Trading Deadline #1 Priority

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    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to rkarp's comment:

    In response to djcbuffum's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

     

    In response to djcbuffum's comment:

     

     

     

    (1) This is a team with the second best record in baseball. We don't have any needs for the 2013 regular season, except to fortify depth in case one player or another goes down with injury, or some of the struggling players can't snap out of their funk.

    (2) Jon Lester will pick it up a bit as the season goes on, but if he ends the season with an ERA north of 4.00, the FO can't go into 2014 thinking of him as a co-ace. By the end of this season, there will be a clear drop from his best years, and any reason to hope he can get it together will be outweighed by the lengthy period of time that he hasn't. Given that Bucholz' is prone to injury, it really will be time for the Sox to bring in the big game pitcher that they've been lacking ever since Beckett tanked, Schilling retired, and Lester lost his mojo. Maybe it's Webster, maybe it's Cliff Lee, maybe it's someone else. 

    And if Lester can't pick it up, I will also be worried about our ability to last a seven game series with Texas and/or Detroit. It might be worth exploring a way to strengthen our rotation at the trade deadline, just looking ahead to a post-season berth. That's problematic, of course, because who do you demote? You don't want a six-month rental who is going to push out any of the guys who have a long-term future with the Sox. The FO will have a delicate balance to make. 


    "Who would have guessed it possible that waiting is sustainable, a place with its own harvests -- or that in time's fullness the diamonds of patience couldn't be distinguished from genuine brilliance or hardness." --Kay Ryan.

    "Everything is happening, all the time, very fast. I like that." -- Warren Ellis

     

     



    while I generally agree with your statement and applaud you for not freaking out like everyone else there is one thing I would like to critique. 

     

     

    Jon Lester is not an Ace.

    Any argument that jon Lester is an ace starts with how good he has BEEN or how good he CAN be.  But there are a lot of #3 #4 #5 starters in the league who have ace stuff (if we talk about pure stuff).  One thing that makes an ace an ace is consistency.  Yes even an ace has a bad start here and there but that is usually a start or two during the year.  Jon Lester while good at times has been largely inconsistent the last 2 years going back to the end of 2011.  

    On his best night, he is as good as anyone out there but he is just way to inconsistant and has been for a while now to even be considered in the conversation as an ace. 

    So actually I pretty much agree with you, lol. 

    If you've noticed the last several years the Red Sox have drafted a LOT of pitchers; their drafts have been particularly top heavy in pitching with the top 10 picks.  Not to mention they have traded for RDLR and Webster.  I wonder if this plays into the general failure of the team to sign pitchers in free agency.  FWIW the general trend has been bad in signing big time pitchers in free agency.  I think the Sox are looking to build a pitching staff from within.

    The good news here is the Sox have one of the most stacked minor league systems they have had in a while with a LOT of pitching depth.  The bad news is while a lot of that talent is CLOSE to the bigs, it's not certain that they can come up and contribute right now.

    Webster may be a very good #2 but he might be that guy who struggles for a while before he puts it together.  Ranaudo, Barnes, Owens, all very close but not quite there yet.  Rubby De La Rosa seems like he has really put it together and turned it on and might be able to contribute right now.  But he is still recovering from tommy john and will likely be shut down later this summer.

    Best case scenario is Doubront continues his upward trend, Lakey bounces back and pitches as good as he has, and Buccholz is fine (I think he is 100% fine and the team is just babying him, but that is just a guess) and Lester at least sprinkles in some good starts here and there or maybe even heats up for a month. 

     



    I think we are saying the same thing. The FO went into 2013 talking about Lester-Bucholz as "co-aces." It was a bit of a stretch to think of either as an "ace" then, and it's pretty ridiculous to talk about Lester as an "ace" now (jury is still out on Bucholz).

     

     



    is CC an ACE?

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I'd say he's an ace....I don't know if he's top 5, but I'd probably put him in the top ten.

    Hypothetically you can say the top 30 pitchers in baseball are #1 starters; which makes the standards a little lower than what most in here would guess.  If that definition is at all subjective then to me it's more like the top 5-10 guys.  But the again I'm a fan of a first division team so I have high expectations.

