Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/Chicago-Cubs-C-Geovany-Soto-has-torn-meniscus-051812

    The Cubs are struggling and probably won't get a better chance to rebuild than if they decide to trade Garza.  Salty, Clay, Youk, prospects?  Theo was the guy who coveted Clay and Salty to no end, I wonder if he still feels that way.

    Salty's doing pretty well and grabbing Garza may be worth going with Lav and Shoppach the remainder of the year if Matt is willing to sign an extension.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Mchampion. Show Mchampion's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    LOL....stop.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from bald-predictions. Show bald-predictions's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    Garza is overrated.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    In response to "Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching": [QUOTE]Garza is overrated. Posted by bald-predictions[/QUOTE] Considering all of the circumstances, I wouldn't trade Buchholz straight up for Garza, never mind throw in our starting catcher and some prospects...
     
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  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching:
    [QUOTE]Garza is overrated.
    Posted by bald-predictions[/QUOTE]

    Riiiiight, a proven pitcher in our division and 0.96 ERA against the Phils in four career starts.  I think most of our pitchers would be considered more overated. 

    Yankees: 4.48 ERA, 1.40 WHIP in 12 games

    Orioles: 3.03 ERA, 1.19 WHIP in 12 games

    Blue Jays: 2.14 ERA, 1.19 WHIP in 13 games

    Red Sox:
    3.63 ERA and some of his best games ever

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from zack5042. Show zack5042's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching : Riiiiight, a proven pitcher in our division and 0.96 ERA against the Phils in four career starts.  I think most of our pitchers would be considered more overated.  Yankees: 4.48 ERA, 1.40 WHIP in 12 games Orioles: 3.03 ERA, 1.19 WHIP in 12 games Blue Jays: 2.14 ERA, 1.19 WHIP in 13 games Red Sox: 3.63 ERA and some of his best games ever
    Posted by craze4sox[/QUOTE]
    Buchholz has been just as good except against the Yankees.
    Yankees: 8 games, 5.84 ERA, 1.75 WHIP
    Orioles: 10 games, 3.79 ERA, 1.38 WHIP
    Rays: 10 games, 2.48 ERA, 1.14 WHIP
    Blue Jays: 11 games, 2.58 ERA,  1.18 WHIP
    They both have pretty good stats against the ALE. So why would we trade Clay, our starting catcher, and prospects for him and his expensive contract?
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from iamme17. Show iamme17's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    nobody wants youk,clay is stinking the joint up this year and salty is salty.Forget garza or any other decent starter for this package.
     
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  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching : Garza is consistent and normally healthy, not to mention close in age.  Clay has a higher career WHIP, had one good year and then often injured which is probably why Theo and other teams probably wouldn't take him anyway.  The package would probably need to include a high level prospect or two.
    Posted by craze4sox[/QUOTE]

    Haha!...good stuff...why don't we throw in Pedroia, Ellsbury and Bard to "secure" the deal...
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching : Haha!...good stuff...why don't we throw in Pedroia, Ellsbury and Bard to "secure" the deal...
    Posted by jasko2248[/QUOTE]

    At the very least it would be interesting to see if Theo is any brighter these days.  I personally like how Garza approaches a big game.  Something we lack in our rotation.  Guys like Bard with no command can only be given so many chances like Miller last season.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Mchampion. Show Mchampion's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    The only catcher we should give up is shoppach, so we can bring up Lavarnway tp replace him and get his career moving.  Whateve we can get is fine.  Just bring up the young kid and let him get better.  
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching:
    [QUOTE]The only catcher we should give up is shoppach, so we can bring up Lavarnway tp replace him and get his career moving.  Whateve we can get is fine.  Just bring up the young kid and let him get better.  
    Posted by Mchampion[/QUOTE]

    So Lavarnway will "get better" by coming up to be a platoon player?  Interesting...
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching:
    [QUOTE]The only catcher we should give up is shoppach, so we can bring up Lavarnway tp replace him and get his career moving.  Whateve we can get is fine.  Just bring up the young kid and let him get better.  
    Posted by Mchampion[/QUOTE]

    I think thats the plan next season Mchampion but probably not until then unless Salty or Kelly go on the DL.  The problem still lies in our pitching staff and injuries like it has for years.  We may see flashes of greatness but as a whole this staff won't get us to the PS.

