What is our real concern?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    What is our real concern?

    The future and who we currently have on the farm in various positions.  Having money for FA's is great when and if you can find the right fit.  How about also trading some of the guys who play all the same positions to fill a few positions we may really need long term?

    IB, Nap, Carp, Overbay, Gomez - Really?

    2B, Pede, Ciraico and nobody on the farm but Brock Holt?

    3B, Middy, Cecchini, Bogy? Ciriaco etc.

    SS, Drew, Ciriaco, Iggy, Marrero, Holt, Vinicio, Bogy? etc.

    C, Salty, Ross, Lav, Swihart, Nap if he can? etc.

    DH, Papi, Nap, Gomez, Lav?

    Pitching,  Besides Clay, Lester, Dempster and Lackey 9 of our top 20 prospects are pitchers in Barnes, De La Rosa, Renaudo, Webster, Wilson, Workman, Britton, Johnson, Owens and Webster take up.  Barnes and De La Rosa are my best bets to make it soon and possibly have more success than guys like Doub, Miller, Morales, Taz etc. who we also have as trade bait.

    OF, Gomes, Carp, Victorino, Sweeney, Ells, Nava, Kalish, Bradley, Brentz, De La Cruz, Jacobs and many others.  Besides "possibly" Bradley in CF who might have the best chance to land in L or RF?

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Flapjack07. Show Flapjack07's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    SS, for once, looks well-stocked. Likewise behind the plate, with Salty, Lavarnway, and eventually Swihart and Vazquez. When one considers that Cecchini or Bogaerts may eventually move Middlebrooks to 1B, the infield should be taken care of.

    So I'd say our biggest long-term needs are starting pitching (as always...you can never assume you have enough, although there are a lot of good prospects there that I have high hopes for) and the outfield, where there isn't much currently after Bradley and Brentz.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Drewski5. Show Drewski5's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    Look at teh current roster:

    Napoli - Not home grown

    Stephen Drew - not home grown

    Vic - Not home grown

    Ortiz - not home grown

    LF platoon - neither home grown

    Salty - not home grown....

    Look at the 2007 team:

    Lugo , ORtiz, Manny, Schill, Beckett, JD Drew , Lowell, 

    2004: Damon, Mueller, Manny, Ortiz, Pedro, Schilling, Bellhorn , VTEK.

    Every year, people like to freak out because when they look three years into the future they  dont have a prospect earmarked for every spot....But it really doesnt matter.  More likely, the 2015-2016 team will have free agents, guys acquired via trade, players youve never heard of, with some home grown prospects.

    Teams like the Padres, Pirates... have to keep their minor league systems stocked because they need replacements when they inevitably lose their stars.  But we can keep our stars and even buy other stars.  

    OMG, what are we going to do when we have Middlebrooks, Boegarts, Cecchini all 3B.  Its very likely that NONE of these guys are our 3B in 2016.  Look at Texas catching.  4 years ago they didnt know what to do because they had too many A++ prospects.  Salty/Teagarden/Max Ramirez.  None panned out, and they wind up w a free agent, haha.

    Im not saying to disregard your farm.  Just dont earmark spots.  Spots are earned not awarded.

     

     

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Drewski5. Show Drewski5's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    Big market teams have an advantage.  We shouldnt operate like a small market team.  To do so would be to disregard our competitive advantage.

     

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    In response to Drewski5's comment:

     

    Im not saying to disregard your farm.  Just dont earmark spots.  Spots are earned not awarded.

     

     



    Very important statement Drewski, which is why I'm not a fan of inserting a youngster like Iggy into an already patched starting lineup that has featured a low OBP, mediocre pitching and very few reliable every day players.  I only see a few important pieces to our puzzle possibly coming from the farm in the next year or two. 

    The question is how many mediocre players does a team need at any given position whether at the minor or major league level?  We need to do a better job addressing our long term needs at both levels at every position. 

