Survey: Bobby V takes over

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from summerof67. Show summerof67's posts

    Survey: Bobby V takes over

    Good morning, campers!

    Bobby Valentine (aka BV) is to be the new manager for BOS.

    Nice move. When his name surfaced in October, I had a visceral reaction similar to gastro-enteritis.  (Look it up! as Casey Stengel used to say.)  I had seen Bobby manager the Amazin' NYM here in NYC around the turn of the century and wanted no part of that for BOS.

    But this has, for me, become a shrewd (and perhaps cynical) move on the part of The Trio. 
     
    First, BOS gets an experienced manager that has actually taken a team to the WS (NYM 2000).  (At this moment, I am supposed to jump for joy. Notice that I remains seated.)

    Second, BOS gets a Mitt-Romney-type who will do whatever the Trio says in order to get a winner.

    Third, BV will be a lightning rod to asbsorb the attention that would have gone to the players for their beer-and-chicken binges.  As Peter Abraham notes, management knows this and it will help to keep that consecutive-sellout streak alive.  And with Dice-K down for most of next season, it will give BOS something to sell to the Japanese market.  (I would like to ask John Henry whether this is the case, but he is too busy rooting for his soccer club in the UK to answer an email from li'l old me.)

    For the record, then, my answer is 2.)

    Yet, in the spirit of saying, "Hey, Bobby! C'mon in and set a spell!" here is a little survey to gauge how this is going over with us peons.

     
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    In Response to Survey: Bobby V takes over:
    Good morning, campers! Bobby Valentine (aka BV) is to be the new manager for BOS. Nice move. When his name surfaced in October, I had a visceral reaction similar to gastro-enteritis.  (Look it up! as Casey Stengel used to say.)  I had seen Bobby manager the Amazin' NYM here in NYC around the turn of the century and wanted no part of that for BOS. But this has, for me, become a shrewd (and perhaps cynical) move on the part of The Trio.    First, BOS gets an experienced manager that has actually taken a team to the WS (NYM 2000).  (At this moment, I am supposed to jump for joy. Notice that I remains seated.) Second, BOS gets a Mitt-Romney-type who will do whatever the Trio says in order to get a winner. Third, BV will be a lightning rod to asbsorb the attention that would have gone to the players for their beer-and-chicken binges.  As Peter Abraham notes, management knows this and it will help to keep that consecutive-sellout streak alive.  And with Dice-K down for most of next season, it will give BOS something to sell to the Japanese market.  (I would like to ask John Henry whether this is the case, but he is too busy rooting for his soccer club in the UK to answer an email from li'l old me.) For the record, then, my answer is 2.) Yet, in the spirit of saying, "Hey, Bobby! C'mon in and set a spell!" here is a little survey to gauge how this is going over with us peons.  
    Posted by summerof67


    Summer, I agree with almost everything you say here, except the Mitt Romney part.  Bobby V. is anything but a waffling yes man with zero personality.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from OnDeckCircle. Show OnDeckCircle's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    What happens if Cherington gets a player that BV doesn't think is a fit on the team ?     Does he run to Lucchino with his disapproval ?
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    In Response to Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over:
    What happens if Cherington gets a player that BV doesn't think is a fit on the team ?     Does he run to Lucchino with his disapproval ?
    Posted by OnDeckCircle


    C'mon.  People are making too much of this Larry/Ben thing.  First off, Ben isn't picking up any players without consulting Bobby or Larry.  Thats the way it works for every team.  No GM operates in a vacuum.  
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    In Response to Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over:
    In Response to Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over : C'mon.  People are making too much of this Larry/Ben thing.  First off, Ben isn't picking up any players without consulting Bobby or Larry.  Thats the way it works for every team.  No GM operates in a vacuum.  
    Posted by SpacemanEephus


    True, althoough I see Valentine as having much more input than Francona had with Theo.
    With next to diametrically opposing views on how to build a winning team, BC and BV could be doing a lot of head-butting.
     
