Why Buch is about to step into the ACE role....

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Why Buch is about to step into the ACE role....

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    Taking a long time between pitches seems to have been an organizational philosophy. I'm not sure why, since I've always heard that pitchers are at their best when they work quickly and can get into a rhythm. I am really glad to see Farrell and the pitching coaches working on quickening the pace.

     



    Actually, I think it was a bad habit our pitchers picked up from Beckett while he was our "staff leader".

     

    Yes, the reason we have been losing is because our best pitcher over the last 6 years took too much time between pitchers, everyone else mimiked him, and now they all stink.



    It was certainly something that contributed. Both Lester and Buch werent known to pitch that slow when they first came up. Whether anyone wants to admit it or not, Beckett had a lot of influence on our younger pitchers whether it was intentional or not. But no one ever said that it was the one reason they all stunk the joint up last year...That ridiculous.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from redsoxdirtdog. Show redsoxdirtdog's posts

    Re: Why Buch is about to step into the ACE role....

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment

    Taking a long time between pitches seems to have been an organizational philosophy. I'm not sure why, since I've always heard that pitchers are at their best when they work quickly and can get into a rhythm. I am really glad to see Farrell and the pitching coaches working on quickening the pace.

    Actually, I think it was a bad habit our pitchers picked up from Beckett while he was our "staff leader".

     

    Yes, the reason we have been losing is because our best pitcher over the last 6 years took too much time between pitchers, everyone else mimiked him, and now they all stink.

    It was certainly something that contributed. Both Lester and Buch werent known to pitch that slow when they first came up. Whether anyone wants to admit it or not, Beckett had a lot of influence on our younger pitchers whether it was intentional or not. But no one ever said that it was the one reason they all stunk the joint up last year...That ridiculous




    When little bobby v tried to speed up Beckett, he was given the stiff arm by Beckett.   That attitude certainly seemed to rub off on the entire SR.  That skroo yoo, I'll do what I want big texas tough guy tude.  Bobby v was a joke, but Beckett simply wanted to play the big dog and mark HIS territory.  What a complete A whole he became!!!  Love the new "just throw the dang ball" attitude Farrell is pushing!!!! 

    Without a shred of a doubt, ADDITION by subtraction with Beckett!

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Why Buch is about to step into the ACE role....

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to redsoxdirtdog's comment:

     

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

     

    Buch has some of the best pure stuff in the AL.  But to me he has to prove he can pitch 220 innings if he wants to be in that top tier.

     




    Anybody heard anything about Buchs workout program in the off season?  Let's hope Buch can simply stay healthy and give the Sox those 220 innings!!! 

     

    I think we're about to see a new and improved Buch, without his favorite golf partner.  It seems he's locked in and ready to roll!  Definitely a clear case of addition by subtraction w/ Beckett. :)

     



    "Definitely"?

     

    Seems speculative to me.



    On the other hand, last year, coming off the back injury, he pitched a career-high 189 innings. And the reason it wasn't higher was due to illness not injury.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from jasko2248. Show jasko2248's posts

    Re: Why Buch is about to step into the ACE role....

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

     

    Taking a long time between pitches seems to have been an organizational philosophy. I'm not sure why, since I've always heard that pitchers are at their best when they work quickly and can get into a rhythm. I am really glad to see Farrell and the pitching coaches working on quickening the pace.

     



    Actually, I think it was a bad habit our pitchers picked up from Beckett while he was our "staff leader".

     

    Yes, the reason we have been losing is because our best pitcher over the last 6 years took too much time between pitchers, everyone else mimiked him, and now they all stink.

     



    It was certainly something that contributed. Both Lester and Buch werent known to pitch that slow when they first came up. Whether anyone wants to admit it or not, Beckett had a lot of influence on our younger pitchers whether it was intentional or not. But no one ever said that it was the one reason they all stunk the joint up last year...That ridiculous.

     



    In Tito's book, he mentions how Lester, whom he considers a son, got to the point where he started wearing cowboy boots and speaking with southern drawl because he looked up to Beckett so much.  There is absolutely no question that a lot of these guys followed Beckett's "lead."  It doesn't matter to me who believes it or not, but it's pretty common knowledge.  They didn't sign Dempster just for the stats on the back of his baseball card, either.  Beckett being gone has also eliminated that "clique" thing among those guys, which some players resented. 

