Reopening old wounds

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

    In response to Sheriff-Rojas' comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    I'm more upset about the David Murphy (and Gabbard) for Gagne deal.

     



    I'm tired of hearing about this one.  No question Gagne was awful.  No question in retropect it was a horrible trade.  But honestly, who at the time thought this was a bad trade?  

    I hate to say it, but this might have been the last time softy was right on a baseball issue.

     

    The intent was obvious.  The Red Sox were a bit thin in the pen.  Basically, all they could count on was Oki and Paps, and Oki had to be shut down in September due to a tired arm.  Fortunately, Oki and Paps were enough to get them through the postseason.  

    Sadly, GMs are mostly rated in hindsight. It's the nature of their business. 

     

    I'll take the World Series, thank you (and no thanks to Gagne, of course), and not complain about what could have been.




    I wasn't really complaining. I'm not upset about the Reddick deal. I was trying to put it in perspective by comparing it to another "no big deal" (but still bad) trade from our past, although the jury is still out on the Oakland deal.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

    In response to dgalehouse's comment:

    It is funny how some continue to defend this trade in an effort to support Cherington. You can still support Ben while admitting that this was a mistake. Everyone in baseball knows that it was. And , comparing Reddick to Plantier is absurd. Reddick is a far better ball player than Plantier was.  Let's get real. You can defend Ben C without trying to diminish Reddick. Let's try to be a little more objective here.

     I was highly critical of Theo, and have been very critical of Ben's moves this winter. I am not "defending" ben by saying that Reddick could be a "flash-in-the-pan" like Plantier was. Reddick's fielding will likely keep him around longer than Phil (8 years), but if Reddick hits like he does in the second half of the season over his career from now on, then this deal was no big loss.

    Career 2nd half: (623 PAs)  .220  20  62  (.262 OBP/.382 SLG/ .644 OPS)

    Time will tell.

     

     

     




     
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  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

    In response to softlaw2's comment:

    It's a season, not "over 2nd half".



    Except when we collapsed in Sept 2011, then it was 1 last month that was all that mattered.... even 2 last games for some (Beckett).

     

    You goalpost must be made of Balsawood for such easy and frequent movements.

     
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  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

    In response to Sheriff-Rojas' comment:

    In response to parhunter55's comment:

     

    Arroyo for Pena is the one that I liked the least.  At the time, I liked the Gabbard and Murphy for Gagne trade, as I thought the Sox were getting a shut down pitcher for a 4th OFer who was never going to get a chance in Boston (and I still believe he would not have amounted to much if he had continued to play for Boston) and Gabbard (who I liked, but recognized he was not likely to ever have any impact on a team's pitching staff).

    Reddick for Bailey still has to play out...which was the final message in the MLBTR column.

     



    I agree with everything you wrote here.  Another thing that I disliked so much about the Arroyo trade is that he loved playing for the Red Sox and embraced the fans.  He was foolish to take less to stay, as he got screwed.  While business is business, it served the Red Sox organization right to get the short end of this deal.  

     




    This trade is really made me lose some respect for Theo. It was shady at best.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

    In response to dgalehouse's comment:

    It is funny how some continue to defend this trade in an effort to support Cherington. You can still support Ben while admitting that this was a mistake. Everyone in baseball knows that it was. And , comparing Reddick to Plantier is absurd. Reddick is a far better ball player than Plantier was.  Let's get real. You can defend Ben C without trying to diminish Reddick. Let's try to be a little more objective here.

     

     

     

     




    Ive stated many times I would have rather given Kalish up. It certainly hasnt worked out well for the Sox, but BC has made some very solid moves that counter and trump his bad one. Steven Wright for Lars should go in our favor and working out the players involved in the LAD deal.

    All GM's are going to bad "bad moves". I do understand the circumstances at the time of the trade and it did look like a fair deal. A 2 time AS closer for a kid who had 4th OF'er written all over him and a couple of low level prospects...

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from carnie. Show carnie's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

    Sparky Lyle for Danny Cater. Worst. Trade. Ever.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hingham Hammer. Show Hingham Hammer's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

    In response to pinstripezac35's comment:

    In response to parhunter55's comment:

     

    Arroyo for Pena is the one that I liked the least.  At the time, I liked the Gabbard and Murphy for Gagne trade, as I thought the Sox were getting a shut down pitcher for a 4th OFer who was never going to get a chance in Boston (and I still believe he would not have amounted to much if he had continued to play for Boston) and Gabbard (who I liked, but recognized he was not likely to ever have any impact on a team's pitching staff).

