Sell the Team

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Sell the Team

    This team needs new ownership. It's not just about cleaning house with the GM, the Manager gone, it's got to be clean and overall. The owners have become divas and are drinking off the 2 WS titles. When Bill James is writing lineups and John Henry is dictating them to Theo then to Tito, it's pretty much time to close shop. I appreciated that Henry said he didn't want CC, well if he didn't want him, you'd think he'd put a hold on that 142 million dollars....That just tells me he might be a"hands-off" owner, but an inept one at that. A good owner who has a bad feeling about a potential signing needs to STEP IN AND STOP IT..NOT RUBBERSTAMP IT...PATHETIC!!!!...John Henry, Larry and Crew....You're Fired!
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from UticaClub. Show UticaClub's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    Is this you Felger?
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from UticaClub. Show UticaClub's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    Felger??
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    This is not the first company to experience internal turmoil and resulting management change.

    Every crisis presents an opportunity ... the Red Sox will recover.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from WesternOregon. Show WesternOregon's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    In Response to Re: Sell the Team:
    [QUOTE]This is not the first company to experience internal turmoil and resulting management change. Every crisis presents an opportunity ... the Red Sox will recover.
    Posted by hill55[/QUOTE]


    Just tell your buddy Mr. Henry the following for me?

    "Be silent, walk away, take Larry with you and don't let the door hit you on the way out."
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from UticaClub. Show UticaClub's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    You can't fire an owner.

    You can't sue the U.S. Government.
    When you dislike 100% of a team you are no longer a fan - DUH.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    In Response to Re: Sell the Team:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Sell the Team : Just tell your buddy Mr. Henry the following for me? "Be silent, walk away, take Larry with you and don't let the door hit you on the way out."
    Posted by WesternOregon[/QUOTE]
    Neither John Henry nor Michael Felger impressed me in Friday's radio exchange.

    Henry may well have opposed the signing of Carl Crawford, but he make a terrible personnel blunder by publicly calling out his $142 million investment.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    In Response to Re: Sell the Team:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Sell the Team : Neither John Henry nor Michael Felger impressed me in Friday's radio exchange. Henry may well have opposed the signing of Carl Crawford, but he make a terrible personnel blunder by publicly calling out his $142 million investment.
    Posted by hill55[/QUOTE]

    I thought that we already learned a lesson today after listening to John Henry about the importance of "context"....What he said was the he opposed the signing but he trusted his baseball opps guys who made a compelling argument that swayed the vote in their favor..He never said that he didn't want him, nor did he at anytime suggest that it was a bad signing or make references to Crawford ability or lack thereof. Merely that he was opposed because we already had enough lefthanded hitters and as a rule in his eyes he's wary of free agents for a myriad of reasons...Lets not put words into his mouth, the press is already doing a fine job of that...
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    In Response to Re: Sell the Team:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Sell the Team : I thought that we already learned a lesson today after listening to John Henry about the importance of "context"....What he said was the he opposed the signing but he trusted his baseball opps guys who made a compelling argument that swayed the vote in their favor..He never said that he didn't want him, nor did he at anytime suggest that it was a bad signing or make references to Crawford ability or lack thereof. Merely that he was opposed because we already had enough lefthanded hitters and as a rule in his eyes he's wary of free agents for a myriad of reasons...Lets not put words into his mouth, the press is already doing a fine job of that...
    Posted by Beantowne[/QUOTE]
    Fair point, but John Henry's statement likely makes Carl Crawford feel unwanted by an organization that could be losing proponents of the Crawford signing.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from fivekatz. Show fivekatz's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    In Response to Re: Sell the Team:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Sell the Team : Fair point, but John Henry's statement likely makes Carl Crawford feel unwanted by an organization that could be losing proponents of the Crawford signing.
    Posted by hill55[/QUOTE]I grant you this, context or not Henry may be well served by giving CC a buzz and explaining, it wasn't that you aren't a terrific athlete Carl, my intially feeling was we already were stacked heavily with LH right after we made the Gonzalez trade. But my baseball operations team persauded me or you would not have been here and we know 2012 will be great.

    95% of this will clean up soon. The B's play a couple of more unispired weeks, the Pats get lit up on D and the RS make a few roster moves and the city will have something new to freak out about aside from KFC, beer, who thought it was God's will, did Tek sleep with a NESN broadcaster 2 years ago, is Pedey a liar bla bla bla.

