THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from CablesWyndBairn. Show CablesWyndBairn's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    I said that last year was a wakeup call, and their reaction was to trade for Gonzalez and sign Crawford.  Wondering what they can do to shake things up?  The minor league pipeline is thin and I'm not sure what cheap vets they can get here to give this team a semblance of a pulse.   
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from pschuller. Show pschuller's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    In Response to THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX:
    [QUOTE]Yes, this is just what the new yankee RED SOX needed. An eye opening jolt. A real wake up call. Only the Yankees(who do it best) can buy championships. And I mean that in the nicest way(to all you yankee posters on here). The SOX have no business trying to become the Yankees. In doing so they are paying the ultimate price: failure. All that 'susposed' talent buying has bitten them in the ars over the past serveral years. It is time to do some house cleaning. Time to get back that blue collar grit. The Sox are best when they find those great hidden gems(Pedroias, Ellsburys and Youks of the baseball world). Entitlement. That is the problem. This organization got too worried about selling the product instead of producing a winning team. A team with hunger. A team willing to lay it on the line every night from game one to game 162. The Red Sox have changed over the past few years and not for the better. So, maybe this is just what they needed to get back to that winning formula. The offseason looks to be very interesting indeed.
    Posted by antiqueman1[/QUOTE]

    Thoughtful post (many are not!). I think it's an interesting notion, and basically I agree with you.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from antiqueman1. Show antiqueman1's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    Thanks pschuller. I think it starts by dumping some contracts if possible and letting some of these kids(pitchers especially) play. I respect Wake and what he has done, but it is time to let him go. Time to move on Lackey. Papi. Drew is gone. I think trading Beckett is an option. I would also try and persuade V-tek into coaching(bench or other for organization). It will be very interesting this offseason.....
     
  4. This post has been removed.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from wallyac. Show wallyac's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    In Response to THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX:
    [QUOTE]Yes, this is just what the new yankee RED SOX needed. An eye opening jolt. A real wake up call. Only the Yankees(who do it best) can buy championships. And I mean that in the nicest way(to all you yankee posters on here). The SOX have no business trying to become the Yankees. In doing so they are paying the ultimate price: failure. All that 'susposed' talent buying has bitten them in the ars over the past serveral years. It is time to do some house cleaning. Time to get back that blue collar grit. The Sox are best when they find those great hidden gems(Pedroias, Ellsburys and Youks of the baseball world). Entitlement. That is the problem. This organization got too worried about selling the product instead of producing a winning team. A team with hunger. A team willing to lay it on the line every night from game one to game 162. The Red Sox have changed over the past few years and not for the better. So, maybe this is just what they needed to get back to that winning formula. The offseason looks to be very interesting indeed.
    Posted by antiqueman1[/QUOTE]
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from small-package. Show small-package's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    yes time for austerity measures
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from wallyac. Show wallyac's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    In Response to Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX:
    [QUOTE]In Response to THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX :
    Posted by wallyac[/QUOTE]

    Sorry messed up, this was one of the few posts that makes any sense. Could have gotten two really good players for what they paid Crawford and i beleive he will bounce back next year.  They need good young arms, i love Wake and all he has done for the good of the team, but its time.  And i know this isnt going to go over well, but Youk has said he wants to end his career in Cincinatti, time to see if a good trade can be made. I dont remember the last time youk played a full  season.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from dskerr. Show dskerr's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    In Response to THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX:
    Perfectly said........

    [QUOTE]Yes, this is just what the new yankee RED SOX needed. An eye opening jolt. A real wake up call. Only the Yankees(who do it best) can buy championships. And I mean that in the nicest way(to all you yankee posters on here). The SOX have no business trying to become the Yankees. In doing so they are paying the ultimate price: failure. All that 'susposed' talent buying has bitten them in the ars over the past serveral years. It is time to do some house cleaning. Time to get back that blue collar grit. The Sox are best when they find those great hidden gems(Pedroias, Ellsburys and Youks of the baseball world). Entitlement. That is the problem. This organization got too worried about selling the product instead of producing a winning team. A team with hunger. A team willing to lay it on the line every night from game one to game 162. The Red Sox have changed over the past few years and not for the better. So, maybe this is just what they needed to get back to that winning formula. The offseason looks to be very interesting indeed.
    Posted by antiqueman1[/QUOTE]
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Veritas007. Show Veritas007's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    This is a definite correlation between player attitude and the manager. Francona during the game can only be seen:
    1) putting gum in his mouth
    2) spitting
    3) taking gum out of his mouth
    4) spitting on the steps
    5) drinking water
    6) spitting
    7) eating sunflower seeds 
    8) spitting 

