Trading Deadline #1 Priority

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    Two words:

    Jonathan Papelbon

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Bill-806. Show Bill-806's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to ADG's comment:

    Two words:

    Jonathan Papelbon

      NOT HARDLY    !!!!!!!


     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from chickenandboose. Show chickenandboose's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    Trade Drew.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from mef429. Show mef429's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    i agree. Not so much with the Paps idea unless the Phils are going to eat some money to make it a reasonable contract but i think we should go out and grab another good BP arm. Other than that im not sure what position we look to bolster... Catcher - set. DH - set. 1B - set. 2B - set. SS - maybe? 3B - unlikely. OF - set. Bench - speed & power on the bench so no need to upgrade there. SP - you can never have too much pitching.

     

    so yeah, i'd definitely have feelers out for a good RH relief pitcher/closer and maybe be looking to pick up another starter. Of course a lot can happen between now and the deadline. just my preliminary thoughts though.

    MASTER OF PUPPETS I'M PULLING YOUR STRINGS!!
    TWISTING YOUR MIND AND SMASHING YOUR DREAMS!!
    BLINDED BY ME YOU CAN'T SEE A THING!!
    JUST CALL MY NAME 'CUZ I'LL HEAR YOU SCREAM!!
    MASTER!! MASTER!!

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from makonikyman. Show makonikyman's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to ADG's comment:

    Two words:

    Jonathan Papelbon



    That's the only upgrade needed on this team. Pushes Baily back to setup and you get an ACE closer with experience who can get it done. No need for the Phil's to eat salary....he's worth it to THIS TEAM...reminds me of 04....

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    I'm still guessing that by the trade deadline, our two biggest needs will still be:

    1) A solid starting pitcher

    2) A RH'd middle order power hitterI'm not saying these are our weakest links going forward, but here are our worst positional OPS positions so far this year:

    1) 3B  .696

    2) CF  .732

    3) RF  .750

    4) SS  .759 (although this is, I believe, the 4th best SS OPS in MLB)

    5) LF  .781

     

    Sox4ever

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    I'm still guessing that by the trade deadline, our two biggest needs will still be:

    1) A solid starting pitcher

    2) A RH'd middle order power hitterI'm not saying these are our weakest links going forward, but here are our worst positional OPS positions so far this year:

    1) 3B  .696

    2) CF  .732

    3) RF  .750

    4) SS  .759 (although this is, I believe, the 4th best SS OPS in MLB)

    5) LF  .781

     

    Sox4ever



    We have 5 solid starters, the worst ERA among our starters is 4.40.  As your numbers imply, we have no material weaknesses, at least right now.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from BosoxJoe5. Show BosoxJoe5's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    I'm still guessing that by the trade deadline, our two biggest needs will still be:

    1) A solid starting pitcher

    2) A RH'd middle order power hitterI'm not saying these are our weakest links going forward, but here are our worst positional OPS positions so far this year:

    1) 3B  .696

    2) CF  .732

    3) RF  .750

    4) SS  .759 (although this is, I believe, the 4th best SS OPS in MLB)

    5) LF  .781

     

    Sox4ever




    I mean an ace would be nice but that would hardly be the biggest cocern. The reliever is definitely going to be need. The starting pitching is good enough. A righty bat for the outfield would be nice no slugger right needed as long as Nava still produced. You are being a bit softy-esque. This was your opinion at the beginning of the season so it has to be right.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to Joebreidey's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    I'm still guessing that by the trade deadline, our two biggest needs will still be:

    1) A solid starting pitcher

    2) A RH'd middle order power hitterI'm not saying these are our weakest links going forward, but here are our worst positional OPS positions so far this year:

    1) 3B  .696

    2) CF  .732

    3) RF  .750

    4) SS  .759 (although this is, I believe, the 4th best SS OPS in MLB)

    5) LF  .781

     

    Sox4ever

     



    We have 5 solid starters, the worst ERA among our starters is 4.40.  As your numbers imply, we have no material weaknesses, at least right now.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I know. The numbers don't show we need a SP, but it almost always happens by the deadline.

