Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

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  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from jete02fan. Show jete02fan's posts

    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    i think it's time for Schill to maybe take a step back...imo starting to comment a bit too much...
     
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    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad':
    [QUOTE]i think it's time for Schill to maybe take a step back...imo starting to comment a bit too much...
    Posted by jete02fan[/QUOTE]


    don't count on it, Jete....Schill never met a microphone he didn't likeSealed

    not to mention he was never in the greatest of shape and managed to get the job done
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from UticaClub. Show UticaClub's posts

    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    He said it is sad that adult men cannot police themselves. It is sad that they aren't mature enough.
     
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    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    Usually I find Schilling to be too opinionated, but there is some truth in his words.  I'm sure Francona treats his players like adults and expects them to do the right thing.  If you have to be told, you either don't get it or you don't care.  I still think Lester is telling his side of the story, and maybe by saying he was wrong and accountable is his way of doing things by not throwing others under the bus. 

    At least Lester said his part.  It doesn't cast him in a flattering light, but he admitted he was wrong.   
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from WesternOregon. Show WesternOregon's posts

    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    When I read this comment in response to a question about whether he followed Josh Beckett in his behaviours?

    "I'm not a follower. I'm a grown-a$$ man. I made my decisions. He wasn't twisting my arm like I was in high school," Lester said.

    I smiled and said to myself, "...did that sound like a high school comment from a teenager, ego-centric man or insecure young adult who still had some growing up to do or what?" Uh huh...it did.

     
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    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad':
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad' : don't count on it, Jete....Schill never met a microphone he didn't like not to mention he was never in the greatest of shape and managed to get the job done
    Posted by J-BAY[/QUOTE]LOL!!..J, of that i have no doubt....The Great Orator speaks...Tongue out
     
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    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad':
    [QUOTE]i think it's time for Schill to maybe take a step back...imo starting to comment a bit too much...
    Posted by jete02fan[/QUOTE]


    Hahaha...you're right, but I think we all know there's zero chance of that.
     
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    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad':
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad' : Hahaha...you're right, but I think we all know there's zero chance of that.
    Posted by greenapplesplatters[/QUOTE]

    What's the saying?

    Opinions are like what?

    Well, it appears Curt Schilling has more than the average human.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from UticaClub. Show UticaClub's posts

    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    Schilling is a chip off of Howard Cossell in telling it like it is - most of the time.
    Michael Felger is the complete opposite.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from fivekatz. Show fivekatz's posts

    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad':
    [QUOTE]i think it's time for Schill to maybe take a step back...imo starting to comment a bit too much...
    Posted by jete02fan[/QUOTE]Right you are Jete.

    Schill is not all that objective at this point. His commentary on Tito and Epstein in that same interview at least from my perspective was biased and at one point became almost embarassing for a man who prides himself all being smart.

    He blasted the players for taking advantage of Tito's management style. Fair enough. But he then blasts ownership for not bringing Terry back. Huh?

    Tito was paid to keep a $162M payroll on track. He did not. Is it a bad reflection on the players. Yes. Sad as a matter of fact because it cost Terry his job but I am not sure what planet Schilling is from if he thinks that those events were going to get Francona's contract extended.

    His takes on Epstein are equally tainted with personal loyality. Facts are Epstein is probably the single most responsible officer in the RS organization for its short comings and he is getting to walk from a heck of a mess and gets a fresh start, a 5 year deal with expanded responsibilty.

    Epstein is getting to walk away with a big win here. I have no idea why the RS would give Theo more authority and and 4 year extension for having assmbled a team that buried Terry.

    Very circular and very personal. If I had to guess Schilling probably had some very tense dealings with Lucchino in his time here. The guys are both pretty direct. So Schill doesn't seem to like management but loves Tito and Theo. Admirable traits right but those traits taint Schilling's observations.

    My favorite in all of this to summarize is that Schilling says that players quit on themselves, their teammates and the organization. And while the players will have to live with that, who let them (Tito) and (Theo) who put those guys in the room.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from SoxFanInIL. Show SoxFanInIL's posts

    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    -a Yankee fan posting anti-Schilling comments doesn't shock me.  I wouldn't like him either if I liked pinstripes.

