The Folly of Bootlickism

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: The Folly of Bootlickism

    In response to georom4's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    The powers that be spouting the conventional wisdom that Valentine was a disaster from the start have decided that an essentially last-place manager who was part of the train-wreck culture that lingers til this day like a bad penny is the BEST CHOICE to manage the team in 2013....The Sox knew that Valentine would be a disaster...Really? I did hear that the guy was not a manager for many years, that he could be colorful, and that he was pretty smart with the x's and o's, but until recently I never heard he was going to be a disaster. I never realized that the guy who coached in Japan and learned to respect their Asian culture and their players was an egomaniac who didnt care about what other people thought. Maybe I am hypersentsitive but when I think a GM takes over 2 months to find a replacement for a totally discredited manager like Francona who made a mockery out of the team concept is maybe not exactly on the ball. Furthermore, I have never heard of any GM reassuring any player on any team that the new manager would NOT be someone they didnt approve of. I would think after quitting like the Sox team did in 2011, they would've been told to shut up and come to camp in shape but I guess I just dont understand the modern team dynamics that others seem to. The final thing that makes me wonder about our GM/leadership is hiring a guy to manage but telling him who his coaches are. My guess this was done to hedge their bets with those players who felt slighted that they could not rubberstamp their next manager (Yes pedey I'm looking at you). Speaking of malcontents, until this season, I has never heard of players calling out managers, demanding meetings with owners, and texting the GM to complain about the coaching....either valentine was a monster or the inmates were use to running the asylum. This morning I read that our old pitching coach is the top candidate for 2013 manager. He is more like Francona and that's what we need. This is the samer brainthrust that still thinks that not hiring the Cubbie manager who lost over a 100 games was the catch the got away becausehe says the right things....All this reaffirms to me that this organization is more about the $$$ and pr than winning. They didn't like losing bit what they really hated was being exposed for the incompetent frauds they are. The secrecy of injury reports, the senseless shuffling of players from pawtucket to Boston, the refusal to let rookies make a mark and instead rely on journeyman retreads because they brass doesnt want to admit they blew it (Bailey, melacon, punto) were all exposed by valentine by simply NOT towing the party line. In short Valentine hurt their brand, and that pains Henry, LL, and Ben more than anything. 2012 was all about the anniversary, not winning. Any chump with a bit of baseball knowledge (like me) could have told the team that our pitchers were lousy, our team heartless, and without depth -

     

    So what is the solution? Hire someone who is a terrible manager (isnt that the argument against Valentine - His record???) but who can spout the party line and will make the whiny babies like Pedroia feel better. The conventional bootlicking wisdom? Resign Cody Ross and Papi...like these guys at this point will turn this franchise around....we are going to committ more money to a RF and DH who are essentially platoon./part time players.  The only thing that makes me hopeful was the big trade - but I dont think this signals a new shift in priorities - not after hearing all this John Farrell nonsense...back to the future I guess.  Wake me this hot stove  when we let papi walk, make a trade for an ace (which we sorely need) get a real shortstop, and tell pedroia to grow up and shut up... 

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Good post. Right on target.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: The Folly of Bootlickism

    In response to georom4's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to pike's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to snakeoil123's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    This spring when I said Valentine was a bad choice and you kept saying that he wasn't you were the bootlicker.  Not me.

    It was a good post and I respect your opinion but if anyone is a "bootlicker" it was you for insisting that the organization made a good choice with Valentine for so long.

    [/QUOTE]


     

    Was this right Georom?

    [/QUOTE]


    i liked bobby V because he was the anti-Francona...but he really wasnt...and the GM and brass made sure of that so i was way wrong about what i thought the management wanted, and what bobby v could do for the team...

    [/QUOTE]


    Lots of us were in favor of Valentine because he had a reputation of a sound fundmental manager who would set the clubhouse right. Turned out he was not a good manager at all by any measure. However, assigning any significant portion of the disastrous results this year to him rather than where it belongs is a mistake: it was the PITCHING and, to a lesser extent, the injuries. Valentine was set up for failure from the beginning and didn't help himself when he added to the problem rather than ameliorating it.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: The Folly of Bootlickism

    In response to georom4's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to Joebreidey's comment:
    [QUOTE]

     joey...i think that backtracking was caused by Ben and sox management...cmon they want a yes man...no other explanation for the fact that they want farrell now...the guy is a lousy manager with toronto....

    BV has passive-aggressive tendencies which he thinks no one will notice.  He uses this all the time, thinks he is being clever, but everyone sees through it, and that in itself is an issue.  Even before the FO forced him to backtrack on Youk, he was saying 'what did I say wrong' and pretending that he didn't really mean to stab him in the back.

    He told the press that Buchholz refused to move up his start, then said Buchholz was right.  Because he wanted to take a dig at Buchholz, but then deny it was a dig.

    Wanted to punch out a write, but hey, I was only kidding.

    Took a dig at the O's after his interview.

    Said his coaches undermined him, but wouldn't say which ones and how, thus inpugning all of them.

    [/QUOTE]


    you really think Bobby V was the problem with the team and not the managment? really?

    [/QUOTE]


    Its not "either or". There is plenty of blame to go around.

     
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  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: The Folly of Bootlickism

    In response to FenwayJimmy's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    Do you live near Fred, Pumpsie? good buddies?

    [/QUOTE]


    We live in the same state. I met him once when we took in a Sox-Giants game. We talk on the phone as well. Why do you ask?

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from traven. Show traven's posts

    Re: The Folly of Bootlickism

    It there is a silver lining to all of this...regardless of who they bring in to manage...he will have to look good because it would be very hard to not improve on this year...assuming of course that the FO really does go out and try to improve the team in a major way.

     
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  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: The Folly of Bootlickism

    In response to pumpsie-green's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to georom4's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to pike's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    In response to snakeoil123's comment:
    [QUOTE]

    This spring when I said Valentine was a bad choice and you kept saying that he wasn't you were the bootlicker.  Not me.

    It was a good post and I respect your opinion but if anyone is a "bootlicker" it was you for insisting that the organization made a good choice with Valentine for so long.

    [/QUOTE]


    he was actually quite good at the start of the season when the team was tanking....but as the season wore on, he lost the players, he lost management, and then he lost interest because he knew he was losing his job...a bad situation all the way around

     

    Was this right Georom?

    [/QUOTE]


    i liked bobby V because he was the anti-Francona...but he really wasnt...and the GM and brass made sure of that so i was way wrong about what i thought the management wanted, and what bobby v could do for the team...

    [/QUOTE]


    Lots of us were in favor of Valentine because he had a reputation of a sound fundmental manager who would set the clubhouse right. Turned out he was not a good manager at all by any measure. However, assigning any significant portion of the disastrous results this year to him rather than where it belongs is a mistake: it was the PITCHING and, to a lesser extent, the injuries. Valentine was set up for failure from the beginning and didn't help himself when he added to the problem rather than ameliorating it.

    [/QUOTE]


     
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