prince fielder.

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from bosoxhero. Show bosoxhero's posts

    prince fielder.

    i was just wondering why the tigers signed fielder when they have a first baseman as good as cabrera.i guess he dh's.but if that is the case why couldn't the sox signed him to do the same thing and not brought ortiz back.fielder is younger and better hitter.i would like some opinions about the sox not needing a great hitterand keeping him from the tigers or any other rival.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    I'd have loved to have Prince here instead of Papi for about 4 years, but 9 years!!??!!?!?!? 
    At $23-24M a year!!!!!
     
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  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from parhunter1. Show parhunter1's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    Not to mention how that would go over with AGon.  I am not at all sure the Tigers plan to use Fielder as their DH for the length of that contract.  I expect he will play a lot of 1B, and suspect he would not have signed if he was only going to DH.  Signing him to play in Boston would have been consigning him to being almost exclusively the DH.  I do not think he would have signed with the Sox for that reason, all money and years being equal.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Skadude22. Show Skadude22's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    Cabrera is moving to third. Fielder is playing first.  At least that is what the baseball world is reporting.  The idea was to replace the offense that they lost in VMart, but now with Cabrera at third, they can use all three.  Although I think Cabrera will be a disaster at third long-term.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from bosoxhero. Show bosoxhero's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    Cabrera at third base would be awful defensively.but i think the tigers will put him at first a few games a week.i just didn't see the need for them.especially at 9 years and 23 million.i think the Tigers would be better served putiing Cabrera in right or left field and leaving Inge at third.but i like that i am not the only person who thinks they put money where they didn't need to.They would have been better suited to add pitching like the Sox.I assume the Tigers will try to outscore their opponents.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Brickbat. Show Brickbat's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    Because at least the last four years of that contract will be a waste of money. Just look at the guy.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    If Papi has a higher OPS over the past two years, why would you want to Fielder approximately $10M per year to hit worse?
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Soxdog67. Show Soxdog67's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    In Response to Re: prince fielder.:
    Cabrera at third base would be awful defensively.but i think the tigers will put him at first a few games a week.i just didn't see the need for them.especially at 9 years and 23 million.i think the Tigers would be better served putiing Cabrera in right or left field and leaving Inge at third.but i like that i am not the only person who thinks they put money where they didn't need to.They would have been better suited to add pitching like the Sox.I assume the Tigers will try to outscore their opponents.
    Posted by bosoxhero


    Third base is Cabrera's natural position, as it is with Youkilis. So while he is still young (29) he'll be OK defensively there, but what he and Fielder will make up offensively will be worth the price of admission.




     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    In Response to Re: prince fielder.:
    In Response to Re: prince fielder. : Third base is Cabrera's natural position, as it is with Youkilis. So while he is still young (29) he'll be OK defensively there, but what he and Fielder will make up offensively will be worth the price of admission.
    Posted by Soxdog67


    If he was bad at 1st, what makes you think he'll be okay at a more challenging position?
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    We know Cabrera can hit but if he goes back to 3rd can he still bend over to catch grounders?

    That's great infield D, Prince on first Cabrera at third.

    I guess the price of having them back to back (no pun intended) in the line-up.

    The big question to be answered in 2012 will be will the gain in offense be worth the less than stellar defense?
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    In Response to Re: prince fielder.:
    Cabrera is moving to third. Fielder is playing first.  At least that is what the baseball world is reporting.  The idea was to replace the offense that they lost in VMart, but now with Cabrera at third, they can use all three.  Although I think Cabrera will be a disaster at third long-term.
    Posted by Skadude22


    After the first 25 bunt singles, they will start looking into moving Martinez out of town and Cabrera to DH.  So look for that about 3 games into 2013...
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Soxdog67. Show Soxdog67's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    In Response to Re: prince fielder.:
    We know Cabrera can hit but if he goes back to 3rd can he still bend over to catch grounders? That's great infield D, Prince on first Cabrera at third. I guess the price of having them back to back (no pun intended) in the line-up. The big question to be answered in 2012 will be will the gain in offense be worth the less than stellar defense?
    Posted by ThatWasMe


    Come on, be real...can he still bend over?? It's not like he's 400 pounds playing that position and he's still only 29 years old so I think he can still make the routine plays at 3B, as I bet the Tigers GM believes...I doubt Dombrowski is expecting either of his corner infielders to be gold glove defensively but they certainly will hit and with their starting pitching they will win a lot of games and bring in the fans.



