1. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    Hickscum was screaming about how Theo failed to address the bullpen this offseason in other threads. I guess the only acceptable thing to do is to overpay free agents in the winter... wait we did that w/ Tavarez and Seanez...

    I mena we brought back the entire bullpen that won a World Series minus the devil Eric Gagne. We expecte Timlin to be worse and Hanse/MDC to be better. Should Theo have spend cash on more guys this past winter, perhaps.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    Or talking about farting and "OMG look what he says!" without the capacity to truly understand where the more intelligent baseball fan was coming from. A very sad individual.

    I agree. I've disagreed with many posters on this board. There are two types in here. The first prototype was DaddyofBob in our ongoing dialogue about Tito. I thought I made a very good point, then surprisingly, he made a very good point. So I researched, but he researched right back. I came away really impressed with him. He pulled some wicked shlt out of the books, a lot of facts, very technical, and sound BB judgement.

    Then there are guys like Hickscum who are too stupid to know any about BB, and too lazy to look it up. Then they give up and talk about farting instead of challenging you and improving themselves in the process.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Joebreidey. Show Joebreidey's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    Hickscum was screaming about how Theo failed to address the bullpen this offseason in other threads.

    Again, a complete lack of knowledge and understanding. We had the best BP in BB last year. So of all the things that we needed to focus on, Hickscum thought we should improve the best BP in BB?
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from ihatefishing. Show ihatefishing's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    Obviously, one cant help but using hindsight now when evaluating the trade. I was as thrilled as anyone when we originally got Gagne, but I, just like everyone else, was dead wrong. However, theo gets the big bucks to predict who will be successful and who will not be. In this case, he was incorrect. THat said, I still agree that he is a very good GM.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from ZILLAGOD. Show ZILLAGOD's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    The fact that Gagne was awful does not make the trade "bad". With Donnelly's injury the Sox were very concerned about their bullpen. I believe they would not have made this deal with a healthy Brenden Donnelly in the bullpen.

    As things turned out, Manny Delcarmen stepped up to fill Donnelly's shoes , so we were O.K. ,but Theo and the rest of teh F.O. could not have known for sure that Delcarmen would do the job.

    The players traded for Gagne , as stated by Joebreidey, were ( naturally) lower on the Sox depth chart than what they are on the Texas depth chart....result; they get a chance to play in Texas , and do well ( at least in the beginning). The final analysis of what Murphy and Gabbard will do in their careers is far down the road, but I don't see the Sox ever regretting taking this gamble, even though it did not pay immediate dividends.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from hill55. Show hill55's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    Joebreidey has the commendable ability to see the Big Picture while many posters to this forum can't recover from the emotional pain of Eric Gagne's woeful performance in a Red Sox uniform last season.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from gickchum. Show gickchum's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    [Quote]Then there are guys like Hickscum who are too stupid to know any about BB, and too lazy to look it up. Then they give up and talk about farting instead of challenging you and improving themselves in the process.[/Quote]

    You have said that you spend a lot of time researching baseball facts, and in exchange for that effort on your part, some men on baseball forums on the internet might possibly have a higher opinion of you (were it not for your bizarre conclusions, such as the Gagne trade not being a bad one). Part of being intelligent is knowing not to waste large amounts of time and energy improving one's knowledge of something that offers absolutely no return.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from schmangell. Show schmangell's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    You still don't (or won't) get it Hickscum. Hindsight is 20/20. When the Gagne trade was made, RSN was agog at the thought of a proven closer like Gagne being added to an already very respectable bullpen. Well, it didn't quite work out the way we wanted and Gagne lost us some games. WE STILL ENDED UP WINNING THE WORLD SERIES. So at worst, the Gagne trade was inconsequential. What the other posters who have a brain in their heads are trying to convey is that the other components of that transaction may still work out.
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    [Quote]

    You have said that you spend a lot of time research baseball facts, and in exchange for that effort on your part, some men on baseball forums on the internet might possibly have a higher opinion of you (were it not for your bizarre conclusions, such as the Gagne trade not being a bad one). Part of being intelligent is knowing not to waste large amounts of time and energy improving one's knowledge of something that offers absolutely no return.[/Quote]

    This quote by Hickscum is like Manny going 8-13 w/ 2 HR in LA. It just proves he has no BB intelligence and looks down upon the person who does, the person who enjoys researching facts and having a friendly back and forth with equally intelligent fans. (like Manny proved he was a quitter and dog)

    Hickscum knows nothing about baseball and is not a Red Sox fan and is not here to have intelligent convo. He is here to be an exaggerating alarmist who insults people and blesses us with negative and untrue comments and a teenage potty mouth.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from mpieretti. Show mpieretti's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    joebreidey is a legend. I love ALL his posts...
    but Gagne really stank
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from gickchum. Show gickchum's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    Djc, the point is that Joebreidey won't even admit it was a bad trade NOW.

    Losing Murphy and getting back Gagme might still pan out, he says.
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from rameakap. Show rameakap's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    [Quote]Djc, the point is that Joebreidey won't even admit it was a bad trade NOW.

