Notre Dame criticized over Obama invite
The White House yesterday announced that President Obama will be the commencement speaker at the University of Notre Dame and, right on cue, a controversy has erupted in Catholic circles over whether it is appropriate for the Catholic university to honor a non-Catholic politician who supports abortion rights.
The university's announcement made no mention of the abortion issue, but noted that Obama will be "the ninth U.S. president to be awarded an honorary degree by the University and the sixth to be the Commencement speaker." The university plans to give Obama an honorary doctor of laws degree at the ceremony on May 17.
The question of how Catholic universities should treat politicians who have policy disagreements with the Catholic church has dogged Catholic higher education for years, but has intensified recently with the rise of prominent Catholic politicians who support abortion rights, now including House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and Vice-President Joseph Biden. In 2004, the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops issued a statement on "Catholics in Political Life" that declared, "The Catholic community and Catholic institutions should not honor those who act in defiance of our fundamental moral principles. They should not be given awards, honors or platforms which would suggest support for their actions." It's not entirely clear to me whether the policy is meant to apply to non-Catholic politicians like Obama, but there have been controversies over such honors before, most prominently when some at Boston College protested an honorary degree for Condoleezza Rice in 2006 because of her role in the Iraq War. Last year, I took a look at the situation in a story for the Globe and found that Catholic colleges were increasingly shying away from controversial speakers.
Of course, the president of the United States raises the stakes considerably -- is a Catholic college really supposed to refuse a platform to the elected leader of the nation if he has a disagreement, however serious, with Catholic teachings? Today, many on the right are arguing that the answer is yes.
The Cardinal Newman Society immediately set up a protest web site, asking people to "Help Stop the Scandal at Our Lady's University." Greg Kandra, over at The Deacon's Bench, blogs, "This falls under the category of "What Were They Thinking?" Thomas Peters, at the American Papist, predicts that Notre Dame will not back down, but says, "What can and will happen, I hope, is a frank discussion in the public spotlight about a) the mission and identity of Catholic universities and b) a greater awareness of the anti-Catholic policies and legislation that Obama is currently pursuing." And over at Via Media, Amy Welborn suggests Catholic universities stop inviting politicians altogether:
"I think it would be easier on everyone, frankly, if Catholic universities cut the cord with politicians completely. I don't care how prestigious you aim to be, how much you want your graduates to contribute to the fabric of American civic life, even a sitting president cannot help but associate you with a political ideology.I'm not arguing for the ghetto, at all, but we're not talking noble statesmen here. We're talking politicians who are divisive figures and who, Obama's case, are pursuing policies that directly threaten Catholic institutions."
At a minimum, there is sure to be significant protest of Obama's speech that will draw much more attention, and likely broaden the debate, over the question of who should be allowed to speak, and receive an honor, on Catholic campuses. The Rev. Austin Fleming, pastor of Holy Family parish in Concord, observes on his blog:
"I'm a Domer, a Notre Dame graduate (M.A. Theology/Liturgical Studies, '80), and worked in the ND Office of Campus Ministry for three years. That job found me on the commencement platform in 1981 when President Ronald Reagan received an honorary degree. Reagan's presence on campus sparked some controversy but I'll wager that was nothing compared to what we're going to see when Obama steps under the Notre Dame mantle."
(Photo, by Gerald Herbert/AP, shows President Obama at the Eisenhower Executive Office Building on the White House campus on 3/20/09.)
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I am not a huge pro-Obama person, but he is the elected President of the country. This idea of banning people from this school or that, simply based on a difference on an issue or two is tiresome. Every time a conservative is scheduled to speak at a school, the usual band of "free thinkers" slinks out to raise a stink. Now, it looks like tit-for-tat time. One would think that, especially at a school, opposing view points would be welcomed, if for nothing else than a vigorous debate. My sense about people who want to shut down those with who they disagree is that they are not comfortable enough in their own position to welcome the argument and to vigorously defend their belief. Let him speak.
