Rivera tears ACL

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from J-BAY. Show J-BAY's posts

    Re: Rivera tears ACL

    famous last words......we'll see, he may not realize what the rehab entalils and at 43, even more so. Especially a knee injury and after a year off from pitching. 
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from MikeNagy stilleatsworms. Show MikeNagy stilleatsworms's posts

    Re: Rivera tears ACL

    Worms
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: Rivera tears ACL

    In Response to Re: Rivera tears ACL:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Rivera tears ACL : I'd be surprised to see him come back at age 42 from a torn ACL.
    Posted by ThatWasMe[/QUOTE]
    If anyone can do it ...
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: Rivera tears ACL

    In Response to Re: Rivera tears ACL:
    [QUOTE]1 innings saves vs 2 innings saves i don't care for how many years there's a big difference Rivera is a top closer of all time - easily top 3, but I can not consider him the clear best of all time
    Posted by andrewmitch[/QUOTE]

    Rivera is cleary the best of the modern closers if one considers both the length of his career and his body of work over what is now almost 2 decades. Eckersley for about a 5 year period with the A's put up some pretty nasty numbers, but his resume falls short of Mo's who's been dominating for 17 years. Who know's what might have been had Eck started his career in the pen. End of the day, if I had to get three outs with a 1 run lead...If I had my choice of Eck in his prime or Mo...I'd take Mo. It was the manner in which Larussa delpoyed Eckersley and the evolution of the set-up guys with Oakland that is chiefly responsible for the way the back end of the pen is used in the modern game...

    That said, It's alway difficult to compare pitchers from differing era's. Closer's in particular who's role has evolved over time. The Yankees in the 50's were chiefly responsible for starting what has eveloved to the way team build and use the modern bullpen. Then begining in the late 60's into the early 70's. The importance placed on having a reliable arm to finish games began to take on more importance..Rollie Fingers in the early 70's & Goose Gossage in the late 70's are two that come to mind, both were asked to pitch mulitple inning to earn a save, often getting as many as 9 outs. Who had they been used like todays modern closers? Might well have been even more dominating and perhaps with the reduced workload might have been able to extend thier primes. Bruce Sutter in the 80's is the hybred version, where he often was asked to get 6 outs, rarely was asked to get 9

    The eveloution of the way the modern closer are used makes it difficult to compare the differing era's but IMHO the genisis started with Fingers who helped to pitch the A's to thee striaght WS tittles. His success and the success of the A's played a key role in the evololution of the position...Gossage, is another example of the evolution of the profile of the modern closer, in that when he was asked to pitch out of the pen, it allowed him to step on the gas peddle and throw the ball by hitters and it is he that is responsible for guys like Papelbon and Mo both beggining thier careers in the pen.


     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from andrewmitch. Show andrewmitch's posts

    Re: Rivera tears ACL

    In Response to Re: Rivera tears ACL:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Rivera tears ACL : Rivera is cleary the best of the modern closers if one considers both the length of his career and his body of work over what is now almost 2 decades. Eckersley for about a 5 year period with the A's put up some pretty nasty numbers, but his resume falls short of Mo's who's been dominating for 17 years. Who know's what might have been had Eck started his career in the pen. End of the day, if I had to get three outs with a 1 run lead...If I had my choice of Eck in his prime or Mo...I'd take Mo. It was the manner in which Larussa delpoyed Eckersley and the evolution of the set-up guys with Oakland that is chiefly responsible for the way the back end of the pen is used in the modern game... That said, It's alway difficult to compare pitchers from differing era's. Closer's in particular who's role has evolved over time. The Yankees in the 50's were chiefly responsible for starting what has eveloved to the way team build and use the modern bullpen. Then begining in the late 60's into the early 70's. The importance placed on having a reliable arm to finish games began to take on more importance..Rollie Fingers in the early 70's & Goose Gossage in the late 70's are two that come to mind, both were asked to pitch mulitple inning to earn a save, often getting as many as 9 outs. Who had they been used like todays modern closers? Might well have been even more dominating and perhaps with the reduced workload might have been able to extend thier primes. Bruce Sutter in the 80's is the hybred version, where he often was asked to get 6 outs, rarely was asked to get 9 The eveloution of the way the modern closer are used makes it difficult to compare the differing era's but IMHO the genisis started with Fingers who helped to pitch the A's to thee striaght WS tittles. His success and the success of the A's played a key role in the evololution of the position...Gossage, is another example of the evolution of the profile of the modern closer, in that when he was asked to pitch out of the pen, it allowed him to step on the gas peddle and throw the ball by hitters and it is he that is responsible for guys like Papelbon and Mo both beggining thier careers in the pen.
    Posted by Beantowne[/QUOTE]