    This team has no self pride. As Jim Rice kept saying during the post game show, this clubhouse needs to eliminate "the spa attitude (as he called it) and start treating this as a job as what it truly is. Too many fat cats, overweight, out of shape with zero pride.

    It was a heart wrenching loss for the fans, the players and coaching staff do not care.   
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from shuperman. Show shuperman's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    In Response to Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX:
    [QUOTE]Thanks pschuller. I think it starts by dumping some contracts if possible and letting some of these kids(pitchers especially) play. I respect Wake and what he has done, but it is time to let him go. Time to move on Lackey. Papi. Drew is gone. I think trading Beckett is an option. I would also try and persuade V-tek into coaching(bench or other for organization). It will be very interesting this offseason.....
    Posted by antiqueman1[/QUOTE]
    anti- good post but starting pitching is our problem.  what does Beckett get us anyway?  It better bring a good starting pitcher.  Wait a minute Beckett is a good starting pitcher. 
    Beckett Lester Clay Lackey will be the top 4 next year.  Trade jacoby now before he commands 20/yr.  Get Felix even if it means giving Jacoby/Clay for him.  Clay officially scares me.  Jacobys value will never be higher especially if he gets MVP.  Find a good defensive CF to replace him on the cheap(Coco PartII)
    I think this could be the biggest year ever.


    It will be fun times in Boston now.  Should be an interesting summer
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from antiqueman1. Show antiqueman1's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    In Response to Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX:
    [QUOTE]This is a definite correlation between player attitude and the manager. Francona during the game can only be seen: 1) putting gum in his mouth 2) spitting 3) taking gum out of his mouth 4) spitting on the steps 5) drinking water 6) spitting 7) eating sunflower seeds  8) spitting  This team has no self pride. As Jim Rice kept saying during the post game show, this clubhouse needs to eliminate "the spa attitude (as he called it) and start treating this as a job as what it truly is. Too many fat cats, overweight, out of shape with zero pride. It was a heart wrenching loss for the fans, the players and coaching staff do not care.   
    Posted by Veritas007[/QUOTE]

    I totally agree with the spa attitude. Time to ship that out.  Too many fat cats is right. Overweight, overpaid, out of shape players. That is what killed the SOX. No chemistry or sense of urgency. Again, it makes for a very interesting off season.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from sinjin5000. Show sinjin5000's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    Time to move on, 2011 was a mess, I hope the RS don't compound the problem by not doing some major changes.

    1. Ortiz needs to go, Move Youkilus to the DH spot, 

    2. Lackey is never going to be a great pitcher, but he can't be traded with that contract, move him to the 5th spot and leave him there.

    3. Wakefield need to hang it up, before the RS kill the 2012 season by trying to get him the 7 wins he wants.

    4. Francona needs to go, thanks for 04 and 07, but it's time. 

    5. find some hungry, productive players for 3rd , short, RF, and catcher, and I don't think you need to spend 20 mill to do it, 

    6. hope like hell that Crawford has a much better year in 2012, it was a mistake to sign him in the first place.

    7. Please no more over priced, over the hill players.

    Lastly, this one hurts, let's just hope the RS learn something from it, or it's going to continue to hurt long after 2011.

     
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from tetonman50. Show tetonman50's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

     I question what is meant by a "spa attitude".  Is there something specific that demonstrates that comment?   What I clearly saw this year was an attitude from the Front Office on down that that seemed to say, OR think:

    That losing game after game in Spring Training was no big deal because it's only spring training.  

    That losses in April or early in the year are not as important as losses later in the regular season.

    That pitchers who didn't set the world on fire last year, were suddenly going to become the best pitching staff in the AL this year.

