Why I, personally, do not like Henry and Co.

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from ma6dragon9. Show ma6dragon9's posts

    Why I, personally, do not like Henry and Co.

    It started out well enough. They come in and want to save Fenway as opposed to working on a new stadium. Fans were kind of split at the time on this point, but overall, I don't think many people would call it a 'bad' idea. And, obviously, they were present for the Sox to break an 86 year drought.

    Since then, however, here's some things I have real issues with:

    Red Sox Nation - This was a FAN derived term. It grew in exposure organically, and was a moniker many of us proudly supported BEFORE winning in 2004. Henry and Co. stole the name, and started charging addmission for it, 50/100 bucks I believe, to have a paper card and the the 'right' to buy tickets at face value! That's just embarrassing.

    Fenway Park - Fenway is a symbol of boston, of the Red Sox, and of Boston itself. They seemingly wanted to save it, they've made some good changes inside the field, I think it's absurd how they've taken over the streets SURROUNDING the park now, but that's not a huge deal. My issue is they took this revered, historical name, spirited it away and stuck it on a NASCAR team! Again, they inherited this park as part of the purchase, and stole the name of it's 100 year old park and stuck it somewhere that very few people in boston, in MA, or fans of the Sox care about. Yet another flat out money grab by these businessmen. They wanted the notoriety of Fenway to increase the reckognition of their NASCAR team. Not cool.

    Ticket Prices/Sellout Streak - Ticket prices are high, as they should be. Red Sox are a hot commoddity, and the park is small. I believe the sellout streak started after they bought it, so credit for that. However, to keep propping this sfalse sellout streak up because of their unholy alliance with Ace Ticket is sickening. Nobody can convince me that there weren't THOUSANDS of tickets sitting in an office in brookline through April/May of 2010 as the game was reported as a sellout, and at least 10,000 seats would be empty for MANY games. Also, it's hard to get tickets at face value as it is, letting Ace Ticket resell so many is downright criminal. It's ok for them to sell at 3x face, but I can't sell for 20 bucks over outside the stadium?

    They cut Francona's legs out from under him after he's out the door. They make Cherrington fall on his sword and say HE was the one who pushed for Crawford, and then cut HIS legs out from under him during the managerial search.

    They are a joke. Yes, baseball has BECOME a business, but that IS NOT what is was built on, that IS NOT what brought in millions of fans. It's a game of passion that grew big enough that greedy people started paying attention and wanting to cash in. I'm so sick of hearing "well, baseball is a business" and people just accept it.
     
    In the 90s and early 2000s there was a list of things that people around here would criticize the Yankees for: Spending outrageously and stupidly mostly. Well, the Sox have caught them there, and passed them in other areas. I used to rip on Stenibrenner, but I've grown to understand that at least, with the Yankees, he was a FAN first, and a BUSINESS man second. The Sox are now business men first, image driven second, and fans possibly third, though I could easily be forgetting something they value above actually winning. If they could figure out a way to make more money while losing, I guarantee they would.

    You've made your money, sell the team for the 1-1.5 billion youd get, get close to double your investment back, PLUS whatever has been made over the past 10 years and move on.

    Print up 10,000,000 $100 stock vouchers and sell them to the public and we'll elect people into the presidency of the team. Those 10mil vouchers would go faster than 10mil anything they currently sell.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from JimfromFlorida. Show JimfromFlorida's posts

    Re: Why I, personally, do not like Henry and Co.

    You must be an Occupier since you have some facts wrong and do not understand business..

    "Red Sox Nation" was first coined by Boston Globe feature writer Nathan Cobb in an October 20, 1986.
    It was not from the fans if anything Mr. Cobb has a bone to pick with the fans and the ownership
    .

    The RS are a business and always have been a business. If these men had not done what they have done you would probably have no WS wins. Using the name is a good business move. It helps the NASCAR team and keeps the team in the eyes of those that may never think about the RS ==NASCAR fans. It is called marketing it is done to help the business stay in the black and not need a bailout.

    When Mr. Yawkey had the team and those after him did not treat it as a business we had terrible teams. Even when they did they screwed it up badly. This current management despite your crying has given you a decent place to see a game. A very good team to watch. They have put far more money into the RS business than almost every other team.

    If you wish to have a team that is more like what you want go watch the Pirates, Royals, and many others.

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from ma6dragon9. Show ma6dragon9's posts

    Re: Why I, personally, do not like Henry and Co.

