Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from garyhow. Show garyhow's posts

    Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    MLBAM is introducing a new system at a conference @ MIT in Boston. Using this system it will be able to show exactly how good a defensive play made was by using all the following:

    1. Batted Ball Speed

    2. Launch Angle

    3. Distance ball traveled

    4. Hang Time

    For the defensive player it will show

    a. Route Efficiency

    b. Speed of defenders 1st step

    c. Players top speed

    d. Amount of ground covered

    Looks like we might finally have a defensive metric that really works. Saw this displayed on MLB network and it was pretty amazing. I'm not a big stat geek and didn't care for the old defensive metrics, because there was the human element of judgement. But this takes into and accounts for just about every variable that goes into making a catch vs. not being able to make a catch.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    In response to garyhow's comment:

    MLBAM is introducing a new system at a conference @ MIT in Boston. Using this system it will be able to show exactly how good a defensive play made was by using all the following:

    1. Batted Ball Speed

    2. Launch Angle

    3. Distance ball traveled

    4. Hang Time

    For the defensive player it will show

    a. Route Efficiency

    b. Speed of defenders 1st step

    c. Players top speed

    d. Amount of ground covered

    Looks like we might finally have a defensive metric that really works. Saw this displayed on MLB network and it was pretty amazing. I'm not a big stat geek and didn't care for the old defensive metrics, because there was the human element of judgement. But this takes into and accounts for just about every variable that goes into making a catch vs. not being able to make a catch.

    sHOULD WORK AS GOOD AS "BIG O-CARE" !!!


     
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  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    In response to JoseLaguna's comment:

    Read about this system being tried a few years back. They use a bank of 3-D cameras, GPS, complex software, and feed every batted ball, catch, and path of the fielder into a huge database. 

    A poor use of time...... I think that the "EYE" works just fine !!


     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    In response to Bill-806's comment:

    In response to JoseLaguna's comment:

    Read about this system being tried a few years back. They use a bank of 3-D cameras, GPS, complex software, and feed every batted ball, catch, and path of the fielder into a huge database. 

    A poor use of time...... I think that the "EYE" works just fine !!




    it's a wonder why you are a SOX fan.  The Sox were revolutionaries in the field of Sabermetrics and it's led them to 3 world titles in 10 years.  I think that would turn any fan into a believer.

    I suppose there will always be some old stubborn fans around who will trust there "eyes" over everything else.  

    What you see with your eyes can be very deceiving.  

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    In response to Bill-806's comment:

    In response to JoseLaguna's comment:

    Read about this system being tried a few years back. They use a bank of 3-D cameras, GPS, complex software, and feed every batted ball, catch, and path of the fielder into a huge database. 

    A poor use of time...... I think that the "EYE" works just fine !!





    Bill: 2 things.

    1) Your eyes need examining.

    2) You don't watch every play of every MLB game (nobody does), so how can you ever know if one of our players is the 10th best, 15th best or worst fielder in the league?

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThefourBs. Show ThefourBs's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

    In response to Bill-806's comment:

    In response to JoseLaguna's comment:

    Read about this system being tried a few years back. They use a bank of 3-D cameras, GPS, complex software, and feed every batted ball, catch, and path of the fielder into a huge database. 

    A poor use of time...... I think that the "EYE" works just fine !!




    it's a wonder why you are a SOX fan.  The Sox were revolutionaries in the field of Sabermetrics and it's led them to 3 world titles in 10 years.  I think that would turn any fan into a believer.

    I suppose there will always be some old stubborn fans around who will trust there "eyes" over everything else.  

    What you see with your eyes can be very deceiving.  




    Fans like Bill will always disregard things they don't understand.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from seannybboi. Show seannybboi's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    How about infield defense?  Does this apply to IFs as well?  

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    In response to ThefourBs' comment:

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

    In response to Bill-806's comment:

    In response to JoseLaguna's comment:

    Read about this system being tried a few years back. They use a bank of 3-D cameras, GPS, complex software, and feed every batted ball, catch, and path of the fielder into a huge database. 

    A poor use of time...... I think that the "EYE" works just fine !!




    it's a wonder why you are a SOX fan.  The Sox were revolutionaries in the field of Sabermetrics and it's led them to 3 world titles in 10 years.  I think that would turn any fan into a believer.

    I suppose there will always be some old stubborn fans around who will trust there "eyes" over everything else.  

    What you see with your eyes can be very deceiving.  




    Fans like Bill will always disregard things they don't understand.



    Unfortunately thats how a lot of us are, in baseball and in life. 

     

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from jete02fan. Show jete02fan's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    i'm hearing for 14' it will begin in three parks..Target(Twins) Miller(Brews) and CitiField(Mets)..then with everyone in 15'....

