Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR DEMANDS 15+ MIL PER YEAR

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    In Response to Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR DEMANDS 15+ MIL PER YEAR:
    Dustin Made a comment after his first deal, after his ROY, GG, SS award etc.. Folks asked why he didnt ask for or get more and settle for 40mm. He said something like...What can I do with 100mm that I cant do with 40? I dont need a bentley. But is my family set up for the rest of thier lives? You bet they are... I dont think he would try to break the bank...Hes a throwback who I believe would retire here if he could...
    Posted by southpaw777


    hes not going to take the same money as he has now. it would be an insult

    more importantly.
    hes our best shot at getting quality pitching

    and 
    how much longer would he continue to perform at a high level?

    they are building for the future

    so if we knew pedey could produce highly over the next 7 years (i think he begins to declne mext year or the year after) and if we could get top pitching prospects somehow without giving up anyone we need for the future without giving up pedey, maybe.

    but im goin to say the odds are not in that favor.

    i love pedey,
    but if we can improve the team more for the next 5 years, by moving on from him. im willing to go that route. 

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from expitch. Show expitch's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    Pedey will not bring a frontline pitcher. But he might bring a couple of highly-ranked pitching prospects. If the Sox intend to stockpile players like that, Pedey and Ellsbury are the only ones who might do the trick. 
    Ellsbury probably stays at least until the trade deadline next season. Right now the Sox have no one close to replacing him in center. Please do not say Kalish. The Sox might consider seeing what they could get for Pedey if the FO thinks that he can be adequately replaced from within or by another trade. That's up to the brass. 
    Needless to say, it would be reckless to declare anyone on the roster untouchable. Not this week.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    In Response to Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR DEMANDS 15+ MIL PER YEAR:
    Pedey will not bring a frontline pitcher. But he might bring a couple of highly-ranked pitching prospects. If the Sox intend to stockpile players like that, Pedey and Ellsbury are the only ones who might do the trick.  Ellsbury probably stays at least until the trade deadline next season. Right now the Sox have no one close to replacing him in center. Please do not say Kalish. The Sox might consider seeing what they could get for Pedey if the FO thinks that he can be adequately replaced from within or by another trade. That's up to the brass.  Needless to say, it would be reckless to declare anyone on the roster untouchable. Not this week.
    Posted by expitch

    good points. yes prospects better than anothr 20 mil per year longterm contract on a top pitcher. frnmakly on ells ive said many tiemes, should be sat down with 1 more time and see if he is willing to extend for reasonable $, telling him if not, we are going to trade you where it workd for us.

    pedey we could shop for up to a year. ells i would do in offseason if he wont extend.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from charliedarling. Show charliedarling's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    Pedroia's trade value will only go up for this off season if he clobbers the ball for the next six weeks and gets his average back near/over .300.

    A more Pedroia like season in 2013 will also increase his trade value either at the trade deadline or in the Winter of 2013-14.

    Right now he probably brings back a decent pitching prospect.  With a great last 35 games perhaps he brings back two decent prospects.

    BUT, with all that said, the Red Sox need him right where he is.  Yes, there can be found another second baseman who might do OK in his spot, but a team needs serious, hard working, productive leaders as well.

    Let's not continue to kill this guy about his "that is not how we do things" line from spring training.  He should not have said it in public, but he was only trying to defend one of his friends and teammates.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    In Response to Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR DEMANDS 15+ MIL PER YEAR:
    Pedroia's trade value will only go up for this off season if he clobbers the ball for the next six weeks and gets his average back near/over .300. A more Pedroia like season in 2013 will also increase his trade value either at the trade deadline or in the Winter of 2013-14. Right now he probably brings back a decent pitching prospect.  With a great last 35 games perhaps he brings back two decent prospects. BUT, with all that said, the Red Sox need him right where he is.  Yes, there can be found another second baseman who might do OK in his spot, but a team needs serious, hard working, productive leaders as well. Let's not continue to kill this guy about his "that is not how we do things" line from spring training.  He should not have said it in public, but he was only trying to defend one of his friends and teammates.
    Posted by charliedarling

    so you are down for giving him 15-18 mil for 5 years over trading him during the next year or so for pitching? and i totally agree with you about needing guys like that. he takes a beating, i think you win with pitching, so we need younger pedeys and good pitching.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from charliedarling. Show charliedarling's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    bredbru,

    i never said that i would give him 15-18 million a year.  as was mentioned earlier in the thread there is no reason to even think of paying him that much at least until his next three seasons of contractual commitment are finished.