       
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    In Response to Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching:
    [QUOTE]http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/Chicago-Cubs-C-Geovany-Soto-has-torn-meniscus-051812 The Cubs are struggling and probably won't get a better chance to rebuild than if they decide to trade Garza.  Salty, Clay, Youk, prospects?   Theo was the guy who coveted Clay and Salty to no end, I wonder if he still feels that way. Salty's doing pretty well and grabbing Garza may be worth going with Lav and Shoppach the remainder of the year if Matt is willing to sign an extension.
    Posted by craze4sox[/QUOTE]

    You do realize you are doing nothing but reaching and rationalizing, right?
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from stan17. Show stan17's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching:
    [QUOTE]The only catcher we should give up is shoppach, so we can bring up Lavarnway tp replace him and get his career moving.  Whateve we can get is fine.  Just bring up the young kid and let him get better.  
    Posted by Mchampion[/QUOTE]

    Agree w/ this completely. Let's get him up here catching in the bigs and see how he does, it's time. 
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching : You do realize you are doing nothing but reaching and rationalizing, right?
    Posted by notin[/QUOTE]

    Doesn't eveveryone at times notin?  The bottom line is we need pitchers who can keep us in a game.  Not guys who have little command who put us behind early, or can't keep us close enough to win.  Our pen has looked better than our starting rotation. 

    ... Bard is last years Miller
    ... Clay is last years Lackey
    ... Dice will hopefully give us a spark but its tough to say
    ... Josh and Lester can't put back to back efforts together
    ... Doub gets the most credit for being much better than Weiland or Wake

    Getting our hitters back won't get us over the top with our present staff.  Just like Ross didn't make our RF better like some predicted.  Reddick was a much better all round player and much younger.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

       "TRANSFORM" That roster now !!!!!!
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    1-Theo doesn't need a catcher.  He has Soto for the next two years, unless his knee is worse than I know about.

    2-Even if Soto's knee gets worse, what does Theo care?  He's looking to re-load, not aqcquire Salty.

    3-Garza's ERA+ since 2008 is 110.  Buchholz' ERA+ since 2008 is 121.

    4-And finally, to paraphrase Ron Paul, if pitching is the prblem, how is trading away a pitcher the solution?
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching:
    [QUOTE]1-Theo doesn't need a catcher.  He has Soto for the next two years, unless his knee is worse than I know about. 2-Even if Soto's knee gets worse, what does Theo care?  He's looking to re-load, not aqcquire Salty. 3-Garza's ERA+ since 2008 is 110.  Buchholz' ERA+ since 2008 is 121. 4-And finally, to paraphrase Ron Paul, if pitching is the prblem, how is trading away a pitcher the solution?
    Posted by Joebreidey[/QUOTE]


    Joe,

    Soto isn't that good and I'm sure Theo could easily take on Saltys contract if hes still in love with the guy.  But to be truthful I'm happy with Salty if he can hit 270 or better and help the offense for now.

    Buchholz should not be in any way confused with Garza who is only "one year older" or Matts endurance over the years.   Clay has pitched 100 innings once and doesn't have the toughness or confidence Garza brings to the mound.

    Lastly, I'm not sure how you define re-load but the last time I checked Salty was younger than Soto and not exactly that expensive.   If uou think Theo is going to find a fountain of youth through trade it will begin by trading Garza not anyone from their farm or present lineup other than maybe Castro. If you feel Theo is going to rebuild the Cubbies through FA's we all know he doesn't have what it takes as a GM.

