Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    What would be the point of that? If a WS team can't draw certainly the Marlins stopping in for a game here in there won't matter.

    That said, it is a neat idea.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    You are probably right, but I think more people per game might show up to 30 games than 81, and same with in Miami.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    I speak truth - not a bad idea.  Cool

    I doubt Dade County or whichever county it is would like to see their new stadium un-played in for 1/3 of the year.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    Yes, it doesn't really maximize stadium usage, but look how much football can make with just a couple hadnful of home games each year.

    North Carolina is a hotbed of baseball. There are so many minor league teams there; it is hard to count them all. TB should move there.

    I'd also love to see a team in Hawaii, but I'm not sure there's enough people there and  travel costs would be prohibitive.

    More likey, we might see a team move to...

    Portland/Vancouver
    San Antonio/Austin
    Sacremento or San Jose
    Memphis/Nashville
    Indianapolis 
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    In Response to Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5:
    [QUOTE]Moon provided intelligence with stats, facts and polite appropriate conversations. Softy is baiting someone with a thread meant to start conflict in his normal mean-spirited and angry way, spreading his misery and hating on posters/sox fans and players
    Posted by rameakap[/QUOTE]

    The only reason Softy has gone into  overdrive with regards to harping on Moon's TB prediction is to cover up / obfuscate the embarrassment over his take on Ellsbury; speaking of, where is he?
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    In Response to Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5:
    [QUOTE]Moonslow is obviously a stealth mod, locking his own old thread. Season not over, Rays still in it, so I'm going to repost his thread. Rays are currently 10 LC out and 3rd place in the WC, and 11 LC out of the East division. Tampa Bay Is Not Going Away: Part V posted at 7/15/2011 11:04 PM EDT www.boston.com/community/persona.html?UID=6ca1d4ce1f944561017c844176cf2177&plckUserId=6ca1d4ce1f944561017c844176cf2177 " /> moonslav59 Posts: 17557 First: 9/27/2005 Last: 8/3/2011 Good pitching wins games. Tampa has very good pitching. Tampa Bay is not going away anytime soon. Only 2 AL teams have less losses (Bos & NYY). Only 3 NL teams have less losses (Phil, SF & Atl). Starters with 5+ starts: Shields 8-7 2.33 0.981 WHIP Hellick. 8-7 3.21 1.148 Price 9-7 3.73 1.075 Davis 7-6 4.25 1.457 Nieman 4-4 4.53 1.416 A. Cobb 2-2 3.41 1.310 Relievers with 25+ innings in relief: Farnsworth 1.95 0.880 Peralta 4.10 1.173 J. Cruz 3.31 1.296 Russell 2.90 1.516 C. Ramos 4.05 1.350 Sox4ever
    Posted by softylaw[/QUOTE]

    Softy - shall we repost some of your older threads which predict dommsday for Elsbury.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from the___yazzer. Show the___yazzer's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    In Response to Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5:
    [QUOTE]The Ray's difference this year is timely hitting. Over the past 4 years they have been 13th in hitting 3 times and 8 once. Their pitching and defense are overall the same. They are missing the timely hitting that they got from Pena and the SBs from Crawford. As great as some profess the Rays pitching to be the RS ERA is .20 less and WHIP is .03 more. Does that mean the RS have as good a pitching staff if as some suggest the Rays have a great BP and SP?????? Let's not forget the RS play in a smalller park. Lastly maybe if the team stopped saying how bad the place is maybe fans would go. All the time you hear how bad the place is to play in, how hard it is too get to and that it is a blight compared to other cities. Well they signed a lease for 26 more years, it was built for them in a place where they and MLB agreed to. IMHO it is a far better place to watch a game from any seat as opposed to Fenway. It is also very easy to get in in and out of. I can leave for a game and get there in 45 minutes and be home within an hour of the game ending and I live 50 miles away.
    Posted by JimfromFlorida[/QUOTE]


    "they are missing the timely hitting and stolen bases from crawford."

    so are the red sox.

    and comparing that depressing hell-hole to fenway is utterly ludicrous.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    In Response to Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5:
    [QUOTE]The Ray's difference this year is timely hitting. Over the past 4 years they have been 13th in hitting 3 times and 8 once. Their pitching and defense are overall the same. They are missing the timely hitting that they got from Pena and the SBs from Crawford. As great as some profess the Rays pitching to be the RS ERA is .20 less and WHIP is .03 more. Does that mean the RS have as good a pitching staff if as some suggest the Rays have a great BP and SP?????? Let's not forget the RS play in a smalller park. Lastly maybe if the team stopped saying how bad the place is maybe fans would go. All the time you hear how bad the place is to play in, how hard it is too get to and that it is a blight compared to other cities. Well they signed a lease for 26 more years, it was built for them in a place where they and MLB agreed to. IMHO it is a far better place to watch a game from any seat as opposed to Fenway. It is also very easy to get in in and out of. I can leave for a game and get there in 45 minutes and be home within an hour of the game ending and I live 50 miles away.
    Posted by JimfromFlorida[/QUOTE]

