The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    As someone who watched Game 6 of the 1986 World Series, it is mind boggling
    to think that Buckner's name is the only one that comes up. I point to a few key points:

    1. The game was tied when he made the error. The Mets may very well have won if had fielded the ball cleanly.

    2. Calvin Schiraldi and Bob Stanley did not do their jobs.

    3. Rich Gedman should have caught the pitch by Bob Stanley that was ruled a wild pitch. That allowed runners to move up and eventually score on the Buckner ground ball.

    I only bring this up because there is a great story in the Globe today on him.

    What are your thoughts?

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    I agree.  Buckner's role in the loss was always blown out of proportion.  As you say the game was already tied.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from dgalehouse. Show dgalehouse's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    In Response to The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series:
    [QUOTE]As someone who watched Game 6 of the 1986 World Series, it is mind boggling to think that Buckner's name is the only one that comes up. I point to a few key points: 1. The game was tied when he made the error. The Mets may very well have won if had fielded the ball cleanly. 2. Calvin Schiraldi and Bob Stanley did not do their jobs. 3. Rich Gedman should have caught the pitch by Bob Stanley that was ruled a wild pitch. That allowed runners to move up and eventually score on the Buckner ground ball. I only bring this up because there is a great story in the Globe today on him. What are your thoughts?
    Posted by ADG[/QUOTE]
    I agree. The lead had already been blown before the error. Mets had all the momentum going forward.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    Yup.  Buckner still is in popular consciousness as the face of the disaster and the butt of many jokes.  But, I think most true Sox fans understand that Bill's error was just the tip of the ice berg.  Schirladi's pathetic lost baby look in his eyes from the moment the bullpen doors opened til he slunked off the mound sticks in my craw way more than Buck's error (shouldn't have even been in the game at that point anyway, that was on Mac).  
     
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    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    In Response to Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series:
    [QUOTE]I remember that year too well. What I recollect that year the most was Sept. trying to get into the Play-offs. Billy Buck carried that team at the most crucial times that month, so I had to look it up. 26 games, 22 rbi's, 8 HRS, .315 BA, .574 Slugging % I always wondered why, Stapleton wasn't brought in as a Defensive replacement, knowing Buck's foot problems that year. He played most of that season on one foot.
    Posted by bobbysu[/QUOTE]

    And, it wasn't like bringing Stapleton in as a late inning defensive replacement was some kind of 20/20 hindsight what-if.  It had become standard practice.  Mac abandoned that practice in the interest of letting Buckner be on the field for the magic moment.  Touching.  But stupid.  The history of post-season tragedy is littered with managers who abandoned the good sense that got them there.***

    *** See G. Little, October 2003
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    There is a reason why in 1990 when Buckner returned to Boston to play out the last few weeks remaining in a great career that he got a standing ovation when he was introduced onto the field. It was because the vast majority of us did not blame him or at least had forgiven him. Why we get a bad wrap as fans on this boggles me.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    In Response to Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series:
    [QUOTE]There is a reason why in 1990 when Buckner returned to Boston to play out the last few weeks remaining in a great career that he got a standing ovation when he was introduced onto the field. It was because the vast majority of us did not blame him or at least had forgiven him. Why we get a bad wrap as fans on this boggles me.
    Posted by BurritoT[/QUOTE]

    That standing O made me cry.  Such a necessary catharsis and moment of recognition.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    In Response to Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series:
    [QUOTE]I remember that year too well. What I recollect that year the most was Sept. trying to get into the Play-offs. Billy Buck carried that team at the most crucial times that month, so I had to look it up. 26 games, 22 rbi's, 8 HRS, .315 BA, .574 Slugging % I always wondered why, Stapleton wasn't brought in as a Defensive replacement, knowing Buck's foot problems that year. He played most of that season on one foot.
    Posted by bobbysu[/QUOTE]

    Stapleton was brought in for defence in Games 1, 2 and 5.  Mac didn't do it in Game 6 so Buckner would be on the field to celebrate with the team.  
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    In Response to Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series : That standing O made me cry.  Such a necessary catharsis and moment of recognition.
    Posted by SpacemanEephus[/QUOTE]

    And that was only 3.5 years after Game 6. We are good fans who always take our guys back if they want to come home.

     
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  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Thesemenarecowards. Show Thesemenarecowards's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    In Response to Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series : Stapleton was brought in for defence in Games 1, 2 and 5.  Mac didn't do it in Game 6 so Buckner would be on the field to celebrate with the team.  
    Posted by Hfxsoxnut[/QUOTE]

    Yup.  This one has always been on McNamara.

    As we saw last night, games like that or game 6 in '86 have so many twists and potentially defining moments, to latch onto 1 moment is lazy and myopic.

     Just like the Sox in '86, the Rangers could go out and win game 7 and make game 6 a foot note.....
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    That's true. I started screaming for Stapleton the minute the ball went through the legs. I had not paid attention to the non-move up until then, being caught up in what I thought was going to be the greatest night of my young life.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    Agree with what everyone has said. (Well, except for 2004Idiot, who apparently posted on the wrong thread).

