New baseball stadium

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from porkshop-a-go-go. Show porkshop-a-go-go's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    Hellgirl rules.  That is all.
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from voteforme. Show voteforme's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    In Response to Re: New baseball stadium:
    we are starting to see life on the streets of downtown on Friday and Saturday nights.


    What about the rest of the week?  You see "life" on Fridays and Saturday nights going into the pubs, that's about it.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from user_4048808. Show user_4048808's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    In Response to Re: New baseball stadium:
    In Response to Re: New baseball stadium : What about the rest of the week?  You see "life" on Fridays and Saturday nights going into the pubs, that's about it.
    Posted by voteforme


    No need to bash that.  So it's a bad thing we have a modest life on a Friday night over a complete dead zone?  Perhaps it's the first step toward a lively center every night.

    One point - Fenway Park is part of the history of Boston and hosts a major league team. Minor league parks are most definitively a suburban phenomena.

    Counterpoint - Does it matter if it can attract large amount of people to the point of being our anchor?  Criticize it as a suburban thing if you must, but if it attracts an urban size crowd and can be directed to our square, then it's a good thing.

    Again also, as is, it's a giant wasteland.  So what do we have to lose?  Is there someone else who wants to invest that in that block?
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from anotherman. Show anotherman's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    TheHumanist:

    I'm leery about downtown Malden being a destination for nightlife with bars and clubs, like Lansdowne Street near Fenway, as that brings its own set of problems.

    I would rather have more upscale retail stores and restaurants to get Malden residents to spend more locally, instead of shopping in neighboring cities and towns.

    The ballpark in itself is not going to be enough to attract visitors, you need to have nearby amenities for folks to have an all-around experience before, during and after ballpark events, and those are sorely lacking now.
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from AnnieOMalden. Show AnnieOMalden's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    I don't believe anyone else thought they had a real chance as this has been a done deal for years. The developers at Wellington did a phenomenal job and kudos to those developers in Everett where Target is. Somehow we cannot bring real jobs to this city. We have more commercial property and yet we want to build a ball park which will be dormant for much of the year. My holiday dollars did not stay in this city this past year or any other year. So far all I can say is: more of the same thinking with this ballpark and more apartments on the way. People are not going to go two streets away from the ballpark to visit Pleasant St. even if you open it up.
     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from anotherman. Show anotherman's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    AnnieO:

    You are right on point. The developer of this stadium only cares about what this ballpark business will do for his bottomline, and could care less about what is being developed around Malden Center, and Mayor Christenson and the MRA have bought into this venture.

    Some previous posters say that this ballpark would be an anchor for downtown Malden, but I am highly skeptical about this viewpoint, as I question how much economic activity would such a minor-league ballpark generate for Malden, especially given the fact that we don't have an adequate level of supporting businesses (i.e. stores, restaurants, etc.) around such a venue.
     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from user_4048808. Show user_4048808's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    In Response to Re: New baseball stadium:
    AnnieO: You are right on point. The developer of this stadium only cares about what this ballpark business will do for his bottomline, and could care less about what is being developed around Malden Center, and Mayor Christenson and the MRA have bought into this venture. Some previous posters say that this ballpark would be an anchor for downtown Malden, but I am highly skeptical about this viewpoint, as I question how much economic activity would such a minor-league ballpark generate for Malden, especially given the fact that we don't have an adequate level of supporting businesses (i.e. stores, restaurants, etc.) around such a venue.
    Posted by anotherman

    Aren't you making a chicken and egg argument?  We can't get enough supporting businesses because there's not enough economic activity to support them.  We can't make anything from an anchor-type business because we don't have neough supporting businesses?  


    You're right to be skeptical on how much this can help exactly.  I can see the worst case scenario - a total bust and we foot the bill to deal with it somehow compounding our trouble centered.  There's also scenario 2 - more of the same - we get a giant crowd 40 days a year who come and leave and nothing else.  