    Jim, I too live in the area of the trop..Or as I like to refer to it as "Cowbell he!!"..
    Their owner did everything possible to bring fans in..Upped the payroll by 40mil, free parking, bring in your own food, concerts etc etc..Still you couldnt get a steady 25,000 into a 40,000 seat venue..In 2008 they were playing the Angels for best record in MLB and the LL WS drew 3000 more fans than the rays game that day...This is just NOT a baseball town..You have some loyal Rays fans here and I applaud them, but its not enough..Although i agree with you that there is not a bad seat in that place, Its like watching a game in a cave with lights...
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from ---TheBabe----------------. Show ---TheBabe----------------'s posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    In Response to Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5:
    [QUOTE]Moonslow is obviously a stealth mod, locking his own old thread. Season not over, Rays still in it, so I'm going to repost his thread. Rays are currently 10 LC out and 3rd place in the WC, and 11 LC out of the East division. Tampa Bay Is Not Going Away: Part V posted at 7/15/2011 11:04 PM EDT www.boston.com/community/persona.html?UID=6ca1d4ce1f944561017c844176cf2177&plckUserId=6ca1d4ce1f944561017c844176cf2177 "> moonslav59 Posts: 17557 First: 9/27/2005 Last: 8/3/2011 Good pitching wins games. Tampa has very good pitching. Tampa Bay is not going away anytime soon. Only 2 AL teams have less losses (Bos & NYY). Only 3 NL teams have less losses (Phil, SF & Atl). Starters with 5+ starts: Shields 8-7 2.33 0.981 WHIP Hellick. 8-7 3.21 1.148 Price 9-7 3.73 1.075 Davis 7-6 4.25 1.457 Nieman 4-4 4.53 1.416 A. Cobb 2-2 3.41 1.310 Relievers with 25+ innings in relief: Farnsworth 1.95 0.880 Peralta 4.10 1.173 J. Cruz 3.31 1.296 Russell 2.90 1.516 C. Ramos 4.05 1.350 Sox4ever

    Posted by softylaw[/QUOTE]

    Yup, they are done. I mean, it's not like any team has ever lost a 14 1/2 game August lead before....err...oh, wait.....scratch that.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from kbair. Show kbair's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    In Response to Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5 : Actually there is no way the Angels are trading Trout for more pitching or the Nats are trading Harper right now. Upton is a hard sell for them. You can only publicly chastize a player for being laxidazical so many times and get max value for him. Anybody who would have wanted Upton wasn't sending an immediate offensive upgrade to them, that would have been counter productive. It would be like the RS sending Beckett to get Velander. Where's the net gain? The Rays are a team that is in a bad market, not just small market but bad market. The fanbase has not rewarded their winning at the gate and that certainly limits their flexibility. I am not sure they outsmarted themselves as much as they did what they had to do and it just did not pan out completely. They did an amazing job of completely rebuilding the bullpen but the offense has fallen short. I would have thought the bullpen would have been the harder to sustain but  it was hard to forecast a 100 point drop in OPS for Longoria after he came off of the DL. And in light of Pena and Crawford leaving his productivity was critical to their run production. Fuld's quick start probably masked issues the delay of Jennings arrival caused them too. But I think they were quite smart not to do anything rash to try and not go away in 2011. I always took the statement that they weren't going away did not mean they'd take WC or the Division only that they'd be a factor in the race and would be a potential threat into September. It was wise of them not to make short term moves to do that.
    Posted by fivekatz[/QUOTE]


    you might be right about trout... the point that i am trying to make is that they are rich specifically where almost every other team is poor. they would be looking for a big market trade partner that has power in young hitters still under team control for the next few years... the nats are a good fit because  they are in a division where every other team has good starting pitching... they need sp to compete more than they need a hitting prospect.
    the rays live off of prospects and need another couple of good hitting prospects to compliment their excellent pitching.
    at this point they have one dangerous hitter. that is not enough to compete with the red sox and yankees. they need to use their resources to build around longoria. and the reason why time is of the essence is because of longoria's contract. they have longoria and zobrist until 2014, 2013 if they want to trade them before their contract is up. then they are gone. if they wave the flag on this season then they have two years to contend.
    this has nothng to do with attendance.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from ---TheBabe----------------. Show ---TheBabe----------------'s posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    In Response to Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5:
    [QUOTE]Half my reason I thought TB would be "in it to the end" was that I did not forsee the Yanks being this good with that staff "on paper" going into the season. I thought the AL East would beat each other up and the WC team would make it with about 91-94 wins. It looks like the WC team (NY) is headed for a 100 win year. So, bash me some more softy: I was actually wrong twice: wrong about NY (by about 8 wins) and wrong about TB (by about 4 wins).