     
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    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    In response to maxbialystock's comment:

     

     

     


    I completely disagree with the OP, not because Papelbon isn't still a terrific closer, because he is, but because he is way too expensive.  While I agree with the concept of a closer, I don't believe a really good one is worth a king's ransom.   Really, really good starters make a much bigger difference in a season. 

     

     



    We'd have to give up some top prospects plus lose salary space to improve in other areas this winter and beyond.

     

     

     



    True...what team contending isnt looking for either a starter or a reliever come July 31st

    Ahhh I totally thought I was replying to a different post.  We really need a delete button.  If you're readin this sorry I wasted 30 seconds of your life.

     

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from redsoxpride34. Show redsoxpride34's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    the sox should aim high at the deadline and go after some top notch talent. despite the teams current record, there are plenty of needs come deadline time. 

    1) top of the rotation starter - buchholz has been great but his durability has continued to hinder his ability to be considered an elite pitcher or ace, lester started out good but has regressed big time. dempster and lackey are #4 pitchers at this point and doubront is a 4/5. we need a reliable top notch pitcher who can lead our staff. this team would not fair well in the playoffs given that the top 3 starters would include lackey or dempster neither of which i would have any confidence in against top notch AL teams. The problem is that top notch pitchers are hard to come by. the top 2 who could be available look to be david price and yovani gallardo followed by the likes of josh johnson and matt garza. ( the latter 2 are much more likely to be moved) price has the ability to be a top notch pitcher and the kind of guy the sox need. would the rays trade him in the division? chances are they would but the price would be somewhat higher. the sox no doubt have the pieces to get a deal done, but at this point price needs to get healthy and rebuild his value prior to the deadline for the rays to even consider dealing him. gallardo is a not on the same level as price in terms of talent and has never pitched the AL, which might make him less attractive to the sox, what he does have on his side is the fact that he is relaticely young (27 i believe) and has the ability to be an ace and has been pretty durable especially the past 2 years (200+ innings in each year) garza and johnson could be options though johnson is always injured and garza is coming off an injury and still has to build value. realistically gallardo and garza are the sox most viable options. of the 2 i would deal for gallardo. 

    2) a middle of the order right handed power bat - though the sox offense has been good, it still continues to be inconsistant and lacks right handed power (power in general). napoli has been good in terms of rbi's, but his power numbers are average at this point and middlebrooks has been non-existant. ortiz has been great, but he is 37 and has 1 year left on his deal, we cant rely in him forever. There is only one guy that fits the sox need and that is giancarlo stanton. he is the guy u throw the farm at. he is young, is one of the best power hitters in the league and would fit nicely in LF and in the middle of the sox line up:

    ellsbury

    pedroia

    stanton

    ortiz

    napoli

    middlebrooks

    victorino

    salty

    drew/iggy

     
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    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    The only reason why I don't want to trade for Stanton is because I think Bogaerts may be just as good.  Plus I think highly of several of the other prospects you wold likely have to give up to get him.  Don't get me wrong I would be psyched to have Stanton.  I personally just want to build from within! Especially with a farm system that is as strong as its ever been with a blue chipper at the top.

     
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    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    "at near ace skill" means nothing. He's not performing like one and results are what counts.

     

    No comparison to Doubront. Doubront is the #5. Lester should be #1/2.

    Yes, if you go by the last 5-6 starts, of course.

    what are you basing your statement on regarding regaining what he once had?

    Has any pitcher ever been really good, then gone through a long stretch of being bad, then regained his stuff? 

    Just like your posts about Wakefield regaining what he did in 2008 and 2009 in 2011?

    Wake pitched about as well as Doubront has in 2012 to 2013. If he had a catcher who catch and a 3Bman who could field, and a SS who could field, and a pen that could keep inherited runners...

     

    He is a weak link at the top of the rotation. 4 2/3 IP with 8 hits, 7 runs and 7 BB is inexcusable.

    Now, it's down to a one game sample size for you guys. Will you treat Doubie the same when he has a game like that?

     

    Look, I wanted to trade Lester last winter. Not many did. Coming from a guy who is always talking about upgrading the top part of the rotation, I think it was pretty significant to want him traded for a prospect (Myers).

