In response to Softlaw1's comment:

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In response to EdithBRTN's comment:

Not to mention the guy as we speak is laying in a hospital bed surrounded by his family.

Poor taste by you but no surprise.

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In response to EdithBRTN's comment:

With an absolute desperate screwball attack on a former President who is currently fighting for his life.

Btw both houses of congress looked into your theory and dropped it for lack of documentation to support it.

Please show me a political post by me on this thread.

Here I am arguing with a crazy man expecting him to be logical.

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In response to EdithBRTN's comment:

I didn't have to review this thread from the beginning.

I don't know what Jimmy Carter has to do with your post.

All I had to do was read your post from some whacko internet site sliming GHW Bush.

I don't care how you justify posting that piece of rubbish.

GWH Bush flew 58 combat missions during WWII and was shot down in hostile territory.

He is 88 years old and in ICU the timing of your post was classless, stupid and your attempt to justify it typically pike.

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In response to EdithBRTN's comment:

The "devil made me do it".

I'm not responsible for how I respond.

Good defense pike.

I didn't vote for GHW Bush his 2nd term and in retrospect I don't know why.

We need more leaders in high places like Storming Norman and GHW.

People who have walked the walk.

Just read about his WWII experience, he was just a kid. Big set.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_H._W._Bush

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In response to EdithBRTN's comment:

pike you posted the bogus story on GHW Bush, that is what I responded to.

Is it really that confusing?

Yaz made me search the internet for the bogus story on Bush, he threatened to kill all my cows.

To put my prize tutu up for sale on e-bay. Yaz made me do it. Don't you understand?

At 2:42 sinceYaz made internet history.

SinceYaz is responsible

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In response to EdithBRTN's comment:

Edith, you need a strong man in your life.

In response to EdithBRTN's comment:

I used leadership as an example and did not attack Jimmy Carter.  I voted for Carter and still think he was one of the more ethical men that has occupied the Oval Office.   What I responded to was the issue Zilla brought up about our technology being superior - it had better be, we pay top dollar for the best and somehow the General wasn't a factor. 

If the bullshirt you want to bring up about supposed back channel stuff is how you wish to respond, fine.  But you missed the whole point.  As usual.  

Your mindset is reprehensible.  I was trying to honor someone.  I don't know who you are and I could give a rat's patoot about it ... this is the last time I will ever waste my time with you.

What a complete idiot and moron you are.  The whole thread was not about sports ... you make the fictional Homer Simpson look like a genuine Oxford scholar.

In response to ThatWasMe's comment:

In response to SinceYaz's comment:

I hope so..... he is creepy isn't he Yaz?

In response to EdithBRTN's comment:

In response to EdithBRTN's comment:

However just because that person does something dumb does not mean you should follow him down that road. You made it worse in light of the thread being about a GREAT MAN.

As Bill's Dad would say TWO WRONGS DON'T MAKE IT RIGHT

In response to EdithBRTN's comment:

The Kennedy and Carter comments made by others are totally out of line and show how bad some on this forum have gotten. When they can not stay on topic even about a GREAT MAN

In response to JimfromFlorida's comment:

On April 24, 1980, an ill-fated military operation to rescue the 52 American hostages held in Tehran ends with eight U.S. servicemen dead and no hostages rescued.

With the Iran Hostage Crisis stretching into its sixth month and all diplomatic appeals to the Iranian government ending in failure, President Jimmy Carter ordered the military mission as a last ditch attempt to save the hostages. During the operation, three of eight helicopters failed, crippling the crucial airborne plans. The mission was then canceled at the staging area in Iran, but during the withdrawal one of the retreating helicopters collided with one of six C-130 transport planes, killing eight soldiers and injuring five. The next day, a somber Jimmy Carter gave a press conference in which he took full responsibility for the tragedy. The hostages were not released for another 270 days.

Link:  http://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/hostage-rescue-mission-ends-in-disaster

    The military equipment - an point Zilla brought up - used at the time was fine for our normal theaters of involvement such as Europe, Pacific rim Asia and so on, but was NOT ready for the demands of desert warfare.  The LEADERSHIP issue that was in question was one that was not properly informed ... but the military learned from this gaff and began retooling for the fine dust and sand of the terrain in the Middle East.    The rescue attempt was seen as a disaster - but if you remember, Jimmy Carter was a man who learned while in office.  He was often seen taking huge tomes of information as his reading material - to his credit.  Many ridiculed him for seeming so intent on learning.  I did not.  I found it refreshing that he didn't put on airs that he knew it all.

     Norman Schwarzkopf was a beneficiary of the technical lessons learned.  But his leadership was top notch and showed clarity, purpose and defined resolve.    As I stated in my first post, the General was one of the examples of efficiency and effectiveness that convinced my older son that the military was also efficient and effective and thus gave himself whole-heartedly in service for the last decade.