Saltalamacchia Tracker...

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    In response to chickenandboose's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    You think he would of turned down 14m? 


    [/QUOTE]

    Why would he take a one-year deal when he could get a multi-year deal like he got?


     


     

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    Having said that, the Sox still should have extended a qualifying offer in my opinion. I don't think he would have taken it because he's a catcher under 30 coming off an excellent offensive year for a catcher. Even with the QO, I think he would have gotten a multi-year deal like he did.


     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    In response to BostonTrollSpanker's comment:



    "I can't believe there's going to be a thread dedicated to a former player throughout the season."he thread will only continue if there is a great deal of interest in it. Otherwise it will fade away. 


     


     


    "What a waste of time and space."


    Space is not scarce in the Internet, there is still plenty of room for other threads. As for time, it's up to individuals here to decide which threads are a waste of time. For example I think complaining about the Yankees and Yankee fans is a waste of my time, and you do it quite frequently, in fact you'll do it all season. It's not a waste of your time as you see it, and that's fine.






     






    "And it's totally disrespectful to the team we have out there playing now."






     






    It's totally not. It would be if we were in the clubhouse, I'll give you that. But the team isn't reading this forum, has no interest in reading this forum, so there is no disrespect here. 






     






    That said I don't plan to post on this thread myself after this once, it's not really my cup of tea. 






     






    From where I sit today I wish we had re-signed Salty. I see it as a mistake but one of the few Cherry has made. And given that we had other plans in play in future years, it's not likely to hurt us much.


     


    QUOTE:

    Maybe we can trade Middy to the Marlins so you can see both their stats improve and then create a Salty/Middy tracker.  Funny how low pressure and changing leagues has changed Salty's mindset offensively so far but he also has 4 errors already and a 15% caught stealing rate.  I'm pretty sure Swihart and Vasquez will improve on that when they hit the bigs.





     

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    In response to royf19's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    Having said that, the Sox still should have extended a qualifying offer in my opinion. I don't think he would have taken it because he's a catcher under 30 coming off an excellent offensive year for a catcher. Even with the QO, I think he would have gotten a multi-year deal like he did.


    [/QUOTE]


    [object HTMLDivElement]


    I think, if the Sox had not benched him in the WS, he'd have taken $14M/1 over $21M/3. The Marlins would have essentially offered him $7M for the last 2 years of the deal.


    That being said, I would not have offered him $14M/1. I'd like to have him at up to $24M/3, but he was not coming here for just that much more. He wants to play- not be benched.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    In response to moonslav59's comment:


     


    That being said, I would not have offered him $14M/1. I'd like to have him at up to $24M/3, but he was not coming here for just that much more. He wants to play- not be benched.



    QUOTE:


    moon,


    It was obvious after the mental mistakes/progress of Vasquez and Swihart he had no place in Boston.  Same thing for Lav, why the Sox keep stringing Ryan along in the event Nap, AJ or Ross get hurt really isn't fair to him either.  I read one report we are trying to trade Lav but can't find anything in return from another club so he will probably need to be packaged.  I wouldn't be surprised to see both Vasquez and Swihart sometime next season.  Vasquez is off to a good start both offensively and defensively while throwing out 44% of runners.  Swihart is doing the same, hitting even better while throwing out 31% at this point. 


    It would be really exciting to see both kids sharing the catching duties together. 

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    moon,


    It was obvious after the mental mistakes/progress of Vasquez and Swihart he had no place in Boston.


    I knew Salty was gone after being benched to close out the World Series. Both sides had clear directions once that happened.


    My talk about Salty remaining here has been just theory based on what might have happened had we not benched him. Once he was benched, Salty did not want to come back here, regardless of any quotes out there. I'm pretty sure the Sox didn't want him back either even at a lower cost that what the Marlins got him for.


    Same thing for Lav, why the Sox keep stringing Ryan along in the event Nap, AJ or Ross get hurt really isn't fair to him either.


    When you are a AAAA player, what can you expect?


    I read one report we are trying to trade Lav but can't find anything in return from another club so he will probably need to be packaged.