    I wish half of the posters got to live in an alternate reality where they'd get all the changes they want in Boston sports and lived with 4 really bad teams.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    My point on Henry is this...It's great that you can defend yourself as an owner (few do publicly). It's great that in your perception as owner that you didn't "fire" your GM and Manager...but forced them out just the same....look, guys, if you don't think the CC statement threw Theo under a bus, and if you don't think that "leaks" from likely Lucchino (the master of PR spins) threw Tito under that same bus (lots of treadmarks on lots of Sox bodies), then continue to drink the Jim Jones kool-aid.

    While I appreciate Patriots, B's, Celts and Sox, that's no excuse for As the Sox World Turns occuring and don't tell me that the Hohler article didn't appear without private information leaked by Sox executives to discredit several Sox players/manager/GM.

    The owners don't have the players backs, or only a few apparently (Henry indicted CC, but defended Beckett). No one said to get rid of Tito and Theo, at least sane posters on this Forum. It should not have spelled their exits--the September fiasco. And fiver, the fans didn't cause the drama or the exits--the owners have done nothing but make it seem like they aren't responsible. Sad.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    Mark Cuban is a hands-on owner who eventually got his prize. Henry has 2. But I guarantee you Cuban never would have had 'doubts' about a deal before rubberstamping approval. This idea that Henry put his faith in his "baseball" people is insane. I thought that's why owners are owners. They can make that final call. You don't think Moreno didn't quash the Angels offers on CC? Think again. Moreno made that call not the GM (who has since been fired--Reagins). Henry's collosal lack of leadership cost the team an albatross for 6 more years--as he even said on record--the team had too many lefty hitters...he was right, and he should have gone with his gut reaction and killed that offer.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    Sell the Team...I stand by this statement.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    There are people out there, potential owners who understand that Sox baseball requires that you don't alienate fans to the lengths that this current regime has pulled off. You can have a great franchise and not Nomar your employees out the door upon employment exit.
     
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  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    In Response to Re: Sell the Team:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Sell the Team : Fair point, but John Henry's statement likely makes Carl Crawford feel unwanted by an organization that could be losing proponents of the Crawford signing.
    Posted by hill55[/QUOTE]

    hill55,
    Well if he returns to the player they thought they had signed. He can have the last laugh. Maybe playing with a bit of chip next year will bring out the aggressive baserunner and game changing athlete that was once call Carl Crawford?

    I'm not defending Henry's statement, because frankly it could've and should've been left unsaid. In the context in which he stated it, which was to give us all a look inside the workings of a senior management meeting and how they make organizational decisisons. It served to clarify his role in and the organizations pyhlosohy of empowering managers to make decisions that effect their area of responsibility..I found it rather enlightening...I'd love to work for an owership group that empowered and trusted me to make decsisions that had a direct effect on the performance of my department...

    Buisness 101 is to surround yourself with competent employees and in the world of sport if you look franchises that have a track record of sustained success they typically have an ownership group that hires the best mangement team and surrounds themselves with content experts and allows the experts to run and oversee the department in which they're hired too...Where would the Pats be if not for Belicheck, Kraft hired him and gave him autonomy to make all football related decisions and who then surrounded himself with competent managers...As Belicheck is to Kraft, Luccino is to Henry...
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from carnie. Show carnie's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    In Response to Sell the Team:
    [QUOTE]This team needs new ownership. It's not just about cleaning house with the GM, the Manager gone, it's got to be clean and overall. The owners have become divas and are drinking off the 2 WS titles. When Bill James is writing lineups and John Henry is dictating them to Theo then to Tito, it's pretty much time to close shop. I appreciated that Henry said he didn't want CC, well if he didn't want him, you'd think he'd put a hold on that 142 million dollars....That just tells me he might be a"hands-off" owner, but an inept one at that. A good owner who has a bad feeling about a potential signing needs to STEP IN AND STOP IT..NOT RUBBERSTAMP IT...PATHETIC!!!!...John Henry, Larry and Crew....You're Fired!
    Posted by dannycater[/QUOTE]Apparently you don't remember Haywood Sullivan. The ownership situation could be much worse.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from donrd4. Show donrd4's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    In Response to Sell the Team:
    [QUOTE]This team needs new ownership. It's not just about cleaning house with the GM, the Manager gone, it's got to be clean and overall. The owners have become divas and are drinking off the 2 WS titles. When Bill James is writing lineups and John Henry is dictating them to Theo then to Tito, it's pretty much time to close shop. I appreciated that Henry said he didn't want CC, well if he didn't want him, you'd think he'd put a hold on that 142 million dollars....That just tells me he might be a"hands-off" owner, but an inept one at that. A good owner who has a bad feeling about a potential signing needs to STEP IN AND STOP IT..NOT RUBBERSTAMP IT...PATHETIC!!!!...John Henry, Larry and Crew....You're Fired!
    Posted by dannycater[/QUOTE]

    Make it easy... You stay away and follow Baltimore and be so very happy.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    All due respect, dannycater, but this is insanity.  John Henry is easily the best owner the Sox have ever had.  The visit to the radio station was ill advised because the talk show hosts are of course masters at drawing out the unwary, especially when they drop by because they are mad as the dickens.

