Theo haters may get their wish

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from susan250. Show susan250's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    I agree with the posters that Theo may be interested in the Chicago position just to get an opportunity to help them win the World Series.  If this happened he would be highly regarded and considered one of the best.  It would be a great accomplishment for anyone to help two teams win a World Series who hadn't won in close to 100 years/over 100 years. 
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    In Response to Theo haters may get their wish:
    [QUOTE]Buster Olney is reporting on espn.com that the Cubs may have an interest in Epstein becoming GM. What do you think?
    Posted by davetheknave[/QUOTE]

    I would think the Cubs may finally be getting a clue, unfortunately the chances of that ever happening are slim to none unless Theo wants a new challenge in his life.  My bet is he could probably turn the Cubs around in less than five years and contend for a title if he was given enough freedom.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from theYAZZER. Show theYAZZER's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    In Response to Re: Theo haters may get their wish:
    [QUOTE]I agree with the posters that Theo may be interested in the Chicago position just to get an opportunity to help them win the World Series.  If this happened he would be highly regarded and considered one of the best.  It would be a great accomplishment for anyone to help two teams win a World Series who hadn't won in close to 100 years/over 100 years. 
    Posted by susan250[/QUOTE]

    that's the spirit susan; join me in wishing that theo takes the cubs' job.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    In Response to Re: Theo haters may get their wish:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Theo haters may get their wish : after signing drew, slackey, and crawford, you still want to know why? hey lloyd, LONDON'S CALLING; you'd better answer.
    Posted by theYAZZER[/QUOTE]
    He also signed Ortiz, Gonzalez, Aceves, Schilling, Salty, and others I'm probably forgetting. That's the thing about signings ... some work out, others not so much. I was thrilled when they signed Crawford, and I'm not ready to bury him yet.
    But you didn't answer my question: How do you explain this fantastic eight-year run, which didn't happen until Theo became GM and Tito became manager?
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    2 WS championships
    3 ALCS
    6 playoffs
    8 years

    yeah, lets get rid of this dog.


     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    In Response to Re: Theo haters may get their wish:
    [QUOTE]I think if Theo went elsewhere we would at least get a look at just how much he has done for the team. I mean, we didn't appreciate Duquette until a 2004 team stocked mainly with his players pulled off a great playoff run, and he didn't have Henry's money to play around with. I like Theo, don't get me wrong, but I think he is highly over-rated and many others could do what he's done given a rich owner and all the resources available to him.
    Posted by ZILLAGOD[/QUOTE]

    In some respects, Duquette did more with less, he gave Manny an unheard of 160 mil for 8 years (gee, 142 for 7 for Craw), you tell me what was a bargain (2 WS titles). That was the only time that the Sox previous ownership opened up the money bags. Most of the time he worked under a far lower bank than Theo has ever had, and Duke had to go cost-cut to find bargains and it resulted in a lot of 3rd-rate SPs and relievers. But still Duke's guys are around--Varitek, Wakefield--and that to me tells me that had Duke had Theo's bank, the Sox might have won sooner than 2004.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from rls5980. Show rls5980's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    I doubt he walks, if he does he'd get a small fortune. You'd need another fortune to rebuild the Cubbies from top to bottom, ownership to farm system.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from theYAZZER. Show theYAZZER's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    In Response to Re: Theo haters may get their wish:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Theo haters may get their wish : He also signed Ortiz, Gonzalez, Aceves, Schilling, Salty, and others I'm probably forgetting. That's the thing about signings ... some work out, others not so much. I was thrilled when they signed Crawford, and I'm not ready to bury him yet. But you didn't answer my question: How do you explain this fantastic eight-year run, which didn't happen until Theo became GM and Tito became manager?
    Posted by LloydDobler[/QUOTE]

    i'll give the credit to john henry and lucchino.
    tito is average at best as a field manager and theo has prevented the sox from being a great team, instead of a good one.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from theYAZZER. Show theYAZZER's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    In Response to Re: Theo haters may get their wish:
    [QUOTE]2 WS championships 3 ALCS 6 playoffs 8 years yeah, lets get rid of this dog.
    Posted by SpacemanEephus[/QUOTE]


    arf arf, ruf ruf, yip yip.

    no, keep the dog; just get rid of theo the clown.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    In Response to Theo haters may get their wish:
    [QUOTE]Buster Olney is reporting on espn.com that the Cubs may have an interest in Epstein becoming GM. What do you think?
    Posted by davetheknave[/QUOTE]

    And?  Any GM would be interested in the Cubs job and the Cubs are interested in any GM that utilizes Sabermetrics tools, draft analysis, etc. Jim Hendry was a dinosour here in Chicago.