    not sure that any second baseman is worth 15M per year at any age.  even cano is a stretch at $15 and he is a power hitting second baseman AND plays for the richest team in the league.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    In Response to Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR DEMANDS 15+ MIL PER YEAR:
    bredbru, i never said that i would give him 15-18 million a year.  as was mentioned earlier in the thread there is no reason to even think of paying him that much at least until his next three seasons of contractual commitment are finished. not sure that any second baseman is worth 15M per year at any age.  even cano is a stretch at $15 and he is a power hitting second baseman AND plays for the richest team in the league.
    Posted by charliedarling



    pedey has 2 years
    so after a  year may go to the sox about extending
    15-18 is an extimation based on cano getting much more.
    more later
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    In Response to Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR DEMANDS 15+ MIL PER YEAR:
    In Response to Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR DEMANDS 15+ MIL PER YEAR : pedey has 2 years so after a  year may go to the sox about extending 15-18 is an extimation based on cano getting much more. more later
    Posted by bredbru


    No, Pedey has 3 years of team control at a very reasonable cost.

    13:$10M, 14:$10M, 15:$11M club option ($0.5M buyout)
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    Anybody should be tradeable for a frontline starter, but that's the only reason for giving up Pedroia. 
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from tomnev. Show tomnev's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    In Response to Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR DEMANDS 15+ MIL PER YEAR:
    Anybody should be tradeable for a frontline starter, but that's the only reason for giving up Pedroia. 
    Posted by maxbialystock


    agree totally max.....trading Pedey for pitching prospects is insane....because they are exactly that....prospects, but no one is untradeable for top line pitching.....and a) how many of those guys are available....b) how many who are, make way too much money....and c) the ones who are and make reasonable dollars would take more than Pedey to get.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    Like I said, a lot of people have no problem trading Pedroia right now, as well as Lester while letting go of Ortiz. So what's left? Bostucket.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from jarretfromportsmouth. Show jarretfromportsmouth's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    In Response to Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR DEMANDS 15+ MIL PER YEAR:
    Hope he can bring someone better than a Garza.
    Posted by soxnewmex


    lol, I was thinking th same thing...if the best he can yield is Garza than they should definitely keep him.

    I'd like to see them try and extend him now before he gets close enough to free agency to take that route.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hetchinspete. Show Hetchinspete's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    In Response to Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR DEMANDS 15+ MIL PER YEAR:
    Sorry guys, I'm on the other end in thia argument.  Dustin Pedroia is the heart and soul of our team and if the team "becomes his team" when all the other old vets are done and gone his special attributes of hard nosed playing and leaving it all out on the field is something we can not do without.  Ciriaco has done very well, but keep in mind that he was a career minor leaguer and we have to be careful he may just be a flash in the pan an one year wonder.  Besides, we can play him at shortstop because Aviles is better as a utility man and Iglesias simply is a miserable hitter and we already have a weak one now playing first base in Baloney Loney, and who knows who plays LF for us next season. In my opinion unless we get a King Felix in exchange we don't move Pedey anywhere.  He is to me a career Red Sox player.
    Posted by seabeachfred



    SeasBeach, 

    I'm with you on this one. We just can't gut this team of every veteran for sake of getting another pitcher. I agree with most that this team needs pitch but if you rob the roster of a gutsy player like Pedey what's left. Any team needs a veteran leadership presence and Pedey is my choice unless it's a trade for King Felix. And that's not going to happen. Seattle has proven they want Noah's Ark in players so forget Felix ever coming to Boston. 

    As for Ciriaco, so far so good but as you say he's been a career minor leaguer. Maybe he's finally coming into his own which is fortunate timing for the Sox but he could be a one year wonder. Can't remember the player but a number of years ago the Yankees brought up a power hitter from the minors and within I believe the first month or so he hit about ten home runs. That was his whole career never to be heard from again and NYC fans probably thought they had the reincarnate of Ruth. 

    Hetch
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hetchinspete. Show Hetchinspete's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    In Response to Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR DEMANDS 15+ MIL PER YEAR:
    Let's trade Pedroia, so that the Sox can officially be Bostucket next year. What the hell, the fans don't give a hoot. They just want to send away every possible link to the last WS title and any remote chance of ever winning again in the next decade. I've never seen a group of fans so completely lost in fiscal jubilee than this Harvard-Yale bunch on this board. If you deal every All-Star and all you have left is non All-Stars and Hope-to-Bes, you can't win. You see WS titles are often bought, often store-bought and often all about your free agent signings and 04 was especially as store-bought as they come with 07 being a combo of an incredible young class and store-bought--Papelbon, Lester, Pedroia, Youkilis and Ellsbury all part of that class....Yup, TRADE THE TEAM AND KEEP THE IDIOT MANAGER!!!!!
    Posted by dannycater


    Danny, 

    I haven't read your prior posts but either you're in an awful mood this morning or you hated the trade. I'm on either side of the fence on the trade but I'm in favor of replacing Bobby V in the managerial role but keeping in on in some form of player developement as he has a good rep for working with young players. That's if he doesn't see a move within the RS as a slap in the butt. 