     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    this contract is just straight up insane...it makes no sense from any perspective...which means it probably will work out great for everyone...
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from bald-predictions. Show bald-predictions's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    Adding fuel to the fire is the fact that he's a designated hitter that wants to be a first basemen. Adding more fuel to the fire is that a GM has signed him that wants to believe he's a first baseman. Adding another log yet is the fact that the same GM believes that another designated hitter on the roster is a third baseman after having spent the last four years trying to convince himself that he was a first baseman. There should be  a collision course between the two corner infielders sometime in the near future...
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    In Response to Re: prince fielder.:
    In Response to Re: prince fielder. : Come on, be real...can he still bend over?? It's not like he's 400 pounds playing that position and he's still only 29 years old so I think he can still make the routine plays at 3B, as I bet the Tigers GM believes...I doubt Dombrowski is expecting either of his corner infielders to be gold glove defensively but they certainly will hit and with their starting pitching they will win a lot of games and bring in the fans.
    Posted by Soxdog67


    When we moved Youk to 3B last, I questioned the move.  He started off a 3B, he's generally a good fielder, but he was older, slower, and while he still played 3B, he didn't play it a lot.  Consequently, I wasn't at all surprised that his fielding was a bit weak.

    Miggy starts off even behind Youk's curve.  It'll be 4.5 years since he last played 3B, virtually at all, was weak when he played it, and is bigger and slower now.

    Theoretically, if you played softball five years ago, and were a bad OFer back then, wouldn't you expect to be worse now, especially if you hadn't played the OF in almost 5 years?

    Whatever he was then, it stands to reason that he'd be worse now.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    In Response to Re: prince fielder.:
    In Response to Re: prince fielder. : When we moved Youk to 3B last, I questioned the move.  He started off a 3B, he's generally a good fielder, but he was older, slower, and while he still played 3B, he didn't play it a lot.  Consequently, I wasn't at all surprised that his fielding was a bit weak. Miggy starts off even behind Youk's curve.  It'll be 4.5 years since he last played 3B, virtually at all, was weak when he played it, and is bigger and slower now. Theoretically, if you played softball five years ago, and were a bad OFer back then, wouldn't you expect to be worse now, especially if you hadn't played the OF in almost 5 years? Whatever he was then, it stands to reason that he'd be worse now.
    Posted by Joebreidey


    Agree entirely Joe.

    Go back in history and name all the great defensive fat 3rd basemen you can think of.

    My point is that this does not look like a great defensive scheme.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Soxdog67. Show Soxdog67's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    In Response to Re: prince fielder.:
    In Response to Re: prince fielder. : When we moved Youk to 3B last, I questioned the move.  He started off a 3B, he's generally a good fielder, but he was older, slower, and while he still played 3B, he didn't play it a lot.  Consequently, I wasn't at all surprised that his fielding was a bit weak. Miggy starts off even behind Youk's curve.  It'll be 4.5 years since he last played 3B, virtually at all, was weak when he played it, and is bigger and slower now. Theoretically, if you played softball five years ago, and were a bad OFer back then, wouldn't you expect to be worse now, especially if you hadn't played the OF in almost 5 years? Whatever he was then, it stands to reason that he'd be worse now.
    Posted by Joebreidey


    Joe, there's no question that most people would not think to move Miggy back to 3B, but my guess is that Dombrowski and Cabrera had a long discussion before the offer for Fielder was placed on the table.

    I certainly am not discounting that Miggy will be less of a 3B than he was 4 years ago, but 3B does not actually require someone to be mobile and have great range...yeah he may allow a few bunts down the line but I think his 35-40 HRs will make up for that...don't you?

    Plus the Tigers have a decent pitching staff, led by the Cy winner, to help bail out Miggy if he gives up an extra hit here and there.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    In Response to Re: prince fielder.:
    In Response to Re: prince fielder. : Joe, there's no question that most people would not think to move Miggy back to 3B, but my guess is that Dombrowski and Cabrera had a long discussion before the offer for Fielder was placed on the table. I certainly am not discounting that Miggy will be less of a 3B than he was 4 years ago, but 3B does not actually require someone to be mobile and have great range...yeah he may allow a few bunts down the line but I think his 35-40 HRs will make up for that...don't you? Plus the Tigers have a decent pitching staff, led by the Cy winner, to help bail out Miggy if he gives up an extra hit here and there.
    Posted by Soxdog67


    Not that I think it's a horrible move.  For me, it goes to the value of the contract.  You added offense, but hurt your defense.  Trading for and signing Gonzo for $22M was a real nice move, on paper.  But we already had a real good 1B.  So that downgraded the move a little.  That was my objection to adding Teixeira.