    In Response to Re: Why I, personally, do not like Henry and Co.:
    You must be an Occupier since you have some facts wrong and do not understand business.. "Red Sox Nation" was first coined by Boston Globe feature writer Nathan Cobb in an October 20, 1986. It was not from the fans if anything Mr. Cobb has a bone to pick with the fans and the ownership . The RS are a business and always have been a business. If these men had not done what they have done you would probably have no WS wins. Using the name is a good business move. It helps the NASCAR team and keeps the team in the eyes of those that may never think about the RS ==NASCAR fans. It is called marketing it is done to help the business stay in the black and not need a bailout. When Mr. Yawkey had the team and those after him did not treat it as a business we had terrible teams. Even when they did they screwed it up badly. This current management despite your crying has given you a decent place to see a game. A very good team to watch. They have put far more money into the RS business than almost every other team. If you wish to have a team that is more like what you want go watch the Pirates, Royals, and many others.
    Posted by JimfromFlorida


    Fair enough. My point was, the term existed before they came along, they stole it and profit from it.

    If companies fall out of the black, they SHOULDN'T GET A BAILOUT, to say they have to advertise or end up getting a publicly funded bailout is...it's just absurd.

    I agreed with your other points about why it makes sense for business men. My problem is sports being run by businessmen.

    They've sold the soul of the Red Sox for a few trophies...was it worth it? And to say the teams before they bought the Sox were bad is flat out ignorant. They have on of the highest winning percentages in baseball going back the mid-80s and possibly longer. Talk about being wrong. They never won, but they were OFTEN very good.

    Exactly my point about NASCAR, Fenway never had even the slightest bit of anything to do with any type of racing, they stole the name just to bring over a few sheep and their money.

    I understand business just fine. No I'm not an occupier, I also just simply do not like capitalist societies. The whole country is worries simply about how much money each individual can amass. We live in a country of excess and waste. Go ahead and be ok with that if you want. I'm not. Call me a socialist, a communist, whatever makes you feel better about your greedy ways. I tend to think of myself as a humanist, I'm only interested in the betterment of people as a whole, not wrapping up 90% of the wealth into 1% of the population. It's disgusting, it's really no wonder why so much of the rest of the world simply despises america and americans. If you DON'T believe that to be the case, travel abroad once in a while outside of the regular tourist traps.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from BurritoT. Show BurritoT's posts

    Re: Why I, personally, do not like Henry and Co.

    I wish they would increase the infield foul teritory... it is insane how small it is, and all for the sake a few seats. They should rip 3 rows out deep all along the infield.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from YOUKILLUS20. Show YOUKILLUS20's posts

    Re: Why I, personally, do not like Henry and Co.

    I'm glad you voiced these concerns, you make some valid points and I also find myself agreeing with JimfromFlorida. Start with Henry, his company which has given him a lifestyle and wealth that puts him in the 1%, good for him. Now let the humanist ask just what product or innovation did he give to the world? Nothing. He exploited a mathematical formula that allows him to time the moves in the commodities market. The purpose of the CM was to provide certainty and liquidity right back down to the farmer and the manufacturer, it really is guys like Henry that had a part in the world wide financial melt down, they speculated, played the spread and got rich, meanwhile farmers have to deal with crazy price movements and we all felt the spike in fuel prices last year when the traders were bidding up oil. You make a good point about Fenway racing. Fenway Park
    is Boston. Period. It's not racing, which is a southern sport in contrast. When the Sox want to make architectural changes to Fenway, they need approval from a Heritage board, which shows how important the look and feel of the park is to the culture of Boston, so why do they get to stamp the word "Fenway" on anything they want? It doesn't make sense, at least from a heritage point of view. This means they could sponsor anything and call it Fenway, whether it's sporting or not. Friendly Fenway condoms, Fenway Chicken, (bad idea?), Fenway Tax Service, see what I mean? The "sell outs" are just unethical, trying to falsify the scarcity of the tickets which then drives up the perceived value is dishonest plain and simple. "If people don't want to go to the game you can't count 'em", to borrow from Yogi Berra for a moment. They have been stewards over some good ideas, Monster seating is cool, and making the area around the ballpark part of the campus, just seems to work. The 04 series win was awesome, but do they get credit for that? One play had to turn out the way it did, and that was the Roberts steal of second. In '86, the Buckner play went against us. Flip the success and failure of those plays around and Henry and Company might never have been heard of. The Henry teams have been slightly more sucessful than it's immediate predecessors, and also more hapless, we can't forget already the EPIC collapse of just this year. Do you want to be the owner of the worst one in baseball history? That's on Henry too. They get credit for signing some top talent, Big Papi, Beckett, Gonzales, but think about it, once you've got the big guns, does it really matter who the ancillary players are?
     At the end of the day, do the Red Sox care about the fan affordability index? heck no. I went to a Nat's game this year, great seats in a great ballpark for $25.00 and that quarter hundred included a 10.00 food voucher! I'd be surprised if you could go to a Sox game for $100, nevermind $25.00.
     The 07 win was anti-climatic, the Rockies had been the hottest team and best story in baseball to close out the season, their long wait for the Sox took the air out of their tires, and they played like the Mountain time version of Boston College. Throw in Manny's steroids and it's tainted a little more. The annual high budget gurantees enough of the right kind of players for success, and also creates an expectation of winning that has us as nothing more than the Harvard version of a Yankee fan, and you can blame Henry for that too. We have lost our innocence, our integrity and our baseball souls under his flag. And that my fellow citizens is the State of the Union of RSN.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Why I, personally, do not like Henry and Co.