    But what of the alternative.  A realistic one to happen within the next 5-10 years?  The only alternative I can see is a no build scenario.  Which, barring some miracle breaking a 30 year trend to my knowledge, means scenario 2.  

    The only chance for a better scenario is to go with the build.  

    Of course, we need to connect Pleasant St to the ballpark.  I think it's possible.  Though the best chance for it to happen requires these things.  The entrence to the park MUST face Malden Station/RT 60.  If it does not, much of the momentum will be lost as people go to the parking garage/lot (I hope it's a garage).  Second, City Hall and its police station bunker must be rid of with its shops extended to exchange.  Third, might require that office building too to be replace with some restaurants, bars, and shops.  Two of the three seem to be in some plans at least.  For three, I can only hope it might eventually turn up or not necessary.  

    I don't see whether the developer cares not matters.  If he cares, would it change anything?  The ball park will attract the same number of people regardless.  What matters is how much beneficial impact it could bring.  He might be only be guided by his self-interest, but I see a chance that it might benefit us in the proccess and Malden can darn-well use the break.  That what I bet Christenson is thinking.  That's what I hope it means for Malden.  
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from user_4048808. Show user_4048808's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    Oh and one more thing.  The Target is "nice" as my memory says it was a swamp before.  But it's a strip mall.  I don't see why is that such a big deal.  The Wellington thing is something worthy of praise.  

    Also, how is the ballpark is "more of the same?"  The more of the same is the habit of knocking down stores and other buildings for parking lots and condos like on Pleasant and Main Street.  A ballpark on a giant National Grid Industrial Lot - a giant chemical parking lot - doesn't sound like a big loss to me.  
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from porkshop-a-go-go. Show porkshop-a-go-go's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    Here's how it's more of the same:

    It's another large stretch of land in Malden where I won't be spending a dollar of my money.
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from anotherman. Show anotherman's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    In Response to Re: New baseball stadium:
    In Response to Re: New baseball stadium : The only chance for a better scenario is to go with the build.   Of course, we need to connect Pleasant St to the ballpark.  I think it's possible.  Though the best chance for it to happen requires these things.  The entrence to the park MUST face Malden Station/RT 60.  If it does not, much of the momentum will be lost as people go to the parking garage/lot (I hope it's a garage).  Second, City Hall and its police station bunker must be rid of with its shops extended to exchange.  Third, might require that office building too to be replace with some restaurants, bars, and shops.  Two of the three seem to be in some plans at least.  For three, I can only hope it might eventually turn up or not necessary.
    Posted by TheHumanist


    I don't pretend to be a city planner, TheHumanist, but you are making a lot of assumptions with your "best case scenario" above, what with the moving of City Hall, the MPD station, the Bank of America office building, replacing them with shops, and connecting Pleasant St to Exchange St. All of these is going to require money, and I seriously doubt the city has allocated any for this plan, have they?

    If these moves do not happen, I don't think the ballpark business will be viable in the long run.
     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from JIRKYRICK. Show JIRKYRICK's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    I have a 10 game plan to the SOX and 20 game plan for the  Bruins.  and sorry Hellgirl... I will also go to the local minor league games.  A lot cheaper and Fenway is a real pain in the posterior to get home from on the green line.  Its 40 minutes during a good day, its 60 minutes or more during a sox game...its the green line from hell (no pun intended, but hey thats funny) after a game.

    Just becuase its a ball park does not mean that is all it can be used for.  Look at how they use Fenway during the winter months and extended road trips.  Think of the bigger picture.  Do we really need another high rise in that space. 

    As much as I hate soccer, I somehow get a feeling that they could fill the park up for soccer games with the current population in Malden and Everett.  Hopefully that crowd would spend some money too
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from JustinApinyen. Show JustinApinyen's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    Hellgirl, I'd like to disagree with you. You stated that if you were going to take in a game which is unlikely, it would be at Fenway. In my fantasy world, I would do the same. But realistically with my family of four I've figured that outing to be roughly $335.00 (Based on a family of 4 - $5. Parking $10.- T, $215.-Tickets, $35-concessions $75-dinner on Landsdown)  Why should I have to spend that kind of money to enjoy America's Past time. I went to the Rox last year and my total for the day was just under $100. all in, with the exception of gas. So from my POV I'm not seeing the plus side of your argument.

