Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    Any explanation? He's cruising along at 88 pitches. He leaves him in at 110 pitches in a bad game, but takes him out tonight.

    And check Tazawa's stats against the Jays.

     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from xdrive. Show xdrive's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    probably trying to get him out after seven good innings in only one run instead of have a him leave on a bad note it backfired Tazawa   is not an eighth inning guy injuries have forced this. Its an easy 2nd guess but who knows maybe Dempster asked out for any # of reasons.We never know the truth

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from southpaw777. Show southpaw777's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    Made no sense to me. Im curious to hear his explanation. Unless he was hurt or tired, I saw no reason to take a guy out that was shutting them down. 1R 4H and 88 pitches? Then put in a guy who has bad numbers against the Jays?

     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    The explanation is simple.  Good 7 innings or not, Farrell didn't feel confident in Dempster putting up another zero.  Ryan can be cruising along sometimes and then the bottom suddenly falls out. 

     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from mef429. Show mef429's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    In response to xdrive's comment:

    probably trying to get him out after seven good innings in only one run instead of have a him leave on a bad note it backfired Tazawa   is not an eighth inning guy injuries have forced this. Its an easy 2nd guess but who knows maybe Dempster asked out for any # of reasons.We never know the truth



    how do you figure he is not an 8th inning guy? the only team that's hit him is the blue jays  His ERA against teams not named the Jays: 1.66 ERA

    Even if you include the games against the Jays, his ERA only jumps up to 2.50 ERA. 1.111 WHIP, 9.7K/9 and an OPSa of .717. His numbers are even more lights out against the other 28 teams.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from soxnewmex. Show soxnewmex's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    It was a totally stupid move, good thing we won despite it.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    Bad move in my opinion. Fortunately, he got away with it so it's a footnote.

     

     

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    It's mostly guessing without hearing Farrell's explanation.  It could be Dempster's .873 OPSa in the 8th.  Past that, I think I'd trust Dempster in that spot more than Taz.

     

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    Of course it was a bad move.  Tazawa gave up a run.

    But if he leaves Dempster in and he gives up two quick runs and we lose 3-2, I'm sure everybody would be here defending Farrell vigorously. Laughing    

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from soxnewmex. Show soxnewmex's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    That's true enough hfx, but Dempster was cruising, no one wd have blamed Farrell for sending him back out I don't believe.

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:

    Of course it was a bad move.  Tazawa gave up a run.

    But if he leaves Dempster in and he gives up two quick runs and we lose 3-2, I'm sure everybody would be here defending Farrell vigorously. Laughing    




    No doubt!

    Although I must admit, going into the bottom of the 8th, I was saying "They gotta leave Dempster in." WIthout checking the game log, I'm guessing this was his best start of the year.

     

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    We're talking about a pitcher that is known by a lot of Sox fans as 'Dumpster', who came into the game sporting a 4.81 ERA and a 1.47 WHIP in his time in the AL.  Now suddenly he inspires all this confidence. 

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:

    We're talking about a pitcher that is known by a lot of Sox fans as 'Dumpster', who came into the game sporting a 4.81 ERA and a 1.47 WHIP in his time in the AL.  Now suddenly he inspires all this confidence. 




    He was on tonight. I'd have had him start the 8th on a short leash with Taz warming. But I'm the first to acknowledge  Farrell knows his team better than I do.

     

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:

    We're talking about a pitcher that is known by a lot of Sox fans as 'Dumpster', who came into the game sporting a 4.81 ERA and a 1.47 WHIP in his time in the AL.  Now suddenly he inspires all this confidence. 



    Kind of like one of the Doubront threads.  The same poster that was bashing Doubront for even being on the team, was bashing Farrell for taking him out too soon.  Anyone want to guess which poster that was?

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from moonslav59. Show moonslav59's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    I think Doubront, Dempster, Lackey, and Lester could all use a break, so they can be rested and ready for the playoffs-- I know: we need to make the playoffs first.

    But, if we aren't going to give these guys a rest (skipped start or two), then we need to do things like tonight to get them a rest.

    I'm not sure if this was the reason Dempster was pulled, but I get the feeling if he was left in and imploded the next inning, someone would have started a thread wondering why he was left in.

    Sox4ever

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Hfxsoxnut. Show Hfxsoxnut's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    In response to LloydDobler's comment:

    He was on tonight. I'd have had him start the 8th on a short leash with Taz warming. But I'm the first to acknowledge  Farrell knows his team better than I do. 



    You're one of the fair ones, that's for sure.

    The way I see it the short leash doesn't really work with a 1-run lead.  The first guy up gets a hit or gets on, do you pull him right away?  And if you do, Taz comes in and a long ball puts them ahead.

    My own personal belief is that managers just roll the dice sometimes because it feels like a 50/50 proposition. 

     

     

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:

    In response to LloydDobler's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    He was on tonight. I'd have had him start the 8th on a short leash with Taz warming. But I'm the first to acknowledge  Farrell knows his team better than I do. 

     



    You're one of the fair ones, that's for sure.