    In Response to Why I, personally, do not like Henry and Co.:
    It started out well enough. They come in and want to save Fenway as opposed to working on a new stadium. Fans were kind of split at the time on this point, but overall, I don't think many people would call it a 'bad' idea. And, obviously, they were present for the Sox to break an 86 year drought. Since then, however, here's some things I have real issues with: Red Sox Nation - This was a FAN derived term. It grew in exposure organically, and was a moniker many of us proudly supported BEFORE winning in 2004. Henry and Co. stole the name, and started charging addmission for it, 50/100 bucks I believe, to have a paper card and the the 'right' to buy tickets at face value! That's just embarrassing. Fenway Park - Fenway is a symbol of boston, of the Red Sox, and of Boston itself. They seemingly wanted to save it, they've made some good changes inside the field, I think it's absurd how they've taken over the streets SURROUNDING the park now, but that's not a huge deal. My issue is they took this revered, historical name, spirited it away and stuck it on a NASCAR team! Again, they inherited this park as part of the purchase, and stole the name of it's 100 year old park and stuck it somewhere that very few people in boston, in MA, or fans of the Sox care about. Yet another flat out money grab by these businessmen. They wanted the notoriety of Fenway to increase the reckognition of their NASCAR team. Not cool. Ticket Prices/Sellout Streak - Ticket prices are high, as they should be. Red Sox are a hot commoddity, and the park is small. I believe the sellout streak started after they bought it, so credit for that. However, to keep propping this sfalse sellout streak up because of their unholy alliance with Ace Ticket is sickening. Nobody can convince me that there weren't THOUSANDS of tickets sitting in an office in brookline through April/May of 2010 as the game was reported as a sellout, and at least 10,000 seats would be empty for MANY games. Also, it's hard to get tickets at face value as it is, letting Ace Ticket resell so many is downright criminal. It's ok for them to sell at 3x face, but I can't sell for 20 bucks over outside the stadium? They cut Francona's legs out from under him after he's out the door. They make Cherrington fall on his sword and say HE was the one who pushed for Crawford, and then cut HIS legs out from under him during the managerial search. They are a joke. Yes, baseball has BECOME a business, but that IS NOT what is was built on, that IS NOT what brought in millions of fans. It's a game of passion that grew big enough that greedy people started paying attention and wanting to cash in. I'm so sick of hearing "well, baseball is a business" and people just accept it.   In the 90s and early 2000s there was a list of things that people around here would criticize the Yankees for: Spending outrageously and stupidly mostly. Well, the Sox have caught them there, and passed them in other areas. I used to rip on Stenibrenner, but I've grown to understand that at least, with the Yankees, he was a FAN first, and a BUSINESS man second. The Sox are now business men first, image driven second, and fans possibly third, though I could easily be forgetting something they value above actually winning. If they could figure out a way to make more money while losing, I guarantee they would. You've made your money, sell the team for the 1-1.5 billion youd get, get close to double your investment back, PLUS whatever has been made over the past 10 years and move on. Print up 10,000,000 $100 stock vouchers and sell them to the public and we'll elect people into the presidency of the team. Those 10mil vouchers would go faster than 10mil anything they currently sell.
    Posted by ma6dragon9


    I have many issues with this post, but for now, I'll just make these two points.

    First, they didn't inherit anything. They bought the team, so they have the right to do anything they want with the name. What they've done is try to bring revenue from where ever they could so they could compete with the Yankees financially, and they've spent the money on high payrolls, so it's not like they've been pocketing all the money.