    We added depth but nothing that will really help anymore than last season in my opinion if the few reliable players we do have go on the DL again. 

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    In response to Flapjack07's comment:

     

    SS, for once, looks well-stocked. Likewise behind the plate, with Salty, Lavarnway, and eventually Swihart and Vazquez. When one considers that Cecchini or Bogaerts may eventually move Middlebrooks to 1B, the infield should be taken care of.

    So I'd say our biggest long-term needs are starting pitching (as always...you can never assume you have enough, although there are a lot of good prospects there that I have high hopes for) and the outfield, where there isn't much currently after Bradley and Brentz.

     



    I agree flapjack, theres a good chance our IF turns out well if we can find a position for some of the youngsters who at the moment play the same positions.  I just think we are "hopefull deep" at a few positions and "close to empty" in others. 

     

    Injuries to any key players will continue to be a problem until addressed. 

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Ice-Cream. Show Ice-Cream's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    Boston's projected payroll for 2013 is around $151 million which is the fourth highest behind the Dodgers (duh~~ lol), Yankees and Phillies.

    Boy did that add up real quick. 

     

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    In response to Ice-Cream's comment:

    Boston's projected payroll for 2013 is around $151 million which is the fourth highest behind the Dodgers (duh~~ lol), Yankees and Phillies.

    Boy did that add up real quick. 

     



    Another good point Ice Cream, how many of us true die hard sox fans acually believe we put our best foot forward this off season after a great salary dump?

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxKimmi. Show RedSoxKimmi's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    In response to craze4sox's comment:

    Another good point Ice Cream, how many of us true die hard sox fans acually believe we put our best foot forward this off season after a great salary dump?




    It depends on what you mean by putting our best foot forward. What I didn't want to see happen this off season was the Sox taking that freed up salary and tying it up in other long term contracts. I also didn't want to see ownership sit on this money, which I really didn't think they would do.

    Did we sign the best players that were available? No.    But, the FO put a contending team together for 2013, IMO, while not sacrificing the future either financially or in terms of prospects. So in that regard, yes, we put our best foot forward.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    In response to RedSoxKimmi's comment:

    In response to craze4sox's comment:

     

    Another good point Ice Cream, how many of us true die hard sox fans acually believe we put our best foot forward this off season after a great salary dump?




    It depends on what you mean by putting our best foot forward. What I didn't want to see happen this off season was the Sox taking that freed up salary and tying it up in other long term contracts. I also didn't want to see ownership sit on this money, which I really didn't think they would do.

     

    Did we sign the best players that were available? No.    But, the FO put a contending team together for 2013, IMO, while not sacrificing the future either financially or in terms of prospects. So in that regard, yes, we put our best foot forward.

    Again I agree Kimmi, a lot of our fans have made great points.  I just have to question whether our current ownership really has a plan for the future.  They allowed so many mistakes to be made on the FA market over the Theo years I'm just not sure they know the direction right now thats best for the teams future.  As Ice Cream stated our payroll is around 151mil and all we have really done is to find a right handed mate for a left handed batter and rest our hopes on the same type pitching staff.

    With Dempster and Lackey I don't think we are any better off than last season but we should have a stronger pen.

    My real question for our FO is ... Do you really have a plan?  or should you sell the club to someone who might.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    I wouldn't worry about lack of prospect depth at 2B, many minor league SSs end up there, and we seem very deep at 2B and 3B.

    I'm also not worried about 1B: it is the easiest position to fill with a player near the middle of the pack in 1B OPS.

    I'm worried more about pitching, although we have several prospects at varying levels of readiness that look very promising.

    Our OF looks sketchy too. Bradley, Brentz and a couple more guys look good, but we are pretty weak at all 3 ML OF slots next year (assuming Ells bolts).

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from pumpsie-green. Show pumpsie-green's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    In response to RedSoxKimmi's comment:

    In response to craze4sox's comment:

     

    Another good point Ice Cream, how many of us true die hard sox fans acually believe we put our best foot forward this off season after a great salary dump?