    -Everything Schilling said was right.  Oh by the way, he's a commentator now.

    -On Lester, good for him for acting like a "leader" (No!!) and taking some heat.  And he's right, they did the same stuff they did when they were leading the majors.

    The key though was the commentary on Tito.  He really clarified why it WAS time for Tito to go. Surprisingly honest.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    What Schilling doesn't understand or refuses to do so, is that yes, there are grown men who act irresponsibly, especially when they are given the freedom to do so.
    Most people, who were not meant to lead, want structure and discipline and yes, clear direction. Speaking from experience after 25 years in the Navy, I saw grown men in their 30's unable to perform unless given a roadmap. many people are not self-motivated, this is another misconception by Schilling. You can't put these guys into a one-size-fits-all box. Each has to handled invidually and I think Tito tried to do that, but may have been hamstrung to some extent.
     
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    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    Yeah, Schill needs to back off this story.  He is getting close to Tiki/Eli territory here.
     
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    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    It should also be said that Schilling's self-discpline was not always razor sharp. he had plenty of issues before arriving in Arizona with maturity.

    While he admitted his issues were nutrition and not acohol consumption this was a guy whose last contract had to pay him to keep him at playing weight and that weight did not call for six pack abs.

    His GM in Philly said of him he was horse every 5th day and horses rear the rest of the time. Well, Curt does not pitch every 5th day any more.
     
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    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    Too many people on here just can't stand to hear anything negative. Even a Sox hero like Schilling gets criticized for stating his opinion , if it is not what you want to hear. Okay , let's pretend that the great collapse never happened. Sox just played poorly in September, that's why they lost. Just one of those things. It was everyone's fault , therefore it was no one's fault. Just part of baseball. Sox pitchers were in great shape down the stretch, they just didn't get the job done. Had nothing to do with their drinking or lack of conditioning. Yeah , right.
     
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    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad':
    [QUOTE]It should also be said that Schilling's self-discpline was not always razor sharp. he had plenty of issues before arriving in Arizona with maturity. While he admitted his issues were nutrition and not acohol consumption this was a guy whose last contract had to pay him to keep him at playing weight and that weight did not call for six pack abs. His GM in Philly said of him he was horse every 5th day and horses rear the rest of the time. Well, Curt does not pitch every 5th day any more.
    Posted by fivekatz[/QUOTE]

    Good post.  This is why I say he is trending towards Tiki territory.  He is not far enough removed from this team to be talking about guys like Lester, who he played with.

    You brought up the weight clause in his final contract, that would be 2008 right, when Schill was paid 8 million dollars and didn't throw a pitch? 
     
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    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad':
    [QUOTE]Too many people on here just can't stand to hear anything negative. Even a Sox hero like Schilling gets criticized for stating his opinion , if it is not what you want to hear. Okay , let's pretend that the great collapse never happened. Sox just played poorly in September, that's why they lost. Just one of those things. It was everyone's fault , therefore it was no one's fault. Just part of baseball. Sox pitchers were in great shape down the stretch, they just didn't get the job done. Had nothing to do with their drinking or lack of conditioning. Yeah , right.
    Posted by dgalehouse[/QUOTE]

    All seven starting pitchers had ERAs over 7 in Sept. They performed terribly. Defense and baserunning was shoddy in Sept. Many dependable hitters couldn't hit in the clutch against TB and NYY in Sept. Ellsbury could have caught the inside-the-park HR in Baltimore. Crawford struck out a lot and played poor defense. Reddick's bat disappeared. Salty had a terrible month at bat. Papelbon and Bard blew many saves in Sept

    Am I up to most of the team? Who am I missing; Scutaro, Ellsbury, Pedroia? Doesn't it look like the collapse was a team effort?.


    Yes you are spot on. Good call.

