Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??

    I love it when you people on the far left fight...

    Calling softy a leftist is going to get him banned again.  

    Cue vitriol of unspeakbale magnitudes.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??

    I always loved the guy.  Miserable failure as a first baseman....miraculous reinvention 3 years later as late season & playoff hero as a pitcher....then d'oh!, immediately and completely loses it and is waived 2 years later after a horrible AAA season....then right back atcha, baby, 14-1 1.65 in August 1995 when....d'oh, the roof falls in again. Etc, etc.  Wonderful career to follow, and a great guy always willing to do whatever he was asked...start, relieve, take a beating to preserve the bullpen, always signed team-favourable contracts, etc.

    He was never going to make the HOF, but he did lose 60 starts 99-02 when he should have been starting...and was very consistent if one looks at his career as a whole rather than tear their hair out over the short term.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from saintJ. Show saintJ's posts

    Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??

    I hope the sox give wake a call mid summer and pry him out of retirement.  Hank will have a stroke.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??

    In Response to Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??:
    [QUOTE]I hope the sox give wake a call mid summer and pry him out of retirement.  Hank will have a stroke.
    Posted by saintJ[/QUOTE]

    Wouldn't that be wonderful?  [the mid summer call, not the stroke]
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from SpacemanEephus. Show SpacemanEephus's posts

    Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??

    In Response to Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??:
    [QUOTE]Don't cry sour grapes, Joe. Cameron, when healthy, will always be a better CF'er than Ellsbury. Cameron was never healthy, but didn't take an entire year off at young age, either. When the careers end, Cameron's career will be superior and longer. Careers don't matter when you sign a FA.  It's all about what you can do over the life of your contract.  And you can't separate age from injuries.  When you sign someone that old, you need to expect more injuries. Don't get me wrong.  I thought it was a terrific signing.  I thought Cam, Ells, and Drew could chase down every single ball hit to the OF.  I thought Ells would be a minimum wage Crawford (instead of aminimum wage Joe DiMaggio).  I understood how quickly the decline comes after 35, but chose to ignore it because I like Cam. But when I knew I got it wrong, I recognized my mistake instead of taking it personally.  It still should've worked out better, but it didn't.   Remember that, Joe, and forget about color for a change. I love it when you people on the far left fight about which minorities deserve more of our sympathy.  FWIW, the Native Americans are a much smaller minority than you, and are currently treated much more harshly than you. Here's a hint-don't play the race-bait card with someone that was born in and went to school in the South Bronx.  We're simply better at this than you are.
    Posted by Joebreidey[/QUOTE]

    Oh, but don't forget Joe, Softy has Native American blood in his veins.  His grandmother I believe was part Cherokee, though I think he is now denying such claims.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Chilliwings. Show Chilliwings's posts

    Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??

    In Response to Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.?? : Oh, but don't forget Joe, Softy has Native American blood in his veins.  His grandmother I believe was part Cherokee, though I think he is now denying such claims.
    Posted by SpacemanEephus[/QUOTE]

    Correct, Space, he was part-Cherokee from approximately Q3 2010 to Q4 2011.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from SoxFanInIL. Show SoxFanInIL's posts

    Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??

    In Response to Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??:
    [QUOTE]17 years with one organization and it's like, "about time, let's move on". This is a sad day indeed. I would hate to think that most of RSN share the same opionion with many on this forum that would just as soon run Tim Wakefield out of town on a rail. He deserves our respect. He has certainly earned it! Wake should have been offered a contract, he is better than any of the reclamation projects that Cherington has signed. I have nothing but contempt for this GM.
    Posted by Alibiike[/QUOTE]

    Completely wrong, of course.

    Too old, out of shape, and ineffective.  Loved him, but leaving was overdue.  Evaluating a player with your heart is always a mistake, and blaming the GM for doing his job is worse.

    Understanding he was done is not remotely being "run out of town on a rail."  More untrue drama queen talk.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??