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from slasher9. Show slasher9's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    sounds like a daunting task but the more metrics the better.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from mrmojo1120. Show mrmojo1120's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

     I don't know a lot about sabermetrics,but if I was curious,does anyone know of a stat that accurately measures the true average runs per game for a pitcher?

      For example,if a starter leaves a man on second when he gets pulled and the runner ends up scoring,he'll get charged with the earned run despite the fact he wasn't on the field at the point the runner scored and the reliever who allowed the run doesn't get charged with it.

      Seems kind of unfair to me,and I was wondering if there's an advance metric that takes those types of situations into consideration when calculating the ERA. 

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    In response to mrmojo1120's comment:

     I don't know a lot about sabermetrics,but if I was curious,does anyone know of a stat that accurately measures the true average runs per game for a pitcher?

      For example,if a starter leaves a man on second when he gets pulled and the runner ends up scoring,he'll get charged with the earned run despite the fact he wasn't on the field at the point the runner scored and the reliever who allowed the run doesn't get charged with it.

      Seems kind of unfair to me,and I was wondering if there's an advance metric that takes those types of situations into consideration when calculating the ERA. 



    couldnt you just take their actual IP instead of figuring it out by 9IP?

    im just guessing.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    In response to mrmojo1120's comment:

     I don't know a lot about sabermetrics,but if I was curious,does anyone know of a stat that accurately measures the true average runs per game for a pitcher?

      For example,if a starter leaves a man on second when he gets pulled and the runner ends up scoring,he'll get charged with the earned run despite the fact he wasn't on the field at the point the runner scored and the reliever who allowed the run doesn't get charged with it.

      Seems kind of unfair to me,and I was wondering if there's an advance metric that takes those types of situations into consideration when calculating the ERA. 



    couldnt you just take their actual IP instead of figuring it out by 9IP?

    im just guessing.



    that wouldn't work because you still have runs charged to them while they are not pitching in games.  You would have to find out how many inherited runners scored after they left the game and subtract that from their earned runs. 

     
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  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from ZILLAGOD. Show ZILLAGOD's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    Of course the "stat geeks" probably had Peyton Manning slicing up the Seattle Seahawks....right?

    Did the "stat geeks' not pick the Yankees and Red Sox fighting it out for last place, with Toronto on the rise?.....how did that work out?

    Stats are nice for people to wonder about as they pick their fantasy league players. Makes great reading in the offseason, between games.....but when you get between the lines, Mike Napoli defies the experst and homers off Justin Verlander, when the probability monitors say he should strike out. Derek Jeter reaches that groundball the "range" indicators say he shouldn't get to.....

    ...you can measure all you want, use stats 'til you are seeing numbers in your sleep...but on game day Terry O'Reilly scores the winning goal in overtime...not Guy Lafleur...Papelbon gives up a 3-run homer while Uehara strikes out the side...Kurt Warner gets intercepted while a young unknown named Brady throws a Touchdown.

    Stats are fun....championships are won by determination and desire, not by computer geeks. You like stats, there's lots of board games to amuse you.

     
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  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    In response to ZILLAGOD's comment:

    Of course the "stat geeks" probably had Peyton Manning slicing up the Seattle Seahawks....right?

    Did the "stat geeks' not pick the Yankees and Red Sox fighting it out for last place, with Toronto on the rise?.....how did that work out?

    Stats are nice for people to wonder about as they pick their fantasy league players. Makes great reading in the offseason, between games.....but when you get between the lines, Mike Napoli defies the experst and homers off Justin Verlander, when the probability monitors say he should strike out. Derek Jeter reaches that groundball the "range" indicators say he shouldn't get to.....

    ...you can measure all you want, use stats 'til you are seeing numbers in your sleep...but on game day Terry O'Reilly scores the winning goal in overtime...not Guy Lafleur...Papelbon gives up a 3-run homer while Uehara strikes out the side...Kurt Warner gets intercepted while a young unknown named Brady throws a Touchdown.

    Stats are fun....championships are won by determination and desire, not by computer geeks. You like stats, there's lots of board games to amuse you.



    You know the pendulum swings too far both ways...you can't dismiss them either.  Do the stats predict everything??? no and those who think they do are those of us who adhere to them think so do not understand them.  

    it is effectively impossible to deny stats.  You can say "it only matters what they do on the field"

    ....well....the stats will show that.  

    Non stats people often think that we look into stats to predict everything, but rather we look at them to tell us what is happening

    If a player is struggling against LHP...then we know to bring in a LH reliever against him and we have a better chance of beating the odds.  Will it work all the time? do we have a crystal ball predicting the outcome? of course not, but that doesn't mean when the stats end up failing us that using saber metrics is a futile process....far far from it. 

