the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from jete02fan. Show jete02fan's posts

    the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    Good morning all, this has been on my mind since watching the Sox the past couple of weeks from afar and from the past week of posts on here...let me preface by saying i'm still fairly certain the Sox will hold off the Rays and get in, with that, how they fare from there will remain to be seen...some think they will not farewell because of their current rate of play, but should they finish ahead of Tampa not having played well, there is still a bit of precedent(sp) for their chances...the 99' Yanks, 04' Cards, and 05' Chisox ..three teams that went into LDS play on the heels of some uninspired play, to advance to the WS...conversely the 07' Rox entered postseason play on an absolute tear only to get steamrolled by the Sox, now i'm not suggesting Sox fans should ignore the Sox' recent play, but just keep an open mind to the fact that once in, you never know... 2004 being exhibit A...
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from BeaconHill19. Show BeaconHill19's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    You sound more like a Red Sox fan than most "Red Sox fans" on this forum.
     
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  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from pschuller. Show pschuller's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    In Response to the spectre/stigma of "backing in":
    [QUOTE]Good morning all, this has been on my mind since watching the Sox the past couple of weeks from afar and from the past week of posts on here...let me preface by saying i'm still fairly certain the Sox will hold off the Rays and get in, with that, how they fare from there will remain to be seen...some think they will not farewell because of their current rate of play, but should they finish ahead of Tampa not having played well, there is still a bit of precedent(sp) for their chances...the 99' Yanks, 04' Cards, and 05' Chisox ..three teams that went into LDS play on the heels of some uninspired play, to advance to the WS...conversely the 07' Rox entered postseason play on an absolute tear only to get steamrolled by the Sox, now i'm not suggesting Sox fans should ignore the Sox' recent play, but just keep an open mind to the fact that once in, you never know... 2004 being exhibit A...
    Posted by jete02fan[/QUOTE]

    Whatever happens, the RS (and their fans) have to be realistic and admit that they have once again been beaten by the Yankees. The RS are now spending enough to make it a relatively level playing field with the Yankees, and over the last several years, the Yankees have continued to win the division while the Sox have either wild carded their way in (this year would definitively by BACKING In if they make it) or failed to make the playoffs at all. Seems like the Yankees have both a better GM and Manager, but any way you slice it, the RS have been beaten lately by the Yankees, and to quote Paps, "that is not acceptable"!
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from DirtyWaterLover. Show DirtyWaterLover's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    Didn't the 2000 Yankees finish the season 4-15, but went on to win the WS?
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from BeaconHill19. Show BeaconHill19's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    2011 Payrolls
    Yankees      $204 mil.
    Red Sox      $164 mil.

    Cashman has made many more bad FA acquisitions over the years than Epstein.

    Paps quote was in respect to the current losing streak not to losing out to the Yankees. How did you spin that wrongly?
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    In Response to Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in":
    [QUOTE]Didn't the 2000 Yankees finish the season 4-15, but went on to win the WS?
    Posted by DirtyWaterLover[/QUOTE]
    The 2000 World Series champion New York Yankees went 3-15 in their final 18 regular-season games:

    http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/NYY/2000-schedule-scores.shtml

    The Yankees were outscored 68-15 in losing the final seven games of the season.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    In Response to the spectre/stigma of "backing in":
    [QUOTE]Good morning all, this has been on my mind since watching the Sox the past couple of weeks from afar and from the past week of posts on here...let me preface by saying i'm still fairly certain the Sox will hold off the Rays and get in, with that, how they fare from there will remain to be seen...some think they will not farewell because of their current rate of play, but should they finish ahead of Tampa not having played well, there is still a bit of precedent(sp) for their chances...the 99' Yanks, 04' Cards, and 05' Chisox ..three teams that went into LDS play on the heels of some uninspired play, to advance to the WS...conversely the 07' Rox entered postseason play on an absolute tear only to get steamrolled by the Sox, now i'm not suggesting Sox fans should ignore the Sox' recent play, but just keep an open mind to the fact that once in, you never know... 2004 being exhibit A...
    Posted by jete02fan[/QUOTE]

    Jete,
    All is not lost and if they can manage to hold off both the Rays and the Angels as they say in the world of poker...you always have a chance with a chip and a chair....