    In Response to Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??:
    [QUOTE]I always loved the guy.  Miserable failure as a first baseman....miraculous reinvention 3 years later as late season & playoff hero as a pitcher....then d'oh!, immediately and completely loses it and is waived 2 years later after a horrible AAA season....then right back atcha, baby, 14-1 1.65 in August 1995 when....d'oh, the roof falls in again. Etc, etc.  Wonderful career to follow, and a great guy always willing to do whatever he was asked...start, relieve, take a beating to preserve the bullpen, always signed team-favourable contracts, etc. He was never going to make the HOF, but he did lose 60 starts 99-02 when he should have been starting...and was very consistent if one looks at his career as a whole rather than tear their hair out over the short term.
    Posted by Chilliwings[/QUOTE]

    Tim almost always defied the odds. One reason so many clowns here bashed him, was because he proved them wrong for so many years. Some clowns wanted him gone after Boone. Some after 2007. And again after 2008, 2009, 2010, and this winter.

    You can throw out the age curve norm with Tim:

    1st 4 Yrs ('92-'95)  30-20  3.59  1.35 WHIP  "Pre-prime"
    Next 5 Yrs (96-00) 55-57  4.87  1.46 "PRIME YEARS"
    Next 4 Yrs (01-04) 43-34  3.96  1.28  Ages 34-38 (Past prime)
    Next 5 Yrs (05-09)  61-51 4.42  1.29 Ages 38-43 (Way past prime)
    Last 2 Yrs (10-11)  11-18  5.22  1.35  Ages 43-45 (After back surgery) 

    His best WHIP years were from 2001-2009 (ages 34-43). Even his last 2 year's (as our 6th starter) WHIP number (1.35) was better than his prime years, equal to his pre-prime years, and better than 4th starter Lackey (1.50) and 5th starter Dice-K (1.39) in 2010 & 2011.

    Chilli, you were right. There were times this guy was untouchable, but then suddenly, "D'Oh!".

    1992 Game Log: (IP H ER)
    9  6  0
    8  7  2
    8  3  1
    9  7  2
    6  8  6
    9  6  0
    9  9  2
    2  7  3
    7  7  3
    6  6  1
    7  5  0
    7  4  2
    5  1  0
    (only 1 game with more hits than IP!) 
    1992 Playoffs:
    18  14  6  (2-0 3.00 ERA/1.05 WHIP)

    1993 was a disaster: He walked 75 in just 128 IP, but only had 1 bad ER game out of his 1st 6, then the wheels totally came off. He was sent to the pen and did OK, then started 7 more games to end the season. Interestingly, he pitched 2 9 inning shoutouts to end the season (only 9 H in 18 IP).

    With the Sox in 1995, he really opened everyone's eyes with his awesome start:
    First 17 starts:
    14-1 (team 15-2)
    He never let up more than 3 ER in those 17 games.
    He pitched a 10 inning game with 0 ERs vs Seattle.
    17 games:
    O ERs 3
    1 ERs 7
    2 ERs 4
    3 ERs 3
    Then... "D'OH!"
    3 IP 7 ER
    7-5
    6-5
    8-1
    6-5
    8-0
    7-6
    6-5
    7-5
    6-1

    In 2002:
    He started 2 games (11 IP  9 H  5 ER  2BB), but was sent to the pen. He had a spot start (6 IP 0 ERs) mixed in, but then became a starter again  on July 31st. After 5 Ip 0 ER and 6 IP 5 ERs, he went on another great 8 game streak:
    IP ER
    8   1
    6   1
    7   1
    7   1
    7   1
    8   1
    8   2
    6   3

    The next year, he let up Boone's late inning HR, and the bashers came out. After 2007, despite going 17-12, guys like softy were saying "he should have retired years ago". The team went 19-12 in his starts of 2007. 11 of those 31 starts Wake let up 0-1 ERs. 

