Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    Here are his last two outings. I was following last night's on milb gameday, 
    and he has completely lost it.

    Tuesday:
    In your weekly Daniel Bard update, the righthander recorded just one out and walked four Tuesday against Scranton. 

    Thursday:

    In the seventh inning on Thursday, it happened again: he walked two, hit Brandon Laird in the head, made a throwing error, and — after a fielding error by Iglesias brought in one run — allowed a two-run single that turned a 4-2 lead into a 5-4 loss.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from JimfromFlorida. Show JimfromFlorida's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    Moving him to a starter may be the dumbest move of the year by him and the team.
     
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  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    This is all on Ben. He was determined that Bard be a starter so he wouldn't have negotiate for one. Bard should have spent this season spot starting, or even better, relegated to the long role in the BP before ever being considered in the regular rotation.
    He's a ballplayer so perhaps they can make him an OFer and get his hitting up to speed.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from jarretfromportsmouth. Show jarretfromportsmouth's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    best thing they can do for Bard now is shut him down for the year...he needs to clear his head.  some guys need to work it out on the field, he is clearly NOT able to do that.  Send him home, let him think about something other than baseball.  Bring him back in a month and see where he's at.

    Right now the mental battle is killing him and he's a danger to other players.


     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from stan17. Show stan17's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    In Response to Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel:
    This is all on Ben. He was determined that Bard be a starter so he wouldn't have negotiate for one. Bard should have spent this season spot starting, or even better, relegated to the long role in the BP before ever being considered in the regular rotation. He's a ballplayer so perhaps they can make him an OFer and get his hitting up to speed.
    Posted by Alibiike


    Wrong, not all on BC only half. The other half belongs with Bard, he wanted to go back to being a starter as he was all through college. We went down this road with him in the minors as a starter and it was a disaster. He should've been kept a reliever.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    In Response to Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel:
    This is all on Ben. He was determined that Bard be a starter so he wouldn't have negotiate for one. Bard should have spent this season spot starting, or even better, relegated to the long role in the BP before ever being considered in the regular rotation. He's a ballplayer so perhaps they can make him an OFer and get his hitting up to speed.
    Posted by Alibiike


    The problem with that theory is he started falling apart last year with a 10.64 ERA and an 11/9 K/W in September.  And he hasn't had a hit since what?  2006?  In college?
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    In Response to Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel:
    In Response to Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel : The problem with that theory is he started falling apart last year with a 10.64 ERA and an 11/9 K/W in September.  And he hasn't had a hit since what?  2006?  In college?
    Posted by Joebreidey


    Bard was overutilized last year-out of necessity. By the end of the year his velocity had dropped and he became ineffective, but only for a short period of time. Over the winter they forced him to change his release point in a futile effort to transform him into a SP. That change caused him to be unable to replicate his delivery and resulted in a loss of control. The issue was not trying to convert him, it was that once it was evident that it wasn't working they left him in there way too long. Nothing wrong with trying, but as usual, this team was too slow with the hook. Its a long offseason; he could still come back next year and be effective. 50-50 IMO.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    In Response to Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel:
    In Response to Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel : Bard was overutilized last year-out of necessity. By the end of the year his velocity had dropped and he became ineffective, but only for a short period of time. Over the winter they forced him to change his release point in a futile effort to transform him into a SP. That change caused him to be unable to replicate his delivery and resulted in a loss of control. The issue was not trying to convert him, it was that once it was evident that it wasn't working they left him in there way too long. Nothing wrong with trying, but as usual, this team was too slow with the hook. Its a long offseason; he could still come back next year and be effective. 50-50 IMO.
    Posted by pumpsie-green


    I would say that there is something wrong with trying.  I had no problem with them making the attempt, but I think the safer route would've been to trade him for value.  There would've been at least a couple of teams that would've thought to make a closer out of him.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from peanutandme. Show peanutandme's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    Can you say Joba Chamberlain when thinking about Bard?

    Same thing happened to Chamberlain when  the Yankees tried to make him a starter.

    Should have left well enough alone, but also Bard insisted on the  move. Now he is a mess and will take a year before he is again a good relief pitcher, if ever, They may just have to move him.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from Mchampion. Show Mchampion's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    In Response to Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel:
    In Response to Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel : Wrong, not all on BC only half. The other half belongs with Bard, he wanted to go back to being a starter as he was all through college. We went down this road with him in the minors as a starter and it was a disaster. He should've been kept a reliever.
    Posted by stan17

    I disagree Stan.  It is 100% BC fault.  It was tried in the minors and was a disaster. The major leagues is no place to experiment again.  Total fault belongs to management, the players are paid to do as they are told and perform at their optimum level.  He should have slid into he closer roll and Aceves should have been the starter.  Again enabling the high draft picks and ignoring the facts.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Motown9009. Show Motown9009's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel


    Didn't Bobby V give an interview during Spring Training where he more or less said they were going to try Bard out as a starter and see if he's a better suited to start or relieve this year? ....and Cherington then came out and said that Bard would be starting, end of story?
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Drewski5. Show Drewski5's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    Chris Sale has transformed from reliever to one of the best starters in the league.  A top of the line starter is worth way more than any relief pitcher.  I never blamed the sox for trying.  I have no idea what went wrong, but it may have been that they tried to tweak too much in the conversion.  Clearly he's lost now.  