    Our biggest weakness on paper right now looks like 3B and CF, but Ellsbury has heated up, and the emmergence of Iggy as a 3B option has upgraded the outlook there as well. 

    I doubt we try for a RF'er with all that money tied up in Shane, so it does look like a stand pat team at this moment in time. A closer is a possibility, but we should know more about Baily by the end of July.

    Let's hope we stay healthy. Lord knows we had more than our share the last few seasons, so a relatively low injury season would ne nice for once. 

    We still have over 7 weeks to the deadline, so a lot can happen by then. I hope we don't have a SP injury or implosion, but it's hard for me to imagine all 5 keeping this up for 7 more weeks, let alone the rest of the season.

    I'd be tickled pink to end up wrong on this, but to me, you can never have too much pitching. 

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Wolfpack13. Show Wolfpack13's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority


    We have 5 "solid" starting pitchers- what team are you following? If Dubront (4.8 era) and Dempster (4.4 ERA)  are "solid" then it's time for me to re-evaluate my knowledge of baseball or the word "solid." That is setting the bar very low. Also, I'd be very curious to see the Sox starting ERA sans Bucholz. Right now we have a #1 and a bunch of not #2's.

    The answer to this question is a top of the rotation stud. Period. Otherwise all other moves will be deemed "nice."In order for Sox to be a true force we need to see a rotation like: Buch, Lee, Lester, whoever. I'm not saying Lee is the guy and I wouldnt mortgage the next 5 years for a starter, but I'm tired of the Eric Bedards at the trade deadline.

    Oh and trade Drew for a set of 1984 Donruss cards.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to ADG's comment:

    Two words:

    Jonathan Papelbon



    TWO  WORDS BUT NOT YOURS .......... STARTING PITCHING

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from makonikyman. Show makonikyman's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    In response to Joebreidey's comment:

     

     

     

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

     

     

     

     

    I'm still guessing that by the trade deadline, our two biggest needs will still be:

    1) A solid starting pitcher

    2) A RH'd middle order power hitterI'm not saying these are our weakest links going forward, but here are our worst positional OPS positions so far this year:

    1) 3B  .696

    2) CF  .732

    3) RF  .750

    4) SS  .759 (although this is, I believe, the 4th best SS OPS in MLB)

    5) LF  .781

     

    Sox4ever

     

     

     



    We have 5 solid starters, the worst ERA among our starters is 4.40.  As your numbers imply, we have no material weaknesses, at least right now.

     

     

     

     

     



    I know. The numbers don't show we need a SP, but it almost always happens by the deadline.

     

     

    Our biggest weakness on paper right now looks like 3B and CF, but Ellsbury has heated up, and the emmergence of Iggy as a 3B option has upgraded the outlook there as well. 

    I doubt we try for a RF'er with all that money tied up in Shane, so it does look like a stand pat team at this moment in time. A closer is a possibility, but we should know more about Baily by the end of July.

    Let's hope we stay healthy. Lord knows we had more than our share the last few seasons, so a relatively low injury season would ne nice for once. 

    We still have over 7 weeks to the deadline, so a lot can happen by then. I hope we don't have a SP injury or implosion, but it's hard for me to imagine all 5 keeping this up for 7 more weeks, let alone the rest of the season.

    I'd be tickled pink to end up wrong on this, but to me, you can never have too much pitching. 

     



    Our 2 biggest weaknessEs are  Jon Lester and Andrew Baily. Not F Doubrant...when are you going to admit that? 

     

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    If you want to make a serious run in the post season then this discussion begins and ends with trading for a starter.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    Jon Lester has turned into the pitcher who is as good as he ever was one start and then he becomes the guy he is tonight.  That is absolutely fine if you are a #4 #5 starter.... That's what Jon Lester has become.  Dear god I hope Lakey can keep up his strong season.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    We shouldn't count on any of these things happening but it's very plausible that both if not one of the two happen: Bogaerts is MLB ready....Will Middlebrooks heats up.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to Wolfpack13's comment:


    We have 5 "solid" starting pitchers- what team are you following? If Dubront (4.8 era) and Dempster (4.4 ERA)  are "solid" then it's time for me to re-evaluate my knowledge of baseball or the word "solid." That is setting the bar very low. Also, I'd be very curious to see the Sox starting ERA sans Bucholz. Right now we have a #1 and a bunch of not #2's.