This choice is a disgrace to the Catholic faith. We need to maintain dialogue and reasoned debate with those in public office who are yet blind to moral and spiritual truth. But to give honor and glory to their blindsided lies is like having a state dinner for Osama bin Laden. I would hope that the students and donors to this school named 'Our Lady' will consider seriously the implications of such an invitation.
Why is Obama wasting his time with a bunch of unChristian heathens that do not practice what they preach. Catholicism is a joke. Nobody cares what they or their poop thinks. How come the poop wears dresses and funny hats???? Why do they worship dead people and mary??? So many false idols, the rosary is man made. Thank god i left this man made religion.
Why would we not expect such behavior from a cult that supported the Nazi's when Jews were being killed and cremated????? This cult is man made and very dangerous. I left this cult many years ago after my parents divorced. Before that I was a happy protestant. My mothers evil family dragged me and my siblings into this evil cult, thank god I left. Obama, tell these cretins to kiss your butt!! If they are receiving any federal money, tell them to give it back.
The Church faction opposing a platform for the duly elected US President shows how truly out-of-touch that group is. As though the Church has any moral standing to judge anybody else, regardless of status -- a church under whose aegis many innocents have recently been abused -- not only that, but in whose name repeated efforts have been made to cover-up the outrage and to reward the enablers (viz. Cardinal Bernard Law). Just because the President fails to share every shred of Roman Catholic dogma does not make him "anti-Catholic" any more than it would make him "anti" any other denomination whose tenets he doesn't fully share. Bravo to those enlightened souls at Notre Dame who feel secure enough to hear what the President has to say.
Obama should not be allowed to give a speech or given a degree he is for taking life all that we honor and belive in at Norte Dame this is so so wrong he is a horrible President and has no write to speak at such a fine place of learning
You know who else Notre Dame has had as speaker? Derek Bok (1987)-- pro-choice. Vernon Jordan (1976)-- pro-choice. Tom Brokaw (1993)- pro-choice. Andrew Young (1988)-- pro-choice.
Give me a break. Hey Otto Ratzinger, this isn't the way you keep the church going-- defend molesters and demonize those concerned about the bodies of women.
i think he should be allowed to speak with no awards given
Such protests are more evidence of the Catholic Church being nothing more than an extreme right wing political party hiding under the veil of 'religion'. No to women's equality, no to gay rights, no to birth control, no to punishing war mongers, no to abortion rights, and on and on (including harboring child abusing priests for years) lead one to ask why anyone would want to be affiliated with the church in any way? Obama's accepting the honorary degree brings respect to a religion that has done far more to hurt mankind than help.
maybe they could have Cardinal Law come and speak about how to manage priest assignments so that the bad ones are never found out
A friend of mine used to teach at Notre Dame who is not Catholic, and vehemently pro choice. So if the university will hire people who are pro choice, surely they can handle a brief visit from one.
The catholic church is killing itself. It needs to evolve or the priests already speaking to nearly empty pews will soon be speaking to themselves.
Another slap in the face of practing Catholics by the "Catholic in Name Only" so called elite. They can forget about any support from me.
What is WRONG with these people?
No condoms to prevent AIDS/HIV? Convert withchraft believers to Catholicism, ie switch one 'faith" for another"? And all this from a man who wants to be taken seriously while wearing a dress.
I could go on....
Whatever happened to separation of church and state?
President Obama's policies cannot by any stretch of the imagination be considered "anti-Catholic, " let alone to "threaten Catholic institutions," but Roman Catholic political activism without a doubt threatens the right of every American to make moral decisions in the light of their own religious beliefs.
I pray for Fr. Jenkins and the entire University. Ever since Fr. Hesburgh left in 1987, It has become Corporate Notre Dame. Letting the current President step foot on campus is a joke. Worse than "Happy Holidays." We're Catholic. Let's be Catholic. Let's take a stance for what we believe in. Obama's pro-abortion stance is sickening. Notre Dame is clearly violating the 2004 US Bishops madate in "Catholics in Political Life".