    Many posters, led by softy, argued that Buchholtz, Masterson, or Colon deserved to start instead of Wake. Buch was on 23, and when he got his chance that year went 2-9  6.75. Masterson did well in 9 starts and Colon went 4-2  3.92 before getting hurt. The same thing in 2009 with an injured Dice-K, Penny, Masterson, and an injured Smoltz. It was then that Wake began what I think was his best 50 consecutive start streak of his entire career. Yes, this at age 40-42 and after several posters pleaded for him to retire. The same posters have been gloating about being right for the past 2 years, but neglect to admit they were wrong about 2008 & 2009.

    Wake finished 5th in WHIP in the AL for 2008. Here's his 50 game streak from ages 40-42:
    2008 (30 starts)
    IP  6 5 6 8 6 7 8 3 5 5 8 7 7 7 7 7 7 6 7 7 5 7 6 5 6 2 8 2 6 5
    ER 3 1 2 5 3 3 0 6 3 8 1 2 2 2 3 0 1 3 1 4 6 0 1 3 3 7 0 6 4 0
    2009 (First 16 starts)
    IP 6 9 7 7 5 6 5 8 6 5 7 6 6 7 6  
    ER 3 2 1 0 5 2 7 1 5 6 3 3 2 4 0 



    Out of those 51 starts, Wake had 9 bad starts and 2 not good starts. That means in 40 of 51 starts, Wake pitched decent to great.  That's about 80%!!! (or 4 out of every 5 starts)

    In 2009, the team went 12-3 in his first 15 starts. One loss was 6 IP 3 ER.
    He could have gone 11-2 (team 13-2) with a little luck.

    In 2008, the team went 15-15, while Wake was "credited" with 10-11. He was one of the leagues most "tough luck" starters. Consider these tough breaks: (IP ER)
    6  3  Loss
    7  3  Loss
    8  1  Loss
    7  2  ND
    7  2  ND
    7  3  Loss
    7  1  Loss
    6  1  ND
    7  4  Loss
    7  0  ND
    6  3  Loss
    5  0  ND  

    It's easy to see how Wake could have had 7 more wins & 2 less losses for a 17-9 record. With a lot of luck, he could have gone 22-4. Combine that with the possible 11-2 in 2008, and he could have been 33-6 in this stretch! (Or at least a reasonable 28-11).

    Then, there were those who said he did not belong in the 2009 All start game. Most of those posters are slaves to ERA. Here were the Sox numbers as of July 2, 2009:

    Wake  10-3  4.18 (Team 12-3) 
    Beck     9-3  3.67  (Team 12-4)
    Lester  7-6  4.35  (Team 10-6)
    Penny   6-3  4.79 (Team 9-5)
    Dice-K  1-5  8.23  (Team 2-6)

    I have gone over the 2010-2011 numbers enough already. Yes, his numbers weren't pretty, but he had some bad luck in terms a higher % of inherited runners allowed to score, poor catching of his knuckler (in 2011 only) and many runs scored on IF hits, Sac Flies, and bloop hits. Last year almost half of his ERs were somewhat cheap.  

    In short, going by these two telling stats, Wake was still one of our top 5 starters the past 2 years. He was our 6th starter.

    2010-2011 Sox starter tERA:
    Lest   3.62
    Buch  3.90
    Beck  4.27
    Dice   4.63
    Wake 4.67
    Lack   4.72
    Miller  6.18

    2010-2011 Sox starter WHIP:
    Lester 1.23
    Beck    1.23
    Buch    1.23
    Wake   1.35
    Dice-K 1.39
    Lack     1.50
    Bedard 1.55
    Weil      1.66
    Miller    1.82

    As our 6th starter, silly clowns like mr hanky try to claim that Wake was a major cause of the September collapse, as he led all Sox starters in Sept ERA (5.25) and was 2nd in WHIP (1.417). Certainly not good numbers, but in the context of what our other starters were doing at the same time, blaming Wake for the Sox woes over the past few years is a low point in many poster's records. Some are still bashing him now. Same, shame, same!

