Sox looking for shortstop?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from devildavid. Show devildavid's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    Zil, ya beat me to it!
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    In Response to Re: Sox looking for shortstop?:
    Furcal is the best deal on the market. A SH with a great arm, above average defense, and speed. To me, if the Sox are serious about acquiring a SS, this is a no-brainer!
    Posted by Alibiike


    No takers? I'll reply to my own post.

    Furcal made $13M between LA and STL last year, and unless he is willing to sign for a lot less, he's not worth it.
    Now, if we can get him for say $8M and trade Scutaro, with Iggy as back up, then let's do it!


     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from soxforlife22. Show soxforlife22's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    In Response to Re: Sox looking for shortstop?:
    In Response to Re: Sox looking for shortstop? : No takers? I'll reply to my own post. Furcal made $13M between LA and STL last year, and unless he is willing to sign for a lot less, he's not worth it. Now, if we can get him for say $8M and trade Scutaro, with Iggy as back up, then let's do it!
    Posted by Alibiike

    I actually agree with this. Although after a .231 average he will not get 8mil. Maybe a one year deal with an option. Hes sufficient defensively and a good hitter when hes not hurt. And with him off the market, Scutaro's trade value would go up.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Wolfpack13. Show Wolfpack13's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    I hope we sign either Reyes or Rollins because when the Sox lose I like to say "Well, if Reyes was healthy we would have won." Injuries are the best excuse you can make.
    Also, when Reyes misses June, July and August we can post on this board stuff like "I think Reyes should stop listening to his personal trainer" or "when he returns the final week of September, boy the Sox will be great."
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    I actually agree with this. Although after a .231 average he will not get 8mil. Maybe a one year deal with an option. Hes sufficient defensively and a good hitter when hes not hurt. And with him off the market, Scutaro's trade value would go up.

    If we are going to pay Furcal $8M to field great and hit .231, why not just play Iggy at $2M? He can hit .200 and still be "worth it" at the $6M disparity.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from soxforlife22. Show soxforlife22's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    In Response to Re: Sox looking for shortstop?:
    I actually agree with this. Although after a .231 average he will not get 8mil. Maybe a one year deal with an option. Hes sufficient defensively and a good hitter when hes not hurt. And with him off the market, Scutaro's trade value would go up. If we are going to pay Furcal $8M to field great and hit .231, why not just play Iggy at $2M? He can hit .200 and still be "worth it" at the $6M disparity.
    Posted by moonslav59

    I should have made this more clear but i would never pay Furcal 8mil nor do i think any other team will pay him that. At the max hes gonna get 5mil. And Furcal was playing hurt for the start of the season but then actually hit at the end so he will do better than .231
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from hankwilliams. Show hankwilliams's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    AL rosters can't float a .200 hitter, at least if they are any good

    Moonschlep, SS was not part of this statement. Varitek was floated, and needs to be sunk.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    Umm...this is a thread about SS. You brought up VTek... again.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from hankwilliams. Show hankwilliams's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    No, a dimwit poster claimed a .200 player can't be floated on a good team in the AL. Umm, Varitek has been floated. 

    Your stalking is about six feet under swamp.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    I think Scutaro could have a few interested teams if the Sox put his name out there..He had a great season at the plate, is a gamer and wont kill you defensivly..Plus hes a good veteran presence in the clubhouse..
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from MadMc44. Show MadMc44's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    Alex Gonzales is still out there as a FA--so if Scutaro was dangled for all the reasons given above---you could sign this "AGon" with his 15 homers and 50 + RBI 
     in addition to his great fielding, for about the same money as Scu and get a player in return you might need as part of a trade package.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from agarbari. Show agarbari's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    This team is not picking up Reyes. This year they are going to be quiet in the FA Market. No way they spend money that Reyes would demand.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    In Response to Re: Sox looking for shortstop?:
    Just because he's cheaper than Reyes, doesn't mean a team is willing to pay $6M and part with players to get him. While it's true that the FA market does not have many good hitting SSs on the market, most NL teams realy value defense at SS. I could see us making a trade for a higher priced SS and/or starter pitcher and Scutty being part of the deal. How's this one? Trade: Ellsbury, Scutaro, Salty, Weiland and Bowden For: Wieters (3 arbs left after this winter) , J. Guthrie (~$7-8M on last arb year--extend him) and JJ Hardy (~$15M/2 left)
    Posted by moonslav59


    Why overcomplicate these trade thought simply to get one player you really want?  How often do 7 player trades happen in MLB?  You have mastered the art of rationalizing overly complicated trades based solely on contractual commitments.  First of all,  Baltimore is not trading Wieters, end of story.  They gave the guy $6mill coming out of college, and did so for a reason.  His nickname is “Switch Hitting Jesus,” again, for a reason.  Trust me- they want him where he is, and 2 years of Ellsbury when they already have a guy they like in CF would not change their minds.  If you kept it simple, like Scutaro and Weiland for Guthrie, you’d have a more realistic proposal.  But I’m not sure the Orioles are the best trade partner here, even if they have a guy we all want.

