Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from SoxPatsCelts1988. Show SoxPatsCelts1988's posts

    Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    Gotta love how this is working out.   They upgrade and have more financial flexibility.  Pretty awesome.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from youkillus. Show youkillus's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...


    It's very rare that a team changes their starting C, SS and CF, and then wins the World Series,

    but hey, JH saved some dough, so we got that going for us.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from fizsh. Show fizsh's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    In response to youkillus' comment:


    It's very rare that a team changes their starting C, SS and CF, and then wins the World Series,

    but hey, JH saved some dough, so we got that going for us.



    How many times has a team changed their starting C, SS and CF? And how many times has that been a team that is a playoff contender?

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hetchinspete. Show Hetchinspete's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    I wouldn't call this an upgrade. We lose a Gold Glove center fielder, probably the best lead off hitter in baseball replaced by a player on the comeback trail. How on earth is that an upgrade ?

    Hetch 

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    In response to youkillus' comment:


    It's very rare that a team changes their starting C, SS and CF, and then wins the World Series,

    but hey, JH saved some dough, so we got that going for us.



    That's kind of like saying the Yankees saved some dough by letting Cano go.  It's true, but it doesn't tell the whole story.

    Our payroll will be right around the luxury tax threshold again - for about the 5th year in a row.

    I can't see knocking Henry about our payroll.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    In response to youkillus' comment:


    It's very rare that a team changes their starting C, SS and CF, and then wins the World Series,

    but hey, JH saved some dough, so we got that going for us.




    The Sox have always changed out their CF and SS.

     

    Before Ellsbury, the last CF to win two World Series with the Red Sox was Tris Speaker.

     

    The last shortstop to win two World Series with the Sox was Everett Scott.

     

    Yet fans cling to the notion that stability at these positions is essential....

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    In response to Hetchinspete's comment:

    I wouldn't call this an upgrade. We lose a Gold Glove center fielder, probably the best lead off hitter in baseball replaced by a player on the comeback trail. How on earth is that an upgrade ?

    Hetch 




     

    Have to agree.  Sizemore is a surprise, yes.  Upgrade? Certainly not yet...

     
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  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonTrollSpanker. Show BostonTrollSpanker's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    It's completely ridiculous to suggest that Sizemore, who hasn't played for who knows how long, is an upgrade over Ellsbury. We don't know who we have in Sizemore. 

    There are those of us who are not all that happy with these developments because we wanted to see Bradley out there anyhow. 

    I would have much preferred Bradley to start and Sizemore as backup. Look, the Sizemore signing looks pretty savvy on the Sox management standpoint as long as it doesn't block Bradley's development. 

    But to claim it's an upgrade over Ells is wishful thinking to the extreme.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    In response to youkillus' comment:


    It's very rare that a team changes their starting C, SS and CF, and then wins the World Series,

    but hey, JH saved some dough, so we got that going for us.



    It's also rare to win 3 WS in 10, so we got that going for us.

    NEXT!

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from dgalehouse. Show dgalehouse's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    Sizemore looks like he could turn out to be a great signing. However, it is extremely premature to call this an upgrade at this point.  But I am sure that John Henry appreciates all those who are happy when he saves money.

     
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  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    In response to dgalehouse's comment:

    Sizemore looks like he could turn out to be a great signing. However, it is extremely premature to call this an upgrade at this point.  But I am sure that John Henry appreciates all those who are happy when he saves money.



    Get serious, man.  This team has one of the highest payrolls in the game year-in and year-out.  The money 'saved' on Ellsbury gets spent somewhere else. 

    Yes, I'm happy to have an owner who's willing to do that. 

    What do you expect - $250 million payrolls and big operating losses every year?

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from javaukti1. Show javaukti1's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...


    A glass half-empty perspective: Sizemore signing and opening day start is due to JBJ failure, not a Grady success

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    ells was great but getting grady to play at this high level again (we hope he can sustain it) is awesome...and props to the many fans on this board who said grady could be a great addition to the team - there were more than a few skeptics if i recall... JBJ needs to be on the roster though because we need his speed and grady and shanev will need frequent days off

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from ma6dragon9. Show ma6dragon9's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    I thought my Henry bashing was the most extreme around...and even I won't go there.

    You're right, impossible to replace the SS, C and CF and win another WS...to that end, the Sox MUST reacquire Damon, Varitek and Orlando Cabrera!

    Also, I've been waiting for Ellsbury to go get paid ELSEwhere...but Sizemore is an upgrade? I know Ellsbury is already hurting, but let's see if Sizemore can even play 100 games.

    Did I wake up in some bizarro universe?

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    In response to georom4's comment:

    ells was great but getting grady to play at this high level again (we hope he can sustain it) is awesome...and props to the many fans on this board who said grady could be a great addition to the team - there were more than a few skeptics if i recall... JBJ needs to be on the roster though because we need his speed and grady and shanev will need frequent days off



    Who does JBJ replace then?

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from dgalehouse. Show dgalehouse's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:

    In response to dgalehouse's comment:

    Sizemore looks like he could turn out to be a great signing. However, it is extremely premature to call this an upgrade at this point.  But I am sure that John Henry appreciates all those who are happy when he saves money.



    Get serious, man.  This team has one of the highest payrolls in the game year-in and year-out.  The money 'saved' on Ellsbury gets spent somewhere else. 

    Yes, I'm happy to have an owner who's willing to do that. 