    We need a new addition in our rotation that will be there and pitch consistently more often than not whether it be Garza, or another of his type.
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching : Joe, Soto isn't that good and I'm sure Theo could easily take on Saltys contract if hes still in love with the guy.  But to be truthful I'm happy with Salty if he can hit 270 or better and help the offense for now. Buchholz should not be in any way confused with Garza who is only "one year older" or Matts endurance over the years.   Clay has pitched 100 innings once and doesn't have the toughness or confidence Garza brings to the mound. Lastly, I'm not sure how you define re-load but the last time I checked Salty was younger than Soto and not exactly that expensive.   If uou think Theo is going to find a fountain of youth through trade it will begin by trading Garza not anyone from their farm or present lineup other than maybe Castro. If you feel Theo is going to rebuild the Cubbies through FA's we all know he doesn't have what it takes as a GM. We need a new addition in our rotation that will be there and pitch consistently more often than not whether it be Garza, or another of his type.
    Posted by craze4sox[/QUOTE]

    They're both FAs in 2014, so age has no bearing.  There is really no reason for Theo to add Salty unless he was getting rid of Soto.

    I like Garza well enough, but I'm not sure how you define 'toughness' or 'confidence'.  Over the past 3+ years, Buchholz is 34-16 with a 3.62.  Garza is 35-33 with a 3.65.  That means, in 18 extra decisions, he is 1-17.

    For all of Garza's 'toughness', he still doesn't have a career .500 record.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching : They're both FAs in 2014, so age has no bearing.  There is really no reason for Theo to add Salty unless he was getting rid of Soto. I like Garza well enough, but I'm not sure how you define 'toughness' or 'confidence'.  Over the past 3+ years, Buchholz is 34-16 with a 3.62.  Garza is 35-33 with a 3.65.  That means, in 18 extra decisions, he is 1-17. For all of Garza's 'toughness', he still doesn't have a career .500 record.
    Posted by Joebreidey[/QUOTE]

    Clay has been fortunate to be on the winning side of a mediocre performance because of the offense we have, as he is again this season.  Just my preference Joe, but I would take Garza over Clay anyday in our rotation.

      
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching : Clay has been fortunate to be on the winning side of a mediocre performance because of the offense we have, as he is again this season.  Just my preference Joe, but I would take Garza over Clay anyday in our rotation.   
    Posted by craze4sox[/QUOTE]

    Buchholz hadn't pitched since last June and he is coming off back surgery.  His last 2 starts have been "encouraging" at worst.  I personally think Buchholz has better stuff than Garza, but that's obviously debatable.  Your opening post about trading Buchholz, Youk, Salty and prospects for Garza was a little crazy, though.
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching : Buchholz hadn't pitched since last June and he is coming off back surgery.  His last 2 starts have been "encouraging" at worst.  I personally think Buchholz has better stuff than Garza, but that's obviously debatable.  Your opening post about trading Buchholz, Youk, Salty and prospects for Garza was a little crazy, though.
    Posted by jasko2248[/QUOTE]

    That's about my thoughts as well.  I think Garza/Buchholz straight up in talent is a reasonable discussion, even if Buchholz has generally been better.  But then you have to consider the contract as well.  We have Buchholz fairly cheap for 2+ years, reasonable for another, and two club options.  That's a pretty good contract.  Garza is only under contract for 1+ years, and is considerably more expensive.  The health is a legitimate issue, but other than that, I think Buchholz' contract is a good bit more valuable than Garza's.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching

    In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Theo needs a catcher, we need pitching : Clay has been fortunate to be on the winning side of a mediocre performance because of the offense we have, as he is again this season.  Just my preference Joe, but I would take Garza over Clay anyday in our rotation.   
    Posted by craze4sox[/QUOTE]

    The Cubs stink, but that's just one+ years.  He didn't win an awful lot with TB either, and they were just as good as us.  We had better hitting, but they also had a much better defense and an easier park to pitch in.
     
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