    Also, I think it would be great if the new stadium offers a Malden resident discount. 
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from anotherman. Show anotherman's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    JustinApinyen:

    Let me ask you this about your trip down to Brockton to see the Rox: did you spend any time and/or dollars on the businesses nearby the stadium before or after the game?
     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from JustinApinyen. Show JustinApinyen's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    Good point, and we actually did. Prior to the game I stopped in at CVS to get sunscreen and some gum for the kids. Then after the game I stopped Shaws to get my food shopping done, it was a Sunday and I didn't want to have to go back out after getting home.

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from fscib52. Show fscib52's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    Today, you cannot compare Brocton to Malden. Two years ago I worked at  Caritas Good Sam in Brockton. The head of security was a Brocton Police sargeant. He told me the crime in that city was worse than all of the Boston neighborhoods. He said there were shootiungs/stabbings every week end. The ER would fill up fast, then they would med flight patients to Boston. They conviently keep it out of the news. Not a good safe enviroment to take kids on a weekend. Malden is a much safer town right know.
    I see the drivers point. We will need more police on our force. Maybe with the new revenue from the ballpark this will happen.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from hellgirl. Show hellgirl's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    In Response to Re: New baseball stadium:
    Counterpoint - Does it matter if it can attract large amount of people to the point of being our anchor?  Criticize it as a suburban thing if you must, but if it attracts an urban size crowd and can be directed to our square, then it's a good thing. Again also, as is, it's a giant wasteland.  So what do we have to lose?  Is there someone else who wants to invest that in that block?
    Posted by TheHumanist


    I think you missed the original point. Fenway is a sneeze away and I fail to see how a minor league ballpark will draw crowds when it's just as easy to jump the T, go to a major league game, and know that there's plenty to do afterwards, within spitting distance of the park.

    The plot being developed isn't a bad thing, but acting like building The Field of Dreams here is going to salvage downtown is ridiculous. I'm more inclined to believe my daughter's imaginary horse talks as she insists it does.

    Even with this "anchor", it's not exactly a skip to downtown or the T from the park; and dowtown's "business district" is hemmed in and hardly readily apparent, even as you step off the T. Open the city up, invest in small businesses that draw, focus on the arts, and then move on.

    Downtown is not a mall. What anchor does Davis Square have? Union? Central? They don't. They do, however, have a great nightlife and lots of unique little shops to duck into along the way.

    Renewal doesn't mean eradication of crime or other problems, but it can be pushed back and having a minor league ballpark in a wasteland 10 minutes walk from a downtown that no one can see or 20 minutes T from a vibrant metro major league park is a non-answer to Malden's decay.
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from hellgirl. Show hellgirl's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    Justin - OK. I see your point, and yet...Fenway keeps filling seats and selling out games. I get a mil discount to Fenway and I forget the prices of tix though, I'll grant that.
     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from anotherman. Show anotherman's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    In Response to Re: New baseball stadium:
    In Response to Re: New baseball stadium : I think you missed the original point. Fenway is a sneeze away and I fail to see how a minor league ballpark will draw crowds when it's just as easy to jump the T, go to a major league game, and know that there's plenty to do afterwards, within spitting distance of the park. The plot being developed isn't a bad thing, but acting like building The Field of Dreams here is going to salvage downtown is ridiculous. I'm more inclined to believe my daughter's imaginary horse talks as she insists it does. Even with this "anchor", it's not exactly a skip to downtown or the T from the park; and dowtown's "business district" is hemmed in and hardly readily apparent, even as you step off the T. Open the city up, invest in small businesses that draw, focus on the arts, and then move on. Downtown is not a mall. What anchor does Davis Square have? Union? Central? They don't. They do, however, have a great nightlife and lots of unique little shops to duck into along the way. Renewal doesn't mean eradication of crime or other problems, but it can be pushed back and having a minor league ballpark in a wasteland 10 minutes walk from a downtown that no one can see or 20 minutes T from a vibrant metro major league park is a non-answer to Malden's decay.
    Posted by hellgirl



    hellgirl:

