Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    I'm not trying to dis Devers eighther or Moon's Minors report just that I'm sickened by the big club and the players on the big club including the poor fast-tracked rookies who are in over their heads.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    In response to dannycater's comment:


    I'm not trying to dis Devers eighther or Moon's Minors report just that I'm sickened by the big club and the players on the big club including the poor fast-tracked rookies who are in over their heads.




    That's an unfair evaluation.  JBJ was rushed, Bogaerts and Betts were both completely unchallenged by minor league pitching.


    Just because a guy has nothing to little left to learn in the minors doesn't mean they are done progressing.  Bogaerts was 100% unchallenged in triple A....so how is sending him back down to triple A going help him hit better??? It's not.  He has learned how to hit minor league pitching, and he's hit MLB pitching before and was much better earlier, he needs to make the adjustments at the MLB level.  He's not going to make them against AAA pitchers.


    Bogaerts and Betts are also the exception and not the rule....the Sox usually get bashed MUCH MUCH MUCH more often for holding guys back.


    Devers is about 6 years away realistically, but he gives us something to dream on as he is probably the most hyped Dominican player we've signed since Hanley Ramirez.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from chickenandboose. Show chickenandboose's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    He will be up in 3 years :) put it on the boooaoarrrrdddd!! Yes!

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    This from soxprospects.com

    In his first game with the GCL Sox, Rafael Devers (pictured,right) had a monster day, going 4 for 4 with a double, triple and three RBI, reaching base all five times he stepped to the plate.

    and...

    Among the pitchers in Pawtucket's loaded, all-prospect rotation early this season, Brandon Workman now appears to have solidified a spot in Boston's rotation, Rubby De La Rosa impressed in his time in the majors, and Allen Webster has pitched well enough to earn another shot at the big leagues. But it is another member of the PawSox rotation who is having perhaps the best season of them all to this point: Right-hander Anthony Ranaudo continues to quietly shut down opposing offenses, and he showed why Monday night in Pawtucket with seven scoreless innings.

    "The fastball was explosive out of his hand, and he was able to utilize a mix," Pawtucket manager Kevin Boles said after the outing. "He left some pitches up, but then he was able to execute. When he was behind in the count, he showed some good execution and was able to get back into the count. He threw some decent breaking balls. I thought the hand speed with the changeup was good. [He was] aggressive. He's really come a long ways."

    Sox4ever

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    In response to chickenandboose's comment:

    He will be up in 3 years :) put it on the boooaoarrrrdddd!! Yes!



    Don't go to Vegas with that bet....he's still 6 levels below Boston.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    2014 first round pick Michael Chavis went 0-4 in his debut.  From what I've learned on this board, I feel it is safe to say he is a complete bust and Ben C. made the wrong choice in drafting him.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from chickenandboose. Show chickenandboose's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    This from soxprospects.com

    In his first game with the GCL Sox, Rafael Devers (pictured,right) had a monster day, going 4 for 4 with a double, triple and three RBI, reaching base all five times he stepped to the plate.

    and...

    Among the pitchers in Pawtucket's loaded, all-prospect rotation early this season, Brandon Workman now appears to have solidified a spot in Boston's rotation, Rubby De La Rosa impressed in his time in the majors, and Allen Webster has pitched well enough to earn another shot at the big leagues. But it is another member of the PawSox rotation who is having perhaps the best season of them all to this point: Right-hander Anthony Ranaudo continues to quietly shut down opposing offenses, and he showed why Monday night in Pawtucket with seven scoreless innings.

    "The fastball was explosive out of his hand, and he was able to utilize a mix," Pawtucket manager Kevin Boles said after the outing. "He left some pitches up, but then he was able to execute. When he was behind in the count, he showed some good execution and was able to get back into the count. He threw some decent breaking balls. I thought the hand speed with the changeup was good. [He was] aggressive. He's really come a long ways."

    Sox4ever



    And this is why the team should start trading Lester,Lackey, and Peavy... It is time to see if they can pitch in MLB.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    and if they can't???? who leads the rotation next year? Buchholz and Doubront?  I'm all for giving these guys a shot, but you need a couple sure thing veterans in your rotation as well.......if you want to compete.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    In response to chickenandboose's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    This from soxprospects.com

    In his first game with the GCL Sox, Rafael Devers (pictured,right) had a monster day, going 4 for 4 with a double, triple and three RBI, reaching base all five times he stepped to the plate.

    and...

    Among the pitchers in Pawtucket's loaded, all-prospect rotation early this season, Brandon Workman now appears to have solidified a spot in Boston's rotation, Rubby De La Rosa impressed in his time in the majors, and Allen Webster has pitched well enough to earn another shot at the big leagues. But it is another member of the PawSox rotation who is having perhaps the best season of them all to this point: Right-hander Anthony Ranaudo continues to quietly shut down opposing offenses, and he showed why Monday night in Pawtucket with seven scoreless innings.

    "The fastball was explosive out of his hand, and he was able to utilize a mix," Pawtucket manager Kevin Boles said after the outing. "He left some pitches up, but then he was able to execute. When he was behind in the count, he showed some good execution and was able to get back into the count. He threw some decent breaking balls. I thought the hand speed with the changeup was good. [He was] aggressive. He's really come a long ways."