    What do you expect - $250 million payrolls and big operating losses every year?

     




    I'm dead serious. I want Henry to spend what it takes. It's not my money. The Sox had to have made a bundle from last year's post season. Spend it, John. Spend it. Do you want to see the Yankees back on top?  I don't.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    In response to dgalehouse's comment:

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:

    In response to dgalehouse's comment:

    Sizemore looks like he could turn out to be a great signing. However, it is extremely premature to call this an upgrade at this point.  But I am sure that John Henry appreciates all those who are happy when he saves money.



    Get serious, man.  This team has one of the highest payrolls in the game year-in and year-out.  The money 'saved' on Ellsbury gets spent somewhere else. 

    Yes, I'm happy to have an owner who's willing to do that. 

    What do you expect - $250 million payrolls and big operating losses every year?

     




    I'm dead serious. I want Henry to spend what it takes. It's not my money. The Sox had to have made a bundle from last year's post season. Spend it, John. Spend it. Do you want to see the Yankees back on top?  I don't.



    Spending "what it takes" is fine.  The typical complaint is usually more along the lines of "Henry is not spending money the way I think he should, so therefore he is wrong and cheap!!"

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    In response to pumpsie-green's comment:

    In response to georom4's comment:

    ells was great but getting grady to play at this high level again (we hope he can sustain it) is awesome...and props to the many fans on this board who said grady could be a great addition to the team - there were more than a few skeptics if i recall... JBJ needs to be on the roster though because we need his speed and grady and shanev will need frequent days off



    Who does JBJ replace then?



    Of course.  You see the same complaints from the less-serious writers sometimes.  A 25-man roster is not a lot of space.  You have set asides for BUC, UIF, #4 OF, and usually 1B.  If JBJ stays, then Nava or Carp go.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    In response to dgalehouse's comment:

    I'm dead serious. I want Henry to spend what it takes. It's not my money. The Sox had to have made a bundle from last year's post season. Spend it, John. Spend it. Do you want to see the Yankees back on top?  I don't.



    Last time they did the spend, spend thing it backfired disastrously.  Last year they did it right and won the World Series.  You're not really paying attention.

     

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    I'm dead serious. I want Henry to spend what it takes. It's not my money. The Sox had to have made a bundle from last year's post season. Spend it, John. Spend it. Do you want to see the Yankees back on top?  I don't.

    1-This is kind of the biggest issue in the world these days.  No one wants to live within a budget.  'Just spend' is usually a bad philosophy.

    2-If the only thing we depend on is trying to outspend everyone, we will lose.  In an all-out spending war, we do not have the resources to outspend NY, NY, Philly, LA, LA,  We're 9th in attendance.

    You really need to get your hands around this.  The only reason we won in 2013 is because we had cheap players in Ellsbury, Pedey, Iglesias, Lester, Buchholz, Doubront, Taz, etc.

    3-Is there really anything wrong with just being #2 or #3 in spending?  Is 'just buy a pennant' the point here?  There is already an inherent unfairness that we're only ahead of TB because we have more money.  How bad do you want to outspend them?

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    The Red Sox have proved 3 times in the last decade they don't have to outspend the Yankees to beat them and win a WS.....why stop now???

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    In response to Joebreidey's comment:

    I'm dead serious. I want Henry to spend what it takes. It's not my money. The Sox had to have made a bundle from last year's post season. Spend it, John. Spend it. Do you want to see the Yankees back on top?  I don't.

    1-This is kind of the biggest issue in the world these days.  No one wants to live within a budget.  'Just spend' is usually a bad philosophy.

    2-If the only thing we depend on is trying to outspend everyone, we will lose.  In an all-out spending war, we do not have the resources to outspend NY, NY, Philly, LA, LA,  We're 9th in attendance.

    You really need to get your hands around this.  The only reason we won in 2013 is because we had cheap players in Ellsbury, Pedey, Iglesias, Lester, Buchholz, Doubront, Taz, etc.

    3-Is there really anything wrong with just being #2 or #3 in spending?  Is 'just buy a pennant' the point here?  There is already an inherent unfairness that we're only ahead of TB because we have more money.  How bad do you want to outspend them?



    I admit that I was also in that camp for a long time. Spend and get the best FA at all cost....over time I have repented. I can see the evidence everywhere that this strategy is hollow. It rarely brings rings. If spending a lot of money worked the Dodgers would probably have won the WS last year, and the years the Dodgers didn't do it, the Yankees would have won. Its pretty clear that spending AROD or PUJOLS money for the number of years those guys got is a strategy that is doomed. Far better to develop inexpensive minor league talent and supplement that with a FA acquisition or two that represents value. No matter who the player is, I so not think that spending huge amounts of money for long contracts (>5 or 6 years at the very most, and usually fewer) is a good idea.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Pretty crazy that the Red Sox were able to upgrade at CF with minimal investment...

    I'm dead serious. I want Henry to spend what it takes. It's not my money. 

    I assume you realize that the players' salaries come from the fans.  How much of YOUR money are you going to send to JH to support the team?

    If you have four ST seats downstairs @$150/ticket, and you're cutting a check for $50,000 every January, and you're willing to pay another $10,000 to increase payroll by 20%, then I can at least respect your position.

    OTOH, if you want ticket holders to increase their contribution so that you can watch a better team on TV, then it looks a little like you want them to spend money on YOUR entertainment.

     
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