    Keep it simpler.  Some thoughts -  the following teams have a very real shot at being competitive next season and have a gaping hole at shortstop.

    Philadelphia

    Milwaukee

    Atlanta,

    Tampa,

    Detroit (if Peralta moves to 3B, either way they need INF help potentially at 2B and 3B and Scutaro could be a good 2B for them),

    St. Louis (very likely to bring back Furcal, but have not yet and might not come to an agreement)

    San Francisco

    Pittsburgh (the balance of power in the NL Central rests solely on where Fielder and Pujols end up)

     

    That is 8 teams in need of a SS. Even if 3 of them sign Reyes, Furcal, and Rollins, that leaves 5 teams.  And those free agents also might each sign elsewhere, though it is doubtful a rebuilding team signs Rollins.  (Reyes could be a nice building block, Furcal a reasonable stopgap).

     

    Atlanta does have a SS prospect (Tyler Pastornicky) who could start opening day, but is reportedly just not thrilling anyone at the moment.  Scutaro is an ideal stopgap for them.  Too bad they have little that matches up (re: they would want to trade) for Scutaro.  A third team would be needed.  That overcomplicates this for me.  Move on.

     

    I’m not sure how Tampa feels about Boston, but I don’t believe that myth that teams don’t like to trade within the division, mostly because it is not true.  (Seattle/Texas Cliff Lee trade, Florida/Atlanta Dan Uggla trade, etc.).  Still, they are unlikely to make the deal since they don’t have a disposable costly pitcher making that they would give up for player like Scutaro.  They might prefer Iglesias, and might even surrender Niemann or Davis for him.  But I’m stretching.  Too complicated.  Next.

     

    The Cardinals would probably love to move Westbrook ($9.3mill thru 2012) or Lohse ($11.8mill thru 2012) for him.  Even if they bring back Furcal, it’s not like Rogers Hornsby is manning 2b there anymore.  This not only helps the middle INF, but also opens a rotation spot for them to discuss lifelong Cardinals fan Mark Buerhle.

     

    I’m having trouble finding anything realistic in Detroit, too.  I now at this point, you come in with some contract numbers and rationalize something like the Sox getting Max Scherzer and Ryan Raburn for Scutaro, Renaudo and Lowrie, but that’s not how I operate.  (Although Raburn is a really good thought for Boston.  Dude plays anywhere and might be the best specialist in all of MLB when it comes to mashing LHP.  Outstanding platoon choice in RF with Reddick/Kalish.  Great call on your part.)  Delmon Young works out financially, but I wouldn’t make that move if I was running either team. 

     

    Milwaukee has Randy Wolf, but they probably need Wolf more than Scutaro.  And I don’t see any match up with the Giants.  Ditto Pittsburgh, although they would love him there.  Anyway, I could see the Giants signing Rollins and the Brewers signing Reyes.

     

    And these are just the teams that might have a shot next year.  Then there are those that might be looking for a simple stopgap solution and maybe a potentially useful contract to move.  Colorado, for example, is one.  The Dodgers, Twins, Blue Jays, Cubs, and Astros also might not mind a stopgap player.  I’d love to see a Scutaro / Huston Street swap, but I doubt they surrender Street for that little.  If 2013 was already guaranteed for $9mill, maybe.  But it’s an option, so he is less of a risk for anyone to acquire.

     

    The guy is movable.  And if the Sox can get a back of the rotation starter for him, they need to do it.  If they can get a quality relief arm for him, they need to do it.  The Dodgers would possibly move Ted Lilly ($22mill through 2013) for Scutaro.  And while Lilly is a very, very underrated pitcher, he is already 35 and that is a pretty big contract.  It might make more sense for the Sox to ask for Matt Guerrer ($9.5mill though 2013).

     

    I still like the idea of Blanton.  He has one year left at $8.5mill, and is a very underrated pitcher.  He certainly has a lot of success in the K/BB department, constantly keeping it over 3.  And Philly would love to move him, the Sox need a starter or two, and this move would cost a net of $2.5mill.  What 180IP starter will anyone be able to sign for that?

     

    Blanton, Westbrook,  Lohse, Lilly or Guerrier.  I know these are not stellar pitchers who will be contending for the Cy Young, but all represent serious upgrades over the Weiland / Wakefield / Miller crowd who represented the back end last year (except Guerrier, who would be in the pen).  All have pitched in the AL, but all have pros and cons.  The idiot answer at this point is “Don’t bother and let’s see what the kids can do.”  First, it’s not like we have a boatload of young pitchers knocking on the door.  And second, there are plenty of innings to go around for veterans and kids.  Last year, the opening day rotation lost 2 pitchers by the end of the season.  In 2012, we get one back but are losing another.  It’s not like simply naming 5 pitchers in April is a realistic solution, and it never has been.

