Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from elvis-surfs. Show elvis-surfs's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    In response to Nggaplz61's comment:

    Why is it always assumed that Jacoby Ellsbury is gonna bolt from the team or be traded? Hes given so much doubt because of the 2 years he suffered freak injuries, he can be a very good player, he hits for Average, and the potential for power is definitely there. He is exactly the kind of player we should be extending. Hes home grown and can put up some crazy numbers if hes out there every day.

    "Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?"

    cuz he suxx?

     
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  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    In response to dgalehouse's comment:

    Regardless of whether or not you want to trade Ellsbury, I don't get the fear of dealing with Boras. Hate him all you want , but Boras is the number one agent in baseball. He represents many top players, including the highly touted but still unproven Bradley Jr.  Boras has to be dealt with. That is the way it is today, like it or not.  Do you think the Yankees are sweating dealing with Boras regarding Cano ? Of course they are not. At what point did the Sox become a small market franchise , unable to deal with the high power agents ? 



    This is the most overrated thing in BB.  Who cares what Boras gets for his players?  Put a number on a player and stick with it.  If Boras gets your opponent to overbid on a guy like like ARod, how does that hurt us?  Most players probably sign within about 5-10% of what they are supposed to.

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    In response to Soxdog67's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    Ask this question: what is there about Boston that Ellsbury would want to stay here?

    I doubt he'd return here even if we offer a million more than the highest offer.

    It's my opinion, but I think there is virtually no chance he stays here. With that in mind, we should do like the Angels just did and trade Ellsbury before we get nothing in return but a comp sandwich draft pick.




    When did the Angels trade Ellsbury...I totally missed that??



    ...do like the Angels did with Haren...

    Thought you could make that small assumption.

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    He has the weakest throwing arm for any MLB CF'er I've seen in my entire life

     

    Further proof that softy does not watch the games.

    If he ever saw Damon throw, he'd know.

     

    (Ask yourself how Manny could have ever cut off that throw had Damon not thrrown like my lil sis.)

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from xXR3S1NXx. Show xXR3S1NXx's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    He has the weakest throwing arm for any MLB CF'er I've seen in my entire life

     

    Further proof that softy does not watch the games.

    If he ever saw Damon throw, he'd know.

     

    (Ask yourself how Manny could have ever cut off that throw had Damon not thrrown like my lil sis.)



    Damon did throw like your little sis throwing motion and everything( havnt seen your sister throw but im guessing if i did it would look like how damon threw). Everytime i saw the ball hit to damon with runners on base, The thoughts "Noodle arm strikes again" came to mind.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from georom4. Show georom4's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    ells covers serious ground...if i had to choose a cannon arm or coverage, i'd take what he has in CF now...

    of course reddick wouldve looked extra good about now when tending offers before ells free agency kicks in

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Soxdog67. Show Soxdog67's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to Soxdog67's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    Ask this question: what is there about Boston that Ellsbury would want to stay here?

    I doubt he'd return here even if we offer a million more than the highest offer.

    It's my opinion, but I think there is virtually no chance he stays here. With that in mind, we should do like the Angels just did and trade Ellsbury before we get nothing in return but a comp sandwich draft pick.




    When did the Angels trade Ellsbury...I totally missed that??



    ...do like the Angels did with Haren...

    Thought you could make that small assumption.




    Well I would have made that assumption, but didn't you hear that the Cubs backed out of the deal and Haren is now a free agent that is available to everyone??

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    In response to Soxdog67's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    In response to Soxdog67's comment:

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    Ask this question: what is there about Boston that Ellsbury would want to stay here?

    I doubt he'd return here even if we offer a million more than the highest offer.

    It's my opinion, but I think there is virtually no chance he stays here. With that in mind, we should do like the Angels just did and trade Ellsbury before we get nothing in return but a comp sandwich draft pick.




    When did the Angels trade Ellsbury...I totally missed that??