    The answer to this question is a top of the rotation stud. Period. Otherwise all other moves will be deemed "nice."In order for Sox to be a true force we need to see a rotation like: Buch, Lee, Lester, whoever. I'm not saying Lee is the guy and I wouldnt mortgage the next 5 years for a starter, but I'm tired of the Eric Bedards at the trade deadline.

    Oh and trade Drew for a set of 1984 Donruss cards.



    Doubront's ERA as a starter is 4.34, and his ERA is 3.10 in his last 5 starts.  And he has 10 starts, and has allowed 3 ERs or less in 9 of them.  He is actually well above 'solid'.  I'm not sure what you'd be looking for.  You're not going to make a trade for a minor improvement.  If you want someone materially better than Dempster, you're looking for someone with less than a 4.00 ERA.  That is well beyond 'solid'.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from seannybboi. Show seannybboi's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    #1 or 2 starter and the middle of order bat.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from maxbialystock. Show maxbialystock's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority


    I completely disagree with the OP, not because Papelbon isn't still a terrific closer, because he is, but because he is way too expensive.  While I agree with the concept of a closer, I don't believe a really good one is worth a king's ransom.   Really, really good starters make a much bigger difference in a season. 

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    I'm still guessing that by the trade deadline, our two biggest needs will still be:

    1) A solid starting pitcher

    2) A RH'd middle order power hitterI'm not saying these are our weakest links going forward, but here are our worst positional OPS positions so far this year:

    1) 3B  .696

    2) CF  .732

    3) RF  .750

    4) SS  .759 (although this is, I believe, the 4th best SS OPS in MLB)

    5) LF  .781

     

    Sox4ever

     

     

     



    We have 5 solid starters, the worst ERA among our starters is 4.40.  As your numbers imply, we have no material weaknesses, at least right now.

     

     

     

     

     



    I know. The numbers don't show we need a SP, but it almost always happens by the deadline.

     

     

    Our biggest weakness on paper right now looks like 3B and CF, but Ellsbury has heated up, and the emmergence of Iggy as a 3B option has upgraded the outlook there as well. 

    I doubt we try for a RF'er with all that money tied up in Shane, so it does look like a stand pat team at this moment in time. A closer is a possibility, but we should know more about Baily by the end of July.

    Let's hope we stay healthy. Lord knows we had more than our share the last few seasons, so a relatively low injury season would ne nice for once. 

    We still have over 7 weeks to the deadline, so a lot can happen by then. I hope we don't have a SP injury or implosion, but it's hard for me to imagine all 5 keeping this up for 7 more weeks, let alone the rest of the season.

    I'd be tickled pink to end up wrong on this, but to me, you can never have too much pitching. 

     



    Our 2 biggest weaknessEs are  Jon Lester and Andrew Baily. Not F Doubrant...when are you going to admit that? 

     

    Lester is struggling right now- no doubt, but you can try all you want, but I won't make definitive judgements on small sample sizes. 

    I have never understood why so many posters look to such tiny sample sizes to determine who is better than another. As you remember, I cautioned those posters saying Lester was going to win the Cy Young after just 4 starts and 5 earned runs. I'm not going to now judge Lester harshly over 5 bad starts in a row. That's not to say I am not concerned: I am, and that's another reason why I'd love for us to get another solid, durable SP.

    All of my suggestions for getting another quality SP have not involved Doubront. In fact, I'd hardly be talking about Doubront, if posters like yourself didn't keep bringing it up. 