    That being said, I will still say there is a chance Lester can get his cat back together and be a decent pitcher. It won't take much to do better than a 1.600 WHIP, but then again, maybe he will never do that again. I will say, it wasn't lucky that Lester had several very good seasons up to Sept 2011. His attitude is messed up. He's got on the wrong side of the umps. He's lost velocity and may have to reinvent himself or bust. It's not impossible, but it's not looking good of late.

     

    We need a solid starting pitcher. Period.

    I am not for trading top prospects for a 2 month rental.

    I'm not for trading for aged guys like Lee. 

    Maybe a guy like Gallardo can be preid from the Brewers, but I'm not sure if he's the answer either.

     

    It was nice to see Aceves pitch well tonight, but he's not a guy I want to count on this October or in years to come.

    Sox4ever

     
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    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    Lester has clearly been terrible in a one game sample size or a recent 5-6 game sample size, and he's not been great for about 1.5 seasons now, but here are the Sox SP numbers since 2012 (200+ IP):

    Buchholz  20-8  3.68  WHIP 1.23  WAR  4.5

    Lester     15-17  4.61  WHIP 1.36  WAR 4.4

    Doubront 15-13  4.73 WHIP 1.47  WAR 3.0

     

    Sox4ever

     
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    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    I'd trade for Lee if it was just a salary dump. As long as we don't get into Luxury Tax territory & we don't give them anyone too important In exchange ( since we would have to part with somebody). Maybe an Aceves or Doubront fits that bill? Maybe a milb scrub does it? 

     
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    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to emp9's comment:

    I'd trade for Lee if it was just a salary dump. As long as we don't get into Luxury Tax territory & we don't give them anyone too important In exchange ( since we would have to part with somebody). Maybe an Aceves or Doubront fits that bill? Maybe a milb scrub does it? 



    If we get Lee at the deadline, I think his pro-rated contract cost would put us very close to the luxury tax limit. We could probably get Philly to pay the small amount needed to stay under the limit, but I'd still rather find a younger SP out there. I know thay don't come cheap, but I just don't like the general idea of getting much older at this point in this team's development.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    I love all the panic here. Nothing needs to be done right now.

    A lot can happen in 6 weeks. I think this team is evaluating what they have with Middy, Iggy and drew. Hoping that Lester can turn things around and at least get back to #2 numbers 3.5 era and 7IP and about a 1.1-1.2 WHIP

    Catcher- All set

    1b-All set

    2b-All set

    ss- All set

    3b- ?

    OF- All set

    Buch-good  3-5-good Lester- ?

    We need some bullpen help and I like Notins idea of Jesse Crain. Have to wait and see who Bailey does.

    So the way I see it is we have to wait and see how Lester and Middy do. Always can use bullpen arms. We might be able to solve that internally though, but a pickup like Crain would be nice too.

    Bottom line, we have to wait and see over the next 6 weeks to have a true idea of what we need.

     
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    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority


    Lester and the ? is perfect. He better realize how important his role is for this team. Needs a really good game in next start, just for his frame of mind, and work off of that.

    Consistency, the art of throwing strikes.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from emp9. Show emp9's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to emp9's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    I'd trade for Lee if it was just a salary dump. As long as we don't get into Luxury Tax territory & we don't give them anyone too important In exchange ( since we would have to part with somebody). Maybe an Aceves or Doubront fits that bill? Maybe a milb scrub does it? 

     



    If we get Lee at the deadline, I think his pro-rated contract cost would put us very close to the luxury tax limit. We could probably get Philly to pay the small amount needed to stay under the limit, but I'd still rather find a younger SP out there. I know thay don't come cheap, but I just don't like the general idea of getting much older at this point in this team's development.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I know what you mean about age, i really do. but if its the difference between a ring now... ( forgive me for entertaining the idea ). It's such a long season to come away empty handed. Schilling weren't no spring chicken.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from emp9. Show emp9's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    I love all the panic here. Nothing needs to be done right now.