    ...do like the Angels did with Haren...

    Thought you could make that small assumption.




    Well I would have made that assumption, but didn't you hear that the Cubs backed out of the deal and Haren is now a free agent that is available to everyone??



    Yes, I know, but it's the thought that counts.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    Looks like the Sox want to see what the market value is this year on FA. Ross, Haren, etc. . maybe they think they can get a better deal once the market for each player has been determined.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from GreenPartyCelt. Show GreenPartyCelt's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    I don't get it either...Red Sox are foolish not to try and make a real offer to sign him...They might not coax him back, but the guy is worth it...

     
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  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Beantowne. Show Beantowne's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    In response to moonslav59's comment:

    Ask this question: what is there about Boston that Ellsbury would want to stay here?

    I doubt he'd return here even if we offer a million more than the highest offer.

    It's my opinion, but I think there is virtually no chance he stays here. With that in mind, we should do like the Angels just did and trade Ellsbury before we get nothing in return but a comp sandwich draft pick.




    Moon,

    Ellsbury with Boras nudging him along will likely be moving on after next season. So it's kind of pointless to debate what it would take to re-sign him. but I digress...I don't agree that he'd sign elsewhere for less than the Sox offered.  Cherington has already made public he and Ownership Group see Ellsbury as a player that the Sox want to make every effort to sign to an longterm deal. If they make him an offer that he and Boras can't refuse or find another team to match or exceed it. However unlikely that may be given the dynamic at play, my guess is that he'd sign it.

    As for the state of the Red Sox union. Though they have a significant mountain to climb to get back into the mix to be seen as a legit contender with Farrel the incoming manager and the return of Papi (a popular clubhouse guy). With a few key additions this club could be in the mix in 2012 if Farrel can get Lester back in the groove.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from MadMc44. Show MadMc44's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    In response to RedSoxKimmi's comment:

    I think the chances of Ellbury staying with the Sox after 2013 are very low, for all of the reasons that have been stated.  Unless he's willing to give the Sox a home team discount, which I don't believe for a second he is, the Sox should let him walk.

    That said, I wouldn't trade him this offseason unless somebody offers the Sox a deal they just can't refuse.  IMO, they shouldn't sell low on him just to get back something that is better than a draft pick. 

    For those who truly believe that we are in rebuilding mode next year, trading Ells now makes sense.  For those of us who think the Sox can contend next season, keeping Ells for 2013 makes more sense. 

     

     

     



    The reason I would give are multiple: not a to z multiple.

    1. His Arb # will come in close to $9 M.

    2. Projecting moves BenC may make--this will be the"Bridge Year" so why keep Ells when we can get the NL batting Champ, for one season, and if JBJ is ready, trade Melky to someone that could use him. We'd probably pay a more for 1 year of Melky with reachable incentives.

    3. The killer "B's" are on the horizon--they need to know they have a chance to "Please Come to Boston In the Springtime"--so if we can get a 3,4, or 5 starter for Ells or a can't miss top prospect in return go for it. 

    4. Ells is not a superstar--he was in 2011 and he may be again--it won't be in Boston.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    Some GM out there will "roll the dice" and take the gamble that Ellsbury will have a "contract year" similar or better than 2011. The supplemental draft pick attached to getting Ellsbury before 2013 begins is the insurance policy in case it doesn't work out or the added bonus if it does.

    To me, it's not even about getting equal or better return than Ellsbury's 2013 worth and the value of the draft pick. The value is too nebulous to assign an exact value to anyways. Instead, it should be about getting multiple years of team control for one year of Ellsbury. I'm not saying I'll take anyone with 3+ years of service remaining: the player should be a pretty sure bet to contribute to our team in a meaningful role, but when getting 3 years for one, I do not expect an equal skillset. The player(s) we get may be a risk, as in a player with huge upside potential, but with an issue or two in the way, or it could be a ML player or ML ready prospect with a solid chance to fill a lesser role than Ellsbury has now, but that is none the less meaningful enough to help our team going forward.