    Before this season began, I was arguing for a top of rotation starter, not because of Doubront's sketchiness, but more because I distrusted the chances that both Lester and Buchholz would stay healthy all year and perform near the top of their ability. I'm not sure if you remember, but I was for trading Lester to KC for Myers, so I'm not just about trading Doubront. One reason for wanting to trade Doubront is that the value you keep talking about, like low cost, long team control, and nasty stuff, is exactly what makes a nice return in value possible. Trading Lester would not net much at this point, anyway. I know you don't agree with my concerns about Doubront's attitude and motivational issues, but it is what it is, and I'm just not so sure why you seem so obsessed with that opinion of mine. I'm not pretending to be a MR. know-it-all, and I've admitted to more mistakes on this site than every poster combined, so can we just move on?

    I'm glad Doubront is doing well. I have never said I thought he would do poorly this year or all year long. He has some great stuff. He had some nice stretches last year where he looked like he could become that 3rd starter we needed, and perhaps someday he will. I'll be happy to eat crow when and if that happens, however, asking me to annoint him our #2 or 3 starter ahead of Lester or even Lackey and Dempster based on a few good games in a row, a BB rate higher than last year, and a WHIP over 6 just isn't going to happen soon enough for your liking.

    Bailey is struggling now, and I would not argue that the closer position is not a weak link on this team right now. He has had some rough outtings, but his 1.08 WHIP is a good sign considering he missed time with an injury and had to rehab on the fly.

    I'd love to get a quality closer, but they don't come cheap, and I'm not for trading away top prospects for a closer. If Bailey keeps having a hard time, my mind might change. The next 7 weeks should shake a lot of things out and lengthen some sample sizes to a point where some decisions may have to be made.

    Yes, Lester's struggles have gone beyong this 5 game sample size. He struggled at the end of 2011 and through most of 2012 as well. You may be right: he may be our weakest SP link right now and going forward. However to be defending Doubront, who has an ERA 0.70 more than Lester and a WHIP about 0.350 more than Lester is a bit of a stretch. I'm hoping Lester turns it around, just as I am hoping Doubront pitches to his potential.

     

     

    Sox4ever

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    If you want to make a serious run in the post season then this discussion begins and ends with trading for a starter.

    It's almost always the case, isn't it?

    It can't hurt to have 6 good starters either. One can always be used in long relief.

    Sox4ever

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to maxbialystock's comment:


    I completely disagree with the OP, not because Papelbon isn't still a terrific closer, because he is, but because he is way too expensive.  While I agree with the concept of a closer, I don't believe a really good one is worth a king's ransom.   Really, really good starters make a much bigger difference in a season. 



    We'd have to give up some top prospects plus lose salary space to improve in other areas this winter and beyond.

     
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  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from makonikyman. Show makonikyman's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    I'm still guessing that by the trade deadline, our two biggest needs will still be:

    1) A solid starting pitcher

    2) A RH'd middle order power hitterI'm not saying these are our weakest links going forward, but here are our worst positional OPS positions so far this year:

    1) 3B  .696

    2) CF  .732

    3) RF  .750

    4) SS  .759 (although this is, I believe, the 4th best SS OPS in MLB)

    5) LF  .781

     

    Sox4ever

     

     

     



    We have 5 solid starters, the worst ERA among our starters is 4.40.  As your numbers imply, we have no material weaknesses, at least right now.

     

     

     

     

     



    I know. The numbers don't show we need a SP, but it almost always happens by the deadline.

     

     

    Our biggest weakness on paper right now looks like 3B and CF, but Ellsbury has heated up, and the emmergence of Iggy as a 3B option has upgraded the outlook there as well. 

    I doubt we try for a RF'er with all that money tied up in Shane, so it does look like a stand pat team at this moment in time. A closer is a possibility, but we should know more about Baily by the end of July.

    Let's hope we stay healthy. Lord knows we had more than our share the last few seasons, so a relatively low injury season would ne nice for once. 

    We still have over 7 weeks to the deadline, so a lot can happen by then. I hope we don't have a SP injury or implosion, but it's hard for me to imagine all 5 keeping this up for 7 more weeks, let alone the rest of the season.