Pete McCormick
Class of '88
"right on cue"? Why, is it incorrect to expect Catholic's to ignore the tenets of their faith?
Politicians would be well advised to cut their ties to all forms of superstition
If I were an alum I would be pressing to withdraw this invite.
How can this place consider it a Catholic Institution and allow such a pro abortion zealot give the commencement? This is a travesty.
Values are what is important, not hearing some radical (infanticide?) baby killer read from his tellie promtpa.
Catolicos Non Perdonatum Hypocresia Extremista ...
Verguenza de Nuesta Dama (French Notre Dame?.. Why French?)
Descriminazione Religiosa... Fascista!
SHame on Noter Dame!
the catholic church is becoming more scared to say no to these people like kerry, polosi, and biden. they should be excommunicated as god,s law is above man,s law.
The baby killer should not be invited to Notre Dame. I'm sure the Pope would agree. This is the guy that made fun of Challanged people on Jay Leno, what would he do there.
My husband attends ND Law School. We are very upset that Obama is the commencement speaker but shocked that he is gettng an honorary law degree. Obama is unapologogeticly against almost everything the Catholic church teaches. How could this happen? I think that Hell might have officially frozen over!
The Real Threat to American Catholicism... is Papa Benedict... who served in NAZI Youth?
in the 21st Century after Christ.... AGAINST CONDOMS in AFRICA to PREVENT AIDS!
CRIMINAL. -- FANATICAL ZEALOTRY! -- ANTI-REASON. --ANTI-CATHOLIC!
The WORD CATOLIC ... Inclusion of Many -- Now MEANINGLESS!
I'm not Catholic but I find this disturbing. Why would a Catholic University have a commencement speaker, who does not agree with the idealogies of the institution speak at commencement? This type of mixed message is unacceptable in my opinion. I's like People for Ethical Treatment of Animals honoring Michael Vick. It's outrageous!
Inviting President Obama to speak does not amount to an endorsement of his beliefs on abortion. A university cannot create an intellectually robust environment if it only allows to speak those people whose views are in lockstep with those of the administration. Certainly people have the right to protest Obama's policies, but to try to have his invitation rescinded is embarassingly small-minded.
Where is the Christianity here. Are the Catholics so blinded that they cannot see beyond their eyes. It is like the priest who said you could not go to Communion if you voted for Obama. Where oh Where is the Catholic Church going????Do they often wonder why so many young folk are turned off by all of these decisions and do not go to church anymore after having been brought up in good Catholic homes? Did God mean it to be this way???
If Notre Dame does not rescind the invitation, then their local bishop should revoke their Catholic identity. Enough is enough!!!
The fact that he is President does not excuse this monumental lapse in judgment by the person responsible for inviting him to speak.
Are they serving him a dinner of broiled fetuses too?
You know it's funny, a lot of these same people who condemn President Obama are the same people whot voted for GW Bush - a guy who is responsible for over 670,000 deaths in Iraq. Iraq had nothing tod do with 9/11, it was a geopolitical war prompted by Cheney and Bush
Where is the outrage there you phony Catholics?!
This is America. Here we can respectfully disagree to the point of physically defending the right of others to hold counter opinions. Certainly Catholics should be concerned and interested in the President's opinions on any important topic relative to natural law. Moreover, this visit is a chance to inform and to persuade him towards the logic and morality of the Catholic position on important issues. Giving this up in the name of dogma is lunacy.
I agree with conservative Catholics.
They should only invite the clergy to speak at Notre Dame
Everyone else will have some disagreement with some Catholic dogma and it's important that we protect our young people from the corrupting influence of any non catholic ideas
In fact, Catholics should be barred from watching TV or listening to the radio.
Too many non catholic ideas floating around there.
The Catholic Church is against abortion. It does however condone pedophilia and hide the perpetrators of such crimes. Go figure.