    I doubt he adds much value to any package, and with our lack of minor league 1B depth, my guess is he stays here all year, but will be gone by next winter. I guess, if we have a 40 man roster crunch due to a trade, he could be gone earlier.


    I wouldn't be surprised to see both Vasquez and Swihart sometime next season. Vasquez is off to a good start both offensively and defensively while throwing out 44% of runners. Swihart is doing the same, hitting even better while throwing out 31% at this point.


    I really like both of these guys, but sometimes it takes a long time for a catcher to get to the point where he is a net overall plus. I'm not sure a contending team is the best place for catching proving grounds, but we'll have to bite the bullet sooner or later.


    It would be really exciting to see both kids sharing the catching duties together.


    They may compliment each other nicely. My guess is, we get a vet catcher on a one year deal for next year and work the kid catchers in slowly.


     


     


    Sox4ever

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from jete02fan. Show jete02fan's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    Peter Gammons ‏@pgammo 36m
    Jared Saltalamacchia leads all catchers in OPS(1.011) and homers(6).

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    In response to jete02fan's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    Peter Gammons ‏@pgammo 36m
    Jared Saltalamacchia leads all catchers in OPS(1.011) and homers(6).


    [/QUOTE]


    [object HTMLDivElement]


    VTek did not become a great catcher until he was about 31 to 32 years old.


    Salty kept improving in just about every single area, except throwing.


    Salty is 29.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from ma6dragon9. Show ma6dragon9's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    In response to jete02fan's comment:
    [QUOTE]


     


    Peter Gammons ‏@pgammo 36m
    Jared Saltalamacchia leads all catchers in OPS(1.011) and homers(6).


     


    [/QUOTE]


    [object HTMLDivElement]


     


    VTek did not become a great catcher until he was about 31 to 32 years old.


     


    Salty kept improving in just about every single area, except throwing.


     


    Salty is 29.


    [/QUOTE]


    [object HTMLDivElement]


    I'm glad you've been on this side of the fence. I fly off the handle at times, but you're always cold and calculated.


    Marlins have 4 starting pitchers with over 35 innings (next highest 21), those 4 starters all have ERAs UNDER 3.29, 3 of them under 3, and Jose Fernandez, a young STUD in the NL, hasn't taken a step back with his 1.59 ERA, and sterling 0.83 WHIP.


    7 game hitting streak, 6 HRs, 300+ average, .416 OBP.


    Marlins are a game OVER .500. NL East, AL East, you only play the teams across the diamond from you.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from ma6dragon9. Show ma6dragon9's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...


    Oh, and yes, he's 29...


    A 29 year old, switch hitting, 6'4" 235 lbs catching LINEBACKER! Some players are blessed with physical tools you simply can't find anywhere besides genetics. He was absolutely, without question trending in the correct direction at the PERFECT age.


    Anyone have a Salty Sox jersey/shirt they want to get rid of at a discounted price? 


    Maybe in ANOTHER ten years, people will reform their expectations of catchers in the post-PED era. When I called him a Top 10 catcher early last year, may have even been 2012 I can't exactly remember, a lot of people argued strongly against that. I think that argument has been firmly decided.


    I remember a can't miss prospect at 1B, he was going to be the future, or the key to the Adrian Gonzalez trade. Anthony Rizzo? No, he rose later...Lars Anderson. You dno't get rid of a KNOWN commodity when the replacement isn't even ML ready, and may never be. Ryan Westemoreland anyone? You NEVER KNOW what will happen to a prospect, I'm really tired of hearing that Vazquez and Swihart are THE REASON the Sox let Salty walk. I'm with Moon, had the WS played out differently, he's very likely still here. They dropped 14mil on Drew a year ago, and were willing to again...they would have qualified him. It makes 0 sense to me otherwise.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from soxnewmex. Show soxnewmex's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    Salty shines in low pressure situations, 9-0-game liners into the gap, playing starting catcher for Miami Marlins.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    In response to ma6dragon9's comment:
    [QUOTE]



    Oh, and yes, he's 29...