    All good points.  That's why I say Rivera is the best of the "Start a clean inning up by 2 runs" closers.  That's why a lot of people say the Save stat is over rated.  I remembered when even guys like The Steamer would come into the 7th inning, 1 run game, 2 on, 1 out and get of the jam and then finish the game.  The Steamer didn't need no stinkin set-up man...Quiz, Willie, Goose, Rollie - they were their own lefty specialists, set up man, and finishers......

    I encourage you guys to go back and look at some of the stats - particularily Innings Pitched.  140 innings year after year.....Tough Saves.......That's why I can't give the title to Rivera.......Yes, he did it for a long time but then why not bring up Trevor Hoffman too?  Because Hoffman's team didn't play in the largest media market in the history of history and therefore didn't have the resources to make the post season year after year to accumulate post season success.....Here's another knock on Rivera - although he was as COLD AS ICE for the easy saves - 3 up, 3 down.......there was a huge difference in him when (if) the lead off man got on.  It completely changed him.  He could be rattled.  Whether it was throwing a bunt attempt into Centerfield or falling down like Charlie Brown on a line drive hit up the middle.  And yes, we have seen him yell at players too (he once yelled "CATCH THE BALL" to Kenny Lofton during a BLOWN SAVE against the Red Sox in yes, 2004 regular season).........

    Here are your automatics

    Best 3B - Schmidt
    Best C - Bench
    Best SS - Wagner
    Best 2B - Hornsby
    Best RF - Ruth
    Best CF - Mays
    Best LF - Williams
    SP - W Johnson

    Closer - Eck, Quiz, Goose, Rollie, and yes, Rivera but it is not the same thing as chosing Mike Schmidt over George Brett or Brooks or Chipper....

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Schumpeters-Ghost. Show Schumpeters-Ghost's posts

    Re: Rivera tears ACL

    Two big questions for the Yankees:

    1.  Who will close?

    and

    2.  How will that closer perform without the benefit of 6 inches of extra strike zone on either side of the plate that Rivera has enjoyed for years?
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: Rivera tears ACL

    In Response to Re: Rivera tears ACL:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Rivera tears ACL : All good points.  That's why I say Rivera is the best of the "Start a clean inning up by 2 runs" closers.  That's why a lot of people say the Save stat is over rated.  I remembered when even guys like The Steamer would come into the 7th inning, 1 run game, 2 on, 1 out and get of the jam and then finish the game.  The Steamer didn't need no stinkin set-up man...Quiz, Willie, Goose, Rollie - they were their own lefty specialists, set up man, and finishers...... I encourage you guys to go back and look at some of the stats - particularily Innings Pitched.  140 innings year after year.....Tough Saves.......That's why I can't give the title to Rivera.......Yes, he did it for a long time but then why not bring up Trevor Hoffman too?  Because Hoffman's team didn't play in the largest media market in the history of history and therefore didn't have the resources to make the post season year after year to accumulate post season success.....Here's another knock on Rivera - although he was as COLD AS ICE for the easy saves - 3 up, 3 down.......there was a huge difference in him when (if) the lead off man got on.  It completely changed him.  He could be rattled.  Whether it was throwing a bunt attempt into Centerfield or falling down like Charlie Brown on a line drive hit up the middle.  And yes, we have seen him yell at players too (he once yelled "CATCH THE BALL" to Kenny Lofton during a BLOWN SAVE against the Red Sox in yes, 2004 regular season)......... Here are your automatics Best 3B - Schmidt Best C - Bench Best SS - Wagner Best 2B - Hornsby Best RF - Ruth Best CF - Mays Best LF - Williams SP - W Johnson Closer - Eck, Quiz, Goose, Rollie, and yes, Rivera but it is not the same thing as chosing Mike Schmidt over George Brett or Brooks or Chipper....
    Posted by andrewmitch[/QUOTE]