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from redsoxdirtdog. Show redsoxdirtdog's posts

    Re: Why Buch is about to step into the ACE role....

    In response to royf19's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to redsoxdirtdog's comment:

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

    Buch has some of the best pure stuff in the AL.  But to me he has to prove he can pitch 220 innings if he wants to be in that top tier.

     




    Anybody heard anything about Buchs workout program in the off season?  Let's hope Buch can simply stay healthy and give the Sox those 220 innings!!! 

    I think we're about to see a new and improved Buch, without his favorite golf partner.  It seems he's locked in and ready to roll!  Definitely a clear case of addition by subtraction w/ Beckett. :)

    "Definitely"?

    Seems speculative to me.
    On the other hand, last year, coming off the back injury, he pitched a career-high 189 innings. And the reason it wasn't higher was due to illness not injury.




    Good point.  I forgot about that stomach thing.  He could easily have been over 200 without that.

    It's going to be a career year for Buch!!!  If he stays healthy, the kid is about to roll!  I hope Lester and Buch push eachother all season long, launching this team into the post season.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from carnie. Show carnie's posts

    Re: Why Buch is about to step into the ACE role....

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    Taking a long time between pitches seems to have been an organizational philosophy. I'm not sure why, since I've always heard that pitchers are at their best when they work quickly and can get into a rhythm. I am really glad to see Farrell and the pitching coaches working on quickening the pace.

     



    Actually, I think it was a bad habit our pitchers picked up from Beckett while he was our "staff leader".

     

    Yes, the reason we have been losing is because our best pitcher over the last 6 years took too much time between pitchers, everyone else mimiked him, and now they all stink.



    Where did I say that? All I said was that Josh takes a long time between pitches and everyone else seemed to pick up on it. Seriously moon, you might be taking your role as the defender of all things Josh a tad too seriously.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Why Buch is about to step into the ACE role....

    In response to redsoxdirtdog's comment:

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

     

    In response to moonslav59's comment

    Taking a long time between pitches seems to have been an organizational philosophy. I'm not sure why, since I've always heard that pitchers are at their best when they work quickly and can get into a rhythm. I am really glad to see Farrell and the pitching coaches working on quickening the pace.

    Actually, I think it was a bad habit our pitchers picked up from Beckett while he was our "staff leader".

     

    Yes, the reason we have been losing is because our best pitcher over the last 6 years took too much time between pitchers, everyone else mimiked him, and now they all stink.

    It was certainly something that contributed. Both Lester and Buch werent known to pitch that slow when they first came up. Whether anyone wants to admit it or not, Beckett had a lot of influence on our younger pitchers whether it was intentional or not. But no one ever said that it was the one reason they all stunk the joint up last year...That ridiculous

     




    When little bobby v tried to speed up Beckett, he was given the stiff arm by Beckett.   That attitude certainly seemed to rub off on the entire SR.  That skroo yoo, I'll do what I want big texas tough guy tude.  Bobby v was a joke, but Beckett simply wanted to play the big dog and mark HIS territory.  What a complete A whole he became!!!  Love the new "just throw the dang ball" attitude Farrell is pushing!!!! 

     

    Without a shred of a doubt, ADDITION by subtraction with Beckett!



    I think this year, it'll be more addition by addition, the addition being Farrell, whom the players respect. Valentine was a joke in that he did nothing to earn the respect of players. Beckett had plenty of success pitching the way he did, so why should he change? I think he's no different than any of us.

    If someone new came in to your job and started telling you to do something different from the way you were doing it and had plenty of success doing it that way, you (you being general, not specifically you) would be reluctant to change if you didn't respect the person who was giving that advice. That's a normal human condition. If someone came in whom you had tremendous respect for, you'd be more likely to listen to his suggestions.

    That's the difference between Farrell and Valentine. Farrell behaves professionally, so the players respect him and are more willing to listen. How can you respect a manager like Valentine who put on a Groucho Marx mask after being ejected from the game? 