    A 29 year old, switch hitting, 6'4" 235 lbs catching LINEBACKER! Some players are blessed with physical tools you simply can't find anywhere besides genetics. He was absolutely, without question trending in the correct direction at the PERFECT age.


    Anyone have a Salty Sox jersey/shirt they want to get rid of at a discounted price? 


    Maybe in ANOTHER ten years, people will reform their expectations of catchers in the post-PED era. When I called him a Top 10 catcher early last year, may have even been 2012 I can't exactly remember, a lot of people argued strongly against that. I think that argument has been firmly decided.


    I remember a can't miss prospect at 1B, he was going to be the future, or the key to the Adrian Gonzalez trade. Anthony Rizzo? No, he rose later...Lars Anderson. You dno't get rid of a KNOWN commodity when the replacement isn't even ML ready, and may never be. Ryan Westemoreland anyone? You NEVER KNOW what will happen to a prospect, I'm really tired of hearing that Vazquez and Swihart are THE REASON the Sox let Salty walk. I'm with Moon, had the WS played out differently, he's very likely still here. They dropped 14mil on Drew a year ago, and were willing to again...they would have qualified him. It makes 0 sense to me otherwise.


    [/QUOTE]


    [object HTMLDivElement]


    After being stiffed in the World Series, I doubt Salty wanted to play here.


    The Sox obviously did not want him to play here. As much as I wish things turned out differently, I can understand the team deciding not to offer a QO or significant deal to a guy the benched in favor of David Ross.


    From 2012 to 2014, only 24 catchers have 700 or more PAs in MLB. Salty places....


    8th in WAR at +6.9


    24th in OBP at .324


    5th in SLG% at .473


    7th in OPS at .796


    4th in HRs at 45


    11th in RBIs at 134 (more RBI/PA than Mauer)


    Some posters have bashed Salty for allowing too many balls to get behind him on defense. Well, look here:


    Salty is 8th in MLB in innings caught since 2012 (2069.1), but look at the catchers with worse WP+PB/Innings:


    Salty 80 PB+WP / 2069


    Montero 117/2453


    AJ Pierz 127/2263


    R Martin 112/2240


    AJ Ellis  101/2185


    (Only 3 catchers have more innings and a better WP+PB/Inn ratio than Salty: Wieters, Y Molina & Posey.)


    Others that are worse (with less innings)...


    Lucroy  79/2024


    S Perez 96/2002


    Rosario 150/1985


    Arencibia 101/1971


    A Avila     90/1916


    Iannetta  83/1707


    J Castro   96/1654


    Santana  106/1607


    J Molina   80/1567


    W Castillo 67/1562


    Hundley   60/1480


    Lobaton   62/1349


    Norris      55/1291


    Stewart   64/1284


    Flowers   62/1252


    G Soto    54/1238


    Mathis    55/1190


    J Thole   59/1152


    Y Gomes 49/967


    Maldonado 43/953


    Torrealba  39/953


    W Ramos   41/890


    R Doumit   45/884


    Shoppach  44/861


    McKerney 36/861


    J Jaso       50/843


    Others that are better (with less innings)....


    McCann 69/1987


    Suzuki  65/1932


    J Buck  62/1881


    C Ruiz  54/1795


    Hanigan 52/1631


    Mesoraco 45/1314


    J Mauer    42/1287


    B Pena     38/1050


    So, out of 42 MLB catchers with more than 840 innings behind the plate, only 11 catchers had a better ration than Salty. 30 had worse.


    Salty stinks at throwing. He strikes out a lot. I'll take the K rate along with his 25.3 LD% (4th best among MLB catchers with 750 PAs since 2012).


    Yeah, I wish he could throw better, but CS rates are way over-rated.


     


     

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from ma6dragon9. Show ma6dragon9's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...


    Stolen bases by themselves are wholly overrated.


    I was sure I could find a nice, neat chart, and I did! Stolen bases allowed, by team:


    http://www.sportingcharts.com/mlb/stats/team-stolen-bases-allowed-per-game/2013/" rel="nofollow">http://www.sportingcharts.com/mlb/stats/team-stolen-bases-allowed-per-game/2013/


    Awesome site I just stumbled upon. Last season, as everyone can plainly see, the Sox were DEAD LAST in allowing stolen bases at a WHOPPING....wait for it....wait a little more....0.82 per game! 133 on the ENTIRE SEASON, and, again, they were DEAD LAST.