    It depends on what you mean by putting our best foot forward. What I didn't want to see happen this off season was the Sox taking that freed up salary and tying it up in other long term contracts. I also didn't want to see ownership sit on this money, which I really didn't think they would do.

     

    Did we sign the best players that were available? No.    But, the FO put a contending team together for 2013, IMO, while not sacrificing the future either financially or in terms of prospects. So in that regard, yes, we put our best foot forward.




    Time will tell Kimmi, but most "experts" do not see this team as a real contender. No, we did not sacrifice the future; neither did we do anything to make it brighter. More likely we are a 4th or last place team in the ALE.

     

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from craze4sox. Show craze4sox's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    I wouldn't worry about lack of prospect depth at 2B, many minor league SSs end up there, and we seem very deep at 2B and 3B.

    I'm also not worried about 1B: it is the easiest position to fill with a player near the middle of the pack in 1B OPS.

    I'm worried more about pitching, although we have several prospects at varying levels of readiness that look very promising.

    Our OF looks sketchy too. Bradley, Brentz and a couple more guys look good, but we are pretty weak at all 3 ML OF slots next year (assuming Ells bolts).

     



    moon, although our opinions have differed as much as we have agreed on many subjects I think our heart is in the same place.  I really think we need to take a serious look at all future positions.  Maybe we are and and I'm just another rambling fan.  After all they are the experts when all is said and done, not you or I.

    Competing is great and it helps to sell tickets which is where I think our FO'S mindset is today.  My stance and yours for the most part?  We need to trade some guys to fill future holes instead of filling holes with mediocre replacements for a year or two hoping one of our prospects may be the answer two or three years down the road.

    We have some prospects that may do this but if and when this happens we will have gone through another year or two of struggles while still being far from great in my opinion.

     
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  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from tcal2-. Show tcal2-'s posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    Knowing what percentage of brown spots is acceptable on a Banana.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from BosoxJoe5. Show BosoxJoe5's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    In response to pumpsie-green's comment:

    In response to RedSoxKimmi's comment:

     

    In response to craze4sox's comment:

     

    Another good point Ice Cream, how many of us true die hard sox fans acually believe we put our best foot forward this off season after a great salary dump?




    It depends on what you mean by putting our best foot forward. What I didn't want to see happen this off season was the Sox taking that freed up salary and tying it up in other long term contracts. I also didn't want to see ownership sit on this money, which I really didn't think they would do.

     

    Did we sign the best players that were available? No.    But, the FO put a contending team together for 2013, IMO, while not sacrificing the future either financially or in terms of prospects. So in that regard, yes, we put our best foot forward.

     




    Time will tell Kimmi, but most "experts" do not see this team as a real contender. No, we did not sacrifice the future; neither did we do anything to make it brighter. More likely we are a 4th or last place team in the ALE.

     

     




    Most people have the Red Sox competing for one of the WC spots. This team is going to atleast be 500.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from pinstripezac35. Show pinstripezac35's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    In response to RedSoxKimmi's comment:


    It depends on what you mean by putting our best foot forward. What I didn't want to see happen this off season was the Sox taking that freed up salary and tying it up in other long term contracts. I also didn't want to see ownership sit on this money, which I really didn't think they would do.

     

    Did we sign the best players that were available? No.    But, the FO put a contending team together for 2013, IMO, while not sacrificing the future either financially or in terms of prospects. So in that regard, yes, we put our best foot forward.



    don't leave out the not giving up any draft choices

    which IMO might of  been just a tad to greedy

    if one could easily go from last to the top

    without doing any of the above

    why would anyone else ever do those things


     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from Ice-Cream. Show Ice-Cream's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    I have the Red Sox (if healthy) winning 87 games and earning a wild card berth. 