    You rock! I could not have expressed this any better, you and I are on the same wavelength! Smile
     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from JIRKYRICK. Show JIRKYRICK's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    since nobody can read my posts, hmmm I dont know why.  Fenway is not a sneeze throw from Malden.  Fenway is not 10, 15 or 20 minutes from Malden unless you drive there. It takes me an hour to get home from a game using the train.  Perhaps if you went to the games you would know that.  

    I plan on going to the minor league games in Malden and then enjoying a cocktail or two after the game in the square. It will be a cheap nite out compared to the Red Sox and Bruins

    If you dont support the local pro teams by going to their games why would anyone expect you to patronize the Malden field? 

    Just please do not put another DOCKSIDE in it, two is more than enough for Malden
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from user_4048808. Show user_4048808's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    If you missed me saying this.

    ...That Fenway Park is only a few miles away, by T, it's about ~40 minutes (the Green Line is slow), but only 10 minutes to North Station.

    Basically, with Fenway so close and given the state of baseball: Is there enough baseball to support the stadium and subsequently our center...?

    I have already agreed with you earlier with the statement "Is there enough baseball to support the stadium and subsequently our center?"  For some reason, this guy have been searching for years to build this thing and throw $50 million dollars at it.  Maybe he's one of those faith guys who thinks "If you build it, they will come."  Or maybe he's just trying to pull a Monorail job, if you get that reference.  I don't know, and I'm pretty sure you don't know.  But I'm keeping in mind that someone who throws that much money is more like to done his homework than not.  However, I get your skepticism, I get this isn't 1969 when there was no doubt it could.  I already said earlier there's many factors to bodes against this project.  

    I'm keeping a balanced view here.  But I'm also trying to give reasonable speculation.  Is it that unreasonable to think about that if we make the City Hall move happen sooner than later can help take advantage of the ball park?  Is it also unreasonable to note a big barrier is the suburban-style office building on Exhange street? Did I say this will save us?  No.  I said that there's a chance we can make something good from this.  For once, a project's best case scenario is actually not more decay (unlike our condo projects which everyone sees except our former mayor - I mean seriously, whowuddathuk condos while knocking down stores only have a best case senario of only more decay?).

    Is it time to bring out the champaign?  No.  But my first post said "This could be our anchor store" not this will be our savior.  I think that's a reasonable thing to postulate.  

    Oh and btw, I also agree downtowns are not malls.  People have subscribed to the anchor stores and the be all and end all too much.  It's what lead to City Hall being build where it is (seriously, what idiot thought a city hall can act like an anchor store?).  My view is things like the ball park can give the spark to spur investors to give our square the streetwall rebuild that we really need.  The chicken and egg I said earlier.  Malden Square needs better shops but too few will fail and we need a cohesive street wall too.  It takes a good number of restaurants and shops for there to be enough to become a distination in-of itself (and several other factors for us too).  To make that jump, something like the ballpark could do it.

    ---

    Oh and btw.  For anchors, Central have MIT and Harvard.  Davis have Tufts.  Union is from the momentum of all the squares around it.  Though I also have to give great credit to the train stations that Somerville, Cambridge, and Quincy have managed to take advantage, unlike us.  I believe that if you take away the schools, it would hurt - a lot, but the shops now have enough of its own momentum to attract on its own.  

    But still, the second half of your argument is incorrect.