    That said frankly  after last nights tough loss, the Sox can't back in not with six games to go and two teams with in 2 games in the loss column.

    The Rays and Angels both have 7 games to go if either runs the table... the Sox, to clinch at least a share and force a playoff have to win 4 of 6...

    At this junture it's about wins now...If they had taken care of the O's then this would all be moot...Now they have to go to Yankee stadium and then to Baltimore and if they win both series or get a total 4 wins...They're garanteed at minimum a play in game...If the Rays or Angels lose one we then if we go 3 & 3 were garanteed a play in game...lots of permutations...bottom line is win and we're in...
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from soxnewmex. Show soxnewmex's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    If they had got Buch up to speed to start come playoff time, I'd be more optimistic; but they didn't do it (over-conservative approach), and now he gets a relief role, so we have just the two starters that give us a chance of winning a game since you can't count on Bedard.  If they put Aceves in a starting role that would help, but apparently they won't. 
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from user_4411795. Show user_4411795's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    In Response to the spectre/stigma of "backing in":
    [QUOTE]Good morning all, this has been on my mind since watching the Sox the past couple of weeks from afar and from the past week of posts on here...let me preface by saying i'm still fairly certain the Sox will hold off the Rays and get in, with that, how they fare from there will remain to be seen...some think they will not farewell because of their current rate of play, but should they finish ahead of Tampa not having played well, there is still a bit of precedent(sp) for their chances...the 99' Yanks, 04' Cards, and 05' Chisox ..three teams that went into LDS play on the heels of some uninspired play, to advance to the WS...conversely the 07' Rox entered postseason play on an absolute tear only to get steamrolled by the Sox, now i'm not suggesting Sox fans should ignore the Sox' recent play, but just keep an open mind to the fact that once in, you never know... 2004 being exhibit A...
    Posted by jete02fan[/QUOTE]

    Jete I don't think the 99 Yanks backed in maybe 2000.....regardless it can be done though I don't see the 2011 Sox winning it all, I still think the will make the playoffs.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from J-BAY. Show J-BAY's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

     Great post Jete. I'm not sure any team "backs in" after 162 games.  just get in and it's a new ballgame.

    Congratulations on the winning the ALE.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    In Response to Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in":
    [QUOTE]In Response to the spectre/stigma of "backing in" : Whatever happens, the RS (and their fans) have to be realistic and admit that they have once again been beaten by the Yankees. The RS are now spending enough to make it a relatively level playing field with the Yankees, and over the last several years, the Yankees have continued to win the division while the Sox have either wild carded their way in (this year would definitively by BACKING In if they make it) or failed to make the playoffs at all. Seems like the Yankees have both a better GM and Manager, but any way you slice it, the RS have been beaten lately by the Yankees, and to quote Paps, "that is not acceptable"!
    Posted by pschuller[/QUOTE]

    Hey pschuller,

    The Yanks have also been beaten by the Rays too and since 2008 4 years all three have missed the playoffs at least once...

    Too me the biggest question I have is why have we not been able to field a healthy team in late september since 2007?
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from pschuller. Show pschuller's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    Too me the biggest question I have is why have we not been able to field a healthy team in late september since 2007?

    Beantowne, this is a very fair question, but since none of us really understands why some teams suffer such streaks and some not, it seems pointless to get into it. On the other hand, if an investigation revealed that the Sox misfortunes were generated by lax conditioning, then heads should roll, but again you and I are not in a position to know that.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from pschuller. Show pschuller's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    Paps quote was in respect to the current losing streak not to losing out to the Yankees. How did you spin that wrongly?       