    It's like when the NYM signed the Japanese SS when they already had Jose Reyes as their SS.  When your primary move forces a secondary move that you otherwise would not have made, it reduces the benefit of what you just paid for.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    In Response to Re: prince fielder.:
    In Response to Re: prince fielder. : Not that I think it's a horrible move.  For me, it goes to the value of the contract.  You added offense, but hurt your defense.  Trading for and signing Gonzo for $22M was a real nice move, on paper.  But we already had a real good 1B.  So that downgraded the move a little.  That was my objection to adding Teixeira. It's like when the NYM signed the Japanese SS when they already had Jose Reyes as their SS.  When your primary move forces a secondary move that you otherwise would not have made, it reduces the benefit of what you just paid for.
    Posted by Joebreidey


    My own personal opinion is that if you are going to sacrifice defense for offense then you'd better have a great player in mind to add to your roster which in this particular cirmcumstance is what Fielder is.

    But then to further weaken your team by putting Cabrera at third you then are asking for some pretty big numbers from these two just to justify the moves.

    As a Yankee fan roids aside I could never accept Giambi at first because of his shoddy defense, I felt he had to put up great numbers every game to justify his presence at 1st. Any shot down the line got by the immobile Giambi in YS was at least a double. Tex gets those balls that Giambi could not.

    Defense is important, good defense from your corner infielders is important. If you are a corner infielder it pays to be quick. A shot up the line in the corner is extra bases.
     
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  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    In Response to Re: prince fielder.:
    In Response to Re: prince fielder. : My own personal opinion is that if you are going to sacrifice defense for offense then you'd better have a great player in mind to add to your roster which in this particular cirmcumstance is what Fielder is. But then to further weaken your team by putting Cabrera at third you then are asking for some pretty big numbers froms these two just to justify the moves. As a Yankee fan roids aside I could never accept Giambi at first because of his shoddy defense, I felt he had to put up great numbers every game to justify his presence at 1st. Any shot down the line got by the immobile Giambi in YS was at least a double. Tex gets those balls that Giambi could not. Defense is important, good defense from your corner infielders is important. If you are a corner infielder it pays to be quick. A shot up the line in the corner is extra bases.
    Posted by ThatWasMe



    Yup.  Basically, I don't think Fielder is a great player.  His best 2-year stretch is .947.  That's real good, but it is at a position where offense is to be expected.  Over the past two years, Fielder is #5 among 1Bs in WAR.  Is that what you get for $24M?  #5?

    Past that, while I'm not a Tex fan, there is no discounting his fielding.  I thought at the time, and now, that his defense is as much an upgrade over Giambi as his hitting.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    I am against spending huge money for a first baseman in most/all cases. 18-20-22-24m+/year for a great SP, SS, CF....ok, it's hard to create or find one of those.  But there are plenty of options available to find or make a guy that can play/hit 1B well and leave you 10-15 million/year to spend on skill positions.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    In response to "Re: prince fielder.": [QUOTE]In Response to Re: prince fielder. :  Just look at the guy  Just look at this  guy I don't think this is about what  Dombrowski has planned ,IMO  it's  all about an 82 yr old owner going 4 it, after losing vmart   fielder was by far the best game changer available he's probably thinking he won't even be around at the end of the deal  kudos 2 Mike Ilitch Posted by pinstripezac[/QUOTE Agreed, from what I've read, this fwas Ilitch and Boras. Dombrowski is a sharp guy, and he had about as much to do with that deal as Theo did with the Beckett trade
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: prince fielder.

    In response to "Re: prince fielder.":
    I am against spending huge money for a first baseman in most/all cases. 18-20-22-24m+/year for a great SP, SS, CF....ok, it's hard to create or find one of those.  But there are plenty of options available to find or make a guy that can play/hit 1B well and leave you 10-15 million/year to spend on skill positions. Posted by Chilliwings
    I disagree. I think 1st base defense is huge. It makes the whole infield that much better. Jeter mentioned how Texeira's glove was as valuable as his bat when they won. Maybe its not a coincidence they never won a World Series with Giambi...when Theo traded Nomar for Cabrera and Doug "M," defense was the reason...
     
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