    I dont know the direction they take from here.  I'm rooting for him though.  
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from dgalehouse. Show dgalehouse's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    I think it is too simplistic to blame all his problems on his being converted to a starter. There has to be more to it than that. A drop in velocity and a complete loss of control. Has to be a problem physically , mentally or both.  I would shut him down and send him to Florida to start from scratch.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Drewski5. Show Drewski5's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    In Response to Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel:
    I think it is too simplistic to blame all his problems on his being converted to a starter. There has to be more to it than that. A drop in velocity and a complete loss of control. Has to be a problem physically , mentally or both.  I would shut him down and send him to Florida to start from scratch.
    Posted by dgalehouse


    Agreed.  Maybe even as a starter.
     
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  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxKimmi. Show RedSoxKimmi's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    While I hated to lose Bard as a reliever, I supported the decision to try Bard as a starter.  The decision, had it worked, would have great long term benefits for the team in addition to helping out this year's team.  Relievers are much easier to find than good starting pitchers.

    I think Bard's struggles began last year, and are not completely the result of converting him to a starter.  I'm not sure he would have had the same success out of the BP this year that he's had in the past.

    Also, I think ideally Bard should have had some time to develop as a starter in AAA instead of being expected to figure it out in the big leagues.  Not practical maybe, but it might have helped.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxKimmi. Show RedSoxKimmi's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    I think only giving him only 10 chances

    sending him to the minors

    messed up his head /confidence more than

    his bad starts


    I think Bard's psyche might be a little fragile.

    There was also a lot of speculation early, when our pen was blowing saves, that Bard needed to be put in the closer's role.

    I'm not sure if Bard ever got the feeling that management was 100% behind him in their commitment to making him a starter.
     
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  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from EnchiladaT. Show EnchiladaT's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    In Response to Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel:
    Moving him to a starter may be the dumbest move of the year by him and the team.
    Posted by JimfromFlorida



    Didn't he fall apart last September like the rest of the team? How can you be sure he was the ordained one?
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from attic-dan. Show attic-dan's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    In Response to Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel:
    This is all on Ben. He was determined that Bard be a starter so he wouldn't have negotiate for one. Bard should have spent this season spot starting, or even better, relegated to the long role in the BP before ever being considered in the regular rotation. He's a ballplayer so perhaps they can make him an OFer and get his hitting up to speed.
    Posted by Alibiike


       I agree this was all about cost cutting, as signing another middle reliever, was a lot cheaper then going after a starter. This is part of a management plan to reduce payroll. It may have cost Bard his career.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheExaminer. Show TheExaminer's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    Yeah, but you can't blame the move to starter for all this. If he is this screwed up, and it was done this easily, that means something is probably wrong that would have eventually surfaced later. I could understand if there was a slight mechanical change that it might take a few weeks to go from one thing to antother, or back again, but this is ridiculous. The guy is mental, he always has been, and IMO he would have cracked under the pressure if given the closer job. He cracked several times last year when they gave it to him. All this mess shows is that he has latent mental hang ups, it's just been somewhat magnified and surfaced.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from EnchiladaT. Show EnchiladaT's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    Yes imagine if he had been asked to close games when every win counted. Bard's problems are deeeeep.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheExaminer. Show TheExaminer's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    In Response to Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel:
    Yes imagine if he had been asked to close games when every win counted. Bard's problems are deeeeep.
    Posted by EnchiladaT


     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Sad, but Daniel Bard may be done ala Rick Ankiel

    The decision, had it worked, would have great long term benefits for the team in addition to helping out this year's team.  Relievers are much easier to find than good starting pitchers.

    Agreed.  I'd feel differently about a closer, but even a premier setup guy isn't even worth a #2.  We really haven't been hurt much by having Padilla as the setup.

    I think Bard's psyche might be a little fragile.

    There was also a lot of speculation early, when our pen was blowing saves, that Bard needed to be put in the closer's role.

    I'm not sure if Bard ever got the feeling that management was 100% behind him in their commitment to making him a starter.

    Agree again.  I have never had much faith in his high-leverage output.  Great stats and all, but I would not have felt comfortable with him as a closer.  I think having BV criticize Bard for not throwing enough changeups in ST also unsettled him a bit.  That should have been a closed door strategy meeting.
     
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