    That when half of this supposed great pitching staff went down with injuries early in the year, the only help Francona was given was another walking wounded pitcher.

    That way too many appearances by our closer turned into nail biting adventures.

    That our very gifted line up was either scoring a dozen runs one game, getting shut out the next, or unable to find a way to even manufacture even a single run to tie up a game, and that was not setting off alarms.

    That we were losing way to many games to teams we should have been able to easily beat.

    That once again this year Francona was filling out as many get well cards, as line up cards before each game.

    That once again it seemed Theo felt his job was over once the regular season started.
    That all the Front Office and Owners seemed to be doing through all this was count their profits. At some point someone up there needed to send a Yankee owner type of message.

    And lastly that once again just winning the Wild Card and coming in second to the Yankees was OK.

    If all that adds up to a Spa Attitude then I agree...... But if fixing just half of all this in the off season gets done, then I'd say yes, this is EXACTLY what the DR ordered.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from BobinVa. Show BobinVa's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    "As Jim Rice kept saying during the post game show, this clubhouse needs to eliminate "the spa attitude (as he called it) "

    And if anyone would know what it is like being an out-of- shape player playing way past his prime to cash a big check, it is Jim Rice. 
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from cpjohn1. Show cpjohn1's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    Victor had heart!  We missed that sorely!
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from SFBostonFan. Show SFBostonFan's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    I Agree we lacked a Kevin Millar, V Martinez etc., guys with heart,  and other than Jacoby, Dustin, Marco & Aceves we had some fat cats i.e. Agon, Ortiz, Crawford.

    Although many believe it's all about pitching...I mean look what the Orioles staff did to us winning 5 out of 7 key games, as I say below, it wasn't all pitching !!!



    In addition to Crawford's pathetic performance, I'm not ecstatic too with Agon, irrespective of his respectable batting average.  Other than Ellsbury, Pedroia & even Scutaro,  our expected big bats of Ortiz & Agon did not come through in the  clutch. I would guess that at least 1/2 the games we lost in Sept, we outhit the opponents.  Even in this last game we got 11 hits (+4) to their 7 and they had 2 errors too. I would guesstimate...don't have the time or desire to research...that at least 75% of our runs came from home runs.  Despite mediocre pitching, it was the lack of CLUTCH HITTING that really did us in !!!  Lester really did  not pitch a bad game last night. Unfortunately he and Beckett can only give up 3-4 runs because we can't get 5 runs. The Yankees can survive average pitching because they can get 5-6 runs !!!  

    I recommend a playoff series between the Braves & Sox with the winner avoiding the stigma of being the bigger loser !!!