    A lot can happen in 6 weeks. I think this team is evaluating what they have with Middy, Iggy and drew. Hoping that Lester can turn things around and at least get back to #2 numbers 3.5 era and 7IP and about a 1.1-1.2 WHIP

    Catcher- All set

    1b-All set

    2b-All set

    ss- All set

    3b- ?

    OF- All set

    Buch-good  3-5-good Lester- ?

    We need some bullpen help and I like Notins idea of Jesse Crain. Have to wait and see who Bailey does.

    So the way I see it is we have to wait and see how Lester and Middy do. Always can use bullpen arms. We might be able to solve that internally though, but a pickup like Crain would be nice too.

    Bottom line, we have to wait and see over the next 6 weeks to have a true idea of what we need.



    I wouldn't say panic SP. I'd say looking for an upgrade for the trade deadline not only to make the post season, but to create a little more separation would just be prudent planning.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from sportsbozo1. Show sportsbozo1's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    Trade Drew and start using Iggy at his natural position. Surely some unsuspecting team will bite !

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to emp9's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to emp9's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

    I'd trade for Lee if it was just a salary dump. As long as we don't get into Luxury Tax territory & we don't give them anyone too important In exchange ( since we would have to part with somebody). Maybe an Aceves or Doubront fits that bill? Maybe a milb scrub does it? 

     

     



    If we get Lee at the deadline, I think his pro-rated contract cost would put us very close to the luxury tax limit. We could probably get Philly to pay the small amount needed to stay under the limit, but I'd still rather find a younger SP out there. I know thay don't come cheap, but I just don't like the general idea of getting much older at this point in this team's development.

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I know what you mean about age, i really do. but if its the difference between a ring now... ( forgive me for entertaining the idea ). It's such a long season to come away empty handed. Schilling weren't no spring chicken.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Good analogy, but the salary will cripple us for years to come.

    13:$25M, 14:$25M, 15:$25M, 16:$27.5M club option ($12.5M buyout)

    If we don't take the 2016 option, he will cost about $70M for 2 and a third seasons, including 3 playoff chances. If we take the option, he will cost us $86M for 3 and a third seasons (4 playoffs).

    We just dumped CC, Beckett and AGon's huge deals. I don't see choosing Lee to be that guy we go big on.

     
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    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    Go get Bud Norris and or bring up one of the kids Ranaudo,Barnes,Britton, or Webster and let them give it their best shot. At all costs get rid of the second coming of JD Drew his sister is stinking up the joint.

     
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    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to ConanObrien's comment:

     

    In response to sportsbozo1's comment:

     

    Go get Bud Norris and or bring up one of the kids Ranaudo,Barnes,Britton, or Webster and let them give it their best shot. At all costs get rid of the second coming of JD Drew his sister is stinking up the joint.

     




     

     

     

    Like your posts.

     



            Wow.

     

            You're an idiot on parade.

            ie, mentally deficient person.

            I forgot. Also a Fake Halo Vet.

     
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  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to sportsbozo1's comment:

    Go get Bud Norris and or bring up one of the kids Ranaudo,Barnes,Britton, or Webster and let them give it their best shot. At all costs get rid of the second coming of JD Drew his sister is stinking up the joint.



    I'm not sure Houston is looking to trade a guy like Norris, but they may figure they are more than 2 years away from contending, so maybe he is an option. (His last arb is after the 2015 season.) His WHIP is over 1.400 this year and career. That's not a good sign, but he is entering his prime at age 28. Jordan Lyles is the guy I would want fro the 'Stros, but he's not going anywhere, since his last arb is after 2017.

    If we trade for a pitcher this deadline, I think it will be from a team looking to dump salary or a player that is not under team control for beyond 2013 or 2014. Here is a short list of starting pitchers from teams that will likely be out of it by the deadline and may be looking more towards the future or extended future:

    Milwaukee:

     Gallardo 13:$8.5M, 14:$10M, 15:$12M

     Lohse  13:$11M, 14:$11M, 15:$11M

     (Maybe Braun, C Hart or A Ramirez could be added)

     

    Kansas City:

    Shields 13:$9M club option ($1.5M buyout), 14:$12M club option ($1M buyout)

    E Santana 13:$13M club option ($1M buyout)

    J Guthrie  13:$5M, 14:$11M, 15:$9M

     (Maybe A Gordon, B Butler or Greg Holland can be added)

     

    Philadelphia:

     C Lee 13:$25M, 14:$25M, 15:$25M, 16:$27.5M club option ($12.5M buyout)

     (Maybe Papelbon, Hamels, Howard or others might be added)

     

    LAD: ???