    Can imagine Tony LaRussa, Joe Torre, Joe Maddon, for example, doing that? That baggage comes with the manager. Valentine came in with the aura that everything was about him. He was a joke. It wasn't just a Josh Beckett "marking his territory" who didn't listen to him. No one respected him. Beckett respected Farrell, so if he was still here, I'm sure they'd be able to work together.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from redsoxdirtdog. Show redsoxdirtdog's posts

    Re: Why Buch is about to step into the ACE role....

    In response to royf19's comment:

    In response to redsoxdirtdog's comment:

    In response to southpaw777's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment

    Taking a long time between pitches seems to have been an organizational philosophy. I'm not sure why, since I've always heard that pitchers are at their best when they work quickly and can get into a rhythm. I am really glad to see Farrell and the pitching coaches working on quickening the pace.

    Actually, I think it was a bad habit our pitchers picked up from Beckett while he was our "staff leader".

     

    Yes, the reason we have been losing is because our best pitcher over the last 6 years took too much time between pitchers, everyone else mimiked him, and now they all stink.

    It was certainly something that contributed. Both Lester and Buch werent known to pitch that slow when they first came up. Whether anyone wants to admit it or not, Beckett had a lot of influence on our younger pitchers whether it was intentional or not. But no one ever said that it was the one reason they all stunk the joint up last year...That ridiculous

     
    When little bobby v tried to speed up Beckett, he was given the stiff arm by Beckett.   That attitude certainly seemed to rub off on the entire SR.  That skroo yoo, I'll do what I want big texas tough guy tude.  Bobby v was a joke, but Beckett simply wanted to play the big dog and mark HIS territory.  What a complete A whole he became!!!  Love the new "just throw the dang ball" attitude Farrell is pushing!!!! 

     

    Without a shred of a doubt, ADDITION by subtraction with Beckett!

    I think this year, it'll be more addition by addition, the addition being Farrell, whom the players respect. Valentine was a joke in that he did nothing to earn the respect of players. Beckett had plenty of success pitching the way he did, so why should he change? I think he's no different than any of us.

    If someone new came in to your job and started telling you to do something different from the way you were doing it and had plenty of success doing it that way, you (you being general, not specifically you) would be reluctant to change if you didn't respect the person who was giving that advice. That's a normal human condition. If someone came in whom you had tremendous respect for, you'd be more likely to listen to his suggestions.

    That's the difference between Farrell and Valentine. Farrell behaves professionally, so the players respect him and are more willing to listen. How can you respect a manager like Valentine who put on a Groucho Marx mask after being ejected from the game? 

    Can imagine Tony LaRussa, Joe Torre, Joe Maddon, for example, doing that? That baggage comes with the manager. Valentine came in with the aura that everything was about him. He was a joke. It wasn't just a Josh Beckett "marking his territory" who didn't listen to him. No one respected him. Beckett respected Farrell, so if he was still here, I'm sure they'd be able to work together.




    SPOT ON!  Valentine was a JOKE from day 1.  He took a bad situation and made it infinitely worse.  I think many posters here view any knock on little bobby v as a defense of all things Tito  Absolutely not!  Most Sox fans realize that Tito had lost control of the clubhouse an a change was needed.  Little bobby v. was simply the worst replacement imaginable!  

    I agree with the addition by addition, visa vie Farrell, but I also see a big addition by subtraction with Beckett.  It was simply time for him to move on.  He had worn out his welcome here in Boston!

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from michaelsjr. Show michaelsjr's posts

    Re: Why Buch is about to step into the ACE role....

    Yep.  If you ever watched Greg Maddux, you know what Farrell is talking about.  Maddux could wrap a complete game in 3 hrs. 

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Why Buch is about to step into the ACE role....

    I agree, but I would love to see a change by dealing Salty.  I think it would be a good thing for the pitchers to gain some continuity.  I honestly think Salty hurts us behind the plate.  Too big a target, dwarfing the mit.  Too long.  Too slow.  Not too bright.  The Sox need to give up the ghost on this big pop rally killing catcher who hurts us up the middle on D.  Nice kid, but there's a reason he was not a full time catcher before the Sox.  He was given a shot, & they didn't like what they saw.  The Sox are still seeing a mirage...

