Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......

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    Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......

    I thought you weren't going to start posts for 3 more days?
     
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    Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......

    In Response to Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......:
    In Response to Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal...... : After watching Middlebrooks for the last 2 games, I need to be back on this board, they need me on this board, they want me on this board !!!!    Bill-806 adds to the MORALE to this board/ship !!!!
    Posted by Bill-806


    ....so little honour left in the world.....
     
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    Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......

    In Response to Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......:
       The future is in the youth of our eyes !!!   What say you ???
    Posted by Bill-806


    Salty and Buch are both 27 years old.....so they both have Youth......Lava would be a more youthful alternative to Salty....so i will give you that one, but I dont see any more youthful alternatives to Buchholz ready for the show....I think we may be better served to give him a stint at Pawtucket to work out the kinks and then youth can truly be served.
     
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    Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......

    In Response to Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......:
       The future is in the youth of our eyes !!!   What say you ???
    Posted by Bill-806


    Why no John Lackey?  Why no Agonz?  Why no Crawford?


    They are the ones to be let go too!!!
     
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    Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......

    Bill I thought you told us a couple weeks ago big changes were happening. 

    Please also reassure me you honestly don't believe that our local GMs (Ben C, Danny Ainge) read your posts here. You're kidding with that right?
     
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    Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......

    I wish when I put Bill on ignore it really made his posts disappear... I still have that little grey bar that says I am ignoring Bill.... grrr....
     
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    Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......

    In response to "Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......":
    In Response to Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal...... : THanks, obviously you are a great Red Sox fan !!! Posted by Bill-806
    Compaired to someone who constantly wants to trade the whole team on a daily bases !!! Bill you should save your self the trouble and find a team that you like the players and buy a new hat !!!!
     
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    Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......

    So far, Ben C has been something of a minimalist, and I think by and large he has been right.  His one definite move was to shore up the bullpen, but Bailey's on the DL and Melancon bombed. 

    The Sox have actually hit the ball well despite the absence of Crawford, Ellsbury, Youk, and, to a lesser degree, the real AGon.  Other guys have stepped up and so far made Ben C look good--especially Sweeney, Ross, and Aviles. 

    The bullpen has been fantastic since the 15-9 debacle 14 games ago.  Padilla's sterling performance last night after the bullpen had to pitch 13 innings (I don't include the 17th inning) the day before was just the latest example of how great they have been.  With the bases loaded and one out, he got the ever popular GIDP. 

    The starting pitching is the one real problem, and I'm not sure Ben had the wherewithal to make a big deal for a real first-line starter even if one were available.  Thus Bard and Doubront get a shot. Lest we forget, the overwhelming majority of contributors to OTFB were adamantly opposed to starting Bard especially after the departure of ace closer Papelbon. Right now that is looking like a pretty good move to me because Aceves, after early struggles, has been terrific as the closer and far more versatile than Pap was.  And making Bard a starter was/is the right move even if he doesn't work out. 

    Right now the five starters are the original five--Lester, Beckett, Buchholz, Doubront, and Bard--but two other starters are standing in the wings, Cook and Matsuzaka.  Give Buchholz one more start, then take Cook or Matsuzaka or both off the DL and put them on the mound. 

    Youk's return is the right kind of problem to have because Middlebrooks has been terrific if only for 4 games.  Youk needs to move to 1B or DH, but those slots are already filled by all-stars.

    If there is one guy to take a hard look at, I'm thinking it's Saltalamacchia.  He can hit OK, especially against righties, but it does look as though one or more starters have doubts about his pitch-calling, whether or not he deserves it.  Worse, he made two egregious errors in his last two games.  The first, a passed ball, led to Cook getting spiked and being put on the DL.  The second, a dropped popup, led directly to the Orioles 6th run and, in the end, 17 innings of agony that almost wiped out the bullpen and gave the Sox their 5th loss in a row.  Not to get too superstitious, but brother Salty is starting to look like a Jonah (I watched Master and Commander last night). 

    Someone else started a thread arguing Shoppach should catch more games, and I now reluctantly agree that is making more sense than not.  I do think it is too early to bring up Lavarnway, who has very little catching experience at any level, but who knows, it could happen soon. 

    Overall, I have to conclude, for now, that the Sox do not need to make any bold trades, which to me translates to massive risk-taking.  In other words, having to worry about the luxury tax threshhold is probably a good thing. 
     
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    Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......

    In Response to Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......:
    In Response to Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal...... : After watching Middlebrooks for the last 2 games, I need to be back on this board, they need me on this board, they want me on this board !!!!    Bill-806 adds to the MORALE to this board/ship !!!!
    Posted by Bill-806


    Why do I picture crazy old Bill :) standing on top of the Green Monster going all Jack Nicholson on us, yelling "You need me on this wall!  You want me on this wall!!!  You want the truth??????   You can't handle the truth!!!!!  "

    Jack down Bill :)
     
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    Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......


