Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from pennasoxfan67. Show pennasoxfan67's posts

    Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys

    Hey...enough of the Wakefield bashing.  I was at at least 3 of his starts going for 200.  The first, in Chicago, was a quality start but we didn't hit.  I think it was his third try that I went to that he had another quality start, went 7 innings I think, and we blew the save.  The only one of the 3 that I saw that he sucked was in the rain at Fenway on August 26th.  That was a stinker but all of our starters sucked but then.  Timmy pitched at least as well as anyone in the rotation down the stretch.  Theo should have fortified the rotation (Bedard was NOT the answer, obviously) when he had the chance.  DO NOT try to hang this on Wakefield.  He actually had better numbers than our 2 aces, or Lackey (by a mile) or the call-ups we were forced to use because Theo didn't do his job.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from jackyldo. Show jackyldo's posts

    Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys

    Ortiz   the driving force of the offense ?? joke ?  1 HR and 8 RBI in September ?
    27 hits, 6 for extra bases in 94    at bats  and   17  K's ..

    Gonzo  cooled,  Youk   tried   to  play and   Papi  was a pitch around  17 walks..

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from proftom. Show proftom's posts

    Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys

    The team came into the season out of shape. Compare Josh Beckets pics 2010 to 2011. Add at least ten pounds for the 2011 season. Remeber the Theo rumors in late August? They happen two weeks beore the great collapse happen. Connect the dots, Theo leaving rumor, Wake 200 saga, players fielding, base running, the pitching starts to crumble, and players in droves stop running out ground balls. 

    Nah, say what you want but the dysfunction came to a head in the last week of August, September was fiction    
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from jackyldo. Show jackyldo's posts

    Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys

    Yes  and AGon  complaining about too many  night games and long  flights in the dark..

    Not only are you making  $62,000 to play that game,  but  you get food and drink after,,  a comfortable  757   with lie flat beds .. for those coast to coast flights    where you can sleep ...

    This team complained about being tired in April..

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Kamdog. Show Kamdog's posts

    Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys

    Contrast the 'team' aspects of the Sox with the Yankees, and you find Yanks try to pick up each other when one blows something.  If a fielder makes a bad error, you see CC screw up his face tight and focus on getting the next guy out, you don't see him making 'you stink' faces at the fielder.  When a fielder makes a great play, the pitcher is out there waiting to tap gloves, not strolling to the dugout as if that is just par for the course.

    Teams pick other guys up, groups of players don't, and, this year, the Sox looked like a group of players.

    Although I really thought they would get in, right up to the final run by the Os.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from chronic352. Show chronic352's posts

    Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys

    In Response to Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys : I think the Wakefield point is spot on and could be the center piece of some of the clubhouse dissent.  While pitching options were thin, it also seemed that Tito was running Wake out there in search of #200, at times to the detriment of the team. Anyone who is on this board knows that there was plenty of anger about Wake continuing to get starts, when it did seem like his pursuit of 200 was too big a priority.  I remember one game where Bard blew a late lead, at Toronto I think, and the first thing Orsillo said after Bard gave up the lead was "no 200th win for Wakefield tonight".  I'm pretty sure I screamed "who f##*#*g gives a s**T". I could see this as a divide in the clubhouse, some of the old guard having Wake's back, and therefore Francona's back and others feeling like Tito was putting his personal like for Wake ahead of making tough managerial decisions.  Tito is somewhat off the hook on this because of all the injuries to the pitching, which gives him an excuse to throw Wake. 
    Posted by Thesemenarecowards[/QUOTE]

    I love Wake!  He does and did SO much for the organization and did everything the team needed; long reliefe, short relief, spot starts.  For all of that Tito supported him in his quest for 200 wins...that is fine and noble.  But, it needed to happen after the Red Sox clinched a playoff spot and was the "lack of urgency" cited when he was "let go" as the manager.

    Why did he stubbornly keep sending Wake out there for 9 tries before he finally got win 200?

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from OnDeckCircle. Show OnDeckCircle's posts

    Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys

    It could be seen even when the team was winning that there was no real unity with this team.     There were different factions within the clubhouse with supposedly a Texas Group, an Old Timers Group, a Rookie group, and a Newbie Group.
    Adrian Gonzalez whined and moaned about everything in sight that didn't suit him, Carl Crawford had little to say about anything to anybody, and Bobby Jenks waddled around until he was too hurt to pitch.
    Even Pedroia couldn't put any spark in this team and eventually threw his hands in the air.
    The next manager better work this team like rented mules next February in Florida.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from hambonawilliams. Show hambonawilliams's posts

    Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys

    All of you Wakefield apologists are lapdogs to failure and futility. The man is only concerned about HIM now, as his statements about wanting to come back so HE can be the winningest RS pitcher of all time attest to....I think his miserable failure quest to #200 set this team on a true death spiral, regardless of all the other stuff we are starting to hear about now.

    And yes, I want to know WHO, in particular, are the new "25 guys, 25 cabs" crew chiefs...get them O-U-T as soon as most practicably possible...Tek has to go, FAT Beckett has to go, FAT Lackey the jackazz has to go NOW, even if you have to take a financial loss to do it....and if the FAT punk with the broken spine wants to continue to act like a HOF pitcher without the wins to back him up, the least he could do is dry up and stop boozing in the locker room before starts....that just blows my mind...the other two Texas morons are just that, Texas morons.