     

    Yes the athletes play the game....but it was the GEEKS who built that 04 team, and that 07 team and that 13 team.  

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from devildavid. Show devildavid's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to Bill-806's comment:

    In response to JoseLaguna's comment:

    Read about this system being tried a few years back. They use a bank of 3-D cameras, GPS, complex software, and feed every batted ball, catch, and path of the fielder into a huge database. 

    A poor use of time...... I think that the "EYE" works just fine !!





    Bill: 2 things.

    1) Your eyes need examining.

    2) You don't watch every play of every MLB game (nobody does), so how can you ever know if one of our players is the 10th best, 15th best or worst fielder in the league?



    I agree that you can't always trust the eye test. But how do we know who is a good fielder if they are just ranked against their peers? In batting, A .300 hitter is a .300 hitter regardless of what every other hitter in the league bats. Where is a similar metric for fielding? If it is a relative measure, it can only be based on current season fielders for the same position. The best SS in 2014 may be better than his peers that year, but how do we know he is actually a good fielder? It's like grading on the curve. He may just be the best of a terrible group of fielders that season. What does that really tell us about his fielding ability?

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from SonicsMonksLyresVicars. Show SonicsMonksLyresVicars's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to Bill-806's comment:

    In response to JoseLaguna's comment:

    Read about this system being tried a few years back. They use a bank of 3-D cameras, GPS, complex software, and feed every batted ball, catch, and path of the fielder into a huge database. 

    A poor use of time...... I think that the "EYE" works just fine !!





    Bill: 2 things.

    1) Your eyes need examining.

    2) You don't watch every play of every MLB game (nobody does), so how can you ever know if one of our players is the 10th best, 15th best or worst fielder in the league?



    And, tangentially, I know of no one that believes that WAR is bulletproof, far from it....but a) if one looks at the annual WAR leaders they are obviously the top players, and vice-versa, and b) pray tell, how else would one evaluate the relative value of, say, Ty Cobb to Lefty Grove to Mickey Mantle to Pedro Martinez to Willie Mays?

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    people always think that stat guys try to predict, it's not so much like that.

    It's like counting cards...you don't have any ideal what the dealer is going to throw out next, you just know when the odds have changed.

    At any given time you can be completely wrong, card counters know there is a HUGE standard deviation and even they have to bring large sums of money to sustain losses.  But they know in the long run the "law of large numbers" will prevail.

    You can play Lefty on Lefty match ups and other tactics to "play the odds" in baseball and be wrong most of the time, but remember baseball is game where you can be wrong 70% of the time and be successful.

    If you were to tip the scale in your favor from 30% to 35% it would be almost impossible to tell the difference from one individual game but from game 1 to game 162 the difference can be huge. 

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxKimmi. Show RedSoxKimmi's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    In response to garyhow's comment:

    MLBAM is introducing a new system at a conference @ MIT in Boston. Using this system it will be able to show exactly how good a defensive play made was by using all the following:

    1. Batted Ball Speed

    2. Launch Angle

    3. Distance ball traveled

    4. Hang Time

    For the defensive player it will show

    a. Route Efficiency

    b. Speed of defenders 1st step

    c. Players top speed

    d. Amount of ground covered

    Looks like we might finally have a defensive metric that really works. Saw this displayed on MLB network and it was pretty amazing. I'm not a big stat geek and didn't care for the old defensive metrics, because there was the human element of judgement. But this takes into and accounts for just about every variable that goes into making a catch vs. not being able to make a catch.



    I saw a video clip of this as well, and it looks awesome.  I think this will help sway some of those who have been against the defensive metrics.

    As far as the metrics that are most commonly used now, such as UZR and +/- , I think that the information you listed above is already taken into account by the thousands of video scouts that watch every play.

    No, those numbers don't currently pop up on their screens, but some of the data is already available.   And for what data is not available, the scouts are trained to watch such plays and are highly adept at determining things like the amount of ground covered and routes taken.

    This technology will certainly help to refine defensive stats even more.

     

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxKimmi. Show RedSoxKimmi's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

    I suppose there will always be some old stubborn fans around who will trust there "eyes" over everything else.  

    What you see with your eyes can be very deceiving.  



    +100

    I am so sick of hearing people say things like "I don't need stats, I watch the games" or "I know what my eyes see".

     

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Stat Geeks Rejoice - New defensive metric on the way

    On Saturday I posted a link that included a video demonstration of the new metric:

    http://boston.com/community/forums/sports/red-sox/on-the-front-burner/latest-in-fielding-metrics/100/7048205

     
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