1. You have chosen to ignore posts from jrabi72874. Show jrabi72874's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    If the records close you go for it. I was more upset about them being pulled once their goals were accomplished. Dungy totally tanked the game so how do you think the Browns felt. The Titans had several turnovers and because the Colts had the JV team in they just barely won the game. Peyton and Co. should have played atleast a half which I felt was long enough to build a sufficient lead. Talk about the integrity of the game I hope they come out flat in 2 weeks.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from keithc175. Show keithc175's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    I say congrats to Payton, Wayne, and the Colts. They played well enough in the regular season to be able to play this game however they wanted. Really...these stats mean nothing. Payton's not a bad guy and he's a pretty damn good QB. I get tired of seeing his mug everywhere too, but I suppose folks are pretty sick of seeing the Pats everywhere these days.

    Give credit where credit's due. He can play and the Colts are probably the only real challengers to the Pats. Both teams want the same thing - hoist a trophy. All this other stuff is something to get us wound up. I couldn't care less about records, endorsements, contracts, or the uniforms. It's all about the ring.

    GO PATS!

     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from mnstormchaser. Show mnstormchaser's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    here is a trivia question for you......before joining the AFL...what were the now Pats called and what city did they play in?.....ya I am aging you....Billy S, owned the team....note!!! I myself born raised in mass.though right now live in Frozen trunda(Minn)
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from mnstormchaser. Show mnstormchaser's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    ok..take away all those games manning played in a DOME..then tell me his records be the same I highly doubt that
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    Underdog et al... let's step outside of the Colts versus Pats records discussion.. (as an aside, I say more power to a player who can set personal, if not league records, in their season, why not? Just not to the detriment of the team, which it appears happened to the Colts )

    Since this seems to be a "record" type of discussion string, how about we discuss the conditions in which these players play which either benefit or harm their ability to set records? And, I will add TWO names to the equation - Favre and Marino.

    Manning, no doubt, is probably on track to break Favre records. Agree? Favre has been breaking Marino's records, right? But consider, Marino and Favre are OUTDOOR players, no benefit of a dome to shield them from the elements playing field half the year, as is Brady. Marino played in fair weather climes most of the time, late into the season, being in Miami. Favre is in the "ice box"! We saw Brady's numbers decline as a result of playing in horrible weather in 3 of the Pats last four games. Can we safely say if Brady had Manning's or Marino's condition for those games, he may have obliterated the TD, QB rating, completion percentage, and possibly, the season yardage totals? Right now, Manning, as much as a can recall, is the only "dome" QB of note who is in this discussion. Manning's QB ratings when he is outdoors, does pale in comparison to his indoor achievements. When all is said and done, IMHO, what Favre has done being in Green Bay will far surpass Marino or Manning because of the conditions he has to face playing there.

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from underdogg. Show underdogg's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    My previous posts were unceremoniously deleted. Guess I was getting too logical.

    AGC,

    1) how were the colts records, personal or otherwise, detrimental to their team?

    2) regarding the records, I think you have some valid points, but I don't know how you relegate Manning's accomplishments to 2nd tier when he had no control over who drafted him.

    3) but that said, I did a little checking - from 2000 through 2007 Manning has played 64 regular season away games. Of those games 2 were meaningless games at the end of the season and he played very little. 4 other games were played in opposing domes. Thus, 58 meaningful games outside. In 33 of those 58 games he had a passer rating of 90 or over (disclosure - these numbers are rounded up so a couple could be 89.6 for example). That is pretty good football, still, in the elements. Additionally, all of these games were away. While the elements are certainly a factor, so is whether or not the game is played at home or away. My general assumption is that Brady would be better in the elements at home more so than in the elements away over his career. Manning's home career is in a dome, so while his games may be better there because of no elements, they may also be better there because they are at home.

    But I will still agree with you that Favre's accomplishments are significant.

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from michelle2227. Show michelle2227's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    Westcoastman, are you kidding me?

    Your entire argument is laughable. When have the Patriots ever rested their starters under Belichick? I can't think of any times really but I'm at work so it's tough to research. Belichick almost has always gone for it on 4th as far as I'm concerned. Also, he always plays his starters until it is definite that teams cannot make a comeback. If you ask me, that's just smart, professional coaching that is also entertaining, rather than sitting your starters and watching a bunch of backups make mistakes - nobody wants to pay for that or watch it. Just because Dungy is cautious with his precious immoble Manning, doesn't mean everyone in the league has to follow in his one super bowl footsteps.

    Here's a thought, maybe if Manning had played in those games you researched he wouldn't have BLEW IT in the playoffs. By not resting your startings, yes, you are risking injury, but aren't you in every friggin game? Give me a break. Belichick is keeping our team in sync and on a roll, not letting them be lazy and sit around watching backups.