    Believe it or not, I eagerly went to see "Fever Pitch." But when Jimmy Fallon's character mentioned Buckner as being part of the jinx, that struck me as completely unrealistic. No true Red Sox fan blames him.

    I remember after the '04 Series I was a sign that said, "Bill Buckner, we forgive you." Forgive him for what?!?


     
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    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    In Response to Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series:
    [QUOTE]Agree with what everyone has said. (Well, except for 2004Idiot, who apparently posted on the wrong thread). Believe it or not, I eagerly went to see "Fever Pitch." But when Jimmy Fallon's character mentioned Buckner as being part of the jinx, that struck me as completely unrealistic. No true Red Sox fan blames him. I remember after the '04 Series I was a sign that said, "Bill Buckner, we forgive you." Forgive him for what?!?
    Posted by LloydDobler[/QUOTE]

    F Jimmy Fallon.

    For my money, Revolver is their best Album. 

    Keeping an eye on the world going by my window.......taking my time.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from J-BAY. Show J-BAY's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    In Response to Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series : That standing O made me cry.  Such a necessary catharsis and moment of recognition.
    Posted by SpacemanEephus[/QUOTE]

     I cried, as am sure many did, in 2008, when he emerged from the Green Monsterto a standing ovation, in celebration of the the 2007 World Championship.

    It's was nothing short of a travesty, Buckner had to move from New England to the Midwest
     
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  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    In Response to Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series:
    [QUOTE]Agree with what everyone has said. (Well, except for 2004Idiot, who apparently posted on the wrong thread). Believe it or not, I eagerly went to see "Fever Pitch." But when Jimmy Fallon's character mentioned Buckner as being part of the jinx, that struck me as completely unrealistic. No true Red Sox fan blames him. I remember after the '04 Series I was a sign that said, "Bill Buckner, we forgive you." Forgive him for what?!?
    Posted by LloydDobler[/QUOTE]

    I have a photo taken from behind homeplate, signed by both Mookie and Buckner in my home office...It used to serve as a means of remembering not to count your chickens before they're hatched and a testment to the heartache of being a 3rd generation Sox fan where my Grandfather was the only one that had ever felt the thrill of victory...Losing that game and then ultimately the series was perhaps the single most bitter pill I had to swallow as Sox fan...I think I drank and entire bottle of jack that night...
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from YOUKILLUS20. Show YOUKILLUS20's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    In Response to Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series:
    [QUOTE]I remember that year too well. What I recollect that year the most was Sept. trying to get into the Play-offs. Billy Buck carried that team at the most crucial times that month, so I had to look it up. 26 games, 22 rbi's, 8 HRS, .315 BA, .574 Slugging % I always wondered why, Stapleton wasn't brought in as a Defensive replacement, knowing Buck's foot problems that year. He played most of that season on one foot.
    Posted by bobbysu[/QUOTE]

     In an eight game span he went 16/41 .390 with 7 HR and 16 RBI. Including consecutive 2 homer games vs Yanks. The Sox were 7-1 in that Buckner Blitzkreig. Despite the bad wheels he stole 6 bases that season, A-Gon by comparison has two, in his career!
     
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  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    Actually a good base stealer for many years... he certainly was old-school. Played on guts when his knee(s) were toast.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from jarretfromportsmouth. Show jarretfromportsmouth's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    History loves a goat...Buckner takes the heat, when some blame lies with him, but hardly all of it.  Bartman in Chicago in '03 was the same.  Sure he has blame, but how about the Cubs not making the plays on the field after that?

    It can't be that the Sox lost as a team or the Cubs lost as a team...
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from SanCap. Show SanCap's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    Mookie Wilson would have beat the throw to the bag anyway.  You can see the top of his helmet in the replay.  Buckner wasn't going to beat Mookie, and neither was the pitcher.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from hankwilliams. Show hankwilliams's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    1. The game was tied when he made the error. The Mets may very well have won if had fielded the ball cleanly.

    This is what people always forget. The Red Sox had already blown it to allow it to be tied up. The Mets were at home and, after the Mets tied it, it was overwhelmingly likely that the Mets would have won in extra innings anyway. See Cardinals v. Rangers after tie and retie, last night.

    The only salient points are:

    1. It was a managerial blunder to have Buckner in during late innings lead protection stage of the game.

    2. Buckner's era occured at a time when pobability is overwhelming that the Red Sox had already blown and lost the game.

    One of the two hack urban legends that was abusive towards a player without having any real merit to it. Buckner did not blow the 1986 WS for the Red Sox on that play. It was done before that.  
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series

    In Response to Re: The Myth of Buckner and Game 6 of the 1986 World Series:
    [QUOTE]Mookie Wilson would have beat the throw to the bag anyway.  You can see the top of his helmet in the replay.  Buckner wasn't going to beat Mookie, and neither was the pitcher.
    Posted by SanCap[/QUOTE]

    You're probably right.  If Buckner had gloved the ball, though, Knight probably couldn't have scored from second on the play.
     
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