    Reddick for Bailey still has to play out...which was the final message in the MLBTR column.

     



    Reddick for Bailey still has to play out...which was the final message in the MLBTR column.

     

     

    I thought ''Transaction Retrospection:'' was a interesting idea

    but was disappointed they didn't focus on a trade from 2 or 3 yrs ago

    granderson  trade would of been more interesting

    Hi Zac,

              The granderson trade was more about the now for ny and tomorrow's for the tigers.

                          

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

    In response to softlaw2's comment:

    No, it wasn't the last month that mattered. It was the entire 2011 season that mattered, which included the greatest team losing games collapse that had noting to do with posting "last half individual player snipets".

    You are blind and don't even know where the goal posts are, much less talking about them moving. "Last half" is trying to tell lies with statistics.

    And I'm so glad Santana is with the Mets, because if it were up to you he would be the pitching version of Carl Crawford.



    You have a history of judging players definitively on tiny sample sizes, at times, as little as one plate appearance, and now you criticize me for using a 600+ PA sample size of Reddick's career 2nd half numbers. And, you wonder why I call you a silly clown.

    I never said that is what his future projects to, but used it as a sample size that may end up being what the rest of his career could amount to as a low end projection. I happen to think Reddick will improve on his overall career numbers, but you seem to enjoy projecting positions onto other posters that don't exist or never existed.

    Josh just turned 26 and has room to improve, but it is also possible that teams have figured out a way to get him out. His career line is not spectacular at all, but I'll leave it to you to tell us all about his "median average" and other silliness.

    In 986 career PAs, Josh has an OBP of .300 and a BA of .244. His BA went down last year (.242).  His 162 game line is: .244  23  66.

    I can imagine if "Jake" put up those numbers...

     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

    No, it wasn't the last month that mattered.

     

    Then why the dozens of posts about the "biggest collapse in MLB history"?

     
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  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThefourBs. Show ThefourBs's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

    In response to Triumph-'s comment:

    In response to Hingham Hammer's comment:

     

    In response to pinstripezac35's comment:

     

    In response to parhunter55's comment:

     

    Arroyo for Pena is the one that I liked the least.  At the time, I liked the Gabbard and Murphy for Gagne trade, as I thought the Sox were getting a shut down pitcher for a 4th OFer who was never going to get a chance in Boston (and I still believe he would not have amounted to much if he had continued to play for Boston) and Gabbard (who I liked, but recognized he was not likely to ever have any impact on a team's pitching staff).

    Reddick for Bailey still has to play out...which was the final message in the MLBTR column.

     



    Reddick for Bailey still has to play out...which was the final message in the MLBTR column.

     

     

    I thought ''Transaction Retrospection:'' was a interesting idea

    but was disappointed they didn't focus on a trade from 2 or 3 yrs ago

    granderson  trade would of been more interesting

     

    Hi Zac,

     

              The granderson trade was more about the now for ny and tomorrow's for the tigers.

                          

     




     

     

     

     

     

    Look foward to your insight every morning

    for a good laugh




    Pot meet Kettle...

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Schumpeters-Ghost. Show Schumpeters-Ghost's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    Yeah, Plantier never won a GG, but he did hit 34 HRs his first year with SD (and 100 RBIs).

     

    He ended up with 91 HRs in 2166 PAs or about 24 per 575 PAs (.243 BA/.332 OBP).

     

    He was basically a one year wonder, and that may be what Josh turns out to be.

     

    Plantier Career: (2166) .243  91  292   0 GG

    Reddick Career: (1076) .244  42  122   1 GG

    per 162 games:

    Plantier  .243  24  78  (.332 OBP/.439 SLG/.770 OPS) 

    Reddick  .244  23  66  (.300 OBP/.445 SLG/.745 OPS)

     

     

     




     

    So defense doesn't matter to you?

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Ice-Cream. Show Ice-Cream's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    No, it wasn't the last month that mattered.

     

    Then why the dozens of posts about the "biggest collapse in MLB history"?



    I had a debate with my colleagues--What is the biggest collapse in MLB history?  Here are my top three.  

     

    1987 Toronto Blue Jays

    The Blue Jays blew a 3.5-game lead with seven to play.  The Blue Jays lost their final three games to the Tigers (all by a single run) which helped Detroit clinch the AL East title.