    Crawford stunk this year, pure and simple, and he is in fact just another lefty bat on a team that could use another good righty bat.  We have argued endlessly about whether paying him $142M over seven years is a good idea.  Yes, it's a done deal, so maybe it makes sense to smooth CC's no doubt ruffled feathers, etc, but that won't guarantee success in 2012. 

    In fact, it might help Crawford if one or more of his teammates called him out publicly for underperforming.  Youk did that to Ellsbury last year, and it worked miracles.  So, Youk, do your stuff one more time.

    Henry helped build what proved to be a very good management team and can do doubt help rebuild one.  If he sells the Sox because some witless Sox fans insist upon it, we will all be the losers. 




     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from redsoxdirtdog. Show redsoxdirtdog's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    In Response to Sell the Team:
    [QUOTE]This team needs new ownership. It's not just about cleaning house with the GM, the Manager gone, it's got to be clean and overall. The owners have become divas and are drinking off the 2 WS titles. When Bill James is writing lineups and John Henry is dictating them to Theo then to Tito, it's pretty much time to close shop. I appreciated that Henry said he didn't want CC, well if he didn't want him, you'd think he'd put a hold on that 142 million dollars....That just tells me he might be a"hands-off" owner, but an inept one at that. A good owner who has a bad feeling about a potential signing needs to STEP IN AND STOP IT..NOT RUBBERSTAMP IT...PATHETIC!!!!...John Henry, Larry and Crew....You're Fired!
    Posted by dannycater[/QUOTE]

    Good idea!  Kill the goose that lays the golden eggs.

    Let's get a-hold of ourselves gentlemen!

    Like him or not, Henry, the guy who has shown time & time again that he is WILLING & ABLE to SPEND $$$ on this team, is the ONLY PERSON able to get us out of this mess!!!

    While I may be disgusted with him for his laissez faire ownership style, I don't want to cut off my nose to spite my face!!!!!

    Get a grip people! 
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from ZILLAGOD. Show ZILLAGOD's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    If Henry's big revelation was that the team has too many left handed bats he should have urged Theo to release the UNPRODUCTIVE LEFT HANDED BAT THAT THE SOX SIGNED AT A HUGE COST 5 YEARS AGO!

    J.D.Drew....instead of making Crawford feel disgraced, responsible for the losing and like a completely useless acquistion, he should have thrown Drew under the bus instead of the guy who is going to be here awhile.

    Another question for Mr. Henry would be this:

    "Hello John, can you read me? Adrian Gonzalez is a left hand bat also. After the season you state you opposed the guy who had the awful year and you seem to be okay with the guy who had the great year....too many left hand bats?....why were you not opposed to trading for Gonzalez, bringing back Ortiz? These guys bat left also. So only Crawford is singled out as unnecessary?...if Crawford had a great year , I think you would have kept your mouth shut about your secret disagreement on this signing."

    You are making the situation even worse, by trying to explain things away. Go home count your money and smile....at least you turned a profit, ain't that all that you really want?

    Hire a PR man to avoid future gaffs like these, you must think Red Sox fans are really, really stupid!
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Goofywocky. Show Goofywocky's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    JH has left fans living in the 'wasteland of the free',  he is no longer wanted and he could be shipped overseas, as is being done with other jobs here.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from UticaClub. Show UticaClub's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    In Response to Re: Sell the Team:
    [QUOTE]If Henry's big revelation was that the team has too many left handed bats he should have urged Theo to release the UNPRODUCTIVE LEFT HANDED BAT THAT THE SOX SIGNED AT A HUGE COST 5 YEARS AGO! J.D.Drew....instead of making Crawford feel disgraced, responsible for the losing and like a completely useless acquistion, he should have thrown Drew under the bus instead of the guy who is going to be here awhile. Another question for Mr. Henry would be this: "Hello John, can you read me? Adrian Gonzalez is a left hand bat also. After the season you state you opposed the guy who had the awful year and you seem to be okay with the guy who had the great year....too many left hand bats?....why were you not opposed to trading for Gonzalez, bringing back Ortiz? These guys bat left also. So only Crawford is singled out as unnecessary?...if Crawford had a great year , I think you would have kept your mouth shut about your secret disagreement on this signing." You are making the situation even worse, by trying to explain things away. Go home count your money and smile....at least you turned a profit, ain't that all that you really want? Hire a PR man to avoid future gaffs like these, you must think Red Sox fans are really, really stupid!
    Posted by ZILLAGOD[/QUOTE]


    CC was redundant as a LH bat in the OUTFIELD.

