Towns that actually did PAYT studies

  1. You have chosen to ignore posts from danc. Show danc's posts

    Towns that actually did PAYT studies

    Here are links to two studies by Arlington and Andover that took the time to do research and engaged the community in implementing a PAYT program.  While it's obvious that Malden did not do either of those, especially community outreach, what is also evident is that Malden's program ignores many of the 'lessons-learned' from other towns and does not address many of the risks and downfalls of these programs.  If you're interested, read and draw your own conclusions:

    http://andoverma.gov/publish/paytreport.pdf

    http://www.arlingtonma.gov/public_documents/ArlingtonMA_TownMeet/2010ATM/reports/PAYT-ReportTownMeeting_2010.pdf
     
  2. You have chosen to ignore posts from ThreeStooges88. Show ThreeStooges88's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

    Thank You for positing this information.
     
  3. You have chosen to ignore posts from Driver54. Show Driver54's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

     danc& three stooges88---read both websites the The arlington one
      was done this year where the other was done in 2003.
     It was a learning experience---Maybe Malden can learn how to post things that concern its citizens--it was very informational.
     
  4. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheVendetta. Show TheVendetta's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

    great post
     
  5. You have chosen to ignore posts from 1775andStillaDemocrat. Show 1775andStillaDemocrat's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

    Danc---we have a Malden resident that works over there and they gave us alot of information.

    But it doesn't surprise me when a Town seems to get projects like this correct as they must listen and work for the people.

    Look at how they actually cared about the citizen's and don't mandate the PAYT against us: 

    PAYT Observations & Conclusions

    • PAYT is the right thing to do.

    – Improves recycling habits and has real

    environmental benefits.

    – Helps cover the Town’s collection costs,

    which in turn can preserve other services.

    – Costs to residents is equitable. You “pay as

    you throw” away non-recyclable items.

    Timing of implementation is of concern.

    – Current financial climate is tough.

    – Prefer to put to PAYT option to voters as part

    of the override discussion

     
  6. You have chosen to ignore posts from Driver54. Show Driver54's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

    1775stillademocrat----PAYT IS BEHIND US< LETS START WITH
    RETURNING THE FIREFIGHTERS AND POLICE TO THEIR JOBS;
     WITH YOU AND MTFA IT IS PAYT___GET A SOME NEW ISSUES
     FIRST____LIKE FIXING OUR STREETS&SIDEWALKS;
     SECOND____BIGBELLYSOLARCOMPACTORS FOR OUR SIDEWALKS
      and more to ideas instead of always PAYT /> IT IS DEAD

     
  7. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheVendetta. Show TheVendetta's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

    1775 your right. They need to work with the people. The people that voted against it. We won that fight and how they over rode it was wrong. We still have a chance to win this fight again. More now then ever.
     
  8. You have chosen to ignore posts from Clee5717. Show Clee5717's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

    I think a big problem we have is no one runs against the mayor.  We need a new voice, 1775? Vendetta? :)

    We need one person, one voice to change things and make a difference. 
     
  9. You have chosen to ignore posts from YouDidMeWrong. Show YouDidMeWrong's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

    In Response to Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies:
    I think a big problem we have is no one runs against the mayor.  We need a new voice, 1775? Vendetta? :) We need one person, one voice to change things and make a difference. 
    Posted by Clee5717


    I think 1775 should run for Mayor, and I know he would win...I for one would do anything to help him get there...Rumor has it that Mayor Howard will not run next time around, I don't know how true that is, but it's out there..
     
  10. You have chosen to ignore posts from Driver54. Show Driver54's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

     YouDidMeWrong----1775andstilla democrat-----Stop and think what
      your saying-----Everytime you hear from 1775 it is all about PAYT,

       we need new Issues---the other thought he runs the Malden Tax

       Foundation----They have no Offices it is run out of his Home;

       Most foundations have Offices and literature that can be sent out

       when the last time you saw a Master mailing from them, when the

       last time he had a major article in amy local papers challenging

       the City Council---he comes to meeting with a pocket note book,

       (when I took bets at the places i worked these were the same

         books i used.No computer to keep notes just a little note

         book---Great way to run a foundation)

     
  11. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheVendetta. Show TheVendetta's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

    Most reporters use note books. Watch the news room in the white house one day.

    I wouldnt run for mayor. I would kick everyone out the city. lol

    1775 should run. he would win
     
  12. You have chosen to ignore posts from anotherman. Show anotherman's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

    Thanks for the links, danc.

    They are really eye-openers and I just wish our Mayor and City Councillors had done such a study and consulted their constituents in a public forum, before shoving the PAYT program down our throats.

    TheVendetta, I agree with you. 1775andStillaDemocrat seems to have his act together and I would definitely support his candidacy if he chooses to run for Mayor or City Councillor... It's time we elect new blood, with fresh ideas into office.
     
