What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from SoxPatsCelts1988. Show SoxPatsCelts1988's posts

    What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

    I've switched my stance on this.  Surely both aspects of the game deserve a large part of the blame for these early struggles but I'm now more inclined to put this on the offense.

    There have been just 4 down right bad pitching performances this year (which is still too many):  2 by Lackey, one by Dice-K and one by Lester.  I'm leaving Buchholz' game against the Yanks off of this list because despite not going deep, the Sox were still in a position to come back.  That leaves 7 winnable games that the offense could have picked up the slack in (even though one of Lackey's games turned out to be a win).

    The Red Sox lineup is yet to score more than 5 runs in a loss this season.  Only 3 players are batting higher than their career batting averages right now (Pedroia, Drew, Lowrie).  Five every day players are batting below the Mendoza Line.  I don't have the stats to back this up, but I'd have to assume that the Red Sox are dead last in MLB when hitting with RISP.

    The more and more we point the finger at the pitching (which we should be as well), the more and more I want to blame the offense. Several of these losses were winnable games had the offense hit to their potential.  The sad truth is that only a small handful of guys are hitting to their potential... which may be the difference between the Sox being 5-6 right now instead of 2-9.

    You're going to get bad pitching performances and hitting slumps no matter what happens... but this is a very bad and prolonged hitting slump.

    So what's your take?  Who do you blame more?
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from SoxPatsCelts1988. Show SoxPatsCelts1988's posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

    Thoughts?
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from FRGL27Rings. Show FRGL27Rings's posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

    I think the pitching should be blamed. I can understand some hitters getting off to slow starts because of the weather in April. But Matsuzaka shouldn't be throwing like he is a batting practice pitcher. And John Lackey has no excuses; he did well in spring traing. And what excuse does Buchholz have? Yes there is a new catcher and pitching coach but I still feel the onus is on the pitching staff to quickly straighten out before the Sox finally turn this around.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

    They scored 5 runs on 10 hits the other night and lost..thats good enough to win if the pitching does its job..Although the offense didnt help Lesters game by leaving a small army on the base paths..More pitching, but both have a role..
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from Alibiike. Show Alibiike's posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

    In Response to Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?:
    Thoughts?
    Posted by SoxPatsCelts1988



    I agree that it's the offense. As bad as the pitching has been, they are not hitting well, particularly with RISP.
    I can remember a time when the RS never gave up and came back many times on teams regardless of the score.

    It would be interesting to check to see how many times the RS came back last year from 5 or more runs down. My guess, not very many.
    I get the impression that Francona seems to throw in the towel when the RS are behind by a significant margin, regardless of the inning.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from -EdithBunker-. Show -EdithBunker-'s posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

    I don't like playing the blame game. Each player is responsible for his own performance. I don't like to make generalizations. I think Pedroia made a mistake when he blamed the pitching.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Jakethesnake53. Show Jakethesnake53's posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

     iT'S "comaS"" FAULT FOR NOT GETTING THE vETS READY TO PLAY INSTEAD OF CODDELING THEM, HE SHOULD HAVE WORKED THEIR TALES OFF!!!
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from jesseyeric. Show jesseyeric's posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

    SPC - why do you feel Clay's performance were acceptable? I think they were the oppposite. 10 innings -5 HR's and an ERA of 7.20. And his game against the Yanks was not won by Boston because he was so bad. Pitchers cannot afford to allow big early inning deficits. A team cannot be expected to play catch-up and prevail all the time.

    That being said - baseball is a team game based on individual performances. My take on it is this.

    There is great pressure when you are odds on favor to win in February, especially when in a media zone like Boston. The bullseye is square on their back. And when a team this good starts out slow, hitters tend to grip those bat handles a but tighter and pitchers try and add a couple of extra mph to their pitches. The Sox team as a whole is pressing.

    I am sure the Sox offense will come around and be in the top 3 in runs scored. But just like every other team in baseball, it's the pitching man.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from DirtyWaterLover. Show DirtyWaterLover's posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

    It's both.  You don't have a 2-9 record with just bad pitching and bad hitting.  It takes a joint effort.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from silversteinsox. Show silversteinsox's posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

    Both
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from pinstripezac32. Show pinstripezac32's posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?