     

    Even if these pitchers don’ t all have ERA’s under 4.00, there is a serious value in getting 170+ IP from a starter and not destroying the bullpen the way the September rotation did. Moving Scutaro could seriously help this rotation, and replacing him with Iglesias (especially if Youkilis is at third, which we all know is going to happen despite many brilliant suggestions that it should not) is probably enough of an upgrade defensively to justify however poorly Iglesias hits…

     


     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from WesternOregon. Show WesternOregon's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    In Response to Re: Sox looking for shortstop?:
    In Response to Re: Sox looking for shortstop? : Why overcomplicate these trade thought simply to get one player you really want?  How often do 7 player trades happen in MLB?  You have mastered the art of rationalizing overly complicated trades based solely on contractual commitments.  First of all,  Baltimore is not trading Wieters, end of story.  They gave the guy $6mill coming out of college, and did so for a reason.  His nickname is “Switch Hitting Jesus,” again, for a reason.  Trust me- they want him where he is, and 2 years of Ellsbury when they already have a guy they like in CF would not change their minds.  If you kept it simple, like Scutaro and Weiland for Guthrie, you’d have a more realistic proposal.  But I’m not sure the Orioles are the best trade partner here, even if they have a guy we all want. Keep it simpler.  Some thoughts -  the following teams have a very real shot at being competitive next season and have a gaping hole at shortstop. Philadelphia Milwaukee Atlanta, Tampa, Detroit (if Peralta moves to 3B, either way they need INF help potentially at 2B and 3B and Scutaro could be a good 2B for them), St. Louis (very likely to bring back Furcal, but have not yet and might not come to an agreement) San Francisco Pittsburgh (the balance of power in the NL Central rests solely on where Fielder and Pujols end up)   That is 8 teams in need of a SS. Even if 3 of them sign Reyes, Furcal, and Rollins, that leaves 5 teams.  And those free agents also might each sign elsewhere, though it is doubtful a rebuilding team signs Rollins.  (Reyes could be a nice building block, Furcal a reasonable stopgap).   Atlanta does have a SS prospect (Tyler Pastornicky) who could start opening day, but is reportedly just not thrilling anyone at the moment.  Scutaro is an ideal stopgap for them.  Too bad they have little that matches up (re: they would want to trade) for Scutaro.  A third team would be needed.  That overcomplicates this for me.  Move on.   I’m not sure how Tampa feels about Boston, but I don’t believe that myth that teams don’t like to trade within the division, mostly because it is not true.  (Seattle/Texas Cliff Lee trade, Florida/Atlanta Dan Uggla trade, etc.).  Still, they are unlikely to make the deal since they don’t have a disposable costly pitcher making that they would give up for player like Scutaro.  They might prefer Iglesias, and might even surrender Niemann or Davis for him.  But I’m stretching.  Too complicated.  Next.   The Cardinals would probably love to move Westbrook ($9.3mill thru 2012) or Lohse ($11.8mill thru 2012) for him.  Even if they bring back Furcal, it’s not like Rogers Hornsby is manning 2b there anymore.  This not only helps the middle INF, but also opens a rotation spot for them to discuss lifelong Cardinals fan Mark Buerhle.   I’m having trouble finding anything realistic in Detroit, too.  I now at this point, you come in with some contract numbers and rationalize something like the Sox getting Max Scherzer and Ryan Raburn for Scutaro, Renaudo and Lowrie, but that’s not how I operate.  (Although Raburn is a really good thought for Boston.  Dude plays anywhere and might be the best specialist in all of MLB when it comes to mashing LHP.  Outstanding platoon choice in RF with Reddick/Kalish.  Great call on your part.)  Delmon Young works out financially, but I wouldn’t make that move if I was running either team.    Milwaukee has Randy Wolf, but they probably need Wolf more than Scutaro.  And I don’t see any match up with the Giants.  Ditto Pittsburgh, although they would love him there.  Anyway, I could see the Giants signing Rollins and the Brewers signing Reyes.   And these are just the teams that might have a shot next year.  Then there are those that might be looking for a simple stopgap solution and maybe a potentially useful contract to move.  Colorado, for example, is one.  The Dodgers, Twins, Blue Jays, Cubs, and Astros also might not mind a stopgap player.  I’d love to see a Scutaro / Huston Street swap, but I doubt they surrender Street for that little.  If 2013 was already guaranteed for $9mill, maybe.  But it’s an option, so he is less of a risk for anyone to acquire.   The guy is movable.  And if the Sox can get a back of the rotation starter for him, they need to do it.  If they can get a quality relief arm for him, they need to do it.  The Dodgers would possibly move Ted Lilly ($22mill through 2013) for Scutaro.  And while Lilly is a very, very underrated pitcher, he is already 35 and that is a pretty big contract.  It might make more sense for the Sox to ask for Matt Guerrer ($9.5mill though 2013).   I still like the idea of Blanton.  He has one year left at $8.5mill, and is a very underrated pitcher.  He certainly has a lot of success in the K/BB department, constantly keeping it over 3.  And Philly would love to move him, the Sox need a starter or two, and this move would cost a net of $2.5mill.  What 180IP starter will anyone be able to sign for that?   Blanton, Westbrook,  Lohse, Lilly or Guerrier.  I know these are not stellar pitchers who will be contending for the Cy Young, but all represent serious upgrades over the Weiland / Wakefield / Miller crowd who represented the back end last year (except Guerrier, who would be in the pen).  All have pitched in the AL, but all have pros and cons.  The idiot answer at this point is “Don’t bother and let’s see what the kids can do.”  First, it’s not like we have a boatload of young pitchers knocking on the door.  And second, there are plenty of innings to go around for veterans and kids.  Last year, the opening day rotation lost 2 pitchers by the end of the season.  In 2012, we get one back but are losing another.  It’s not like simply naming 5 pitchers in April is a realistic solution, and it never has been.   Even if these pitchers don’ t all have ERA’s under 4.00, there is a serious value in getting 170+ IP from a starter and not destroying the bullpen the way the September rotation did. Moving Scutaro could seriously help this rotation, and replacing him with Iglesias (especially if Youkilis is at third, which we all know is going to happen despite many brilliant suggestions that it should not) is probably enough of an upgrade defensively to justify however poorly Iglesias hits…  
    Posted by notin