    Toronto:  ???

    Minnesota:  ???

    Cubs:  ???

    Seattle:  ???

    San Diego:  ???

    CWS:  ???

    NYM:  ???

    Miami:  ???

    Houston:  ???

     

     

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to emp9's comment:

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    I love all the panic here. Nothing needs to be done right now.

    A lot can happen in 6 weeks. I think this team is evaluating what they have with Middy, Iggy and drew. Hoping that Lester can turn things around and at least get back to #2 numbers 3.5 era and 7IP and about a 1.1-1.2 WHIP

    Catcher- All set

    1b-All set

    2b-All set

    ss- All set

    3b- ?

    OF- All set

    Buch-good  3-5-good Lester- ?

    We need some bullpen help and I like Notins idea of Jesse Crain. Have to wait and see who Bailey does.

    So the way I see it is we have to wait and see how Lester and Middy do. Always can use bullpen arms. We might be able to solve that internally though, but a pickup like Crain would be nice too.

    Bottom line, we have to wait and see over the next 6 weeks to have a true idea of what we need.

     



    I wouldn't say panic SP. I'd say looking for an upgrade for the trade deadline not only to make the post season, but to create a little more separation would just be prudent planning.

     

    [/QUOTE]


    mabye panic WAS a bit dramatic, but I just think a lot can happen in 6 weeks. Lester could turn things around, Middy could start hitting and remembering how to play defense. Then again, Iggy could get hurt (if he actually playsWink) or God forbid Buch goes down for an extended amount of time. I would guess that they would have feelers out everywhere.

    Toronto might be sellers along with Philly. The Cubs too. Lots of teams could be looking to sell at the deadline. LAA, M's and CWS are right there as sellers. All the teams that are 10+ games out right now. THAT could change as well too. The A's might be looking for an upgrade after winning 20 of 25 games and are now 2 games ahead in the ALW.

    Im not sure that we have an obvious need right now and who the obvious sellers would be is all Im saying, so I really cant say for sure. The list I have is what I think we need to keep an eye on going forward. But again, a LOT can change in 6 weeks.

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to sportsbozo1's comment:

     

    Go get Bud Norris and or bring up one of the kids Ranaudo,Barnes,Britton, or Webster and let them give it their best shot. At all costs get rid of the second coming of JD Drew his sister is stinking up the joint.

     




    You do realize that Bud Norris (who youve now suggested in a few threads) is basically the same guys as Doubront but costs more and is older with less control years, right?

    Maybe you should set the bar a bit higher than Bud Norris.

    Plus, I would worry more about Middy that concentrating on your bias against anyone with the last name Drew. Drew drove in the 3rd run last night while Middy made a costly error that cost Doubie another dozen pitches resulting in ther O's 4th run. Then kicked another ball later in the game.

     

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to sportsbozo1's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    Go get Bud Norris and or bring up one of the kids Ranaudo,Barnes,Britton, or Webster and let them give it their best shot. At all costs get rid of the second coming of JD Drew his sister is stinking up the joint.

     



    I'm not sure Houston is looking to trade a guy like Norris, but they may figure they are more than 2 years away from contending, so maybe he is an option. (His last arb is after the 2015 season.) His WHIP is over 1.400 this year and career. That's not a good sign, but he is entering his prime at age 28. Jordan Lyles is the guy I would want fro the 'Stros, but he's not going anywhere, since his last arb is after 2017.