    Sox4ever



    And this is why the team should start trading Lester,Lackey, and Peavy... It is time to see if they can pitch in MLB.




    Extend Lester or trade him.

    Keep Lackey: he is cheap next year.

    Trade Peavy.

     

    Give de la Rosa, Workman a FT slot in the rotation and Ranaudo or Webster a few starts at some point.

    Keep Doubront in the pen.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Teakus. Show Teakus's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    Thanks for the update Moon. I'll tell you, I rarely fall in love with prospects and take most evals of teams farm systems with a grain of salt, but I am growing more and more excited about our farm. It's one of the deepest I've seen in many years, with lots of MLB close or ready players and lots of potential trade pieces. Hopefully we'll nab some more kids this trading deadline when we hopefully jettison guys not in our future.

    Teakus-Carpe Veritatem!

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    I don't think we should pencil in any prospects as FT'er next year, but keep some room for them to fill in or earn their way to the top.

    Sox4ever

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from chickenandboose. Show chickenandboose's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

    and if they can't???? who leads the rotation next year? Buchholz and Doubront?  I'm all for giving these guys a shot, but you need a couple sure thing veterans in your rotation as well.......if you want to compete.




    But if they do? You won't need 35 year old pitchers making 20-25m

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    In response to chickenandboose's comment:

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

    and if they can't???? who leads the rotation next year? Buchholz and Doubront?  I'm all for giving these guys a shot, but you need a couple sure thing veterans in your rotation as well.......if you want to compete.




    But if they do? You won't need 35 year old pitchers making 20-25m




    No way 5 kids pitch well enough to lead us to a ring in 2015.

    Yes, we need a veteran stud pitcher or two.

    Lester, Price and Scherzer aren't close to 35.

    Lackey's far away from making $20-25M next season.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    Anyone who gives a 35 year old 25 million a year is an idiot....now if you want to sign a FA pitcher around the ages of 28-30 then you might have to give them that kind of money that results in the tail end of the contract being that.

    Otherwise....you better hope you just draft aces. 

     

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Anyone who gives a 35 year old 25 million a year is an idiot....now if you want to sign a FA pitcher around the ages of 28-30 then you might have to give them that kind of money that results in the tail end of the contract being that.

    Otherwise....you better hope you just draft aces. 

     

     Who's 35?

     Lester in his last year of a 5 year extension?

     35 is not that old for most SP'ers and many have several great years after 34.

     

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

    Anyone who gives a 35 year old 25 million a year is an idiot....now if you want to sign a FA pitcher around the ages of 28-30 then you might have to give them that kind of money that results in the tail end of the contract being that.

    Otherwise....you better hope you just draft aces. 

     

     Who's 35?

     Lester in his last year of a 5 year extension?

     35 is not that old for most SP'ers and many have several great years after 34.

     




    Oh I don't know, I was talking to Chicken who I was assuming we'd be paying a 35 year old 20-25, which would be realistic 4-5 years from now if we sign a Scherzer, Lester in FA. 

    Reality is, if you want to sign an ace in FA they are going to get a contract that pays them well into their 20's...

    with player inflation, that might not even be that bad of a salary in 5 years.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

    Anyone who gives a 35 year old 25 million a year is an idiot....now if you want to sign a FA pitcher around the ages of 28-30 then you might have to give them that kind of money that results in the tail end of the contract being that.

    Otherwise....you better hope you just draft aces. 

     

     Who's 35?

     Lester in his last year of a 5 year extension?

     35 is not that old for most SP'ers and many have several great years after 34.

     




    Oh I don't know, I was talking to Chicken who I was assuming we'd be paying a 35 year old 20-25, which would be realistic 4-5 years from now if we sign a Scherzer, Lester in FA. 

    Reality is, if you want to sign an ace in FA they are going to get a contract that pays them well into their 20's...

    with player inflation, that might not even be that bad of a salary in 5 years.




    Thinking we can win in 2015 or 2016 with a rotation of de la Rosa, Workman, Ranaudo, Webster and Owens is a fantasy.

    I'm okay with letting these kids fight for the 5 slot or even the 4 and 5 slot, if the other 3 are filled with solid dependable vets.

    We can't let the fact that we lost this year because of poor hitting make us think we can now skimp on pitching going forward.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from chickenandboose. Show chickenandboose's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    I am thinking of being competitive every year instead of being good one year and then being bad in another... Ala the Cardinals.  They let Pujols walk and many though they were stupid... 

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    In response to chickenandboose's comment:

    I am thinking of being competitive every year instead of being good one year and then being bad in another... Ala the Cardinals.  They let Pujols walk and many though they were stupid... 




    What Pujols wanted for a contract was insane. What Lester wants is not.

    We can probably build a winning team without Lester, but at 30 years old, a $120M/5 deal is not unreasonable.

    What's alternative? Pay half as much for a pitcher like Masterson and pray our kids rise high and quickly? Spend all the rest on our offense? 

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    Lester probably wont even get 1/2 of what Pujols did. And when you factor in salary inflation and higher salarycaps his contract will be closer to 1/4 of Pujols value, give or take.