    Losing Murphy and getting back Gagme might still pan out, he says.[/Quote]

    You are an idiot. He says that the draft picks we got for Gagne might still be better than Murphy. and they could. Learn to read, you know NOTHING.

    and didn't we win the Wolrd Series last year?? do Murphy or Gabbard make this years team? Go away small brain.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from DirtyWaterLover. Show DirtyWaterLover's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    It was a great trade and it helped the Sox win the WS.

    Gagne was brought in primarily to give Oki and Pap some rest and secondarily as insurance in case the Oki didn't benefit from the rest. Even though Gagne pitched like crap, he still served his primary function. And because Oki did respond to the rest, he was able to be effective in the post season and helped the team get to and win the WS. One could even make the argument that without the trade, the Sox may not have made it to the WS, let alone, win it.

    And, I think what Joe is saying is that when Gagne left as a free agent, the Sox picked up a draft pick. To completely judge the trade, we would have to give the draft pick time to develop to see if he is better than the player the Sox gave up.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from gickchum. Show gickchum's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    Ridiculous.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from ufcchamp. Show ufcchamp's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    If ifs and buts were candy and nuts.....gulpcum would finally have some nuts. If they don't sign that bum ramirez and lose the 1st rounder in '01, then maybe the Sox draft a real ball player named David Wright.

     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from schmangell. Show schmangell's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    [Quote]
    If ifs and buts were candy and nuts.....gulpcum would finally have some nuts. If they don't sign that bum ramirez and lose the 1st rounder in '01, then maybe the Sox draft a real ball player named David Wright.
    [/Quote]

    "gulpcum." priceless. and appropriate.

     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from DADDYOBOB. Show DADDYOBOB's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    [Quote]Or talking about farting and "OMG look what he says!" without the capacity to truly understand where the more intelligent baseball fan was coming from. A very sad individual.

    I agree. I've disagreed with many posters on this board. There are two types in here. The first prototype was DaddyofBob in our ongoing dialogue about Tito. I thought I made a very good point, then surprisingly, he made a very good point. So I researched, but he researched right back. I came away really impressed with him. He pulled some wicked shlt out of the books, a lot of facts, very technical, and sound BB judgement.

    Then there are guys like Hickscum who are too stupid to know any about BB, and too lazy to look it up. Then they give up and talk about farting instead of challenging you and improving themselves in the process.
    [/Quote]miss me joe?
     
  18. This post has been removed.

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from gickchum. Show gickchum's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    Saying that over and over isn't going to suddenly make it funny.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from notin. Show notin's posts

    everyone look at this quote from joebreidey

    [Quote]Gagne sucked but that's actually the smallest component of the trade. We traded Murphy, Gabbard and Beltre for what turned out to be Price. Murphy was behind Manny, Crisp, Ellsbury, Drew, and Moss. That makes him #6 on a team that only keeps 4 OFers. Gabbard was behind Beckett, Dice, Wake, Lester, Buchholz, Bowden and Masterson. That makes him the #8 starter on a team that only needs 6.

    Murphy is so far a mixed bag. He started off hot, but with only 4 HRs and a .229 over his last 38 games with weak L/R splits. He should be somewhere between an average outfielder to maybe a good #4. Gabbard has been up and down to the minors a couple of times, carries an ERA />5.00 for TX, and has a lifetime 103/96 K/W ratio. It would extremely difficult to predict any success for him.

    But the results of Murphy and Gabbard don't really have as much of an impact in the decision as one would think. If Murphy was to be our #6 OFer, and Gabbard our #8 SP, are the RS, in the longrun, better off keeping the two of them in AAA, or trading them for draft picks with the hope that Gagne makes a solid contribution.

    While I like keeping and developing prospects, keeping prospects that you have almost no use for is counter-productive if you can use them better elsewhere. In this case, we traded two guys that had no shot at playing for us in exchange for the #45 pick in the draft.

    That's what Hickscum would've said had he had enough time, and 100 extra IQ points.

    So Hickscum, based on your analysis of Price, would you rather have Murphy and Gabbard in AAA, or Price in A?[/Quote]


    Gabbard was out of options. He was either on the parent club on a minor league free agent.

    I think even calling Murphy a "mixed bag" gives him more credit than he deserves. This team won't miss Murphy, either. In fact, Texas could have dealt him without missing him.

    Losing Gabbard and Murphy is about as nothing as it gets.

    So it comes down to Engel Beltre vs. Bryan Price. Beltre is younger and further away from actual MLB action, but is a terrific combination of tools. He is more of an athelte than a baseball player at this point. Bryan Price is a college pitcher with minimal minor league experience. Beltre has more potential; Price is probably closer to the majors. Both players are Baseball America Top 10 guys in two of the better minor league systems right now. It's fairly equal.

    I liked the Gagne trade at the time, and while long term it could come down to Price vs. Beltre (which won't be decided any time soon, and in fact may never be), but there really is no way to call it anything but a bust. Don't forget the Sox had hoped to land TWO picks for Gagne, and not just the single sandwich pick...

     

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