     

    If we trade for a pitcher this deadline, I think it will be from a team looking to dump salary or a player that is not under team control for beyond 2013 or 2014. Here is a short list of starting pitchers from teams that will likely be out of it by the deadline and may be looking more towards the future or extended future:

    Milwaukee:

     Gallardo 13:$8.5M, 14:$10M, 15:$12M

     Lohse  13:$11M, 14:$11M, 15:$11M

     (Maybe Braun, C Hart or A Ramirez could be added)

     

    Kansas City:

    Shields 13:$9M club option ($1.5M buyout), 14:$12M club option ($1M buyout)

    E Santana 13:$13M club option ($1M buyout)

    J Guthrie  13:$5M, 14:$11M, 15:$9M

     (Maybe A Gordon, B Butler or Greg Holland can be added)

     

    Philadelphia:

     C Lee 13:$25M, 14:$25M, 15:$25M, 16:$27.5M club option ($12.5M buyout)

     (Maybe Papelbon, Hamels, Howard or others might be added)

     

    LAD: ???

    Toronto:  ???

    Minnesota:  ???

    Cubs:  ???

    Seattle:  ???

    San Diego:  ???

    CWS:  ???

    NYM:  ???

    Miami:  ???

    Houston:  ???

     

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Out of that list, Id love to get Shields. Without a doubt.

     
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    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to emp9's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

    In response to emp9's comment:

     

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

     

    I'd trade for Lee if it was just a salary dump. As long as we don't get into Luxury Tax territory & we don't give them anyone too important In exchange ( since we would have to part with somebody). Maybe an Aceves or Doubront fits that bill? Maybe a milb scrub does it? 

     

     

     



    If we get Lee at the deadline, I think his pro-rated contract cost would put us very close to the luxury tax limit. We could probably get Philly to pay the small amount needed to stay under the limit, but I'd still rather find a younger SP out there. I know thay don't come cheap, but I just don't like the general idea of getting much older at this point in this team's development.

     

     

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I know what you mean about age, i really do. but if its the difference between a ring now... ( forgive me for entertaining the idea ). It's such a long season to come away empty handed. Schilling weren't no spring chicken.

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Good analogy, but the salary will cripple us for years to come.

     

    13:$25M, 14:$25M, 15:$25M, 16:$27.5M club option ($12.5M buyout)

    If we don't take the 2016 option, he will cost about $70M for 2 and a third seasons, including 3 playoff chances. If we take the option, he will cost us $86M for 3 and a third seasons (4 playoffs).

    We just dumped CC, Beckett and AGon's huge deals. I don't see choosing Lee to be that guy we go big on.

    [/QUOTE]

    If I could preface that I'm just spitballing the idea of Lee, or someone of that caliber including that type of salary. Even with $$$ coming off the books next year, coupled w/ the fact that the guys we might assume are taking their place [ Ex: Ellsbury's $9M to Bradley's 500k?, Drew's &9.5M to Iglesias' $2.6M (or is it $3.56M?) ], and the players that they're already paying league minimum to (Ex: Middlebrooks, Nava, Doubront), not to mention it's conceivable Boegarts might win a position next year which would mean not having to sign another over-priced FA. Lee's contract still might cripple them? That my friend is disappointing to say the least. I'm hearing the horns shouting: " Wha!...wha!...Whaaaaaa....". 

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to sportsbozo1's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

    Go get Bud Norris and or bring up one of the kids Ranaudo,Barnes,Britton, or Webster and let them give it their best shot. At all costs get rid of the second coming of JD Drew his sister is stinking up the joint.

     

     



    I'm not sure Houston is looking to trade a guy like Norris, but they may figure they are more than 2 years away from contending, so maybe he is an option. (His last arb is after the 2015 season.) His WHIP is over 1.400 this year and career. That's not a good sign, but he is entering his prime at age 28. Jordan Lyles is the guy I would want fro the 'Stros, but he's not going anywhere, since his last arb is after 2017.