    Posted by moonslav59[/QUOTE]

    I think you mean..... It looks like the WC team (bos) is headed for a 100 win year.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    In Response to Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5:
    [QUOTE]Toronto will be ahead of them end of this week.  Can't stand them.  Period.
    Posted by soxmeister[/QUOTE]

    An exciting game today. Toronto goes ahead by 1 in the 10th and Jennings hits an HR to tie it in the bottom of the inning. Toronto then scores 2 in the 11th and Tb matches them in the bottom. Tb wins in the bottom of the 13th.

    24 year old Desmond Jennings is off to a great start since his call up:

    Before today's big game (3 for 6 with 7 total bases) he was:

    .333/.440/.643/1.083 (5 SBs in 11 games).

    I had expected this kid to be on the team to start the year, but Sam Fuld stole his thunder to start the year.


     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from smiles-all-around. Show smiles-all-around's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    THe Rays are still in it.  Don't count them out just  yet.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    I'm sick of this subject and these threads.  moonslavs early prediction was reasonable.  The Rays have been a very competitive AL team and even went to the WS in I think 2008.  Maybe losing Garza and Crawford hurt them, I don't know. 
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    moonslav59 which player that walked this past winter do you think might have made a positive difference had they stayed with the Rays?
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    None, and that was my point. (Maybe Jason Bartlett.)

    Almost every player that walks from TB ends up in serious decline. Soriano got hurt, Crawford has been horrible, Pena is nothing special. Wheeler? Nah. Benoit? Hmmm... Balfour, Cormier...

    I'm not saying these guys aren't missed, but based on what they have done in 2011, none except for Bartlett are doing better than their replacements.

    More PAs for Joyce and Fuld have even come close to replacing the numbers Crawford had in 2010!

    Kotchman is blowing Pena's numnbers away.

    Damon? Better than Willie Aybar.

    Hellickson is better than the 2010 or 2011 Garza.

    Farnsworth is no 2010 Soriano, but has done well.

    Alex Cobb and Desmond Jennings have looked great in small sample sizes.

    Overall, the pen did worse, less timely hitting, many tough-luck close losses, and great seasons by 2 teams in the same division has combined to be too much for them to stay "in it to the end". 




     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    Of course TB may cut salary this waiver wire month or this winter, but compared to the players they lost last winter, next year doesn't look so bad:

    Free Agents:
    Damon ($5.5M)
    Peralta ($.925M)
    Kotchman ($.75M)
    J. Cruz ($.85M)

    Arb players:
    BJ Upton
    JP Howell
    Sonnanstine
    Niemann
    Rodriquez

    TB loaded up on top picks this last draft. They got some great talent for Garza and others they dealt recently. They have already seen some young players come up this year and look good. Next year will probably see some more. 
    Joyce

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    Maybe trading Garza was a mistake? THough I admit I do not even know who they received in return.

    Good points about how nearly all of the ex-players have been borderline terrible at this date.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    Matt Garza is 5-8 with the Cubs this year, but he does have a 3.78 ERA and 1.298 WHIP in the no DH league. Hellickson has done better, but Garza is better than Davis or Nieman.

    Sidenote: The Rays got these players in return for Garza:
    Sam Fuld
    Robinson Chirinos
    Brandon Guyer
    Chris Archer
    Hak-Ju Lee

    The Rays have a stacked farm system and have already seen the benefits of Hellickson, Cobb, and Fuld this season. They just brought up DesmondJennings (playing great) and Chirinos (two big hits in extra innings last night). Of the prospects still in the minors, here is how Raysprospects ranks these kids:

    (Matt Moore is #1)
    2) Hak-Ju Lee
    3) Guyer
    11) Chris Archer 

    I think TB made a great trade, especially since they had Hellickson and Alex Cobb waiting in the wings.

    Hellickson: 10-7  3.15  1.133 in 19 starts.
    Alex Cobb:  3-1   2.79   1.200 in 8 starts.

    Joyce for Crawford (.851 OPS in 2010):
    .282  15  50  (.845 OPS)

    Kotchman for Pena (.732 OPS in 2010):
    .328  5  32  (.839 OPS)

    Damon for Aybar (.654 OPS in 2010)
    .268  9  49  (.721 OPS)

    Rodriguez/Brignac for Bartlett (.675 OPS in '10)
    .682 OPS/ .453 OPS

    (Since Zobrist has moved to 2B and Rodriquez to SS, it worked out that Sam Fuld is really getting most of Bartlett's PAs. He started off hot but has faded to a .648 OPS in 303 PAs, but with 19 SBs and some awesome defense in LF.)

    Farnsworth for Soriano (3-2  1.73  0.802/ 45 saves):
    3-1  2.16  1.008 (20 saves)
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from law2009a. Show law2009a's posts

    Re: Tampa Bay is not Going Away: Part 5

    m
     

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