    Top rumored candidates include:

    Rick Hahn  (White Sox assistant GM)
    Brian Cashman
    Andrew Friedman
    Theo Epstien
    Josh Bynes
    Ben Cherrington

    All of these names have been in the Chicago papers since Hendry's firing last week.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    And I forgot Kim Ng from MLB's office.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from theYAZZER. Show theYAZZER's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    In Response to Re: Theo haters may get their wish:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Theo haters may get their wish : And?  Any GM would be interested in the Cubs job and the Cubs are interested in any GM that utilizes Sabermetrics tools, draft analysis, etc. Jim Hendry was a dinosour here in Chicago. Top rumored candidates include: Rick Hahn  (White Sox assistant GM) Brian Cashman Andrew Friedman Theo Epstien Josh Bynes Ben Cherrington All of these names have been in the Chicago papers since Hendry's firing last week.
    Posted by ADG[/QUOTE]


    other than theo being a 'tool,' i wonder what tools theo employed for his FA signings? i'm guessing the only tool he used was the back of a baseball card.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from soxmeister. Show soxmeister's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    Man ... tough crowd ... Theo won't walk, Henry won't give the Cubs permission to talk to him when he is under contract.   

    Cashman would fit right into the Sox organization ... and will concentrate on developing young players.    Sounds like a good change if it all happens.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from futbal. Show futbal's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    I like Theo, his results are what they are - 2 WS is an accomplishment for any general manager, under andy circumstances. That said, what if instead of taking draft picks as compensation for letting Theo out of his contract (as the Patriots did to get Belechick) to join the Cubs, instead, the Cubs had to agree to assume Carl Crawford's contract. Would that interest any one -- (not adressing the "haters" per se)...
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from splendidsplinterteddyballgame. Show splendidsplinterteddyballgame's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    Theo is under contract to Boston so the Cubs couldn't just sign him up.  If I were the Sox I would offer Theo to the Cubs for Starlin Castro, Sean Marshall and Geovanny Soto.  Then I would promote Ben Cherington to G.M.  I think the Sox would make out fine in that scenario. 
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoUconn13. Show GoUconn13's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    Is that a tampering by the Cubs since Theo is still under contract with the Red Sox???


     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from rharts9. Show rharts9's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    This Theo bashing drives me crazy.  The whole argument against him is that every FA signing hasn't been perfect.  The team doesn't win a championship for 86 years, but you believe that the GM who has won two of them in the past 7 years is crap.  Such perspective blames a leader for every problem, but does not give him any credit for the successes.  The Sox have won at least 90 games almost every year he has been here, have always been a least .500, and they have made the playoffs for all but two seasons.  How about the Ortiz signing?  Say what you want about Drew, but overall numbers put him within the top 5 right fielders over the time he has been with us, not to mention he had some key moments in the 2007 playoffs.  He is also a very good fielder who gets perfect jumps on balls, and he was the only decent replacement of Trot Nixon at the time.

    What some people don't understand is that nothing is guarenteed in baseball.  Most of the time, the top free agents are 30 years old or older, which means that they are already on the down-slope of their prime or past it.  Much of the money that they get is for showing that they already have been a successful player; they are not prospects.  You either overpay for just about any top free agent that you get, or you simply don't sign any free agents.  Yes, what seems like a good signing at the time may not end up working out, but that's baseball.  Now let's look at development... Pedroia, Ellsbury, Lester, Papelbon, Buchholz, Bard, and (I believe) Youkilis were all drafted by Theo.  Let's think about how great of a core these players are before we start trashing him.  Think of some non-moves - letting Pedro go at the right time, finally getting rid of Manny before the awful years and steroid scandal, not trading Lester for Santana... to name a few.  How about the Curt Schilling trade during Thanksgiving?  Could anyone else have pulled that off?  The guy made a successful pitch for joining the team at the dinner table during a holiday!  He drafted Hanley Ramirez, which led to Beckett and Lowell.  Some bullpens haven't been good, but two great patched together bullpens won the Sox two rings, and this year's has been doing quite well.  You blame Theo for 4 bad months of Crawford, but you don't thank him for 4 great months of Gonzalez (the prospects needed to get him? ... drafted and developed under Theo).  Theo wanted Gonzalez before he even played a major league game.  He has also wanted Salty for a few years, and people were quick to trash him (as they were quick to trash Pedey his first couple months), but now he has been a solid, young catcher. 

    Then in the same posting thread, people like to say how good of a job Cashman has done.  Yeah, the Yankees haven't had any free agent busts.. right?  There's GMs out there who have PERFECT track records.. right?

    One last thing... how many Super Bowls have the Pats won without Pioli?