    Good luck, Wake! 

    Most of us knowledgeable Sox fans know the true score.






     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from jidgef. Show jidgef's posts

    Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??

    I posted this yesterday on another thread, but it fits better here...
    I got to listen to the Wakefield presser this afternoon and he was as emotional and classy as I would have expected him to be. He thanked the entire organization, naming names, from Joh  Henry to Dan Duquette to his bullpen catchers anbd clubhouse boys. His last few seasons may not have been great, but I can't think of another player on the team that I would rather sit and have a beer with than Tim. But Boston dotcom has to be nervous because the number of hits to all the Softy Wake-bashing threads might cripple their advertising budget. And what on earth, or should I say who on earth, will Softy write about now? Maybe just keep up the attack on our friend Moon.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from hankwilliamsjr. Show hankwilliamsjr's posts

    Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??

     FWIW, the Native Americans are a much smaller minority than you, and are currently treated much more harshly than you.

    Here's a hint-don't play the race-bait card with someone that was born in and went to school in the South Bronx.  We're simply better at this than you are.

    You obviously aren't "better at this". Since you don't know my ancestral lineage, you don't know how I am treated. As for "Native Americans", that is an artifice class description of the federal government. I am a native American, and both senses, and few people would classify as 100% drop aboriginee ancestry.
     
    Pretty clear that your claim of coming out of a South Bronx dung hole is accurate, where a decent man of moral virtue would be castigated with a large cheerleader section.

    "Our friend" Moonshill is a bad shill. He claims that he doesn't like Wakefield, then displays his foolish prideful emotion by calling out Wakefield's first and middle name and doing a political style snipet blitz to defend the washed up beer gutted bald man who took advantage of owernship good will.

    Moonshill said their was a 2 million market for Wakefield. Then he claimed there was 1M market. Then he claimed Wakefield should be offered 800,000 when there was zero MLB contract market. Tim Wakefield was kicked out MLB, begging until it became clear that his begging would work no more. That is a fact.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from daveymo1234. Show daveymo1234's posts

    Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??

    In Response to Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??:
    [QUOTE] FWIW, the Native Americans are a much smaller minority than you, and are currently treated much more harshly than you. Here's a hint-don't play the race-bait card with someone that was born in and went to school in the South Bronx.  We're simply better at this than you are. You obviously aren't "better at this". Since you don't know my ancestral lineage, you don't know how I am treated. As for "Native Americans", that is an artifice class description of the federal government. I am a native American, and both senses, and few people would classify as 100% drop aboriginee ancestry.   Pretty clear that your claim of coming out of a South Bronx dung hole is accurate, where a decent man of moral virtue would be castigated with a large cheerleader section. "Our friend" Moonshill is a bad shill. He claims that he doesn't like Wakefield, then displays his foolish prideful emotion by calling out Wakefield's first and middle name and doing a political style snipet blitz to defend the washed up beer gutted bald man who took advantage of owernship good will. Moonshill said their was a 2 million market for Wakefield. Then he claimed there was 1M market. Then he claimed Wakefield should be offered 800,000 when there was zero MLB contract market. Tim Wakefield was kicked out MLB, begging until it became clear that his begging would work no more. That is a fact.
    Posted by hankwilliamsjr[/QUOTE]

    In the Words of the immortal Ace Ventura...LOOOOOOOOOOOOSER!!!!!!!...THANKS FOR PLAYIN...FACE
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??