    This whole "playing for stats" argument is retarded. It's all Manning does - rather than win SBs, whereas Brady and Co just likes to win SBs. Argument ending. Get over it.

     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from michelle2227. Show michelle2227's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    And on another note, this is Professional Football, not High School so stop whining about running up scores and going for it on 4th, the way I see it, it's just our team giving some of the awful defenses a chance to actually stop us. If they could just do their damn job correctly this wouldn't be an issue.

    So let Peyton Manning go down as the greatest pass QB with the most 4,000+ yard season, etc, etc, etc CONGRATS TO HIM!

    But Brady will go down with the most SB wins and I much rather that than any other personal records. Don't be all jealous just because Brady is that good that he breaks a few on the way. Trust me, nobody cares about personal records around here NEARLY as much as Manning and Co.

     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    underdogg..

    What I meant was, if Dungy had left Manning et al in longer to secure the win, that's what I meant. I would think each team's goal is to win the game. Dungy may have felt winning was not important in this instance versus getting some players to significant personal achievements. Again, opinion, as I do not know Dungy.

    I did not relegate Manning's achievement to second tier.. I stated he will most likely eclispe them all. The overall point is this: compared to the other record holders in the list, Manning is a dome quarterback and how has the dome helped him considering his "dome" ratings are signiciantly higher than what he achieves outdoors, which, are nothing to sneeze at. Manning is an excellent QB and is the first of the "domer" type QBs to be in the top tier. As you pointed out in your response, there is a difference between playing at home versus on the road, which helps no matter what. Manning has a dome for a home.

     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    The Pats played their tail off harder than I believe I've seen any team play this year in that one game - they played as if that was the superbowl and they made sure they got their little individual records in the process.

    Westy, what are you saying? The Pats shouldn't have tried so hard given their circumstances? Not play hard enough to win the game? Insert your favorite team name here: "The ????? blew their last game of the season, a potentially undefeated season, becasue they rested their starters and barely made any efforts to win. Fans applaud effort to avoid history so starters can rest."

    I guess it is easy to make your statements when it is not YOUR team and players who are on the cusp of setting records and making history. Don't be a hypocrite!!

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from underdogg. Show underdogg's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    I guess then by your arguement, we will never really know whether or not Harrison and Wayne are actually good receivers since they will be colts for life. Isn't that what you are saying?

    In order to appropriately assess the excellence of a player they must first play outside of the system in which they were originally deemed to be good.

    The colts could say the same thing about Brandon Stokely, Marcus Pollard, Edgerrin James, Ken Dilger, Jerome Pathon, Dominic Rhodes...I could go on.

     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from underdogg. Show underdogg's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    NJ,

    by the same token we could say that the pats played too much in their game in order to accomplish their achievements. And we saw some of these same actions when playing brady well into the 4th during the season when games were already won.

    but the real answer to your issue is that the colts earned the right to play in whatever way they wish. the pats earned the same right.

    On the "integrity" comment. Everyone in pats land has a problem with dungy due to his comments about belichick. fair enough. But dungy's comments never would have come out if the crime had not been done. Not only that, but dungy didn't offer it of his opinion unasked. If we are to cut bb slack for his transgression then I think you all need to cut dungy twice as much slack for his comments. They are not somehow worse than what bb did.

    Re: Jeff fisher. Again, the colts earned the right to play the game they wanted. They have been dealing with significant injuries all year and were not going to put others on the team in harms way too deep into the game. Look at Vince Young. He was hurt in the third. I think the pats are fortunate they came out of their game unscathed. It would suck to have your superbowl go down the drain in pursuit of regular season perfection.

    Re: your comments on manning vs. colts poor defense being the reason for losing games. It is easy to make your comment that manning was the problem, but Brady has never felt the need to carry his team on his shoulders because the defense couldn't hold their own. While I agree manning had bad games, in my opinion, some of that was due to concerns that the d would not hold up so he pressed too much.

    Brady has been excellent, no doubt, but again he has had much more of a complete team around him to help get the wins.

    In 2003 - he beat tennesse with 1 td and under 50% completion rate in a very cold game and one t.o. by both teams; against the colts, the d came up with 5 turnovers vs. 2 for the colts. vinateri kicked 5 field goals. Manning was awful. Brady was not special; the superbowl, brady was great, but again vinateri pulled it out. one t.o. by both teams.

    In 2004 - brady threw for 144 yds and the d came up with 3 turnovers (1 by manning) against the colts vs 0 by the colts). against pitt, brady threw for 200 yards and the d came up with 4 turnovers. against philly the d came up with 4 turnovers and brady threw for 2 tds and no ints.