    Mr. Cater thinks that Bob Hohler is also a liar, I see. Hohler stated that Henry, Lucchino, and Werner were not sources.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    Danny,
    I disagree with your posts on this thread. First, and I'm not sure if it was you or someone else on this thread who phrased it this way, but he didn't "indict" Crawford. He just said he wasn't in favor of the deal because he wasn't a good fit. It's hardly an indictment that's blaming Crawford for the bad finish and hardly a fracture in the relationship that can't be mended.

    Also, an owner can trust the baseball people. It's like any company -- any good company. The owner isn't necessarily going to know every thing about every part of the company. At some point, you have to trust the people you hire. Now if it's a situation that spending the money is going to ruin the company financially and put it out of business, that's one thing. But that wasn't the case with Crawford. 

    Henry has been the ideal owner. He stays involved as the top person, but let's people do the job they were hired for. And he's really not much different that Cuban in that respect. Cuban isn't making trades or signing free agents. He's simply giving his GM the money to do whatever he thinks is needed to be successful. And talk about coddling the players. People rip Henry for the headsets and sprucing up Fenway to make it more comfortable. Go ahead and read what Cuban has done for the players there. The only difference between Henry and Cuban is that Cuban hungers for the spotlight and has to be the face of the team. Henry prefers to stay in the background and there's absolutely nothig wrong with that.

    Yes, Henry and Co. could have handled the past month or so better. But that shouldn't erase the past 10 years. They took over for a regime that seemed to go out of its way to backstap players, not support its managers, and most importantly not care about the fans or what the fans wanted.

    Henry and Co. came in and did a complete 180. They spent money to improve the product at all levels. I can believe Henry with much of what he says because of the history. Remember, when he came in, he said he was committed to spending the money necessary to make the Sox a winning team. Many critics called him a liar and predicted he was going to run the team like a small-market team.

    Now who was right -- Henry who put millions into Fenway and has always had a big payroll and won two titles or the critics?

    I'm not saying that there's not reasonable criticism that should be directed Henry's way and ownership in general. But I think that overall they certainly deserves some benefit of the doubt and certainly the chance to righten the ship.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from carnie. Show carnie's posts

    Re: Sell the Team

    In Response to Re: Sell the Team:
    [QUOTE]Danny, I disagree with your posts on this thread. First, and I'm not sure if it was you or someone else on this thread who phrased it this way, but he didn't "indict" Crawford. He just said he wasn't in favor of the deal because he wasn't a good fit. It's hardly an indictment that's blaming Crawford for the bad finish and hardly a fracture in the relationship that can't be mended. Also, an owner can trust the baseball people. It's like any company -- any good company. The owner isn't necessarily going to know every thing about every part of the company. At some point, you have to trust the people you hire. Now if it's a situation that spending the money is going to ruin the company financially and put it out of business, that's one thing. But that wasn't the case with Crawford.  Henry has been the ideal owner. He stays involved as the top person, but let's people do the job they were hired for. And he's really not much different that Cuban in that respect. Cuban isn't making trades or signing free agents. He's simply giving his GM the money to do whatever he thinks is needed to be successful. And talk about coddling the players. People rip Henry for the headsets and sprucing up Fenway to make it more comfortable. Go ahead and read what Cuban has done for the players there. The only difference between Henry and Cuban is that Cuban hungers for the spotlight and has to be the face of the team. Henry prefers to stay in the background and there's absolutely nothig wrong with that. Yes, Henry and Co. could have handled the past month or so better. But that shouldn't erase the past 10 years. They took over for a regime that seemed to go out of its way to backstap players, not support its managers, and most importantly not care about the fans or what the fans wanted. Henry and Co. came in and did a complete 180. They spent money to improve the product at all levels. I can believe Henry with much of what he says because of the history. Remember, when he came in, he said he was committed to spending the money necessary to make the Sox a winning team. Many critics called him a liar and predicted he was going to run the team like a small-market team. Now who was right -- Henry who put millions into Fenway and has always had a big payroll and won two titles or the critics? I'm not saying that there's not reasonable criticism that should be directed Henry's way and ownership in general. But I think that overall they certainly deserves some benefit of the doubt and certainly the chance to righten the ship.
    Posted by royf19[/QUOTE]Hear hear roy. An eminently reasonable position and I applaud you for it.
     

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