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  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    In Response to Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over:
    In Response to Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over : True, althoough I see Valentine as having much more input than Francona had with Theo. With next to diametrically opposing views on how to build a winning team, BC and BV could be doing a lot of head-butting.
    Posted by Alibiike


    Why do say they have next to diametrically opposing views on how to build a winning team?
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    In Response to Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over:
    The Valentine hire makes the Red Sox less likeable. Wait until the first five game losing streak, when he starts publicly ripping players. You guys that think Valentine is going to implement some sort of military discipline in the clubhouse and everyone will fall in line like scared teenagers are in for a surprise.
    Posted by davetheknave


    Dave, this has been my unshakable fear with Bobby V.  We shall see.  
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Soxdog67. Show Soxdog67's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    In Response to Survey: Bobby V takes over:
    Good morning, campers! Bobby Valentine (aka BV) is to be the new manager for BOS. Nice move. When his name surfaced in October, I had a visceral reaction similar to gastro-enteritis.  (Look it up! as Casey Stengel used to say.)  I had seen Bobby manager the Amazin' NYM here in NYC around the turn of the century and wanted no part of that for BOS. But this has, for me, become a shrewd (and perhaps cynical) move on the part of The Trio.    First, BOS gets an experienced manager that has actually taken a team to the WS (NYM 2000).  (At this moment, I am supposed to jump for joy. Notice that I remains seated.) Second, BOS gets a Mitt-Romney-type who will do whatever the Trio says in order to get a winner. Third, BV will be a lightning rod to asbsorb the attention that would have gone to the players for their beer-and-chicken binges.  As Peter Abraham notes, management knows this and it will help to keep that consecutive-sellout streak alive.  And with Dice-K down for most of next season, it will give BOS something to sell to the Japanese market.  (I would like to ask John Henry whether this is the case, but he is too busy rooting for his soccer club in the UK to answer an email from li'l old me.) For the record, then, my answer is 2.) Yet, in the spirit of saying, "Hey, Bobby! C'mon in and set a spell!" here is a little survey to gauge how this is going over with us peons.  
    Posted by summerof67


    Hey summer, I also answered #2 on your survey and personally feel that all the hubbub about Valentine and how he managed in the past and interacted with the GM is being blown way out of proportion.

    First off, the way the Red Sox do things, or have done things is that the manager is oftentimes directly involved in player acquisitions so the concerns about BV running to LL are moot.

    Secondly, like Francona, I think BV will have learned from some of his managerial mistakes in the past and will be less likely to repeat them here, especially while working under the microscope known as the Boston media circus.

    Let's give Bobby V a chance to straighten this ship and get the team back to it's winning ways.

    I am a firm believer that the 2011 September collapse had more to do with complacency...where the guys believed they had clinched a playoff spot when September started and could rest up for the playoffs...unfortunately they crossed the lines of how a baseball player should act along the way...and by the time they realized they were in trouble it was too late to correct it.

    I also believe that the 2012 Red Sox will be extremely motivated to restore their images and Bobby V will help that along by introducing a new level of discipline these guys can use to help them reach that goal.

    Obviously, I am optimistic that this move is a good thing for the team and organization!


     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from beavis. Show beavis's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    I give a vote of confidence to Bobby. I am suspect if he will need to get caught up with the innuendo and intricacies of the AL game. Maybe he will stress small ball from his NL days and from Japan.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from hankwilliams. Show hankwilliams's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    Red Sox ended up with too many old complacent fat veterans in the clubhouse, including 2 who were not fit for some minor league rosters. Valentine will need to creat new clubhouse leaders and find hungry players who work hard and want to be professional about their day's work. That means nearly all of the old faces who are FA do not need to be gifted new contracts. 
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from attic-dan. Show attic-dan's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

       Short term I think this a great move, a proven winner taking over that roster, I'm assuming someone will notice the bull-pen, or better yet lack there-of, only good things lie ahead. I give Bobby V. a shelf life of three years, in which time Sox can groove his replacement.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    In Response to Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over:
    In Response to Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over : Why do say they have next to diametrically opposing views on how to build a winning team?
    Posted by SpacemanEephus


    I think Valentine is more "old school", and takes the human element much more into consideration than stats, while BC puts the emphasis on numbers, much like Epstein. BC is more of a money-baller.
    Also, Francona was more a stats manager and I believe BV will manage his by gut.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Soxdog67. Show Soxdog67's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    In Response to Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over:
    In Response to Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over : I think Valentine is more "old school", and takes the human element much more into consideration than stats, while BC puts the emphasis on numbers, much like Epstein. BC is more of a money-baller. Also, Francona was more a stats manager and I believe BV will manage his by gut.
    Posted by Alibiike


    Ali, you obviously have not been reading the recent articles about Bobby V...considering that he was one of the original proponents of sabermatric analysis and uses it, in conjunction with his baseball expertise to make managerial decisions...