    In Response to Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??:
     FWIW, the Native Americans are a much smaller minority than you, and are currently treated much more harshly than you. Here's a hint-don't play the race-bait card with someone that was born in and went to school in the South Bronx.  We're simply better at this than you are. You obviously aren't "better at this". Since you don't know my ancestral lineage, you don't know how I am treated. As for "Native Americans", that is an artifice class description of the federal government. I am a native American, and both senses, and few people would classify as 100% drop aboriginee ancestry.   Pretty clear that your claim of coming out of a South Bronx dung hole is accurate, where a decent man of moral virtue would be castigated with a large cheerleader section. "Our friend" Moonshill is a bad shill. He claims that he doesn't like Wakefield, then displays his foolish prideful emotion by calling out Wakefield's first and middle name and doing a political style snipet blitz to defend the washed up beer gutted bald man who took advantage of owernship good will. Moonshill said their was a 2 million market for Wakefield. Then he claimed there was 1M market. Then he claimed Wakefield should be offered 800,000 when there was zero MLB contract market. Tim Wakefield was kicked out MLB, begging until it became clear that his begging would work no more. That is a fact.
    Posted by hankwilliamsjr


    In the Words of the immortal Ace Ventura...LOOOOOOOOOOOOSER!!!!!!!...THANKS FOR PLAYIN...FACE.

    I see, ole mr hanky is continuing his lies in hopes that by repeating them several dozen times, someone might believe it. I never said there was "2 million market" for Wake. I said he pitched as well as many making over $2M. I said the Sox should offer him between $1M and $1.5M for 2012. It appears there was no such market, at least publicly stated. Later, I said $800K with incentive, but unlike the silly clown, I never denied I had once said $1-1.5M. I ahve no issues with admitting I was wrong, and I have been wrong numerous times. When you make about 100 positions known per month, you're bound to be wrong a few times. I don't run away from my mistakes, or try to gloss over them and revise history like the silly clown.

    See his month long claim that AGon had a 50-50 chance of being traded last winter, later changed to 1005 with the 50-50 that he'd be traded to the Sox. Hogwash!

    See his 6 month long vitriol on what AGon would be worth, and saying he's a worth $17-18M extension. Boom said he was worth Howard money. I said he was worth about $21-22M. After the extension was signed, mr hanky revised history again and said his $18M claim included the 2010 season. Nobody ever includes the previous season's pay when saying what an extension is worth, but softy sure tried.

    See his prideful thread on why AGon would not extend last April. "No way!" he said. If an extension was part of the deal, then SD would have gotten more for him... like his projection of "Jake and Jed". 

    When AGon signed for what I said he would, when I said he would, softy changed his ID and pretended to be someone else (who happenes to hold every simgal outlandish position). I also called the trade of Kelly, Rizzo, and Bowden in Septemeber of 2010... long before softy even mentioned a trade. Softy then lied and said I was linked with harness and others who said SDS would not trade him. I provided my direct (unerased) quote from September where I said that SD fans knew AGon would be traded, so keeping him until July would not get any more to but season tickets than if they traded him in the winter. I pleaded with softy to "get off the fence" and make a call one way or another. He clung to his 50-50 claim up to the day of the trade.

    Look at his backtracking from his wanting Cam to start CF FT and Jake to be the 4th OF'er or traded while his value was high (after 2008, after 2009, after 2010, and still going on now). Never can he admit even a tiny mistake. For some reason, he thinks admitting a mistake shows weakness. He loves to talk of moral superiority, but lives a lie every day.

    The weasel is exposed. His racism is obvious. His hatred of about a third of Sox players and administrators is clearly evident and goes beyond the play on the field. His wishy washy false claims like Mikey was his favorite player are twisted and warped. Next, we'll start hearing how he loved Wake, and Jed, and Jake, and...

    Just wait; it will come someday.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from beavis. Show beavis's posts

    Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??

    In Response to Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??:
    [QUOTE]Softy can now get back to trying to put Cameron in CF and Ellsbury on the bench where he belongs.
    Posted by Joebreidey[/QUOTE]

    Cameron retired yesterday after 17 years in the game...
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??

    In Response to Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.??:
    [QUOTE]In Response to Re: Wakefield to retire today at 5:00 PM May we now move on Softy/Soft Law/HankWilliamsJr.?? : Cameron retired yesterday after 17 years in the game...
    Posted by beavis[/QUOTE]

    Where's softy's pleas that his retirement was years too late?

     

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