     

     

    2007 New York Mets

    On Sept 12, the Mets had a seven-game lead over the Phillies.  The Mets then went 5-12 in their final 17 games which helped the Phillies win the NL East.  

     

     

    2012 Texas Rangers

    The Rangers had a five-game lead over the Oakland A's with only nine to play.  The A's swept the Rangers to win the AL West.  

     

    I am a bit biased so I refuse to add the 2011 Boston Red Sox.   LOL

     

     

     

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from mef429. Show mef429's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

    In response to Ice-Cream's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    No, it wasn't the last month that mattered.

     

    Then why the dozens of posts about the "biggest collapse in MLB history"?

     

     



    I had a debate with my colleagues--What is the biggest collapse in MLB history?  Here are my top three.  

     

    1987 Toronto Blue Jays

    The Blue Jays blew a 3.5-game lead with seven to play.  The Blue Jays lost their final three games to the Tigers (all by a single run) which helped Detroit clinch the AL East title.

     

     

    2007 New York Mets

    On Sept 12, the Mets had a seven-game lead over the Phillies.  The Mets then went 5-12 in their final 17 games which helped the Phillies win the NL East.  

     

     

    2012 Texas Rangers

    The Rangers had a five-game lead over the Oakland A's with only nine to play.  The A's swept the Rangers to win the AL West.  

     

    I am a bit biased so I refuse to add the 2011 Boston Red Sox.   LOL

     

     

     




    you HAVE to include the 2011 sox as well as the 2011 Braves..... the 2 biggest blows leads in MLB history and they happened at the same time..

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

    In response to Schumpeters-Ghost's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    Yeah, Plantier never won a GG, but he did hit 34 HRs his first year with SD (and 100 RBIs).

     

    He ended up with 91 HRs in 2166 PAs or about 24 per 575 PAs (.243 BA/.332 OBP).

     

    He was basically a one year wonder, and that may be what Josh turns out to be.

     

    Plantier Career: (2166) .243  91  292   0 GG

    Reddick Career: (1076) .244  42  122   1 GG

    per 162 games:

    Plantier  .243  24  78  (.332 OBP/.439 SLG/.770 OPS) 

    Reddick  .244  23  66  (.300 OBP/.445 SLG/.745 OPS)

     

     

     

     




     

     

    So defense doesn't matter to you?



    Defense matter more to me than almost anyone here. I was not taking sides here. I agree the trade looks bad so far. I was just saying that, like Plantier, Josh could just be a flash in the pan. I also mentioned his defense will probably keep him in MLB longer than Phil's 8 years.

    Try to understand what others post instead of inventing strawmen.

     
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  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

    In response to softlaw2's comment:

    The biggest collapse in MLB season history is about the entire season, not "the last 30 days of stat snipets".



    Wow, that's deep.

    Let me get my boots.

     

    I wonder who the softy impersonator was who made countless posts about the "biggest collapse in MLB history" and went on and on about short poor one month sample sizes by various players. Iguess one month mattered then, but now 600+ PAs is not worthy of discussion, because the larger sample size does not indicate what your preconceived mind wants it to.

     
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  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

    In response to softlaw2's comment:

    and went on and on about short poor one month sample sizes by various players

    No, that's what you do, Moonshlep. You and your "last half" nonsense.

    The team was not "doing great". They had a massive payroll and were simply clinging to tiny lead. Wastefield was being carted out there like the fat loser he was, and the leadership for the entire pitching staff was horrible. That team was going nowhere in the playoffs, even it didn't end up being the greatest season collapse team in MLB history.



    Once again- proving you don't let the facts or the truth get in your way.

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Ice-Cream. Show Ice-Cream's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

     

    I agree with you mef429   :)

    But I am trying to forget that painful Sept of 2011.  

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Schumpeters-Ghost. Show Schumpeters-Ghost's posts

    Re: Reopening old wounds

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    Defense matter more to me than almost anyone here. I was not taking sides here. I agree the trade looks bad so far. I was just saying that, like Plantier, Josh could just be a flash in the pan. I also mentioned his defense will probably keep him in MLB longer than Phil's 8 years.

     

    Try to understand what others post instead of inventing strawmen.




     

    Now I understand.

    You made the worst comparison you could come up with.  Why would you pick Phil Plantier who couldn't field AT ALL? 

    It's a lousy comparison to make a goofy point "he could be a flash in the pan"

    So could Mike Trout.  He could be a flash in the pan.  Bryce Harper?  Could be a flash in the pan.

     

     

     

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