As a BC Alumnus, I was disgusted with my Alma Mater giving Condaleza Rice an honorary degree. She was Secretary of State during an unprovoked war on Iraq. There were no Iraqi's involved in 9/11 and there were no "weapons of mass destruction". Ms. Rice was buying Ferragamo shoes and going to Broadway shows while Americans were dying in the wake of Hurricane Katrina. Is the living human being in New Orleans and Iraq less valuable than an unborn fetus? Notre Dame has invited a President that believes every American should be dealt with respect, honor and dignity. Jesus Christ felt the same way.
He is the Anti-Christ. Not only 3rd Trimester abortion but also stem cell research!
Catolics are being told to stop the travesty of these activities but ND takes a bye for academia!! This is totally wrong, will never ever support ND in anything again!
My child went there so I know it
And yet this same school would gladly have priests ,bishops ,cardinals and vatican stewards and a Pope who watched the abuse and sexual gratification of their priests over the innocent for years . With out even a boo. Sad really . Since the catholic church has adopted conservatism. Conservatism has changed the church more than the church has changed conservatism. Greed does not exist other than platitudes. Marriage is secondary. Women are pawns.
to increase power.It is the church that no longer recognizes Jesus and God as the supreme deciders. No Like George Bush, they are the deciders .And like George Bush. GOD HELP US ALL.
No, he isn't Catholic. Yes, he has idealogical differences with the church.
However, while Notre Dame is a Catholic university, it is, above all, an American university, and as such, the American President shouldn't be rebutted on such flimsy grounds.
But hey, that's just my two cents.
Congratulations to Notre dame for having the courage and the conscience to invite President Obama to speak at the university. Catholic universities should be able and willing to invite speakers with whom they disagree on issues of faith and morals. That is what universities are supposed to be about, including Catholic universities: to teach, to learn, and to dialogue.
thom you are one sick puppy; go kick your dog !
Is the pope funding this "catholic" school? If there are any federal grants going to this school, they must be stopped. Why should the tax payers funding these type of schools which are narrow, disgraceful and un-American?
When will the age of reason truly begin?
Why should we pander to anyone's cult of the invisible buddy? I don't care if it's Allah,or Jehovah or whatever. It's insane to have faith where there is no evidence.
Catholics don't 'worship' anyone you mentioned. Before you go blabbering on about something you know nothing about you should check your facts, Thom.
i love seeing religious idiots publicly declare their idiocy. it makes it easier to see how foolish, silly, willfully ignorant, and evil religion and religious people are. they're always afraid of people who disagree with them, because they have no argument, because arguments require logic, reasoning, facts and respect, things that religious people don't understand.
You can say whatever you want but do not call my pope "poop" ever again or I will abortion you.
Catholics must focus their collective energy on social reform, social justice and saving poor children already walking the earth. An average of 27,000 die EVERY DAY from poverty and preventable diseases. Ten million every year. Supporting Republicans who give lip service to Pro-Life issues to get your vote, then do nothing about it with a conservative court in place now, is hypocrisy-in-action. Republicans who start wars under false pretenses don't deserve to speak at Catholic Universities either. Catholics who support Pro-Life candidates (who will never overturn RvW, lest they lose your vote) are blind to the duplicity and wealth mongering pervasive in the Republican party - expressly opposite Jesus' teachings.
The reporter wrote that Obama agreed to speak at Notre Dame, and "right on cue" a controversy started. Why can't reporters be objective? This little comment is a jab at those Catholics who are actually Catholics and oppose abortion! I would say that the Globe has inserted its bias into the story "right on cue." Go back to Journalism 101, Mr. Paulson.
And you people wonder why so many people are leaving the Catholic faith? Such hypocrites you are. Catholics are supposed to be Christians! None of these comments against Obama are christian like whatsoever!! When I was growing up as a Catholic I was taught to love everyone! That belief has eroded more and more every year. But you so called christians still follow blindly a faith that let priests molest young boys and girls and didn't do anything about it until it leaked into the press. Yes you are a bunch of damn hypocrites. I have to say I really feel sorrow for your narrowmindedness!
No government official should have anything to do with any religious entity. Remember seperation of church and state? They should also get no support from the government. The idiot pope says condoms make HIV worse. How ignorant can people get to be a follower of such stupidity?