    I"ve never seen something that happens with such INFREQUENCY be such a focal point.


    The 80 errors the team committed likely cost them more.


    The 524 walks the pitchers issued hurt more.


    The team grounded into 137 double plays.


    I'm just trying to put those 133 steals, worth 1 BASE APIECE, into some perspective. His "passed ball" problem has been debunked. His "inability to handle a staff" was flat out wrong. His pitch framing got MUCH better, and became an underrated aspect of his catching.


    Yes, where he is is a LOW pressure situation. Also, the Marlins showed a little faith in the guy, and GAVE HIM THE JOB...which he THOUGHT he had in Boston, only to have it ripped away...again. Security will do wonders for a players confidence and production. This is his 4th team at 28 years old (Braves, Rangers, Sox, Marlins), he was a HIGHLY regarded prospect for a long time, and Texas totally blew that situation, as they have done many times...or did until Ryan took over. He's meeting his potential, this is exactly what people thought he would be, and it's coming to fruition right at the time nobody should have been surprised.


    I genuinely like this player, and did for a few years before he got to Boston. I smile when WEEI starts to talk about him. Especially with the AJ disaster, it looks that much worse.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    Salty was certainly not let go because of his offence or his K's.  He was deemed expendable because of how he was assessed as a defensive catcher, including his game-calling and those things that don't show up in the stats.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    Here are some comments by moonslav from his 'Realistic 2014 Part 1' thread that explain where he expected Pierzynski to be an upgrade over Salty: 


    We should have a better staff supporting catching group this year with a healthy Ross and Pierzynski replacing Salty. There may be a learning curve, but overall, it could be a significant help to this year's staff. (Plus, this is the second year under new coaching/managing, so expectations are known, and comfort with the routine should be improved.)


    In terms of just getting the most out of the pitching staff, I can't see any of our current catchers other than Lava doing worse than Salty/Lava did last year.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    Salty was certainly not let go because of his offence or his K's.  He was deemed expendable because of how he was assessed as a defensive catcher, including his game-calling and those things that don't show up in the stats.


    [/QUOTE]


    [object HTMLDivElement]


    His "game calling" improved greatly over the years. The stats show it. Personal observations show it. He may have still been a bit below average last year, but if you look at VTek's CERA numbers, he really didn't start to dominate this area, until after age 32.


    His pitch framing was above average. Some reports showed him as top 10 in that area.


    So, Salty was poor at throwing, okay at game-calling, good at pitch-framing, and very good at preventing PBs and WPs combined. Put it all together, and I think Salty had become pretty close to an average overall defensive catcher by age 28. With room for further improvement, which may or may not happen, I still wish he was on this team.


    I realize after the benching, it was never going to happen. I hope AJ P and Ross will do well enough this year to get us to the playoffs and bridge us to a successful tandem of Vazquez and Swihart, but there are a lot of legitimate questions and concerns about our future at this important position.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    Here are some comments by moonslav from his 'Realistic 2014 Part 1' thread that explain where he expected Pierzynski to be an upgrade over Salty: 


     


    We should have a better staff supporting catching group this year with a healthy Ross and Pierzynski replacing Salty. There may be a learning curve, but overall, it could be a significant help to this year's staff. (Plus, this is the second year under new coaching/managing, so expectations are known, and comfort with the routine should be improved.)


     


    In terms of just getting the most out of the pitching staff, I can't see any of our current catchers other than Lava doing worse than Salty/Lava did last year.


    [/QUOTE]


    [object HTMLDivElement]


    I have never claimed Salty was a plus at CERA-related areas. I still expect AJ P to get to know the staff enough this year to be an improvement in that area, but it not a certainty. So far, AJP has looked pretty bad behind the plate. His 36% CS rate is a nice improvement.


    I do not expect the offense of AJP/Ross to match that of Salty/Ross, but I thought it would be pretty close. 