    Rivera is one of the greatest players of all time. He ranks in Yankee history with Ruth and Gehrig.

    Eck and Gossage?

    Absolutely hilarious. Neither can hold a candle to Rivera in the record books, achievements or longevity either in regular or post season. Not even close.

    You would not be posing this stupid bumbling rant of contrived standards if Rivera pitched for the Red Sox.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThatWasMe. Show ThatWasMe's posts

    Re: Rivera tears ACL

    It will be interesting to see how the Yankees and Girardi meet this challenge.

    Robertson comes in last night bottom of the 9th and ks the three batters he faces.

    They have Soriano and they could move Hughes into the pen where he's had success.

     
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  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Rivera tears ACL

    In Response to Re: Rivera tears ACL:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Rivera tears ACL : Rivera is one of the greatest players of all time. He ranks in Yankee history with Ruth and Gehrig. Eck and Gossage? Absolutely hilarious. Neither can hold a candle to Rivera in the record books, achievements or longevity either in regular or post season. Not even close. You would not be posing this stupid bumbling rant of contrived standards if Rivera pitched for the Red Sox.
    Posted by ThatWasMe[/QUOTE]

    LOL, so true.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

    Re: Rivera tears ACL

    Just back from a rough week but needed to chime in here. I will stay clear of the "Greatest Ever" discussion. I have my opinion on this and no discussion of amount of innings pitched will change that.

    Mo has been the class act of baseball since he came into the league. He has been humble, generous with his financial blessings and a joy to watch. He is a professional who IMO was a shining star during the roids era. We talk about how he only pitches an inning a game and although that is an untrue statement - we don't mention that he had to go against the biggest cheats that ever played the game, A-Rod, Manny, M.M., etc.

    The Yanks will miss him dearly and his loss will affect the NY bullpen in the long run. His loss is a loss for all MLB.

    He is my all-time favorite Yankee for so many reasons and I am hard pressed to think that would ever change.

    As Bobby Cox once said, put Mariano on my Braves and we would have been filled with rings.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from jete02fan. Show jete02fan's posts

    Re: Rivera tears ACL

    In Response to Re: Rivera tears ACL:
    [QUOTE]Just back from a rough week but needed to chime in here. I will stay clear of the "Greatest Ever" discussion. I have my opinion on this and no discussion of amount of innings pitched will change that. Mo has been the class act of baseball since he came into the league. He has been humble, generous with his financial blessings and a joy to watch. He is a professional who IMO was a shining star during the roids era. We talk about how he only pitches an inning a game and although that is an untrue statement - we don't mention that he had to go against the biggest cheats that ever played the game, A-Rod, Manny, M.M., etc. The Yanks will miss him dearly and his loss will affect the NY bullpen in the long run. His loss is a loss for all MLB. He is my all-time favorite Yankee for so many reasons and I am hard pressed to think that would ever change. As Bobby Cox once said, put Mariano on my Braves and we would have been filled with rings.
    Posted by jesseyeric[/QUOTE]hey Jess, good to have you back, hope things are ok..
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: Rivera tears ACL

    Agree with jesseyeric.   We have all been robbed by this injury.  I do think the Yankees will find an adequate replacement, but that's not the same as watching the maestro at work. 
     
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