    I was for trading Salty (and all other FAs to be) this winter as well, but it will have to be at the deadline now, unless some contender loses their catcher and gets desperate enough to make us an offer we can't refuse.

    I am also not sure if Ross can catch more than 90-100 games, so I'm not sure the continuity thing would happen your way either. I have always been for platooning catchers by lefty-righty offense, so each catcher gets exposed to all the pitchers, in case one goes down, it's not a starting from scratch situation. I never liked the VTek as Beckett's caddy method of platooning, but that way does build continuity. What burned my up was that Tito stuck to the personal caddy method, then used VMart with Beckett in the playoffs, and poof- a loss.  Not saying that was the only reason we lost, but VMart had almost no experience with Beckett (16 innings all year).

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from redsoxdirtdog. Show redsoxdirtdog's posts

    Re: Why Buch is about to step into the ACE role....

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    I agree, but I would love to see a change by dealing Salty.  I think it would be a good thing for the pitchers to gain some continuity.  I honestly think Salty hurts us behind the plate.  Too big a target, dwarfing the mit.  Too long.  Too slow.  Not too bright.  The Sox need to give up the ghost on this big pop rally killing catcher who hurts us up the middle on D.  Nice kid, but there's a reason he was not a full time catcher before the Sox.  He was given a shot, & they didn't like what they saw.  The Sox are still seeing a mirage...

    I was for trading Salty (and all other FAs to be) this winter as well, but it will have to be at the deadline now, unless some contender loses their catcher and gets desperate enough to make us an offer we can't refuse.

    I am also not sure if Ross can catch more than 90-100 games, so I'm not sure the continuity thing would happen your way either. I have always been for platooning catchers by lefty-righty offense, so each catcher gets exposed to all the pitchers, in case one goes down, it's not a starting from scratch situation. I never liked the VTek as Beckett's caddy method of platooning, but that way does build continuity. What burned my up was that Tito stuck to the personal caddy method, then used VMart with Beckett in the playoffs, and poof- a loss.  Not saying that was the only reason we lost, but VMart had almost no experience with Beckett (16 innings all year).



    Good points!

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from ctredsoxfanhugh. Show ctredsoxfanhugh's posts

    Re: Why Buch is about to step into the ACE role....

    In response to redsoxdirtdog's comment:

    In response to royf19's comment:

     

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to redsoxdirtdog's comment:

    In response to ctredsoxfanhugh's comment:

    Buch has some of the best pure stuff in the AL.  But to me he has to prove he can pitch 220 innings if he wants to be in that top tier.

     




    Anybody heard anything about Buchs workout program in the off season?  Let's hope Buch can simply stay healthy and give the Sox those 220 innings!!! 

    I think we're about to see a new and improved Buch, without his favorite golf partner.  It seems he's locked in and ready to roll!  Definitely a clear case of addition by subtraction w/ Beckett. :)

    "Definitely"?

    Seems speculative to me.
    On the other hand, last year, coming off the back injury, he pitched a career-high 189 innings. And the reason it wasn't higher was due to illness not injury.

     




    Good point.  I forgot about that stomach thing.  He could easily have been over 200 without that.

     

    It's going to be a career year for Buch!!!  If he stays healthy, the kid is about to roll!  I hope Lester and Buch push eachother all season long, launching this team into the post season.



    That was a good point, I'd forgotten about the bug.  This makes me slightly more optimistic for Bucch

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from snakeoil123. Show snakeoil123's posts

    Re: Why Buch is about to step into the ACE role....

    In response to redsoxdirtdog's comment:

    This kids is really dealing!  When you can go 94mph to 74mph changeup, really mix pitches, HIT YOUR SPOTS as he is doing, and stay healthy, you are ready for a HUGE YEAR......  I'm predicting about 20 wins from Buch, and pushing Lester for the ACE role on this team.

    With two potential 20 game winners, I give the Sox a more than decent chance of making the post season.   I really think these two are poised to light it up this season!  Farrell will do a great job of keeping their heads in the game, which was Lester's biggest problem the past few years.



    Buch has some of the best stuff in baseball. If he and Lester pitch up to capability and Lackey and Dempster pitch reasonably well this team is tough.

     

     

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