    "Okay , let's pretend that the great collapse never happened. Sox just played poorly in September, that's why they lost. Just one of those things. It was everyone's fault , therefore it was no one's fault. Just part of baseball."
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from jete02fan. Show jete02fan's posts

    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad':
    [QUOTE]-a Yankee fan posting anti-Schilling comments doesn't shock me.  I wouldn't like him either if I liked pinstripes. -Everything Schilling said was right.  Oh by the way, he's a commentator now. -On Lester, good for him for acting like a "leader" (No!!) and taking some heat.  And he's right, they did the same stuff they did when they were leading the majors. The key though was the commentary on Tito.  He really clarified why it WAS time for Tito to go. Surprisingly honest.
    Posted by SoxFanInIL[/QUOTE] hey SFinIL, if you are referring to me, i'm not anti-Schill at all, nor do i dislike Schill, had total respect/admiration what he could do on the bump...  i absolutely respect his right to have his say, i just think it's a bit too often that's all,  has nothing to do with him as a person...and NOTHING to do with being a Yankee fan...and my second post was just me busting... 
     
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    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad':
    [QUOTE]i think it's time for Schill to maybe take a step back...imo starting to comment a bit too much...
    Posted by jete02fan[/QUOTE]

    He can comment all he wants. And he very clearly stated in early September that the Red Sox would not win the wild card. Guess what? He was right.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from fivekatz. Show fivekatz's posts

    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad':
    [QUOTE]Too many people on here just can't stand to hear anything negative. Even a Sox hero like Schilling gets criticized for stating his opinion , if it is not what you want to hear. Okay , let's pretend that the great collapse never happened. Sox just played poorly in September, that's why they lost. Just one of those things. It was everyone's fault , therefore it was no one's fault. Just part of baseball. Sox pitchers were in great shape down the stretch, they just didn't get the job done. Had nothing to do with their drinking or lack of conditioning. Yeah , right.
    Posted by dgalehouse[/QUOTE]I happen to fault his opinions. he comes to the table with some built in bias. The fact that he was a great pitcher and was truly heroic in 2004 should does not change that.

    On matters of clubhouse or for that matter conditioning, Schill did not always walk his current talk.

    His position as a former player and "hero" give his poinions extra weight to many.

    As for the collapse I am sure there were plenty of issues. The club went 7-20 so duh!

    But the market has been out for blood from the moment Carl Crawford dropped the sinking liner in LF in Baltimore. It started with taking a two week comment from Adrian Gonzalez and tying it together with his saying at the moment of absolute belief that it was God's will and hasn't stopped yet.

    Guys are getting blasted for not talking, for talking. Epstein makes a mess and he's a victim. Francona's leadership failed him and he's a victim. If either guy got extended the market would scream about that.

    Sorry but it all looks like a temper tantrum and is a huge as the collapse itself. And Schilling IMO feeds it with a certain amount of prejudice and some self-interest.

    As far as fault goes, go ahead and find every one and then what? What changes the prior result? What the RS do today forward seems to be the answer.   

     
     
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    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad':
    [QUOTE]i think it's time for Schill to maybe take a step back...imo starting to comment a bit too much...
    Posted by jete02fan[/QUOTE]

    I respectfully disagree.  I normally cringe when Schill opens his pie-hole but he's on point with his analysis in this case.

    These grown men need to hear from a veteran HoF-bound former teamate that they're acting like dummasses.  On top of that Schill's love and respect for Tito makes him (and a huge portion of Sox fans everywhere) royally pist that Lester (ungrateful little...), Becket (snotty brat), and Slackey (fat slob) basically flipped Tito off, more or less.

    I'm a huge Sox fan and I'm disgusted more so by the treatment of Terry Francona by Sox ownership and specific clubhouse members than I am by the September Collapse.  A game is a game, but these players and owners took a steamy dump on a very well respected man's reputation.

    So low class.  I have a 2004 WS Championship jersey that I've been waiting to put a name on.  I thought I might one day put Varitek's name and number on the back, but no way now.  Varitek isn't a leader.  Leaders stand up and do whats right regardless of what others think.

    Francona's name is going on the back.  To heck with Slackey and Beckett and turncoat Lester.
     
