That's Why No One Wants To Play Here!!!

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    m
     
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    In Response to Re: That's Why No One Wants To Play Here!!!:
    [QUOTE]I look around the league and see alot of failure: Philly=fail NYY= fail Det=fail MIL=fail ATL=fail TB=fail LAA=fail This year BOS came in first in that long line of failure. It happens. Let's move on.
    Posted by emp9[/QUOTE]
    You're going to equate the Yankees and Phillies winning their division and being elimated in a 5 game series; as the same as what happened to the Sox? Or Milwaukee or Detroit coming with two games of the World Series succumbing to the same fate as the Sox? Why don't you ask the fans of Detroit or Milwaukee if they thought their teams failed? please ...........
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: That's Why No One Wants To Play Here!!! : You're going to equate the Yankees and Phillies winning their division and being elimated in a 5 game series; as the same as what happened to the Sox? Or Milwaukee or Detroit coming with two games of the World Series succumbing to the same fate as the Sox? Why don't you ask the fans of Detroit or Milwaukee if they thought their teams failed? please ...........
    Posted by pri360[/QUOTE]

    In short? Yes
     
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    Manny was a cancer, Damon did not last, Jason Bay left in a hurry, couldnt keep Beltre, how about Vmart?? Now Ortiz has one foot out the door..Texeira did not want to come to Boston.. I am glad we ended up not getting him and got AGonz anyway.... AGonz had a great year and the media is already saying he does not fit in good in Boston and should have stayed out West.. how can you win in this city????Granted Manny had some issues but talk about throwing someone under the bus... Wonder why he acted the way he did the last month.. 
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: That's Why No One Wants To Play Here!!! : You're going to equate the Yankees and Phillies winning their division and being elimated in a 5 game series; as the same as what happened to the Sox? Or Milwaukee or Detroit coming with two games of the World Series succumbing to the same fate as the Sox? Why don't you ask the fans of Detroit or Milwaukee if they thought their teams failed? please ...........
    Posted by pri360[/QUOTE]

    In the end I think what happened to the Sox and the Braves is that both teams learned the valuable lesson that pitching wins and further lent credence to the adage that you can never have enough arms...The similarities are striking both teams lost 2/5th of thier opening day starting rotations (Jurrgens & Hansen / Matusaka & Buccholz) along with the season long struggle of an underachieving vet (Lackey & Lowe) niether of whom pitched to thier resumes and due to thier lack of innings... ulitmately led to the demise and over use of the back on of thier bullpens which both imploded after a sterling season...

    I agree that no other team in the game aside from the Sox and Braves could be clasified as having a failed year. Though I still feel as though they both simply ran out of gas in September for a myriad of reason not related to Chicken and beer...Of the team that made the post season I would say that the Phillies losing in 5 games to the Cardinals and not reaching ,then winning the WS is the only one of the playoff teams that you could make a case for having failed, given the expectations. They were prohibitive favorites to win it all entering the spring with arguably the best rotation that entered the postseason since the Orioles of the 70's...The Yankees were not prohibitive favorites to win the AL east ,let alone win the WS so their ouster while it was disapointing to many Yanks fans (joy for many sox fans) was not surprising nor woud I claisfy it as failure...They simply got exposed for what they were a good regular season team was not built for the post season...A team that lacked quality and depth in the starting rotation after CC with an offense that relied too heavily on the long ball...

    From the ashes a pheonix will rise...I see no reason that the Sox can't overcome what was a lost season with a few roster tweeks and be right there again next year...As a life long Sox fan, I've already resigned myself to the fact that our team fell short and epic might not be an accurate level to describe the collapse of the team...they and the Braves have an offseason to ponder what whnet wrong and how best to fix it...the Phillies on the other hand are left to ponder what if...So to me if I am a phillies fan, I am thankful, that I already have 1 championship but I have to wonder if as comprised is this team of championship mettle....
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: That's Why No One Wants To Play Here!!! : In short? Yes
    Posted by emp9[/QUOTE]
    I don't see any of the other teams firing their manager and changing GM's. Make no mistake about it, the Sox had to give epstein permission to talk to the Cubs. Think they would have done that 4 years ago? You can believe what you want to believe, but nobody else is going to mention the other 7 teams when they talk about the biggest failure of the 2011 baseball season.
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: That's Why No One Wants To Play Here!!! : I don't see any of the other teams firing their manager and changing GM's. Make no mistake about it, the Sox had to give epstein permission to talk to the Cubs. Think they would have done that 4 years ago? You can believe what you want to believe, but nobody else is going to mention the other 7 teams when they talk about the biggest failure of the 2011 baseball season.
    Posted by pri360[/QUOTE]

    pri...that may well be the truth...but it also has little bering on the teams future...