     

     

    If we trade for a pitcher this deadline, I think it will be from a team looking to dump salary or a player that is not under team control for beyond 2013 or 2014. Here is a short list of starting pitchers from teams that will likely be out of it by the deadline and may be looking more towards the future or extended future:

    Milwaukee:

     Gallardo 13:$8.5M, 14:$10M, 15:$12M

     Lohse  13:$11M, 14:$11M, 15:$11M

     (Maybe Braun, C Hart or A Ramirez could be added)

     

    Kansas City:

    Shields 13:$9M club option ($1.5M buyout), 14:$12M club option ($1M buyout)

    E Santana 13:$13M club option ($1M buyout)

    J Guthrie  13:$5M, 14:$11M, 15:$9M

     (Maybe A Gordon, B Butler or Greg Holland can be added)

     

    Philadelphia:

     C Lee 13:$25M, 14:$25M, 15:$25M, 16:$27.5M club option ($12.5M buyout)

     (Maybe Papelbon, Hamels, Howard or others might be added)

     

    LAD: ???

    Toronto:  ???

    Minnesota:  ???

    Cubs:  ???

    Seattle:  ???

    San Diego:  ???

    CWS:  ???

    NYM:  ???

    Miami:  ???

    Houston:  ???

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Out of that list, Id love to get Shields. Without a doubt.

     

    [/QUOTE]

    This past winter, I spoke of getting Shields, but was told over an over that the Rays would never trade him within the division. I then mentioned that maybe we could make a trade with the team that does get him, which turned out to be KC- a team dropping from contention.

    Shields is better than a 2 month rental, but he'll be a FA after 2014, unless we extend him. Gallardo's not put up the numbers Shields has, but he's signed through 2015.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: Trading Deadline #1 Priority

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

    In response to sportsbozo1's comment:

     

     

    [QUOTE]

     

     

     

    Go get Bud Norris and or bring up one of the kids Ranaudo,Barnes,Britton, or Webster and let them give it their best shot. At all costs get rid of the second coming of JD Drew his sister is stinking up the joint.

     

     

     



    I'm not sure Houston is looking to trade a guy like Norris, but they may figure they are more than 2 years away from contending, so maybe he is an option. (His last arb is after the 2015 season.) His WHIP is over 1.400 this year and career. That's not a good sign, but he is entering his prime at age 28. Jordan Lyles is the guy I would want fro the 'Stros, but he's not going anywhere, since his last arb is after 2017.

     

     

     

    If we trade for a pitcher this deadline, I think it will be from a team looking to dump salary or a player that is not under team control for beyond 2013 or 2014. Here is a short list of starting pitchers from teams that will likely be out of it by the deadline and may be looking more towards the future or extended future:

    Milwaukee:

     Gallardo 13:$8.5M, 14:$10M, 15:$12M

     Lohse  13:$11M, 14:$11M, 15:$11M

     (Maybe Braun, C Hart or A Ramirez could be added)

     

    Kansas City:

    Shields 13:$9M club option ($1.5M buyout), 14:$12M club option ($1M buyout)

    E Santana 13:$13M club option ($1M buyout)

    J Guthrie  13:$5M, 14:$11M, 15:$9M

     (Maybe A Gordon, B Butler or Greg Holland can be added)

     

    Philadelphia:

     C Lee 13:$25M, 14:$25M, 15:$25M, 16:$27.5M club option ($12.5M buyout)

     (Maybe Papelbon, Hamels, Howard or others might be added)

     

    LAD: ???

    Toronto:  ???

    Minnesota:  ???

    Cubs:  ???

    Seattle:  ???

    San Diego:  ???

    CWS:  ???

    NYM:  ???

    Miami:  ???

    Houston:  ???

     

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]


    Out of that list, Id love to get Shields. Without a doubt.

     

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    This past winter, I spoke of getting Shields, but was told over an over that the Rays would never trade him within the division. I then mentioned that maybe we could make a trade with the team that does get him, which turned out to be KC- a team dropping from contention.

     

    Shields is better than a 2 month rental, but he'll be a FA after 2014, unless we extend him. Gallardo's not put up the numbers Shields has, but he's signed through 2015.

    [/QUOTE]

    You are correct. Almost all teams are no longer willing to make any kind of significant trade within their own division, but Tampa GM Andrew Friedman is pretty adamant about it.  There's also a possibilty that Andrew Friedman and Royals GM Dayton Moore have a gentleman's agreement (not that uncommon) that the Royals can't trade Shields to an AL East team if the Rays are in the race for the pennant.  If not, I would love to see the Sox acquire Shields near the deadline, if he were a available...

     

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