Herr Ratzinger -- Mideval - African - Tour to African Poor.
In his speech in Angola, Benedict criticised part of the African Union's charter that gives women a right to an abortion in cases of rape, incest or major health risks to the mother,
He said abortion was not a health issue.
Benedict's Africa visit has been overshadowed by his rejection of condoms in Aids prevention and his reiteration of the church's ban on abortions, even in cases where the mother's life is at risk.
In remarks made on Tuesday, Benedict said that Aids "cannot be overcome through the distribution of condoms, which even aggravates the problems".
(It is ok for third world poor to die from preventable diseases?)
This led to anger amid Aids activists as well as some governments, who said that Benedict's remarks could harm Aids-prevention campaigns.
Angola is one of the countries where the government is carrying out a massive nationwide campaign to promote condoms.
Catholics now have a Nazi Pope. The Catholic cult makes a lot of noise about its special interests, while it hides corruption and a large population of criminal priests. While a Catholic University is free to exist, the United States and its citizens are not ruled by the Nazi Pope or under any obligation to accept the narrow, special interest obsessions of the cult of the so-called Church. Church doctrine as such has no value in education. Education requires and implies by its very definition an openness to all ideas and dialogues so that the real truth, rather than the selected truth of the cult, can be made available to all people. What a strange and divisive community that pounds the tables on an issue like this but has no opinion on the appointment of a Nazi to its highest office or the criminal epidemic of sexual predatory behavior of its so-called priests. Hypocrisy is inherent in every breath of this organization.
Notre Dame University should sever its relationship with the Catholic Church. They can splinter off, property and all, just like some of these conservative Episcopalians have done. Universities with departments in the arts and sciences have no business being beheld to politicized religions, and the last I heard this was the United States of America, not the United States of The Vatican. The sorcerers of The Vatican need to take their egotistically preserved and outmoded mythologies into their own gut to stew on, not inject them into our political and educational mainstreams. If something bad happens, there will be hell to pay, and religion will be the target.
If they start banning people, they could lose their 501c3 status, which means government grants, etc. would be at risk.
I am not a Catholic, but I do support Obama. However, with that said, it does seem odd that a Catholic University would invite someone to speak at their Commencement that has views on abortion, stem cell research, gay marriage, etc. that are diametrically opposed to those views of the Roman Catholic Church. Even the Pope has spoken out against some of Obama's decisions. However, maybe this goes to show that even Catholic Institutions are changing with the times, and are no longer in lock-step with the Vatican.
I didn't vote for Obama, but I don't have many fond memories of Catholics either. After witnessing the brutality of nuns toward children in Milwaukee's Catholic schools back in the day, I just couldn't flay Obama for his "Special Olympics" comment anywhere near as much as a religion that regularly abuses kids.
I hope Notre Dame doesn't stop playing BYU in sports because we baptise for the dead.
As a lifelong catholic it is most discouraging to see how entrenched in ineffective policy making we are. We embrace Christ in words and not in deed. I believe if Catholics were more effective and honorable in embracing those among us who were most susceptible to out of wedlock pregnancies irrespective of the reason, the trueness of our cause would be embraced. Instead we more often than we ought embrace hypocrisy and discrimination that our ranks are diminishing fast. Look at the rise in non-denominational churches and the reasons people give for leaving the catholic church! If we only emulated Christ in deed and gave love to the least among us then we would be better Christians. That is our mandate! Can we be Christlike and be loving and forgiving, not assault people or property in the name of "right to life" and still speak with passion and conviction about the beauty of life? If our dialogues were filled with love and understanding, the very people who feel ostracized and rejected would respect life more. How many of us embrace the doctrine of St. Francis? We have all these saints whom we glorify
and can recite their deeds, yet too many of us never inculcate those deeds in our daily lives! Would Christ recognize us through our deeds or the hurt that we have inflicted on others?