    Second, don't kid yourself. George Steinbrenner was a business man first and foremost. A fan doesn't demolish Yankees Stadium. A business man does that. Steinbrenner always spent a lot of money on the team, but guess what. That's because he had the money. Take a moment from your Henry tirade and really look at the Yankees situation and you'll understand the advantage they have financially over everyone else.

    I never begrudged Steinbrenner for spending money, but he spent money like that because he could and still make a profit. But it is because Steinbrenner has spent money like he did that has forced other owners to do all they can to bring in more revenue so they can compete.

    And what has Henry and Company ever done that has shown they don't care about winning or losing. If that was the case, their payroll would be $40M cheaper and they'd be making even more money. The fact that they've been willing to shell out stupid money on Crawford and Lackey and eat contracts for non-producing players shows that they do care about winning.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: Why I, personally, do not like Henry and Co.

    Hey Mad,

    Proffesional sport is first and foremost a business. In 1972 George Stienbrenner bought the Yanks for a click over 10M to include the park. Today that franchise is value at more than a billion and half. How's that for a return on investment. Over time there's been many a pro sports league started. that has failed due to economics. Recently both the NFL and the NBA had work stopages, where the ownership and the players were fighting over how best to split the pie.

    John Henry is no different than Stienbrenner in that he's a very successful buisness man that understand the importance of driving the top line revenues to enhance the bottom line profitability. Thus increasing shareholder value. Every change he's made to the park and the surrrounding area were done to do just that. Those moneys are what allows him to invest in his buisness and pay for the infrastructure which ulitmately manifest it self in the teams successes on the field...Winning is the key to his formula, becasue it creates intrest in the brand and attracts the casual fans who spend thier hard earned dollars willing while rooting for the home town nine...

    Given the teams successes since he arrived. I find it difficult to question his motives. Frankly it is becasue of he that you and many in the "Nation" now have a greater expectation and sense of entittlement...Before he bought the club, we celebrated our once in a decade chance to win it all only to fall short...Personally speaking, I've been a fan sice the mid 60' and I am simply just enjoying the ride and instead of lamenting another season of wait till next year. I look forward to the promise of another chance to win it all and if we do make it to the WS, I expect us to win it!
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from donrd4. Show donrd4's posts

    Re: Why I, personally, do not like Henry and Co.

    In Response to Why I, personally, do not like Henry and Co.:
    It started out well enough. They come in and want to save Fenway as opposed to working on a new stadium. Fans were kind of split at the time on this point, but overall, I don't think many people would call it a 'bad' idea. And, obviously, they were present for the Sox to break an 86 year drought. Since then, however, here's some things I have real issues with: Red Sox Nation - This was a FAN derived term. It grew in exposure organically, and was a moniker many of us proudly supported BEFORE winning in 2004. Henry and Co. stole the name, and started charging addmission for it, 50/100 bucks I believe, to have a paper card and the the 'right' to buy tickets at face value! That's just embarrassing. Fenway Park - Fenway is a symbol of boston, of the Red Sox, and of Boston itself. They seemingly wanted to save it, they've made some good changes inside the field, I think it's absurd how they've taken over the streets SURROUNDING the park now, but that's not a huge deal. My issue is they took this revered, historical name, spirited it away and stuck it on a NASCAR team! Again, they inherited this park as part of the purchase, and stole the name of it's 100 year old park and stuck it somewhere that very few people in boston, in MA, or fans of the Sox care about. Yet another flat out money grab by these businessmen. They wanted the notoriety of Fenway to increase the reckognition of their NASCAR team. Not cool. Ticket Prices/Sellout Streak - Ticket prices are high, as they should be. Red Sox are a hot commoddity, and the park is small. I believe the sellout streak started after they bought it, so credit for that. However, to keep propping this sfalse sellout streak up because of their unholy alliance with Ace Ticket is sickening. Nobody can convince me that there weren't THOUSANDS of tickets sitting in an office in brookline through April/May of 2010 as the game was reported as a sellout, and at least 10,000 seats would be empty for MANY games. Also, it's hard to get tickets at face value as it is, letting Ace Ticket resell so many is downright criminal. It's ok for them to sell at 3x face, but I can't sell for 20 bucks over outside the stadium? They cut Francona's legs out from under him after he's out the door. They make Cherrington fall on his sword and say HE was the one who pushed for Crawford, and then cut HIS legs out from under him during the managerial search. They are a joke. Yes, baseball has BECOME a business, but that IS NOT what is was built on, that IS NOT what brought in millions of fans. It's a game of passion that grew big enough that greedy people started paying attention and wanting to cash in. I'm so sick of hearing "well, baseball is a business" and people just accept it.   In the 90s and early 2000s there was a list of things that people around here would criticize the Yankees for: Spending outrageously and stupidly mostly. Well, the Sox have caught them there, and passed them in other areas. I used to rip on Stenibrenner, but I've grown to understand that at least, with the Yankees, he was a FAN first, and a BUSINESS man second. The Sox are now business men first, image driven second, and fans possibly third, though I could easily be forgetting something they value above actually winning. If they could figure out a way to make more money while losing, I guarantee they would. You've made your money, sell the team for the 1-1.5 billion youd get, get close to double your investment back, PLUS whatever has been made over the past 10 years and move on. Print up 10,000,000 $100 stock vouchers and sell them to the public and we'll elect people into the presidency of the team. Those 10mil vouchers would go faster than 10mil anything they currently sell.
    Posted by ma6dragon9