    ...something tells me that Francona was a saberguy the whole way and it took the heat off of some of his managerial decisions because he was following the Carmine Book of Stats to the letter!! Unfortunately for Tito, Carmine did not advise Francona when the players were crossing the lines between right and wrong!

    Expect Valentine to use a combination of discipline, fundamentals and statistical analysis to manage the team now...it should be interesting to see the differences that surface in management styles.

    The traditional baseball manager advocates will expect AGon to bunt with runners on 1st and 2nd and nobody out...since they criticized Francona repeatedly for those type of decisions..well they'll be surprised when Valentine also has his best hitters swinging away in bunt situations.

    The biggest difference I see with Valentine is that his pitchers will be allowed to throw more than 100 pitches before the bullpen starts warming up...although last year some of those supposedly great pitchers were gettng to 100 before the 5th inning and pitching from behind.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from sportsbozo1. Show sportsbozo1's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    After watching Tito sleep on his perch and spit seeds in the dugout for the last 3 years Bobby should be a refreshing change. Here comes Groucho!
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from beavis. Show beavis's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    bobby_valentine_signature_final.jpgBobby has been influence by Tommy Lasorda -which is not a bad thing.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    In Response to Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over:
    In Response to Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over : I think Valentine is more "old school", and takes the human element much more into consideration than stats, while BC puts the emphasis on numbers, much like Epstein. BC is more of a money-baller. Also, Francona was more a stats manager and I believe BV will manage his by gut.
    Posted by Alibiike


    You should read more on Cherrington and Valentine.  He is a money-baller, of course.  But he is also a baseball guy and actually differed with Theo in many instances because he factors in character/make-up/passion very highly into the equation.  Conversely, Valentine may be a "human element" guy, but he was one of the first number-cruncher managers in the modern way.  While he is certainly a baseball man who will go to his instincts often, he is far from just managing by his gut.  He is a stat man through and through.  these guys are not as diametrically opposed as you think they are.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from beavis. Show beavis's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    What is the WAR ON BobbyV?

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from summerof67. Show summerof67's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    In Response to Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over:
    In Response to Survey: Bobby V takes over : Summer, I agree with almost everything you say here, except the Mitt Romney part.  Bobby V. is anything but a waffling yes man with zero personality.
    Posted by SpacemanEephus


    Thanks, Space.  This is just an impression I have of BV lately.  He seems to have wanted the job too much for my taste, which led to my Mitt-Romney analogy. 

    I could be wrong.  But, as with so many other things, we shall see over time.

    Thanks for the post.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from summerof67. Show summerof67's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    Hey, Dog! Thanks for the post.  I think on balance BV will be okay, but with a fiery personality etc. I only see him sticking around for three years, four tops.

    He has the potential to wear out his welcome really fast, though.

    Agree with you and the other posters on the idea that this is a move to shake the complacency out of the team that we have.

    It'll be quite a ride!!  Looking forward to it.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from jete02fan. Show jete02fan's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    In Response to Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over:
    In Response to Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over : Dave, this has been my unshakable fear with Bobby V.  We shall see.  
    Posted by SpacemanEephus
    hey Space, i do think during those times, he will be able to direct the media's heat onto himself...though that runs the danger of constant clashes, Valentine is known to dig in when taking on critics.. 
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over

    In Response to Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over:
    In Response to Re: Survey: Bobby V takes over : hey Space, i do think during those times, he will be able to direct the media's heat onto himself...though that runs the danger of constant clashes, Valentine is known to dig in when taking on critics.. 
    Posted by jete02fan


    Yeah jete, if he uses his abundance of fire energy to deflect from the players, as Francona used his abundance of water energy to do the same, then it will really work.  The fear comes from him actually hanging his players out to dry in the media.  This could be problematic.  but, i have a little faith in the guy.  he knows the pressure cooker he is stepping into.  And, I have to think that his experience in japan tempered him for the better.  
     
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