    I'd be tickled pink to end up wrong on this, but to me, you can never have too much pitching. 

     



    Our 2 biggest weaknessEs are  Jon Lester and Andrew Baily. Not F Doubrant...when are you going to admit that? 

     

    Lester is struggling right now- no doubt, but you can try all you want, but I won't make definitive judgements on small sample sizes. 

    I have never understood why so many posters look to such tiny sample sizes to determine who is better than another. As you remember, I cautioned those posters saying Lester was going to win the Cy Young after just 4 starts and 5 earned runs. I'm not going to now judge Lester harshly over 5 bad starts in a row. That's not to say I am not concerned: I am, and that's another reason why I'd love for us to get another solid, durable SP.

    All of my suggestions for getting another quality SP have not involved Doubront. In fact, I'd hardly be talking about Doubront, if posters like yourself didn't keep bringing it up. 

    Before this season began, I was arguing for a top of rotation starter, not because of Doubront's sketchiness, but more because I distrusted the chances that both Lester and Buchholz would stay healthy all year and perform near the top of their ability. I'm not sure if you remember, but I was for trading Lester to KC for Myers, so I'm not just about trading Doubront. One reason for wanting to trade Doubront is that the value you keep talking about, like low cost, long team control, and nasty stuff, is exactly what makes a nice return in value possible. Trading Lester would not net much at this point, anyway. I know you don't agree with my concerns about Doubront's attitude and motivational issues, but it is what it is, and I'm just not so sure why you seem so obsessed with that opinion of mine. I'm not pretending to be a MR. know-it-all, and I've admitted to more mistakes on this site than every poster combined, so can we just move on?

    I'm glad Doubront is doing well. I have never said I thought he would do poorly this year or all year long. He has some great stuff. He had some nice stretches last year where he looked like he could become that 3rd starter we needed, and perhaps someday he will. I'll be happy to eat crow when and if that happens, however, asking me to annoint him our #2 or 3 starter ahead of Lester or even Lackey and Dempster based on a few good games in a row, a BB rate higher than last year, and a WHIP over 6 just isn't going to happen soon enough for your liking.

    Bailey is struggling now, and I would not argue that the closer position is not a weak link on this team right now. He has had some rough outtings, but his 1.08 WHIP is a good sign considering he missed time with an injury and had to rehab on the fly.

    I'd love to get a quality closer, but they don't come cheap, and I'm not for trading away top prospects for a closer. If Bailey keeps having a hard time, my mind might change. The next 7 weeks should shake a lot of things out and lengthen some sample sizes to a point where some decisions may have to be made.

    Yes, Lester's struggles have gone beyong this 5 game sample size. He struggled at the end of 2011 and through most of 2012 as well. You may be right: he may be our weakest SP link right now and going forward. However to be defending Doubront, who has an ERA 0.70 more than Lester and a WHIP about 0.350 more than Lester is a bit of a stretch. I'm hoping Lester turns it around, just as I am hoping Doubront pitches to his potential.

     

     

    Sox4ever



    You never seize to amaze me. In your first paragraph, you use the "small sample size" of his last 5 starts, then...in your last paragraph you  acknowledge the "larger sample size" from 2011 to present in regards to Lester. Which one is it? You go back and forth on every topic with various stats and differing opinions that when a player or team for that matter does ANYTHING you can't help but be right. You're the master of SPIN...at least you think you are. Here's a spin on sample sizes...let's remove Lester's 6-0 start to this yr when you and the rest were touting him for ACE status, because EVERYONE knows that pitchers are WAY ahead of hitters the first month of the season, right? If we do that...Jon Lester is an astounding 10 - 20 with an era well north of 5. Even with his 6-0 start he is only 16-20 with an era slightly under 5. That is a large sample size covering close to 50 starts. Jon Lester is a 4/5 guy and has been for awhile now. Those are the facts. 

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from BMav. Show BMav's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    Wait until mid-late July and figure it out. Trades don't happen now. We don't know who will be healthy. Who will be available. Right now, nothing is a high priority need.

     
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