     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from RonMan. Show RonMan's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    My take:
    1.  The lineup was badly constructed, with six left handed hitters in Fenway, only one of whom (Gonzalez) can use the wall effectively.
    2.  Not one pitcher actually improved as the year went along, which indicates a major hole with the pitching coach.
    3.  Terrible base running, which sends a real message about the entire coaching staff and their ability to instill discipline during the game.
    4.  Conditioning-Except for Bard and Paps, every pitcher's body is looking like Matt Albers' body.  Overweight and overpaid is not a formula for success.
    5.  Game Management-Did you notice that every time Joe Maddon was on camera he was consulting his computer printout, his personnel notes, or his pitching coach.  When Francona was on camera he was chewing and spitting all by himself.
    6.  Crawford needs a swing makeover.  Only BJ Upton has more unnecessary movements in his swing than Crawford.
    7.  No right-handed power hitter in the outfield.  With Ellsbury in center, we need hitting in the other outfield positions, not defense.
    8.  Too many long term contracts.  I am hoping that Crawford gets a swing makeover.  He does seem to want to be successful.  Lackey is an albatross.
    9.  Where is the vaunted Minor League Pipeline that Theo supposedly created?  Did anyone except for Lavarnway come up and produce anything of long term value?  We need a complete housecleaning, starting with Theo, Tito, and the coaches.  Build around Pedroia, Ellsbury (at any cost), Lester (less fifteen pounds), Beckett (also less fifteen pounds), Bard (as is), Buchholz (as is), Gonzalez (no choice) and Crawford.  Scutaro is a solid player as is Youk, but Youk may be better at first base and create value for us elsewhere.  I would hang onto Ortiz for one more year.  Everyone else is expendable.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from william93063. Show william93063's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    In Response to Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX:
    [QUOTE]My take: 1.  The lineup was badly constructed, with six left handed hitters in Fenway, only one of whom (Gonzalez) can use the wall effectively. 2.  Not one pitcher actually improved as the year went along, which indicates a major hole with the pitching coach. 3.  Terrible base running, which sends a real message about the entire coaching staff and their ability to instill discipline during the game. 4.  Conditioning-Except for Bard and Paps, every pitcher's body is looking like Matt Albers' body.  Overweight and overpaid is not a formula for success. 5.  Game Management-Did you notice that every time Joe Maddon was on camera he was consulting his computer printout, his personnel notes, or his pitching coach.  When Francona was on camera he was chewing and spitting all by himself. 6.  Crawford needs a swing makeover.  Only BJ Upton has more unnecessary movements in his swing than Crawford. 7.  No right-handed power hitter in the outfield.  With Ellsbury in center, we need hitting in the other outfield positions, not defense. 8.  Too many long term contracts.  I am hoping that Crawford gets a swing makeover.  He does seem to want to be successful.  Lackey is an albatross. 9.  Where is the vaunted Minor League Pipeline that Theo supposedly created?  Did anyone except for Lavarnway come up and produce anything of long term value?  We need a complete housecleaning, starting with Theo, Tito, and the coaches.  Build around Pedroia, Ellsbury (at any cost), Lester (less fifteen pounds), Beckett (also less fifteen pounds), Bard (as is), Buchholz (as is), Gonzalez (no choice) and Crawford.  Scutaro is a solid player as is Youk, but Youk may be better at first base and create value for us elsewhere.  I would hang onto Ortiz for one more year.  Everyone else is expendable.
    Posted by RonMan[/QUOTE]

    Most of these criticisms are fair.  We will need to eat at least half of Lacking's albatross of a contract to get rid of him.  Frankly I don't know what team would even want him.  The talk of disconnect is squarely at his feet.  Many of the scribes and electronic media members are discussing issues with team chemistry in the clubhouse.  Once again I would bet much of this is on Lackey.  When you consider that the sox were willing to trade for Bruce Chen for today's one gamer (had it been necessary) that tells you everything about their complete lack of confidence in Mr. Lackey.
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from lquintin. Show lquintin's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    Just think if the Red Sox stayed PAT and kept Victor Martinez and Adrian Beltre
    where would be the SOX today.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from baltimorefan. Show baltimorefan's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    Karma.  enjoy
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from Thesemenarecowards. Show Thesemenarecowards's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    I've said this on other threads, to those of you who think a big shake up is coming.... enjoy the wait.  2012 rotation looks like Jon, Josh, Clay, John, Andrew Dice Miller.  Maybe an Aceves but I see him being used as a late inning guy.  Lackey is untradable and he makes to much for 3 more years for the organization to give up on now.

    There will be a new RH in RF, C will some combination of what we have, SS as well.  All other positions are filled.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from antiqueman1. Show antiqueman1's posts

    Re: THIS is just what the DOCTOR ordered for the RED SOX

    The spa attitude is more metaphorically speaking and it refers to the entire organization really(from front office to the players). The Sox just assumed by assembling this line-up,sorry, by BUYING this line-up I mean, that they were automatically entitled to the playoffs. Not so. The previous Sox teams, before deciding to become the new yankees, were all about blue collar work. Gettin dirty. Working hard. Keeping leads. Coming back in games. Sweating hard. That was Red Sox baseball. Now this new yankee Red Sox regime is all about entitlements. You can't buy entitlements, you have to earn them through hard work. Where were the smiles and laughter this year? What happened to this organization? It became a sell-out. And not that type of sell-out, but the type that just cares about selling its product. It lost sight of the team, as did the players and coaches, even THEO. This, by far, is the best thing that could have happened to this team. It will take work, but maybe this will lead them back down the road they once travelled. The road that produced and made guys like the Youks and Ellsburies and Pedroias. That is RED SOX baseball. Earning every win, not buying it.
     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share