    BeaconHill, I see that you continue to misunderstand my points, which I suspect emanates from your basic predilection to always take issue with what I say. If you want to nitpick, Paps' quote was actually related to his failure to execute on an 0-2 count, but that is not the point either. I was merely introducing the notion that at least one player has the ambition that some things are "unacceptable", and I was actually having fun with Jete by suggesting that we RS fans think it's "unacceptable" to keep losing the division title to the Yankees. (And BTW, you might want to try poking a little fun from time to time, instead of just counterattacking.)                           
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from Kamdog. Show Kamdog's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    In is In.  The only real difference between winning the last game yourself, or getting in by the other team losing,  is the after party.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hammah29r2. Show Hammah29r2's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    www.boston.com/community/persona.html?UID=880b2b3b648993f6f6a5834badc61e63&plckUserId=880b2b3b648993f6f6a5834badc61e63">
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    You sound more like a Red Sox fan than most "Red Sox fans" on this forum


    not THIS red sox fan. I'm in this to the end. and we're still gonna make the post season.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from WilcyMoore. Show WilcyMoore's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    In Response to the spectre/stigma of "backing in":
    [QUOTE]Good morning all, this has been on my mind since watching the Sox the past couple of weeks from afar and from the past week of posts on here...let me preface by saying i'm still fairly certain the Sox will hold off the Rays and get in, with that, how they fare from there will remain to be seen...some think they will not farewell because of their current rate of play, but should they finish ahead of Tampa not having played well, there is still a bit of precedent(sp) for their chances...the 99' Yanks, 04' Cards, and 05' Chisox ..three teams that went into LDS play on the heels of some uninspired play, to advance to the WS...conversely the 07' Rox entered postseason play on an absolute tear only to get steamrolled by the Sox, now i'm not suggesting Sox fans should ignore the Sox' recent play, but just keep an open mind to the fact that once in, you never know... 2004 being exhibit A...
    Posted by jete02fan[/QUOTE]  Actually the 2000 Yankees are a very good example of a team which backed into the postseason, played lousy baseball down the stretch, were not even in the top 6 or 7 teams in all of baseball after the regular season, but managed to win a WS. 

    Anything can and often does happen in October and that has been the case over the past decade.  Don't think anyone in their right mind expected the WS matchup we had last year (Giants and Rangers) and I think it's very fair to view the 2002 Angels, 2003 Marlins, the 2004 Red Sox, the 2005 White Sox, the 2006 Cards, the 2007 Rockies and the 2008 Rays as unlikely pennant winners.

    All it takes to win a few games here and there is a good amount of luck, a few position players to get hot and couple of starters to simply do their jobs and keep their team in games.   Baseball is the most unpredictable of all of the major sports for good reason.   
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    In Response to Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in":
    [QUOTE]Too me the biggest question I have is why have we not been able to field a healthy team in late september since 2007? Beantowne, this is a very fair question, but since none of us really understands why some teams suffer such streaks and some not, it seems pointless to get into it. On the other hand, if an investigation revealed that the Sox misfortunes were generated by lax conditioning, then heads should roll, but again you and I are not in a position to know that.
    Posted by pschuller[/QUOTE]

    Or perhaps it is not a coincidence and in fact is a by product of the new adjusted norms sans the use of steriods...2008 was the first year of the new drug testing policy implemented by MLB? Which was forced upon Selig and Fuhr after the release of the mitchell report and the dog and pony show put on by congress that winter...hmmm That year we saw Lowell & Beckett both suffer debilitaitng injuries in Septmeber? Beckett hasn't been the same pitcher since...We also witnessed a dramatic drop in Ortiz and Variteks production and Youk hasn't been able to play 150 games and stay ion the lineup either...Coincidence? Hardly...

    So here's the factual challenges that face the Red Sox today...It's all about pitching...the two clubs that are chasing us down have arguablly the best two staffs in the AL and both have also gotton contribution from the farm down the stretch...we haven't...

    Our staff aside from Beckett and Lester (after losing Matsuska and then Buccholz) we've gotton little from our 3-4-5 starters...sorry to say but in September both of them (beckett and Lester) have been "ordinary" neither have been stoppers....Fact we've gotton 1 QS in September which means that we're either getting waxed or our guys have failed to go 6 full...When 3/5th of your rotation has been a mess all year it's tough to win....Becasue of that we've been forced to overuse the pen and we're now seeing the downside of guys pitching on fumes...

    >Bedard: to little too late and unfortunately his rep for not being able to stay on the field came to fruition. His next start is a must win game...