    Time to fire more than Tito, that's for sure...he had to go after what happened, but he should have gone LAST...I know that's not the way it works, but ownership knows only getting retribution against Tito won't fly with the fans...they have to make the REAL culprits pay as well, and ownership knows that's a fan expectation as well....lots of change is coming....oh YEAHHHHHHH.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from chronic352. Show chronic352's posts

    Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys

    In Response to Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys:
    [QUOTE]Yes  and AGon  complaining about too many  night games and long  flights in the dark.. Not only are you making  $62,000 to play that game,  but  you get food and drink after,,  a comfortable  757   with lie flat beds .. for those coast to coast flights    where you can sleep ... This team complained about being tired in April..
    Posted by jackyldo[/QUOTE]


    I am not sure AGon was used to it as well as Crawford and there comments were more that they were not used to it.  Now Beckett complaining about it is different.  This is his fifth season and he will whines?
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from traven. Show traven's posts

    Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys

    In Response to Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys : At what. 5.30?  You do know he started going for 200 in July right?  You do know that before his magical 5.30 SEPT he was around 6.00 for July/August right?  You do know the only time he finished a 6th inning in the last 6 weeks of the season was when he got his 200th and his team backed him with about 20 runs right?  So sure maybe in September his 5 something ERA was lower than everyone else's 5 something ERA and as I said in my post, the options behind him weren't great but those losses that piled up on the pursuit to 200, that seemed inconsequential at the time, well would been nice to have 1 or 2 of those.
    Posted by Thesemenarecowards[/QUOTE]

    Totally agree with you that Wake was the reason the season went down the tubes.  Without him one of the other great pitchers could have had a chance to improve their 6+ ERA in September.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxvsGiants. Show RedSoxvsGiants's posts

    Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys

    Theo created this chemistry in the club house.  First he gets Uke and Peddy to sign for hometown rates and then insults them by going out and paying big for the likes of Crawford and Lackey.  How would you feel if you worked your a55 off somewhere and the bosses brought in new guys to do your job but paid them a hellofa lot more.  I feel ripped and I am sure Crawford felt it.  Theo created an uncomfortable atmosphere in that locker room with the way he threw money at the new guys and convinced the old guys to take less.  That would create problems on any job. 

    Ellsbury may not be a Red Sox much longer if he dosent get paid Crawford money by the Sox.  Theo is a brilliant idoit.  He is the root of the problem.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys

    In Response to Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys:
    [QUOTE]Theo created this chemistry in the club house.  First he gets Uke and Peddy to sign for hometown rates and then insults them by going out and paying big for the likes of Crawford and Lackey.  How would you feel if you worked your a55 off somewhere and the bosses brought in new guys to do your job but paid them a hellofa lot more.  I feel ripped and I am sure Crawford felt it.  Theo created an uncomfortable atmosphere in that locker room with the way he threw money at the new guys and convinced the old guys to take less.  That would create problems on any job.
    Posted by RedSoxvsGiants[/QUOTE]

    I disagree, this is just the economics of baseball.  Doesn't seem to be bothering Robinson Cano much.  How about Longoria?  That guy is criminally underpaid by the Rays but it doesn't affect his play.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Kamdog. Show Kamdog's posts

    Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys

    In Response to Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys : I disagree, this is just the economics of baseball.  Doesn't seem to be bothering Robinson Cano much.  How about Longoria?  That guy is criminally underpaid by the Rays but it doesn't affect his play.
    Posted by Hfxsoxnut[/QUOTE]

    Cano knows his deal. They wrapped him up for 10 mill a year when he was a newbie rookie.  He knows they will pay when this contract is over if he is worth it.  So I don't worry about Cano.

    Longoria is on the team he is on, he is not watching what the Sox players were watching with these two siginings.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys

    In Response to Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys:
    [QUOTE]Does all this really matter? Make changes if you have to Mr Hendry and be quick about it. Find a manager whose tough and whose bottom line is winning...stop this babysitting type coaching we've have been accustom to. From players ignoring stop signs on bases to players swinging for the fences at every at bat. It's time for an immediate change... so please Mr Henry make it quick and and let's throw out any or every player in a Red Sox uniform who is not about winning in 2012. I've simply have had a enough of this bulls%$t
    Posted by walk2run[/QUOTE]

    agreed. and while you are at it pickup the best startign pitching availabel and dont complain that you cant compete with yankees, phillies, etc for top starters.
    you have enough money to feed the darned world.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from bredbru. Show bredbru's posts

    Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys

    In Response to Re: Veteran Sox player: Sox clubhouse had "zero" chemistry with too many "me-me-me" guys:
    [QUOTE]The team came into the season out of shape. Compare Josh Beckets pics 2010 to 2011. Add at least ten pounds for the 2011 season. Remeber the Theo rumors in late August? They happen two weeks beore the great collapse happen. Connect the dots, Theo leaving rumor, Wake 200 saga, players fielding, base running, the pitching starts to crumble, and players in droves stop running out ground balls.  Nah, say what you want but the dysfunction came to a head in the last week of August, September was fiction    
    Posted by proftom[/QUOTE]

    exactly.
     its almost good that this happened. francona needed to go. yeah he was great in manging for our championships but he is not a good manager for this team now. that is obvious. and the writing was on the wall when the team didnt show up for the start of the season.
    if we got in, this doesnt happen and the poor effort and attitudes continue for another year or 2. it is better it happened now.

     

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