
    You are blaming me for your taking a position off a weak OP.
    I think Tito should get credit for starting Lester. He could have started Hottovy...
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonTrollSpanker. Show BostonTrollSpanker's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    : I knew then you were a piece of work so don't mind me if I just ignore you after tonight

    If you think Harness is a piece of work and hard to talk to you're not going to last long in here. 

    This isn't a good place for thin-skinned types who don't like opposing viewpoints, so if you're one of them you might want to find a more carefully managed forum.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    Be careful. He has relatives who post here!
    And he works for the organization.  Surprised

    Who else could get away with calling Theo a liar and not have any proof?
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from traven. Show traven's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    Bottom line - there has NEVER been a more successful manager than Terry Francona with the Sox.  History will treat him very kindly when his days with the Sox are over.  On this board we are all blessed with 20-20 hindsight and it is very easy to make a case against a Francona failure which seems to be one of the favorite topics on this board.  When the Sox lose, he gets the blame.  When the Sox win, the players get the credit. 

    Case in point - Philly thumps the Sox 2 out of 3 and Francona gets the blame - the Phillies get no credit, the Sox players get no blame - Francona is at fault for the lineup he put on the field, except of course for today which Lester got the credit for winning the game.
     
    I don't always agree with his moves, but that is my right, however for the Sox I have never seen him throw a wild pitch late in the game, blow a save opportunity, boot a ground ball with the bases loaded, strikeout with the bases loaded, and on and on.  The players are paid to perform, perhaps they should be called to account when they don't instead of finding some way to blame the manager for their failure.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from kimsaysthis. Show kimsaysthis's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    Does anyone else find it creepy that Zac copied Beni's pic and is still using it on the board? I realize he has a lot of kid pics on his computer and uses them all over the board, but isn't it enough with the Beni pic? 

    Maybe someone should take Zac's avatar and use it, since I'm sure it probably resembles him.

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    Pike did it also, Kim.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    In Response to Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL:
    [QUOTE]Bottom line - there has NEVER been a more successful manager than Terry Francona with the Sox.  History will treat him very kindly when his days with the Sox are over.  On this board we are all blessed with 20-20 hindsight and it is very easy to make a case against a Francona failure which seems to be one of the favorite topics on this board.  When the Sox lose, he gets the blame.  When the Sox win, the players get the credit.  Case in point - Philly thumps the Sox 2 out of 3 and Francona gets the blame - the Phillies get no credit, the Sox players get no blame - Francona is at fault for the lineup he put on the field, except of course for today which Lester got the credit for winning the game.   I don't always agree with his moves, but that is my right, however for the Sox I have never seen him throw a wild pitch late in the game, blow a save opportunity, boot a ground ball with the bases loaded, strikeout with the bases loaded, and on and on.  The players are paid to perform, perhaps they should be called to account when they don't instead of finding some way to blame the manager for their failure.
    Posted by traven[/QUOTE]

    This may be an unrelatable analogy for many, but I see a mgr as I would a jockey/driver on a race horse.
    A poor one can screw up a really good horse.
    A mediocre one can easily bring a strong horse in.
    A good one can get much out of a mediocre horse.

    Take UR pick.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from kimsaysthis. Show kimsaysthis's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    In Response to Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL:
    [QUOTE]Pike did it also, Kim .
    Posted by harness[/QUOTE]

    If he did, then I didn't see it. Doesn't excuse Zac as he has always used Beni's pic and has put it in a number of his posts. Everyone, including Pike if he did, should stop already. 
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: Positive Terry thread for ZILL

    Pike is the poster YOUR-ECHO. He uses it as his avatar, in a ridiculing fashion.
     
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