    I'm all for unloading salary and it is a strong argument that Agon had to go to make this trade work, but I'm pissed at all of these idiots who are now all of a sudden Agon haters. Agon obviously was not a team leader but we can win without him being so. Yes he wasn't the HR hitter we expected but he hit for average and drove in a boat load of runs and fielded a great first base. He wasn't happy here but with new management that might have changed. I'll miss him but the jury is out on the trade. Whether this trade work or not depends on the productivity of the prospects from the Dodgers and whether this front office can spend the riches noe freed up via the trade wisely. Only time will tell.  

    As for what's left, we have a decent nucleus but I'm with you, enough trades for the time being. The Sox need to focus on getting Ells signed along with Ross and Yes I know some won't agreem but Papi needs a two year deal, say 2yrs at 24mil. Start rebuilding the staffs around a rejuvinated Lester, Buch and Doubrant, pray for Dice K or I know other think I'm nuts, but Lackey or get rid of him. They need to get Aceves in one role, not a closer but long relief and spot starter as he was happy in that role and did a fine job. 

    Yes they have holes to fill but there exists a decent core of players to build around and they have decent players on the way over the next few years. They won't win right away but the fan base has to have what we usually don't have, patience. We're only a few years away. Maybe I'm being overly optimistic but that's my limited point of view. 

    Lastly the Sox need a strong managerial presenceand the entire FO and staff needs to take one from the BB book. Keep the damm press away from the bandwagon and keep team issues in house away from the evil frenzy feeding press. We'll all be a lot better off. 

    Lastly, would someone write to the Globes FO and ask to have the article "Inside the Red Sox Collapse" with Tito Francona's portrait removed. Let's move on already. 

    Hetch
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    good post, Hetch. Yeah, I'm not a fan of dumping the most highly sought out FA that the Sox desperately had to have over a Beltre-3B and Youkilis-1B corner infield. So instead, we have none of them now.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from xcaliber. Show xcaliber's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    You folks kill me. Not ONE ounce of loyalty to the team. get rid of this one trade that one. Why don't you root for the Yanks who buy every piece they need.
     
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  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from parhunter55. Show parhunter55's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    How different it might be if the Sox had resigned Beltre.

    As for Pedey for Garza, when I said Garaz-like, I was really referring to his contract status and his pedigree as a decent #3 type starter.  I in no way want to see Pedey traded for Garza and his spitoon.
     
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  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from CablesWyndBairn. Show CablesWyndBairn's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    The fun thing about this trade is reading up on all the propects involved and projecting whether they will be part of the future core or included in a trade package that yields an established pitcher. 

    The confusing thing is trying to figure out just where this team is headed.  Are they happy with the core they have and will they add to it?  Or will they move guys like Pedroia, Ellsbury or Lester and start from scratch and build from within?

    I suspect this offseason will answer a lot of questions.  If Ortiz is not re-signed or offered arbitration or if Ellsbury or other players are traded we'll have a better idea where things are headed. 
     
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  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from xdrive. Show xdrive's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    In Response to Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR DEMANDS 15+ MIL PER YEAR:
    The Sox have a decent replacement in Ciriaco.  And they have a huge hole to fill in their rotation.  If Pedroia can bring a Matt Garza type starter, even if the contract inherited is for a bit more, they have to consider it.  Starting pitching is the problem for this team.  The amount of offense they lose by switching to Ciriaco at 2b and Iglesias/Aviles at SS is not that crippling, IMO.  I have been saying this for some time now (really since Pedroia told Bobby V that "that is not how we do things around here.") and I totally agree with the article author's view on Pedroia's value going forward.  Trading now brings the most in return and mitigates the eventual cost.
    Posted by parhunter55


    i would want a lot more than Matt Garza for Pedroia
     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from xdrive. Show xdrive's posts

    Re: Think this through Instead of a Knee Jerk Reaction: article Below about Trading Pedey for Pitching, before he DECLINES OR...

    another option would be to tear up his current deal and resign him to a 6 year deal now that would take him to age 35. you would have to pay him a little more than you do now but would avoid the whole issue at age 32
     
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