  13. You have chosen to ignore posts from Driver54. Show Driver54's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

     Anotherman----everyone has his opinion----Mayor's race is long way

      off------Again Bob Miller might be a great guy ---but again to get

      people to listen is to have Public Forums, Mass Mailings,etc;

     
  14. You have chosen to ignore posts from Clee5717. Show Clee5717's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

    I like Bob Miller as Mayor, I think it's a great idea, and don't worry about the cash to run Bob, I'm sure your could raise the money.  I think to organize a campaign the way you did and be able to reach the amount of people you have is incredible, you can reach the citizens of Malden!!!!

     
  15. You have chosen to ignore posts from TheVendetta. Show TheVendetta's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

    I would give a large donation to him. He has the right stuff.
     
  16. You have chosen to ignore posts from Driver54. Show Driver54's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

    vendetta-----another lie---that makes 3 on here;
     
  17. You have chosen to ignore posts from danc. Show danc's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

    If Malden approached PAYT like these towns did, I would support it.  I recycle more and throw out less trash than probably 99% of residents, so having people pay for their own trash instead of using my property taxes makes a lot of [cents]. 

    However, I read this Andover study way back before the mayor had his after-the-fact town meetings with his revenue pie-charts about selling bags.  (No such charts about increased recycling by the way.  That was an after thought.)  Those meetings were a joke.  The contrast between the two approaches was so dramatic that I couldn't support it if it was the best idea in the world due to the sleazy way it was deployed.

    The problem continues today.  That problem is that Mayor Howard and others officials refuse to engage in honest, open and intelligent dialogue with Malden citizens.  Here's an example:  In the article about illegal dumping on Waitt's Mount a couple months back, the DPW Director was quoted denying that there has been any increase in illegal dumping, when we all know there has.  I've reported dumping incidents to the DPW or ward councillor on a monthly basis since the program started and that's just me.

    So why deny what we all know?  Why not just say, "There has been a slight increase, but the DPW promptly takes care of all reported dumping.  The benefit of increased recycling and savings far outweighs the slight increase in dumping."    I would buy that in a heartbeat.  It's honest and reasonable.  Instead we get lies and denials. 

    That's why I helped gather signatures for Bob's petition even though having the PAYT benefits me more personally.

    So I would certainly vote for Bob or any candidate that engages our citizens openly and honestly and intelligently.  Our mayor, many of the councillors, and other city officials who continue to show us they won't do this, need to go ASAP.

     
  18. You have chosen to ignore posts from JIRKYRICK. Show JIRKYRICK's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

    "Costs to residents is equitable. You “pay as

    you throw” away non-recyclable items"

    ummm huh, wha... isnt that what are taxes are for?

     
  19. You have chosen to ignore posts from YouDidMeWrong. Show YouDidMeWrong's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

    danc, isn't our waste pickup included in our property taxes? I think it is, that makes it double taxation. I don't mind recycling but I do not want it forced on me. I think had the Mayor been honest from the start it would have gone a lot smoother.
     
  20. You have chosen to ignore posts from Driver54. Show Driver54's posts

    Re: Coming soon phone#s of elected officials

      Very shortly all the Phone numbers of the 9 councilors who voted
      for a Budget that eliminated 13+Firemen and 10+ Police Officiers
       Do not be afraid to call them and ask why?
     
  21. You have chosen to ignore posts from danc. Show danc's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

    Waste pick up WAS part of our property taxes.  In theory (and I stress the 'theory' part since tracing the money trail would be difficult even if city hall was cooperative, which they wouldn't be), the property tax money that was being spent on waste was freed by PAYT for other things.  However, since there were budget gaps to close, that's where the freed money went.  So again 'in theory' PAYT allowed them to make up a budget gap without cutting services in past years.  Essentially meaning the same amount of tax revenue (paid only by property owners) went further because the waste collection was paid for (or at least partially offset) by PAYT revenue (paid for by everyone including renters).

    Ideally you'd want to see PAYT revenues reduce your taxes, but instead it was used on the other end to prevent cuts to services and balance budgets (last years).

    The concern is whether the PAYT program will work at all in the long term considering the poor way that it was deployed.  One or both of these studies document risks that the program may not sustain itself long term.  On top of that, even in the first year it fell short of the projected savings.

    Since neither the mayor, the town nor the DPW is willing to restructure the program to deal with these risks (they like the cross-your-fingers approach to risk mitigation), our best bet is continue pushing them to repeal it.
     
  22. You have chosen to ignore posts from Driver54. Show Driver54's posts

    Re: Towns that actually did PAYT studies

     Danc---Your 100% right---Payt Monies paid for other expenses-----
      But to cut 13+ Fireman and 10+ Police Officers and possible
      demotions-----is wrong-----Not one City Hall Employee had their
      Pay Cut,offered furloughs or laid off.
      This is a situation which is totally wrong-----
      Today my wife was at Shop& Stop and had a flyer put on her
       car window it was asking the  residents to call the 9 Councilors
       who voted on this Budget and to reinstate the Firemen& Police:
      When the stock market crashed I was taking 3 day furlougs without
      pay------now it is going good again.
     
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