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    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad':
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad' : I respectfully disagree.  I normally cringe when Schill opens his pie-hole but he's on point with his analysis in this case. These grown men need to hear from a veteran HoF-bound former teamate that they're acting like dummasses.  On top of that Schill's love and respect for Tito makes him (and a huge portion of Sox fans everywhere) royally pist that Lester (ungrateful little...), Becket (snotty brat), and Slackey (fat slob) basically flipped Tito off, more or less. I'm a huge Sox fan and I'm disgusted more so by the treatment of Terry Francona by Sox ownership and specific clubhouse members than I am by the September Collapse.  A game is a game, but these players and owners took a steamy dump on a very well respected man's reputation. So low class.  I have a 2004 WS Championship jersey that I've been waiting to put a name on.  I thought I might one day put Varitek's name and number on the back, but no way now.  Varitek isn't a leader.  Leaders stand up and do whats right regardless of what others think. Francona's name is going on the back.  To heck with Slackey and Beckett and turncoat Lester.
    Posted by cglassanos[/QUOTE]While you are angry in your tone, you have valid points about the pitchers.

    As for Francona, I have always been a big supporter of Francona's. I admire the way he treated men and 95% of the time understood his game to game moves. But in the end Tito was paid to keep that ship a float. He did not earn an extension. It wasn't Varitek's responsibility, it was those players and ultimately if the players did not self-police, it was for Terry to rein it in.

    Somebody in the organization was spinless enough to leak the stuff about Francona's meds and marriage. The writer that IMO should have never printed it without the person being willing to go on record. But Schilling, much of the media not only jumped to the conclusion that this come from ownership but continue to back off of that even when the writer has now gone on record as staying the owners were not his source.


     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from jete02fan. Show jete02fan's posts

    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad':
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad' : I respectfully disagree.  I normally cringe when Schill opens his pie-hole but he's on point with his analysis in this case. These grown men need to hear from a veteran HoF-bound former teamate that they're acting like dummasses.  On top of that Schill's love and respect for Tito makes him (and a huge portion of Sox fans everywhere) royally pist that Lester (ungrateful little...), Becket (snotty brat), and Slackey (fat slob) basically flipped Tito off, more or less. I'm a huge Sox fan and I'm disgusted more so by the treatment of Terry Francona by Sox ownership and specific clubhouse members than I am by the September Collapse.  A game is a game, but these players and owners took a steamy dump on a very well respected man's reputation. So low class.  I have a 2004 WS Championship jersey that I've been waiting to put a name on.  I thought I might one day put Varitek's name and number on the back, but no way now.  Varitek isn't a leader.  Leaders stand up and do whats right regardless of what others think. Francona's name is going on the back.  To heck with Slackey and Beckett and turncoat Lester.
    Posted by cglassanos[/QUOTE]hey CGlassanos, point taken, i just wonder if going forward his seemingly everyday commenting will do more harm than good..make no mistake i don't expect nor am i insuniuating that he won't speak his mind...i know full well it's who Schill is..
     
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    Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad'

    In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad':
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Schilling on M&M: Lester comments 'sad' : I happen to fault his opinions. he comes to the table with some built in bias. The fact that he was a great pitcher and was truly heroic in 2004 should does not change that. On matters of clubhouse or for that matter conditioning, Schill did not always walk his current talk. His position as a former player and "hero" give his poinions extra weight to many. As for the collapse I am sure there were plenty of issues. The club went 7-20 so duh! But the market has been out for blood from the moment Carl Crawford dropped the sinking liner in LF in Baltimore. It started with taking a two week comment from Adrian Gonzalez and tying it together with his saying at the moment of absolute belief that it was God's will and hasn't stopped yet. Guys are getting blasted for not talking, for talking. Epstein makes a mess and he's a victim. Francona's leadership failed him and he's a victim. If either guy got extended the market would scream about that. Sorry but it all looks like a temper tantrum and is a huge as the collapse itself. And Schilling IMO feeds it with a certain amount of prejudice and some self-interest. As far as fault goes, go ahead and find every one and then what? What changes the prior result? What the RS do today forward seems to be the answer.     
    Posted by fivekatz[/QUOTE]

    Very true.  Unfortunately there won't be a whole lot of actual news to report for awhile yet, so into the vacuum the tabloid winds will keep blowing.
     

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