    Also, another big credit they have a cohesive street wall those squares.  A square that actually feels connected together.  Again I refer to this video(I posted this before in the "A New Vision for Malden Center" Thread watch around 5-8 mins area for the short version).  http://www.ted.com/talks/lang/en/james_howard_kunstler_dissects_suburbia.html


     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from poppymal. Show poppymal's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    (Rick, check your account that you are not hiding comments or contact the globe about your problem).
    From JirkyRick: since nobody can read my posts, hmmm I dont know why.  Fenway is not a sneeze throw from Malden.  Fenway is not 10, 15 or 20 minutes from Malden unless you drive there. It takes me an hour to get home from a game using the train.  Perhaps if you went to the games you would know that.  

    I plan on going to the minor league games in Malden and then enjoying a cocktail or two after the game in the square. It will be a cheap nite out compared to the Red Sox and Bruins

     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from buddykerr. Show buddykerr's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    the new ballpark will have a year 'round restaurant on corner of commercial and medford-- the park will also have a year 'round pro shop on route 60, aside concourse to parks' entrance. the park IS going to include the high school and home games; possibly including football games in the fall. the park will be family friendly, so, moneywise a far less wallet buster like fenway. the park is obviously not expecting malden residents alone to fill the park. baseball fans and families from neighboring communities will be included in all ads. do you think fenway is sold out( 8 years and counting) every game with boston residents? they come from all over new england. like anything else, if the 'product' they run out every game wins, interest  will remain high. under stand this. because of the condition of entire square block' s land, only a certain type of venture can locate there. like it or not this is perfect, ask the engineers, they know.
     
  23. You have chosen to ignore posts from fugghedaboutit. Show fugghedaboutit's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    In Response to Re: New baseball stadium:
    I'd much rather see a Trader Joe's than Whole Paycheck...er...Whole Foods come to Malden. But I fail to see how a baseball stadium is going to be any kind of economic boon to this city. I mean, let's face it...there's nothing for game attendees to do in the city afterwards! And I didn't buy one single thing for Christmas in Malden. Not even at Stop n Rob or Wal-Greens - although when I did recently visit Wal-Green's to pick up some blue bags, I was approached by a young lady whose face was clearly beginning to show the ravages of Crystal Meth abuse (awesome teeth too!) while I was buckling my toddler into her carseat. Said young lady asked me for a dollar so she could "Pick up her scrip" - while one of her male companions was screaming obscenities at a car that had just gone by on 60 and the other genius was off a ways loudly shouting at someone on his cell phone. THAT was an interesting conversation with my daughter on the way home. "Mummy, are you OK? Why was that lady asking you for a money? She smelled funny." "Why is that guy yelling at people? Wow! You goin' fast! " I couldn't bloody well say, "Yeah. She reeked of chemicals from her meth habit and that's why she was asking me for money!" and "Because he's completely out of his tree high!" and "You better believe I just laid a patch of tire getting out of this h311 hole! Those people made the hair on my neck stand up and I don't have a gun. So we're OUT." Oh, Malden.
    Posted by hellgirl

     
  24. You have chosen to ignore posts from AnnieOMalden. Show AnnieOMalden's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    buddy: If the ballpark will host football games in the fall, why are we spending a million bucks to redo McDonald stadium? Will the city have to pay to use the park? This is not a city owned park so I cannot imagine the owner just allowing city events to just be held there for no charge. As far as I can recall, the charter school had to pay to play on the fields the city has and they weren't in the best shape. Like Gary says, the devil is in the details.
     
  25. You have chosen to ignore posts from anotherman. Show anotherman's posts

    Re: New baseball stadium

    In Response to Re: New baseball stadium:
    buddy: If the ballpark will host football games in the fall, why are we spending a million bucks to redo McDonald stadium? Will the city have to pay to use the park? This is not a city owned park so I cannot imagine the owner just allowing city events to just be held there for no charge. As far as I can recall, the charter school had to pay to play on the fields the city has and they weren't in the best shape. Like Gary says, the devil is in the details.
    Posted by AnnieOMalden



    You are correct, Annie. I don't know what kind of arrangement will be made between the ballpark owner and the local schools for use of that facility, but I cannot imagine Bok not charging a fee for using the stadium, and then, this begs the question: why in the world would the local schools do that if they have existing facilities that they can use, without paying a fee?
     
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