I am appalled at Notre Dame's decision. As a student at the University, I think it is morally wrong to choose a speaker who goes against the Catholic values of the church. The faith community at Notre Dame is one of the main reasons I decided to attend the University. This decision goes against the foundations of the church which clearly state how wrong abortion and gay marriage are. I am thankful that I am not graduating this year and do not have to show support for a man who goes against the teachings of the church, and I pray for all those graduating that they may stay true to their faith.
"You can say whatever you want but do not call my pope "poop" ever again or I will abortion you."
Verrrry Christ-like. Christians of all denominations make me want to vomit.
I wouldn't have a problem if they actually practiced the teachings of their lord. Instead they twist and subvert, molest and cover up, build huge and expensive churches and annoy the poop out of me.
Oh. And your poop is a Nazi and you know it.
Inviting a popular president to give the commencement address is a no-brainer. They are fortunate to get him.
This is why The Church is a joke. The Church and education are antithetical. Kudos to Notre Dame (and BC too btw) for remembering that they are institutions of higher learning and not propaganda tools.
Mary McCurry must not be allowed to breed or operate machinery. Lucid insanity is very dangerous.
The nonsense continues. This is why I am a "fallen Catholic".
I congratulate the Catholic leadership at the University of Notre Dame on this decision. I am a church-going, pro-life Catholic, and also an ND grad who voted for McCain. If Catholic universities could only invite commencement speakers who agreed fully with church doctrine, there would be few options to chose from. Obama is a Christian who preaches that every American should be dealt with respect, honor and dignity, and that sounds alot like the values I was taught at Notre Dame.
Why is there no comment from Bishop D'Arcy, in whose diocese Nore Dame lies? Was he asked about this? Will he attend?
Unfortunately, Notre Dame has gone Spiritual Bankrupt like most all of our Nations University. President.Obama is the admirer of Planned parenthood and biggest booster.
Bob Sutton
Ed wrote: "Obama's accepting the honorary degree brings respect to a religion that has done far more to hurt mankind than help."
The Catholic Church can be criticized for many things, but, personal grievances aside, this statement is objectively wrong. Catholic charities do much good work in the world, more than any other religion or religious organization can claim. Yes, the Catholic Church has, through its actions and polices, caused harm, but this is outweighed by the good works of the church throughout the world.
I'm sure that are thousands of universities out there that would absolutely LOVE to have a current president at their commencement speaker. Not sure why Notre Dame got the pick, but people are going to be disrespectful about it, I say that Obama moves on to a school that actually cares.
you people are pathetic
Un-American and un-Christian describe those Catholics in opposition. Obama is not speaking to further his "anti-Catholic" agenda. He's not representing some interest group or lobby, he is this country's duly elected leader. There are plenty of opportunities to "take a stance" and this isn't it. It's unfortunate this closed-mindedness is typical of Catholicism.
An Obama quote, dealing with a hypothetical unwanted pregnancy of a daughter:
"....if they make a mistake, I don't want them punished with a baby," Obama said.
I'm a grandfather of 7 beautiful children (including 1 adopted), and I thank God for these "punishments" daily. For Notre Dame to "honor" one with such an attitude, repulses me, and this lifelong Notre Dame supporter will support no more should the (once) proud institution not reneg on this invitation.
"Obama should not be allowed to give a speech or given a degree he is for taking life all that we honor and belive in at Norte Dame this is so so wrong he is a horrible President and has no write to speak at such a fine place of learning"
Michael and Debbie, did it take both of you to write such an ignorant excuse for a sentence?
The Catholic Church and its affiliates provide 25% of the anti-retroviral care to AIDS victims in Africa. The Pope says tht behavioral change is the only way to fight AIDS, and he's right. Putting a condom on it doesn't solve the problem, it doesn't create a culture of respect for women, it doesn't protect against malfunctions and it doesn't protect against HPV.
If the Church wants to get political fine, but they should lose their tax except status... they we would so quickly they shut up...
The guy is the next thing to a communist and he has shown he hates Catholics so why even let him come. It is a disgrace. Doesn't the world realize by now that the guy is a faker and is the coming of the anti-Christ.