    BenC was very willing to move Lars from first to left--my question to Ben is why wouldn't you try Lavarnway in LF which he played before moving behind the plate at Yale. I'm sure Ben was trying  to showcase the versatility of Lars to the A's but they have a better 1 B and plenty of OF depth.

    Lavarnway  may need 5-10 games in LF with the PawSox --if he looks like he could cover it adequately--you have a third catcher on the roster and you have an added bat--with no disrespect intended--DMac is not going to be around after CC returns.

    Come on Ben get Lavarnway up here somehow.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from ADG. Show ADG's posts

    Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......

    In Response to Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......:
       The future is in the youth of our eyes !!!   What say you ???
    Posted by Bill-806


    100% Bill. Steer that ship the right way. Unfortunately Adrian, Carl and Lackey will cripple this team for years.
     
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    Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......

    In Response to Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......:
    In Response to Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal...... : Why no John Lackey?  Why no Agonz?  Why no Crawford? They are the ones to be let go too!!!
    Posted by GoUconn13


    Nobody will take those albatrosses
     
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    Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......

    The players who we have coming up (Boegarts, Iggy, Lava, Barnes, Kalish...) are not as good as the players who are either currently in their prime or are in their twilight years but still performing (Pedey, Lester, Ortiz...)...

    I we turn this year into a "youth movement", then we are wasting the primes / final years of players like Pedey, Lester and Ortiz to "bridge the gap" to lesser players like Boegarts, Iggy , Lava.

    2012 should remain focused on 2012.  Field the best possible team, regardless of age.
     
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  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from GoUconn13. Show GoUconn13's posts

    Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......

    In Response to Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......:
    In Response to Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal...... : Nobody will take those albatrosses
    Posted by ADG


    And no one would take Beckett, Bucholtz, Dice K, etc either!!

    Maybe they would take Salty!
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from MadMc44. Show MadMc44's posts

    Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......

    Drewski---Punto, Shop, DMac, Byrd---I won't include pitchers because we have no young guys really ready.

    If we don't have young guys that could outproduce these four players our farm is in serious trouble. Do you not think Pedroia, Ortiz and AGon would prefer to play with Punto, DMac, Shop and Byrd over Middlebrooks, Lavarnway, Kalish and Ciriaco?
    I think wimmers want to play with players that will help the team be most successful.
     
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    Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......

    In Response to Re: Youk, Salty, Beckett'$, Buchholz,Dice-man... Ben C., time to cut a deal......:
    Drewski---Punto, Shop, DMac, Byrd---I won't include pitchers because we have no young guys really ready. If we don't have young guys that could outproduce these four players our farm is in serious trouble. Do you not think Pedroia, Ortiz and AGon would prefer to play with Punto, DMac, Shop and Byrd over Middlebrooks, Lavarnway, Kalish and Ciriaco? I think wimmers want to play with players that will help the team be most successful.
    Posted by MadMc44


    It generally isnt wise to call up rookies to let them sit on the bench.  Lava is better served getting consistent at-bats and working on his D in AAA , than he is a Salty's backup.  So Shop vs Lava really isnt the question.

    Similarly, Iggy is better served getting reps in the field and working with hitting coaches in the minors than he is as Aviles back up.  So Punto vs Iggy is also irreleveant.

    Back up players should be vets.  So the question isnt are our minor leaguers better than our major league back-ups.  The question is: are our minor leaguers better than our starters.  I say that in some cases yes (I feel Lava and Barnes could help this team) and in some cases no (I dont believe any of our minor league OF'ers are better than Ross, Sweeney, Ells).

    I would replace Punto with Ciricao (sorry for the spelling) because Ciricao isnt a high upside young minor leaguer.  He's a journeyman (like Punto).  Therefore i feel that if he can outproduce Punto , he should be on this team.

    Re: my initial post.  I was just saying that to call this a youth movement / bridge year is rediculous.  This team doesnt have many young studs in the minors that are on the cusp of breaking through.  This team doesnt get better in 2013/2014 than it is right now.  Now is the time to win.  Let's not trade Ortiz to guarantee Middlebrooks at-bats (as some have suggested).  Let's not trade for prospects (as some have suspected).  Five teams make the playoffs now, so there is a good chance we get in.  And this team can be dangerous if it gets in.

    Sacrificing 2012 for a full blown youth movement is a bad idea.  In two years , we prob wont have Ells, Papi will be gone, not to mention Pedey,and Lester may be at the end of their primes.  I feel that we are better suited to contend now than we will be in two years.  Generally speaking, our minor leaguers arent as good as our starters.  Now that Middlebrooks is called up, I really dont see a ton of studs worth sacrificing 2012 and 2013 for (possible exceptions: Lava and Barnes).
     
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