    Last year, the Red Sox bullpen blew 22 games (tied with the Angels for most in the majors).  I do not see this happening this year. 

    The line-up will score runs.  Despite all of their injuries, they were fifth in runs scored. 

    The key is their starting rotation.  Last year, the starting rotation's ERA was third worst in the AL.

    My prediction of the teams who will make the playoffs

    AL East: Toronto, Boston

    AL Central: Detroit

    AL West: Oakland, Angels 

     

     
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  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Schumpeters-Ghost. Show Schumpeters-Ghost's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    In response to Drewski5's comment:

    Big market teams have an advantage.  We shouldnt operate like a small market team.  To do so would be to disregard our competitive advantage.

     




     

    Since when do "Big Market Teams" sign 5 guys who batted less than .225?

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    Most people have the Red Sox competing for one of the WC spots. This team is going to atleast be 500.

     

    What's "competing"?

    7 down for the last WC slot with 8 to play?

    7 down with 14 to play?

    7 down with 21 to play?

    7 down with 28 to play?

     

    My worst fear is that we will be 7 down at the deadline and Ben might think we still have a chance and not sell off the guys that will bolt after 2013 or the FAs we just signed who will not help much in 2014 or 2015 (Dempster/SV). We end up missing the playoffs by a mile, and have nothing to show for Ellsbury, Salty, Demp, and Vict...

    Even if we squeek into the playoffs and bow out early, are we any better going into 2014 or 2015 than we were before this winter began? It may help guys like Hanraqhan want to stay, but if all we get for Ellsbury is a sandwich pick, and we get nothing for Salty and others, I'll be here saying, "I told you so". I'm also sure that if we win it all, I'll be hearing in stereo, "Moon, we told you so!!!"

     

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    In response to Schumpeters-Ghost's comment:

    In response to Drewski5's comment:

     

    Big market teams have an advantage.  We shouldnt operate like a small market team.  To do so would be to disregard our competitive advantage.

     

     




     

     

    Since when do "Big Market Teams" sign 5 guys who batted less than .225?



    We didn't sign Carp. 

    Napoli has never batted below .227 and is career .259.

    Victorino batted .255 (career .275).

    Gomes batted .262.

    Ross batted .256.

    Drew batted .223. That's one. (career .265)

     

    The guys you are talking about, I assume Carp & Overbay (who has also never hit below .234), will not even make the 25 man roster unless we are crippled with injuries.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from BostonTrollSpanker. Show BostonTrollSpanker's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    "Did we sign the best players that were available? No.    But, the FO put a contending team together for 2013, IMO, while not sacrificing the future either financially or in terms of prospects. So in that regard, yes, we put our best foot forward."

    I actually agree with that even though I have been accused of being negative on the team, I see a more positive aspect of this approach than some. Having said that, this kind of approach puts a lot of stake on our prospects, which can be a dangerous game as well. But if our prospects our good it may look like a genius move...otherwise, not so much....

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from kimsaysthis. Show kimsaysthis's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    I wouldn't worry about lack of prospect depth at 2B, many minor league SSs end up there, and we seem very deep at 2B and 3B.

    I'm also not worried about 1B: it is the easiest position to fill with a player near the middle of the pack in 1B OPS.

    I'm worried more about pitching, although we have several prospects at varying levels of readiness that look very promising.

    Our OF looks sketchy too. Bradley, Brentz and a couple more guys look good, but we are pretty weak at all 3 ML OF slots next year (assuming Ells bolts).




    I was just going to say that 2B sounds iffy considering Pedroia's injury. It could be easily aggravated, especially the way Pedroia covers his whole area throwing himself all over the place. I'm glad you've said you don't find that position a concern.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from kimsaysthis. Show kimsaysthis's posts

    Re: What is our real concern?

    In response to tcal2-'s comment:

    Knowing what percentage of brown spots is acceptable on a Banana.




    They're all acceptable. When the banana gets really brown it's the perfect banana for banana bread.

     
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