    The main difference is that after this year, we have a huge question mark at the catcher position. It's great to have two top 10 catching prospects (in system rankings by soxprospects). This is the main reason I wish things had turned out differently.


    The reality is Salty was not coming back here. I get that. I am not sitting here wishing he was here right now, because last year's World Series benching made that a near impossibility. I'm okay with the choices made. I'm not crying about the loss of Salty. My position is just that I wish things had turned out differently. Salty was not benched; we still won a ring, and Salty is back here at about $24M/3. It's just a theoretical position based on something that might not have happened last fall.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    Too bad the Salty tracker doesn't track backwards.  The Sox got him for a song from the Rangers because he had severe throwing problems and maybe other stuff.  A reclamation projection, he turned out pretty darn good.  But he was absolutely horrible in the postseason and had to be benched to give the Sox a shot at the WS, which they won, 4 games to 2.  The two losses were the games Salty caught and one was the result of a bad decision and bad throw by Salty.  The four wins were all caught by journeyman Ross.  


    So far this season Pierzynski despite a much lower OPS, has produced (runs + rbi's - HR's) the same number of runs, 23, as Salty.  I am guessing he is an improvement in calling the game.  Given Salty's failure in the postseason, his emphatic desire for a long term contract, the availability of Pierzynski, and the two or more presumably talented catchers in the Sox system, it was reasonable for the Sox not to offer Salty.  


    I was a huge Iglesias fan, then grew to like Drew, who I thought the Sox should have brought back.  But in the end I have to admit Cherington, no doubt with input from Farrell and even the coaching staff, has made some pretty astute trades, deals, etc.  More than that, I do not believe Saltalamacchia catching for the Sox right now would have made one iota of difference.  

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from jete02fan. Show jete02fan's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    In response to moonslav59's comment:
    [QUOTE]


    In response to jete02fan's comment:
    [QUOTE]


     


    Peter Gammons ‏@pgammo 36m
    Jared Saltalamacchia leads all catchers in OPS(1.011) and homers(6).


     


    [/QUOTE]


    [object HTMLDivElement]


     


    VTek did not become a great catcher until he was about 31 to 32 years old.


     


    Salty kept improving in just about every single area, except throwing.


     


    Salty is 29.


    [/QUOTE] i hear ya Moon, while i was on Twitter that day, Gammon's tweet just happened to catch my eye


     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    Pierzynski now hitting .294 with 3 HR 15 RBI himself. 

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    ...But he [Salty] was absolutely horrible in the postseason and had to be benched to give the Sox a shot at the WS...


    Seriously?


    He had to be benched for us to win?


     


    Many players were "horrible" in the post season. Choosing to blame one is being short-sighted.


    Sox4ever

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from boboinfla. Show boboinfla's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    Question how is Salty doing behind the plate. Are runners stealing? He has a major league bat, but certainly is not a very upscale defensive guy.

    boboinfla

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    In response to boboinfla's comment:


     


    Question how is Salty doing behind the plate. Are runners stealing? He has a major league bat, but certainly is not a very upscale defensive guy.

    boboinfla

    [object HTMLDivElement]


     


    17 SBs and 3 CS (Pretty bad)


    1 PB and 10 WPs (Pretty bad)


    He appears to be off to a ruff defensive start, but he should be afforded a learning curve with a new staff to catch.


    If you go by WAR, which combined offense and defense...


    2014 Leaders at Catcher (30 catchers with 60+ PAs):


    1) Salty +1.4


    2) Y Molina +1.3


    3) Wieters  +1.1


    ...


    18) AJ P  +0.5

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    What happened to the updates on this thread?

    Salty 242/337/412 749 OPS 6 HR 17 RBI

    AJP 283/314/415 729 OPS 4 HR 26 RBI

     

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from chickenandboose. Show chickenandboose's posts

    Re: Saltalamacchia Tracker...

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    What happened to the updates on this thread?

    Salty 242/337/412 749 OPS 6 HR 17 RBI

    AJP 283/314/415 729 OPS 4 HR 26 RBI

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Poster felt like an idiot after AJ started doing better

     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share