Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.

    disagree there. it is about salary and Lackey.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from dannycater. Show dannycater's posts

    Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.

    the 82 mil invested is just not something the Sox can walk away from.
     
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    Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.

    In Response to Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.:
    The starter numbers: ERA (staff 4.03): 1) Beck  2.20 (98 IP/15 GS) 2) Miller 3.09 (11.2/2) 3) Lest   3.43 (110.1/17) 4) Buch  3.48 (82.2/14) 5) Wake 4.84 (61.1/10) 6) Dice    4.95 (36.1/7) 7) Acev   5.14 (21/4) 8) Lack    6.81 (70/12) WHIP (staff 1.270): 1) Beck  0.929 2) Lest   1.242 3) Wake 1.288 4) Buch  1.294 5) Dice   1.404 6) Miller 1.457 7) Lack  1.557 8) Acev  1.571 If you combine the placements above, our top performing starters so far this year are: 1) Beckett  1.0 2) Lester     2.5 3T) Wake    4.0 3T) Buch     4.0 3T) Miller    4.0 6) Dice-K    5.5 7T) Acev     7.5 7T) Lack     7.5 Wake's numbers are worthy of staying in the rotation. He has also had a higher percentage of his inhereited runners allowed to score than any other starter on the team. I don't have any data to support this claim, but I have watched every Sox game and it seems like Wake has had more "cheap hits" that have resulted in earned runs scored. Drew's dropped fly ball, Jacoby's poor route to a fly ball, Youk's bobbled grounder, an HR that Drew perhaps could have caught had he played it differently, and more. I know every pitcher has several "what ifs" over a season, but it seems like Wake has had more than his "share". Also, look at innings per start and who saves the pen: 1) Beck  6.53 (98 IP/15 GS) 2) Lest   6.49 (110.1/17) 3) Wake 6.13 (61.1/10) 4) Buch  5.91 (82.2/14 5) Miller  5.84 (11.2/2) 6) Lack   5.83  (70/12) 7) Acev   5.25 (21/4) 8) Dice    5.19 (36.1/7)
    Posted by moonslav59


    Interesting.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from redsoxcorpseman. Show redsoxcorpseman's posts

    Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.

    Another Moonslow post claiming Wastefield should stay in the rotation.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.

    Its between wake and Miller..
     
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    Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.

    In Response to Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.:
    Another Moonslow post claiming Wastefield should stay in the rotation.
    Posted by redsoxcorpseman


    Another post ridiculing a Boston legend.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.

    In Response to Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.:
    Another Moonslow post claiming Wastefield should stay in the rotation.
    Posted by redsoxcorpseman


    I just listed the numbers, including your favorite number: ERA. I said "the numbers" show he should stay in the rotation. I have said Tito will demote him if he has 2 bad games: his last 2 starts could be judged as "bad" by short-sighted people, so my position is that Wake will be the odd man out when Buch comes back even if lackey stinks his next 2 starts.

    The higher salary paradigm is hard to break for Tito/Theo. Lackey is going to get more chances to prove himself than Wake. It's just the way it is. I understand it, but don't agree with many of these tired old paradigms.

    As for Miller, I like what I have seen. He has more upside than Lackey or Wake. I like having 2 lefties in the rotation. It's a tough call, and I certainly understand the posters who think Wake deserves the 5th slot over Miller, but I am leaning towards Miller as the 4 and Wake as the 5. (As I said before, Lackey will not be made the 6th starter unless he has 4-6 more bad starts.)

    Regardless of what the silly clown says, Miller was not ready earlier this year to be a MLB starter. He was horrible out of the gate, but pitched very well recently in AAA, and has looked very good in his brief time with the Sox this year. 3 starts is not a large enough sample size to know for sure, but if he pitches 2 more good games before the break, I'd say he deserves a slot over Lackey.

    Maybe someone else will go on the DL and the choice will be made easy. Maybe Tito will toy with a modified 6 man rotation of Beck/Lest/Buch going every 5 days, but Lackey, Wake and Miller rotating the other 2 slots by pitching 2 times every 15 days. Perhaps they could do some lonf relief on their "off day".


     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.

    I'm not as optimistic about Miller. He is using deception and taking advantage of N.L. competition and being a relative unknown, given his mechanical tweaks.
    He's very unproven.

    Lackey was hurt and has been half decent since his return. Wake needs a strong next outing. Otherwise, any demotion is justified.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.

    In Response to Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.:
    In Response to Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away. : Another post ridiculing a Boston legend.
    Posted by harness


    As Rodney King once said .... stop, please stop. (JK)
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from nhsteven. Show nhsteven's posts

    Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.

    In Response to Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.:
    I'm not as optimistic about Miller. He is using deception and taking advantage of N.L. competition and being a relative unknown, given his mechanical tweaks. He's very unproven. Lackey was hurt and has been half decent since his return. Wake needs a strong next outing. Otherwise, any demotion is justified.
    Posted by harness


    You may be right, but mostly 'cause he's a rookie and seems to have related issues where he gets flustered. I like him (and saw him live vs Pitt). He's only bound to get better, IMO.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.

    Miller is no rookie now. He's matured, but I'm not as optimistic as others here.
    He has a terrific change, but throwing 91-92 doesn't equate to a high ceiling
    without a put-away pitch, like Lester's cutter. His command is suspect.

    If he learns the cutter from Lester, or increases his velocity w/o sac. command, then I'd agree with you. He's simply a work in progress right now. He falls off the mound poorly and won't get to balls other pitchers can. His pick-off move is one of the worst I've ever seen.

    His size allows for deception in his delivery, but works against him in several other areas. An unproven commodity.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.

    harness, even if Wake has another 6 IP/5 ER start, he will still be a team top 5 ERA for starters, top 4 WHIP starter, and even if don't you factor in the inherited runs allowed to score and cheap earned runs allowed, there is still a strong case to say he deserves to stay.

    I do agree though, one more bad start: he's the 6th man, deserving or not. Even if he has a very good start next time, he might still be demoted.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.

    I don't think he'll be demoted if he has a strong start, Moon.
    The competition is becoming a matter of "what have you done for me lately".
    They could still deploy a 6-man rotation revolving the last three for a time.
    The health of Lackey/Buch is fragile, so it would make sense.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from redsoxcorpseman. Show redsoxcorpseman's posts

    Re: Tim Wakefield is now 9 wins away.

     Miller was not ready earlier this year to be a MLB starter.

    Wastefield was not ready earlier this year, now, or in the future. Miller was ready earlier this year, and so was Aceves.

    The reality is that you are delusional with the Wakefield starter defense. He stinks, and has stunk for years.
     
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