    />Lackey has been awful all year...no news there...the question that needs to be answered is why...Is it due to injury or is something else amiss. Becasue he's a better pitcher than he's shown since pulling on a Sox Jersey...My theory is it's related to his elbow...He no longer throws that sharp breaking slider and is now using the cutter which is easier on the elbow...His next start is a must win game

    >Wakefield; has been way overused out of nessecity...his results have mirroed Lackey's both of them have taxed the pen and have given us little sine the AS break...

    >Miller; sorry but the kid's pitched himself back on to the FA market. What might have been wasn't...

    >Weiland; In the spring he was mentioned a posible September callup for the pen. To bad the kid wasn't ready it would ahve been a great story...

    >Doubront; was supposed to be our #6 organizational depth, but came to spring training out of shape (reported by Gammons) and hurt himself in the spring and hasn't been the the same guy all year. 2010 version of Doubront might have made all the difference. If inded he showed up out of shape...then he doesn't in mind derserve to be on a MLB roster...

    So while the injuries to Youk and the under performance of Drew and Craford haven't helped us...End of the day it has been our pitching that has fallen short...we've given away 4 games with the lead with Aceves, Bard or Papelbon on the bump...in the last two weeks...
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from jete02fan. Show jete02fan's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    In Response to Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in":
    [QUOTE]In Response to the spectre/stigma of "backing in" : Jete I don't think the 99 Yanks backed in maybe 2000.....regardless it can be done though I don't see the 2011 Sox winning it all, I still think the will make the playoffs.
    Posted by MikeintheBronx[/QUOTE] hey mike, i agree.. i cited them more for a bit of a stumble than a back in...although it was in the ALCS where they started to roll...
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from SFBostonFan. Show SFBostonFan's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    I believe the coming 3 game series has arrived at a most auspicious time and in Yankee Stadium too as it gives out team a chance to redeem itself for the pathetic performance in September and maybe restore some faith in the fans, many who have abandoned ship waiting for next year.


    Does anyone really care we didn't win the division with the real plum being home field advantage where we really haven’t had one lately with opponents putting more dents in the Green Monster than us.  I think going on the road for our last 6 games may be a blessing !!!   Let’s be positive going into NY.  We have beaten them 11-4 this year and the last series in Fenway when they won 2 out of 3, we could have swept but lacked clutch hits !  And, Sabathia whom we had beaten in 4 previous games this year did not dominate in his victory in the last game.  If we can win 2 out of 3 in NY, and you know they can’t be as motivated as us having clinched the division, they could be questioning themselves if, when, hopefully we meet in the playoffs.  And, ya know, 2 out of 3…don’t want to be greedy and say a sweep by us…would bring the fans back aboard when, according to numerous posts, feel we don’t deserve to be in the playoffs. And, if Yankees sweep us or even win 2 or of 3, I’ll be in the same camp “we don’t deserve to be in the playoffs, backing in especially, if the Rays & Angels can’t win the majority of their games.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from jete02fan. Show jete02fan's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    great posts everybody, i hope noone thinks i'm accusing the Sox of backing in, my thread title is more in line of the labeling of teams so called having "backed in" by the sports talkies, media and such, just pointing out that teams have thrived in the face of said labeling...
     
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  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    In Response to Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in":
    [QUOTE]great posts everybody, i hope noone thinks i'm accusing the Sox of backing in, my thread title is more in line of the labeling of teams so called having "backed in" by the sports talkies, media and such, just pointing out that teams have thrived in the face of said labeling...
    Posted by jete02fan[/QUOTE]

    Hey Jete,
    No issues...Personally I don't care how they get in but frankly I just don't have a great amount of confidence that we can hold off both the Rays and the Angels....

    As for the stigma of backing in...I can garantee you that the players and coaches couldn't careless about a media created stigma that somehow your less worthy by not winning your way in...Just asked Rex Ryan...
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

    Re: the spectre/stigma of "backing in"

    Rex Ryan and the Jets is a great analogy. I am sure they didn't mind backing their way into the Conference championship game.

    I just will never understand fans who want to jump off the train before the seaosn has ended.
     
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