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    In Response to Re: Theo haters may get their wish:
    [QUOTE]Is that a tampering by the Cubs since Theo is still under contract with the Red Sox???
    Posted by GoUconn13[/QUOTE]
    Media speculation is not tampering.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from theYAZZER. Show theYAZZER's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    In Response to Re: Theo haters may get their wish:
    [QUOTE]I like Theo, his results are what they are - 2 WS is an accomplishment for any general manager, under andy circumstances. That said, what if instead of taking draft picks as compensation for letting Theo out of his contract (as the Patriots did to get Belechick) to join the Cubs, instead, the Cubs had to agree to assume Carl Crawford's contract. Would that interest any one -- (not adressing the "haters" per se)...
    Posted by futbal[/QUOTE]

    win/win! i think john henry would hoot for joy if that was a deal maker.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from theYAZZER. Show theYAZZER's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    In Response to Re: Theo haters may get their wish:
    [QUOTE]Theo is under contract to Boston so the Cubs couldn't just sign him up.  If I were the Sox I would offer Theo to the Cubs for Starlin Castro, Sean Marshall and Geovanny Soto.  Then I would promote Ben Cherington to G.M.  I think the Sox would make out fine in that scenario. 
    Posted by splendidsplinterteddyballgame[/QUOTE]

    the cubs are without a GM; i'm sure they still have a brain in the front office.
    you overvalue theo more than he overvalues himself.

    just be happy if he's gone.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from splendidsplinterteddyballgame. Show splendidsplinterteddyballgame's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    In Response to Re: Theo haters may get their wish:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Theo haters may get their wish : the cubs are without a GM; i'm sure they still have a brain in the front office. you overvalue theo more than he overvalues himself. just be happy if he's gone.
    Posted by theYAZZER[/QUOTE] I was saying what Sox should offer, not what Cubs would do.  Cubs don't have any brains in their front office: they signed Milton Bradley, Soriano, Zambrano, Fukedome to huge contracts and haven't won since 1908.  They might be dumb enough to do it.  And, I don't want Theo to leave.  He has helped the Sox win two WS and be good every year.  
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    what dannyc said and a few others said are 100% correct.

    Theo is young and looking for a legacy - getting stiff off his beantown legend is not the end and be all imo...i bet this story has serious legs..especially if the sox win it again...the cubbies would give him the moon and generate serious interest in the windy city
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from theYAZZER. Show theYAZZER's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    In Response to Re: Theo haters may get their wish:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Theo haters may get their wish : I was saying what Sox should offer, not what Cubs would do.  Cubs don't have any brains in their front office: they signed Milton Bradley, Soriano, Zambrano, Fukedome to huge contracts and haven't won since 1908.  They might be dumb enough to do it.  And, I don't want Theo to leave.  He has helped the Sox win two WS and be good every year.  
    Posted by splendidsplinterteddyballgame[/QUOTE]

    that was true; the cubs had a inept GM, but they finally got rid of his butt.
    the SOX have to do the same.
    the sooner, the better.

    how many more years will this two  WS excuse go on?
    i guarantee it's not happening this year. main reason----THEO.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonTrollSpanker. Show BostonTrollSpanker's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    "i'll give the credit to john henry and lucchino.
    tito is average at best as a field manager and theo has prevented the sox from being a great team, instead of a good one."

    You might be the dumbest person to ever post on this board and that's saying a lot. The Nomar trade (by Theo) was key to the first title and Francona out-managered several elite managers, notably Joe Torre, to get that title. 

    I have some criticisms of both of them but they also get the credit for the rings, whether you give it to them or not is irrelevant. I think the phrase you lack is "good enough," as in "good enough to get it done and win a title." That was enough for most of us but not for you. Ignore

    As for this:. 

    " I think he is highly over-rated 

    Perhaps Theo is overrated in general but surely not on this board, the myopic contingent hammers him all the time, so your criticisms are hardly radical here. 

    and many others could do what he's done"

    You could say that about virtually any aspect of human achievement. Maybe Al Gore could have been a better president than Bush, maybe McCain better than Obama. Regardless, people get the credit and the blame of whatever their legacy is in retrospect, even if they may have had some luck and good circumstances and others could have in theory done better. In sports you measure accomplishments by rings and so criticizing Theo is fair game as long as it's balanced against what he DID accomplish. Since no GM in the history of the Sox ever won a ring before Theo, it shouldn't surprise you that he gets credit for them. Doesn't mean he doesn't have shortcomings. Sports is about triumph over imperfection not the fantasy league "I need a perfect team and a GM who makes all the right moves or I'm going to whine like a baby" stuff we see in here.


     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: Theo haters may get their wish

    In Response to Re: Theo haters may get their wish:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Theo haters may get their wish : i'll give the credit to john henry and lucchino. tito is average at best as a field manager and theo has prevented the sox from being a great team, instead of a good one.
    Posted by theYAZZER[/QUOTE]
    See, this is when you look foolish.
     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share