     

    no one is talking about that kinda money.  

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from chickenandboose. Show chickenandboose's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to chickenandboose's comment:

    I am thinking of being competitive every year instead of being good one year and then being bad in another... Ala the Cardinals.  They let Pujols walk and many though they were stupid... 




    What Pujols wanted for a contract was insane. What Lester wants is not.

    We can probably build a winning team without Lester, but at 30 years old, a $120M/5 deal is not unreasonable.

    What's alternative? Pay half as much for a pitcher like Masterson and pray our kids rise high and quickly? Spend all the rest on our offense? 



    Negative I want the team to let their youth play and not sign or trade for old vets that will not produce here... Hell the ultimate goal for this team should be to trade Lester and sign him in the open market (if he makes it that far). It would be a win win situation. 

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from davidap. Show davidap's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    If anything, I think the Red Sox are too slow to promote prospects. The reason why other teams seem to have young superstars hit free agency before age 30 is because they give them a chance to strut their stuff at the major league level. Whether by design or necessity, they get called up. In organizations like Boston and New York, we seldom see the same trajectory. A guy can be ready for 2-3 years and languish in AAA. Then everyone dismisses them as a 4A player when the reality is that in most other organizations that player would have been promoted sooner and not provided the censorious moniker. Someone like Ryan Lavarnway comes to mind. He's not seen as anything special anymore because he's languished in Pawtucket for too long. But maybe the guy really can hit and simply was stuck in the wrong organization.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    Negative I want the team to let their youth play and not sign or trade for old vets that will not produce here... Hell the ultimate goal for this team should be to trade Lester and sign him in the open market (if he makes it that far). It would be a win win situation.

    Where have I ever advocated signing or trading for "old vets that will not produce here"?

    Lester is not old. He is 30. He'll have just turned 35 before the 5th year of an extension. That is prime years for a starting pitcher in MLB.

    If we go totally with the youth movement, it could be 3 or more years before we become highly competitive, and some of our kids, no matter what some of you think, are not ready for the ML leap and or will fail when they finally get the chance.

    I'm all for giving a 2015 25 man roster spot to JBJ, Bogey, Betts, Holt, Vazquez, and maybe even Cecchini or Middy, if they earn it. Maybe by mid season 2015 Swihart or Marrero could get a chance, but I would not hand 6 slots to rookies or 2nd year players (C, SS, 3B, LF, CF, RF). I'd give the youngsters every chance to win a FT slot, but I'd have 2-3 vets on hand, just in case.

    As for pitching, you are dreaming if you think a rotation of de la Rosa, Workman, Ranaudo, Webster and Owens is going to lead this team to a ring in 2-3 years time. None are proven winners. None have any playoff experience. None.

    I'm fine with letting these 5 fight it out for the 4 and 5 slots in the 2015 rotation, but expecting all 5 to make it this quickly is not reasonable.

    The pen will also need tending to. We may lose Uehara, Miller and Badenhop this winter... just about our best 3 RP'ers on the 40 man roster.

    Sox4ever

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    In response to davidap's comment:

    If anything, I think the Red Sox are too slow to promote prospects. The reason why other teams seem to have young superstars hit free agency before age 30 is because they give them a chance to strut their stuff at the major league level. Whether by design or necessity, they get called up. In organizations like Boston and New York, we seldom see the same trajectory. A guy can be ready for 2-3 years and languish in AAA. Then everyone dismisses them as a 4A player when the reality is that in most other organizations that player would have been promoted sooner and not provided the censorious moniker. Someone like Ryan Lavarnway comes to mind. He's not seen as anything special anymore because he's languished in Pawtucket for too long. But maybe the guy really can hit and simply was stuck in the wrong organization.



    Other than Brandon Moss, I can't think of any players we kept in the minors too long and they ended up doing great once given the chance.

    Lowrie had injury issues.

    We fast-tracked Ellsbury and it worked.

    We fast-tracked a few more who failed.

    Waiting for players to mature before starting the FA clock is a reasonable plan.

    Even the Astros held off bringing up Springer to gain another year of team control.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Sox to Promote Devers to GCL

    In response to davidap's comment:

    If anything, I think the Red Sox are too slow to promote prospects. The reason why other teams seem to have young superstars hit free agency before age 30 is because they give them a chance to strut their stuff at the major league level. Whether by design or necessity, they get called up. In organizations like Boston and New York, we seldom see the same trajectory. A guy can be ready for 2-3 years and languish in AAA. Then everyone dismisses them as a 4A player when the reality is that in most other organizations that player would have been promoted sooner and not provided the censorious moniker. Someone like Ryan Lavarnway comes to mind. He's not seen as anything special anymore because he's languished in Pawtucket for too long. But maybe the guy really can hit and simply was stuck in the wrong organization.




    You had me up until Ryan Lavarnway.  A great player would still be a great player in Boston.  Perhaps Lavarnway would have got more of a shot in other city, but if he was something special he would be a big leaguer by now....if he had that kind of potential the Sox would have traded him for something of value by now.  Lavarnway just isn't that great at baseball.

     
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