    WARNING: Please observe character limits as we value your input but only skim postings that exceed 1000 characters. This is not a contest, size does not matter notin. (Disclaimer: add moonslav and we'd have a political debate of words and no substance)
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    In Response to Re: Sox looking for shortstop?:
    No, a dimwit poster claimed a .200 player can't be floated on a good team in the AL. Umm, Varitek has been floated.  Your stalking is about six feet under swamp.
    Posted by hankwilliams


    "Floating a player" does not include back-ups who have a better OPS than all but 8 team catcher OPS silly clown. You have never acknowledged the fact that the MLB catcher position is rarely looked upon as a position of offense. There's really only about a handful of good hitting catchers (who catch more than DH or play 1B).

    VTek's OPS was just .014 below the starter Salty's OPS and was better than the guy you wanted to lead off all year (CC's). It was better than your idol, JD Drew's and better than your bashee Jed: that makes 3 guys on the Sox who had more PAs than VTek and a lower OPS. 

    Salty and VTek together were about the 9th or 10th best catcher combination offensively in MLB by OPS. ONLY 1 TEAM HAD MORE RBIs from the catching position in 2011. If that's "floating", you truly have no clue.

    VTek surprisingly had more RBIs per PA or AB than many big name Sox players: better than Pedey, Salty, CC, and Scutty. His rate is nearly that of Youk and Papi's and not far from "Jake's".

    BTW, 10 teams had a worse BA than the Sox catchers.
    (I see you are now using your cherry-picked stat of BA to judge players by. Why not just choose one  and stick to it for everyone? With BHall it was HR%, Miller it was road ERA, Jake and Jed: OPS vs lefties or righties)

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    Good post notin. I know I get carried away sometimes trying to suggest blockbuster deals as possible solutions, but it's the slow time of the year.

    I'm not sure we get much for Scutty straight up, and so that is why I tend to expand the deals. Getting a salary dump pitcher is probably the most likely offer for Scutty, but the way we are seemingly looking to keep payroll down, I'm not sure how realistic that is either.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from kimsaysthis. Show kimsaysthis's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    In Response to Re: Sox looking for shortstop?:
    I hope we sign either Reyes or Rollins because when the Sox lose I like to say "Well, if Reyes was healthy we would have won." Injuries are the best excuse you can make. Also, when Reyes misses June, July and August we can post on this board stuff like "I think Reyes should stop listening to his personal trainer" or "when he returns the final week of September, boy the Sox will be great."
    Posted by Wolfpack13


    A poster who talks about injuries as excuses, and pretends to be a Sox fan. It's amazing how many people buy that. Right, Wolfpack? Interesting name, btw.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    Scutaro and a roll of the dice prospect to Florida (Miami) for one of their sensational middle relievers - Mujica
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Sox looking for shortstop?

    In Response to Re: Sox looking for shortstop?:
    Scutaro and a roll of the dice prospect to Florida (Miami) for one of their sensational middle relievers - Mujica
    Posted by BurritoT


    Really? You think the Marlins would do that?

    Just wait until they non-tender LNJCO.  (Luis Nunez Juan Carlos Oviedo)
     
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