As a Notre Dame graduate, I applaud the University's decision to invite a truly forward thinking Christian President to address its commencement. Notre Dame has always been in the forefront of social progress, and President Obama has indicated in his first two months in office that, after 8 years of a White House engaging in religious mockery, immoral wars, torture and pandering to the lowest common denominator, the country will once again become the moral leader of the world. In what other direction would Notre Dame turn?
"This choice is a disgrace to the Catholic faith"
Right. Lots of good stuff being done these days by the Catholic Church and especially at Notre Dame. Catholics are the biggest fakers when it comes to morals. BIGGEST!
Notre Dame seems simply to be continuing its pattern of inviting presidents to serve as Commencement speakers. For example, it invited George H.W. Bush to speak, and he chose family values, although his progeny include two massive perpetrators of bank fraud, Jeb and Neil, and a sociopath who not only was a vigorous supporter of the death penalty but who also found last-minute pleas for mercy to be hilarious. (I don't think that Jesus approved of bank fraud, and I'm pretty sure he was not a big fan of the death penalty.) And then it invited George W. Bush, aforesaid sociopath who was appointed, not elected, president.
This isn't a time for hate, but it's an opportune time for an institution that welcomes protest to initiate a protest of its own for life. Notre Dame, Look up the word "honor" in the dictionary, and decide if this is what you feel comfortable doing.
People, in general, in this ultra uptight and politcally correct country need to get a life. Unbelievable. He's asked to speak as a leader and because he is a very good speaker. Leave the religion and political elements out of it. I thought religion was about accepting others?
I recently heard someone on a Catholic media outlet bellowing that "Obama's first priority is killing babies!" As as lifelong Catholic, I was left wondering--where do these wackos come from? I can only assume it's good bait for fundraising since the next sentence was "Send Money!"
to all the haters writing comments, thanks for showing your true colors. universities are about learning and pushing boundaries, not hunkering down and memorizing fables of scripture. as an nd alum, who saw GHWB speak in '92, I think it's a proud tradition to invite the pres to speak, regardless of politics. those who disagree sound like they peddle in fear.
There are some really ignorant comments on this post. Chris, you must be an ignorant bigot to claim that the President is a "faker and is the coming of the anti-Christ". Where in your tiny mind did you get this idea? Catholics need to get real and start policing the pedophile priests that are still in your Church. Notre Dame is slipping in every area from academics to their sorry football team. I agree with most of you Catholics, the President should speak at a really first class University like where he received is Juris Doctorate, Harvard.
Humml....Don't invite the President of the United States, but still after all these years keep a stiff upper lip re Crotia's actions in WWII, just because it "advances the Catholic Faith". So sayath Pope Pius the XII. Perhaps when President Obama appears at Notre Dame, a group from The Entity (as the intelligence espionage unit of the Vatican, formally known as the Holy Alliance, originally formed 1566 by Pius V to re-claim England from the "Heritic Elizabeth I", and turn it over to the nympho and not too bright Mary Queen of Scotts. That one along with the Armada really worked, didn't it? Look out for White Carnations thrown in Obama's direction.
I'm a Domer and while I don't like President Obama's pro-abortion rights stance, I did vote for the man, and I am happy to see him as commencement speaker in May. I do believe that abortion terminates human life and is terribly wrong, I do realize that people of good will can disagree on this subject.
What hypocrisy!! A "religion" that sanctioned and protected pedophiles for DECADES has no moral standing on any topic. When I was a kid, I witnessed nuns whacking kids with rulers for infractions that were merely kids being kids. I sat in the kitchen while our parish priest (a falling down drunk) told my parents that my brother would be excommunicated if he married his Protestant fiancee. It is now and always has been a religion of intolerance and double standards.
Does ND accept tuition from non-Catholics? You bet they do. Probably even from some parents who are physicians and actually perform abortions. Seems they forget their moral indignation when they are taking money. If you are Catholic and think abortion is wrong, then don't have one. It's that simple. Don't, however, impose your views on me or try to interject religion in our government which is for ALL the people. Saying that Obama supports third trimester abortions is absurd and shows the lack of information on the part of the poster.