    This philosophy is greatly influenced by my belief that we will probably not seriously compete in 2013, so the one year value of Ellsbury has to be higher with a team that thinks they have a serious shot at 2013-- not us.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    Columnist Michael Silverman at the Boston Herald offers his take:

    http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/baseball/red_sox/view/20221104sox_best_betdeal_ellsbury/

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from boborielly224. Show boborielly224's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    In response to georom4's comment:

    ells covers serious ground...if i had to choose a cannon arm or coverage, i'd take what he has in CF now...

    of course reddick wouldve looked extra good about now when tending offers before ells free agency kicks in




    I agree i was not happy when Riddick was dealt. When I watch my fav. sports teams I like watching the minor league players make their way into the big league. Just when i am content with the player BANG!!!! traded. Elsbury may be getting older but he is one the best Defensive center fielders in the league. I will be keeping my on Brentz in the spring training and with Pawtucket, if we see any injuries in OF this kid will be the first call up. Riddick Elsbury (maintaining the center field) and Brentz, personally I thought this would be a very consistent outfield for many years.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from JimfromFlorida. Show JimfromFlorida's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

     

    BECAUSE THEY ARE RED SOX FANS

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from Soxdog67. Show Soxdog67's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    I somewhat agree with JFF here...Red Sox fans nowadays and on this forum live by the "what have you done for me lately" attitude.

    The fact that some already speak of a "bridge year" before the Hot Stove season even has started is another indication of that...Ben C hasn't fully transformed the team before we all sit down for Turkey dinner.

    The Sox may indeed trade Ellsbury...but I believe only if they receive value back in return for him...the fact that many claim he is unsignable because Boras is his agent indicates that the Sox would never be able to sign a Boras client, which pretty much translates to not being able to sign any of the top players in the game...since many of them use Boras.

    If you are looking to sign FA players to 1 or 2 year deals, then don't expect those signings to occur until around January...since between now and then FA players will be shopping the marketplace.

     
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  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    In response to softlaw's comment:

    I have been busy bringing hope and change to Washington, D.C., but couldn't get Peolisi and Ried to cooperate on cutting the deficit in half and ending the war in Afghanastan. I haven't been able to change Washington, but in four more years I will give it my best shot. I'm counting on the People's Republic of MA to vote for moving forward with the hope and the change of the last four years.

    You've been too busy to learn how to spell the last name of the Senate Majority Leader.

     
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  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from RedSoxKimmi. Show RedSoxKimmi's posts

    Re: Why is everyone so quick to dismiss Ellsbury?

    The reason I would give are multiple: not a to z multiple.

    1. His Arb # will come in close to $9 M.

    2. Projecting moves BenC may make--this will be the"Bridge Year" so why keep Ells when we can get the NL batting Champ, for one season, and if JBJ is ready, trade Melky to someone that could use him. We'd probably pay a more for 1 year of Melky with reachable incentives.

    3. The killer "B's" are on the horizon--they need to know they have a chance to "Please Come to Boston In the Springtime"--so if we can get a 3,4, or 5 starter for Ells or a can't miss top prospect in return go for it.

    4. Ells is not a superstar--he was in 2011 and he may be again--it won't be in Boston.

    All fair points.  For those who think that 2013 will be a rebuildng year, trading Ells makes sense.  If the Red Sox are going to contend next year, however, Ells is a player that can help the Sox get there.  That  being the case, I am not as willing to trade him this offseason as others are, especially since we already have holes/question marks at our other OF positions. 

    I'm not saying that he will match his 2011 season, but if he can stay healthy, he should be a very solid player, offensively and defensively.  The fact that he will be playing for his first potentially big contract can't hurt.

    Unless someone offers up a great deal for him, I'd rather keep him, take a shot at contending for a playoff spot, then take the draft pick when he leaves.

     

     
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