    OK Rubber lips.... If Henry offered you a job for big money ,you would B.... him....... Get out of here.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from brdbreu. Show brdbreu's posts

    Re: Why I, personally, do not like Henry and Co.

    In Response to Re: Why I, personally, do not like Henry and Co.:
    In Response to Re: Why I, personally, do not like Henry and Co. : Fair enough. My point was, the term existed before they came along, they stole it and profit from it. If companies fall out of the black, they SHOULDN'T GET A BAILOUT, to say they have to advertise or end up getting a publicly funded bailout is...it's just absurd. I agreed with your other points about why it makes sense for business men. My problem is sports being run by businessmen. They've sold the soul of the Red Sox for a few trophies...was it worth it? And to say the teams before they bought the Sox were bad is flat out ignorant. They have on of the highest winning percentages in baseball going back the mid-80s and possibly longer. Talk about being wrong. They never won, but they were OFTEN very good. Exactly my point about NASCAR, Fenway never had even the slightest bit of anything to do with any type of racing, they stole the name just to bring over a few sheep and their money. I understand business just fine. No I'm not an occupier, I also just simply do not like capitalist societies. The whole country is worries simply about how much money each individual can amass. We live in a country of excess and waste. Go ahead and be ok with that if you want. I'm not. Call me a socialist, a communist, whatever makes you feel better about your greedy ways. I tend to think of myself as a humanist, I'm only interested in the betterment of people as a whole, not wrapping up 90% of the wealth into 1% of the population. It's disgusting, it's really no wonder why so much of the rest of the world simply despises america and americans. If you DON'T believe that to be the case, travel abroad once in a while outside of the regular tourist traps.
    Posted by ma6dragon9



     ma6,

    re"The whole country is worries simply about how much money each individual can amass. We live in a country of excess and waste. Go ahead and be ok with that if you want. I'm not. Call me a socialist, a communist, whatever makes you feel better about your greedy ways. I tend to think of myself as a humanist, I'm only interested in the betterment of people as a whole, not wrapping up 90% of the wealth into 1% of the population. It's disgusting, it's really no wonder why so much of the rest of the world simply despises america and americans"

    its refreshing for someone to be aware beyond the cultural brainwashing we get growing up here (and think we decided it in our own minds, when we were spoon fed the propagnda when we were in diapers). fighting for "freedom" is one of too numerous empty slogans (propaganda), when the only thing we have ever fought for is using disposable "soldiers" young men and now women, to steal, rape, murder, and commit genocide for billionaires increased $ and power.

    Below are only a couple of the thousands of references to only 1  (of the many) U.S. sponsored genocide (and theft).

    and at bottom, a nuclear whistleblower to a recent event that may shock you, especially because it ultimately also targets americans.

    http://www.thewe.cc/weplanet/news/depleted_uranium_iraq_afghanistan_balkans.html

    reference: http://www.nogw.com/download/_07_5_nukes_part3.pdf

    http://www.uruknet.info/?p=37167


    berkeley nuclear SCIENTIST whistleblower:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UOYhZlEf5gI
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from DirtyWaterLover. Show DirtyWaterLover's posts

    Re: Why I, personally, do not like Henry and Co.

    Henry and Co paid a lot of money for the Red Sox and deserve to earn a profit any way they can.  I like a lot of the things they've done to Fenway, and some of the things they've I don't like.  I like what they've done with concessions and all of the new seating areas.

    But, I don't like how they've squeezed in additional seats in pre-existing areas.  It's impossible for 2 average sized men to sit up straight side by side.  Every other person has to lean forward. 

    I don't like the high price of concessions.  The prive of food is just tooooo high.  Increase the cost of beer and soda and the higher end foods.  But keep the price of water and a hot dogs relatively reasonable. 
     
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