    As for Epstein and Francona like all of the other reports that are merely symptoms of the bigger problem...Both of them are also separate issues...one is looking for career adavancement (Epstein)...the other Francona, issue was related to his contract...The team would have to have picked up both 2012 and 2013 options..something after the collapse and the subsequnet meetings that was highly unlikely to happen. Was Franconas fired? I guess you could conclude that, frankly given the teams collaspe Henry has every right to do. In the end does it really matter is he was or was not fired?..

    Epstein is making a play for Luccino's job with the Cub's as position that was not in the cards unless he waited another 3 or4 years for Luccino to retire. It's that simple he already informed Henry that he wasn't interested in an extension beyond his current deal. What made Epstein GM material is also what drives him to seek further advancement...in the end I see him as a guy that one day want's to be part of an ownership group and aspires to hold the title of CEO that's the nature of the upward mobile yuppies...
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: That's Why No One Wants To Play Here!!! : pri...that may well be the truth...but it also has little bering on the teams future... As for Epstein and Francona like all of the other reports that are merely symptoms of the bigger problem...Both of them are also separate issues...one is looking for career adavancement (Epstein)...the other Francona, issue was related to his contract...The team would have to have picked up both 2012 and 2013 options..something after the collapse and the subsequnet meetings that was highly unlikely to happen. Was Franconas fired? I guess you could conclude that, frankly given the teams collaspe Henry has every right to do. In the end does it really matter is he was or was not fired?.. Epstein is making a play for Luccino's job with the Cub's as position that was not in the cards unless he waited another 3 or4 years for Luccino to retire. It's that simple he already informed Henry that he wasn't interested in an extension beyond his current deal. What made Epstein GM material is also what drives him to seek further advancement...in the end I see him as a guy that one day want's to be part of an ownership group and aspires to hold the title of CEO that's the nature of the upward mobile yuppies...
    Posted by Beantowne[/QUOTE]Hey bean -- the context of my post was a reply to another poster who feels that all teams who did not go to the world series essentially failed, just as the Sox did. I contend that the Sox were in a class by themselves, when it came to re-evalauting their team and personnel. The Sox would not have given Epstein permission to talk to the cubs if they weren't willing to part ways. Epstein's ambition notwithsatnding -- no way they allow him to talk to another team at the end of the 2007 season.
     
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    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: That's Why No One Wants To Play Here!!! : You're going to equate the Yankees and Phillies winning their division and being elimated in a 5 game series; as the same as what happened to the Sox? Or Milwaukee or Detroit coming with two games of the World Series succumbing to the same fate as the Sox? Why don't you ask the fans of Detroit or Milwaukee if they thought their teams failed? please ...........
    Posted by pri360[/QUOTE]

    The Phillies were the favorite before the season started. They were "The Lock" to win it all. You won't deny that will you?

    The Yankees FO have always said every year they don't win the WS is a failure. So those aren't even my words. Take it from the source.

    I have talked with Yankee fans I know, before they lost to Detroit. I asked all of them, "how you gonna feel when you lose to the Tigers?" All of their responses were as follows: Surprise. Denial. Delusion. Then failure happened.  

    As a Boston fan, and a baseball fan, watching the Sox lose this season felt like every other time they've lost. To ME, personally. I don't share this collective entitlement you new Red Sox fans have. I find most of you pretty pathetic. Stop crying! Act like you've been there before.
     
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    nobody is a lock, just because people say a team is unbeatable doesn't make them stupid..... the Phillies like the Red Sox (in July) were indeed unbeatable. Why would you not make the Phillies the favorite choice to win it?

    I chose the Phillies followed by the Red Sox, Milawaukee, Texas, and New York. I don't feel stupid.
     
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    The media plain and simple is giving Red Sox Nation what it wants:  Non-stop, year round, 24 X 7 coverage of every single thing Red Sox.

    Remember folowing Matsuzaka's flight en route to Boston pre-signing? Geez.

    If enough enabled writers are looking compulsively for a story to feed the fandom masses, voila!
     
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    Francona declines golf tournament      ..........


    http://www.telegram.com/article/20111020/NEWS/110209289/1116
     

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