    I could not get 2001 stats. My point here is that Brady had some great d to help. I do think brady has been remarkable in that when I went through those games, he did not turn the ball over. That is key.

     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from underdogg. Show underdogg's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    NJ and Sandman

    I don't disagree with your assessments of Manning. I am an Indy guy who attended college in Tennessee (not at UT). Actually hated manning and was a believer in the "he can't beat florida" mantra. he continued to prove that to me through some of his years against belichick. I was one of those guys that believed the colts should have drafted Ryan Leaf. Oh how wrong I was.

    What I believe I have learned about Manning is that he does press. Sometimes too much. I often wonder sometimes when he throws deep balls at questionable times if those are by design (to keep the db's honest) or if he is just getting antsy - maybe a little of both. I actually saw Brady do this a few times late in the season this year and was surprised.

    I sometimes believe that he thinks he needs to put the entire team on his shoulders and that he must (and that he can) win the game for his team. Against excellent coaching and smart defenses, he has come up short. I believe that Manning has started to get more comfortable against belichick defenses the more he played and lost to him. remember, the colts won 2 against the pats before winning the afccg.

    This year, however, was a new and an old animal. The new was that Harrison was out and the colts lost gonzalez in the first q. They were also without their starting left tackle something that is not common for Manning. The old is that they were without two starting linebackers, and two other starters were on IR. Thus the offense was down and the defense was down.

    That said, the colts were ahead in the 4th. Both the d and the o had played well. But, kind of like the pats last year, I think with the colts (due to their injuries) wore down.

    If they both make it to the afccg, I think it will be interesting.

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from flasox. Show flasox's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    If the Colts lose to the Pats, you will see Polian complaining about the field or ref's and Manning throwing his teamates under the bus.
     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from underdogg. Show underdogg's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    hmm - sort of like the pats complaining about piped in noise or excessive heat?
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    Spoken like a true west coast fan, or better yet, someone who doesn't care. really, for the Pats. If your fav team were the ones in the 16 - 0 seat and someone from the east called "eastcoastman" posted the same stuff you did, I am 100% certain you would react the same as Pats fans do here. So don't give us the 16 - 0 record doesn't mean much! It does if it is YOUR team and since it isn't, you'll do what you can to diminish the Pats accomplishments. Which you have in many ways with the sugar coating of "I respect the Pats, but..." . Jealousy is a hard woman to push away, isn't she?
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from indianafan. Show indianafan's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    Shows how much you people know about the Colts. There has numerous games over the years he could of played whole games and racked up bigger numbers. He came out the other night in the 2nd quarter. Unlike your wonderful team where your coach plays everyone till the clock runs out with a big lead. I was thinking someone would break Brady's leg in a meaningless game during the season. I seen Wilfork got a slap on the hands this week. About like the other one's he has gotten over the years.(what class) I hope the Pats and Colts make it to the AFC Championship game. Can't wait till we come to Foxboro.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from agcsbill. Show agcsbill's posts

    Manning's eight 4000-yard seasons

    Westy,

    Ok, you may not be jealous at all and thanks for the respect given. Also, I think we do see more posters from outside NE diss the Pats than respect them. You are in the minority.

    I am not MAD or expect fans outside of the NE area to oooh and aaahh over the Pats. What I find shallow about your comments is the fact your team IS NOT in the position the Pats are in and it is VERY EASY to say what you say, because it sounds politically correct for someone outside of NE to say. I think you would be in a VERY small minority of fans of your fav team who would want to see their team not be in the history books for the sake of not losing in the playoffs. I find it interesting you can feel this way even if your team has this opportunity. Grabbing a piece of history apparently is not your cup of tea. Maybe I'm wrong. My opinion.

    If your team were to have "thrown out" the last game of the season, to lose a chance to have an undefeated regular season, and it does win the SB, how many times may you say: "I wonder if we would have done it if we didn't lose that last regular season game?" First, have FAITH in your team that they CAN! Pats fans DO!! The Pats aren't thinking "undefeated", they're thinking win the next game and they have been successful at being 1 - 0 16 times. The next game will be another effort at being 1 - 0, etc.. Their goal is to win the SB, having gone undefeated in the regular season is a pleasant surprise. Now, if they lose, sure we will be upset, and this site won't be a pleasant one with all the trash talking that will appear, but it will not be the end of the world.

    As to your last paragraph: Tom Brady could have been hurt in ANY game he played, whether it happens in the 1st quarter or 4th. That risk occurs every time he steps on the field. Why is this season any different that prior years other than that 16 - 0 record?

     

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