     

    The way I see it the short leash doesn't really work with a 1-run lead.  The first guy up gets a hit or gets on, do you pull him right away?  And if you do, Taz comes in and a long ball puts them ahead.

    My own personal belief is that managers just roll the dice sometimes because it feels like a 50/50 proposition. 

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    Pretty much.  Usually an RP will pitch better in one inning in the 8th than the typical starter.  Add to that that Dempster's ERA was 4.67 coming into tonight, with Tazawa's ERA being about half of that.  In any given random inning, Taz is a better bet than Dempster.  Offsetting that was the fact that Dempster was pitching well.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from royf19. Show royf19's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    In response to LloydDobler's comment:

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    We're talking about a pitcher that is known by a lot of Sox fans as 'Dumpster', who came into the game sporting a 4.81 ERA and a 1.47 WHIP in his time in the AL.  Now suddenly he inspires all this confidence. 

     




    He was on tonight. I'd have had him start the 8th on a short leash with Taz warming. But I'm the first to acknowledge  Farrell knows his team better than I do.

     

     

    [/QUOTE]

    I agree. It's my pet peeve with the way the game is managed today. Unless the pitcher is considered an ace (or possibly a 2) managers really don't manage. If it's a close game and a pitcher goes seven innings, it doesn't matter what the pitch count is. They automatically go with the eighth-inning guy then the closer.

    I'm not blasting Farrell for the move. He's not unique in this regard. It's simply how the game is played today. But 88 pitches and cruisin -- in this case, I'd ratehr err in giving him the next inning.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from LloydDobler. Show LloydDobler's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:



    You're one of the fair ones, that's for sure.

    The way I see it the short leash doesn't really work with a 1-run lead.  The first guy up gets a hit or gets on, do you pull him right away?  And if you do, Taz comes in and a long ball puts them ahead.

    My own personal belief is that managers just roll the dice sometimes because it feels like a 50/50 proposition. 

     



    That's very true. And had he left Dempster in, there's no guarantee he doesn't give up the lead himself.

     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    I agree. It's my pet peeve with the way the game is managed today. Unless the pitcher is considered an ace (or possibly a 2) managers really don't manage. If it's a close game and a pitcher goes seven innings, it doesn't matter what the pitch count is. They automatically go with the eighth-inning guy then the closer.

     

    I'm not blasting Farrell for the move. He's not unique in this regard. It's simply how the game is played today. But 88 pitches and cruisin -- in this case, I'd ratehr err in giving him the next inning.

    For better or worse, that's how teams are designed today.  It used to be complete games.  Then they added a closer.  Then they added a setup guy.  Now the model is 7+1+1.

    If you look at it from a pitch count, the OPSa goes up every 25 pitches, with 76-100 the OPSa is at .754.  The average RP OPSa is at .695.  Taz is at .717.  The data move is to bring Taz in.  The gut feeling is to leave Dempster in.

     

     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from BosoxJoe5. Show BosoxJoe5's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    I would have left him in, however Farrell though that he could probably get 6 outs from Tazawa and Koji and wanted to have something to build upon with Dempster. It still worked in the end they just needed 12 out from Tazawa, Breslow, and Koji instead. 

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Sheriff-Rojas. Show Sheriff-Rojas's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    In response to ADG's comment:

    Any explanation? He's cruising along at 88 pitches. He leaves him in at 110 pitches in a bad game, but takes him out tonight.

    And check Tazawa's stats against the Jays.



    ADG - The King of Hindsight Posting

    You seem to always know what the Red Sox should have done.

     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from Sheriff-Rojas. Show Sheriff-Rojas's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    In response to Hfxsoxnut's comment:

    In response to LloydDobler's comment:

    [QUOTE]

     

    He was on tonight. I'd have had him start the 8th on a short leash with Taz warming. But I'm the first to acknowledge  Farrell knows his team better than I do. 

     



    You're one of the fair ones, that's for sure.

     

    The way I see it the short leash doesn't really work with a 1-run lead.  The first guy up gets a hit or gets on, do you pull him right away?  And if you do, Taz comes in and a long ball puts them ahead.

    My own personal belief is that managers just roll the dice sometimes because it feels like a 50/50 proposition

     

     

    [/QUOTE]


     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from dgalehouse. Show dgalehouse's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?

    The manager makes the decisions. It is up to the players to do their job. If they do, it was the right decision. If they don't, it was wrong. Dempster pitched a very good game , but the trust level is not too high for a good reason. When to pull your starter ?  That is the question. We have seen it work both ways many times. No big deal. Second guessing is just that. If Tazawa holds the lead, no problem. If Dempster stayed in and gave it up , there would be complaining about that. Second guessing the manager is all part of the fan experience. It should be noted that Farrell gambled by bringing in Uehara in the tenth. Obviously hoping that we would score in the eleventh. That move worked to perfection. That's the way it goes. No manager is right all of the time. Farrell has been right more than most. 

    Stabbed by Foulke.

     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from ampoule. Show ampoule's posts

    Re: Why Take Dempster Out after 88 pitches, 1 Run and an easy 7th inning?


    Actually, I think it's Tazawa who needs a little rest.

    I wonder when Morales gets some innings.

     

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