    I agree with jessey

    one of the hardest things to do in sports is to

    win when you are suppose to

    thus so few repeat champs

    I blame posters like soxpatscelts

    for their perdictions of 105 wins
     


    personally nothing has change for me

    I never thought 100 plus had merit

    but I'm still sure they will make the PO
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from silversteinsox. Show silversteinsox's posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

    http://www.boston.com/community/forums.html?plckForumPage=ForumDiscussion&plckDiscussionId=Cat%3aSportsForum%3a81df60f3-70ee-4ca3-9336-8cf2c0a8301aDiscussion%3aace62204-8b60-437d-9f5e-086c4dbe7510
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from SoxPatsCelts1988. Show SoxPatsCelts1988's posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

    In Response to Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?:
    SPC - why do you feel Clay's performance were acceptable? I think they were the oppposite. 10 innings -5 HR's and an ERA of 7.20. And his game against the Yanks was not won by Boston because he was so bad. Pitchers cannot afford to allow big early inning deficits. A team cannot be expected to play catch-up and prevail all the time. That being said - baseball is a team game based on individual performances. My take on it is this. There is great pressure when you are odds on favor to win in February, especially when in a media zone like Boston. The bullseye is square on their back. And when a team this good starts out slow, hitters tend to grip those bat handles a but tighter and pitchers try and add a couple of extra mph to their pitches. The Sox team as a whole is pressing. I am sure the Sox offense will come around and be in the top 3 in runs scored. But just like every other team in baseball, it's the pitching man.
    Posted by jesseyeric


    I'm not saying they were acceptable but they certainly weren't horrible.  They were not on the level of both of Lackey's starts, Dice-K's last start or Lester's first start.  I know he gave up the HR's, but 4ER in 6.1 IP is not a horrible game.  I'll take your point about his last start.  He wasn't good but it was still a game that the offense could have bailed him out on.
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from harness. Show harness's posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

    In Response to Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?:
    I don't like playing the blame game. Each player is responsible for his own performance. I don't like to make generalizations. I think Pedroia made a mistake when he blamed the pitching.
    Posted by -EdithBunker-



    I don't agree. Pitching dictates how many runs have to be scored to win. If the pitching stinks, the hitters end up pressing and coming out of their game. And while the opposite is also true, it begins  with pitching.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from marstan. Show marstan's posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

    its the offense. There are only three guys on offense who
    scare anybody...Dustin, A Gon and Papi. Crawford is totally
    useless..he can't hit hrs and he bails out against southpaws.
    How can you match these guys against a Yankee lineup that
    comes out every nite with practically a 6 or 7 man allstar team.
    Nearly everyone in that lineup with the exception of Gardner
    is capable of 15 hrs a season, and Tex, A Rod, and Cano will
    probably hit 30 each. How many guys on the Sox will hit 30 ?
    They have a catcher and we don't. Their relief is as good as
    ours or better, and their starters only have to get to the 6th.
    Figure it out for yourselves. We just don't score so we lose
    9/11. It's not rocket science. The worst team in the division
    kicked our behinds twice in a row.

    /
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from BaseballGM. Show BaseballGM's posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

    Correct, good pitching allows hitters to swing freely and be more selective. Catching has nothing to do with good pitching. Good catching is moving well to block pitches, strong, quick accurate throws ahead and behind baserunners. Pitchers decide what pitches they throw and where they will throw it.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from 67redsox. Show 67redsox's posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

    I think the whole off season crowning of the Sox was stupid.  I didn't follow a lot of it so I don't know what was said but I can't tolerate bragging from any team.

    If any of the Sox players bragged they are getting what they deserve right now.

    If anyone in the sports world made predictions they were stupid too.

    The game is played on the field, not on paper. 

    The Sox have been humbled, good.  Now they need to start playing as a team not as individuals.

    They will turn this thing around, I hope in time to make the post season.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from 1for89. Show 1for89's posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

    a run differential of THREE indicates it is both.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from 1for89. Show 1for89's posts

    Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?

    In Response to Re: What deserves more of the blame for the slow start: The pitching or the offense?:
    I think the whole off season crowning of the Sox was stupid.  I didn't follow a lot of it so I don't know what was said but I can't tolerate bragging from any team. If any of the Sox players bragged they are getting what they deserve right now. If anyone in the sports world made predictions they were stupid too. The game is played on the field, not on paper.  The Sox have been humbled, good.  Now they need to start playing as a team not as individuals. They will turn this thing around, I hope in time to make the post season.
    Posted by 67redsox


    "If anyone in the sports world made predictions they were stupid too."

    NESN is OWNED by the RS.  Nothing like tooting your own horn.  Or spanking your own monkey.

    http://www.nesn.com/2011/01/2011-red-sox-will-challenge-1927-yankees-for-title-of-greatest-team-in-major-league-history.html#comment-6a0115709f071f970b01538dddbc12970b
     
Sections
Shortcuts

Share