It is an honor to have a sitting President speak at commencement. ND should be thankful that Obama isn't holding their decades of supporting pedophiles against them.
It follows that Notre Dame must surely examine its toilet paper vendors for their socio-political leanings, correct? If the Charmin comes from a vendor who also supports such things as a woman's right over her body, an adult's right to marry who they choose, then the vendor must get the flush.
And of course, Notre Dame, who relies on all that cash every fall when their football stars smash into one another for glory, must vet each one of them for condom use and all the other "sins" (the religious being experts in such matters).
Notre Dame, the rather large and rich institution, with its deep commitment to "faith" has to do these things, and more. For among Notre Dame's hierarchy of needs, toilet paper and football players rank way up there.
I should think, after reading this, Notre Dame's religious nutcases will be resorting to a wad of dry leaves and dismal revenues until, mercifully, they leave the scene and allow the college to be run by the less-certifiable.
Something we need on a much wider scale.
Now I know why I know why my wife and I left the Catholic Church 35 years ago...If the Church hierarchy is so insecure as to ban from speaking at Notre Dame the most faithful and dedicated family man to win the presidency in decades, it fully deserves to see Catholic ranks continue to shrink. Both my wife and I are happy we brought up our son Unitarian-Universalist, and would recommend that religious persuasion to all parents. Personal responsibility, promotion of caring relationships and acceptance of differences are the modern values worth teaching. Too bad Catholicism continues to dismiss them out of hand!
I am a Notre Dame graduate and would have been thrilled to have President Obama speak at my graduation. Obama and the Vatican may not see eye to eye on every single issue, but he is the President of our country, a compassionate, accomplished and intelligent man, and a compelling orator. He's a great choice for a commencement speaker. Religion shouldn't be about judging and condeming others, it should be about trying to be a good person, loving your neighbors, helping those less fortunate, and being thankful for the blessings you have received.
The pro-abortion President does not belong on Notre Dame property or any other Catholic campus.
Notre Dame's choice of Obama is an excellent one. If nothing else, it
may serve as an act of contrition for having invited George W. to give
the commencement address in 2001.
One of the things that makes Catholicism great is that it holds uncompromising absolute principles and stands by them. Hardly any institutions (or individuals)still do. NDU does disservice to itself and catholicism by indulging this secular humanist.
It's amazing how polarizing this appears to be, and how nasty are some of the comments. When random folks write in, we get no sense of how many or what proportion of people feel this way, or of who the speakers are. I would get more out of these comments if each writer would list some personal data, say his/her age, years of formal education, religion, trade or profession, and ethnic background. Some of these comments I would expect from a spinster aunt forty years ago, or a twenty year old auto thief in 1980, but I'm quite curious what manner of beast makes them now. My father taught at Notre Dame and I have always regarded it as a fine university; I can't fathom who would presume to dictate its actions and carry on like the third reich about educational purity.
I'm an ND alum and I think it is great Obama is going to speak. One of the purposes of going to college is to learn to think for yourself. A major contributor to that desired result is hearing different viewpoints. Quite frankly, the main reason so many religious fanatics cling so tightly to their beliefs is because that is what they were told and it is much easier to believe what someone else tells you than it is to think for yourself. Obama will not speak about the controversial issues mentioned above. He will congratulate the graduates for what they have accomplished and will encourage them to go into the world and do the best they can at whatever they choose. What's wrong with that??????
If Obama is barred from speaking at NU because he supports a woman's right to choose, would the same hold for every political figure who:
- supports the death penalty?
- supported the invasion of Iraq?
All of these things run counter to the church's position. Where's the principle here? Is Notre Dame a university functioning in the open market of idea and thought, or is it another neighborhood church, covering its ears and screeching loudly to shut dissenting voices?
Mike and Debbie, what a laughable post he's a terrible President all of how many days again. Please go back to your cave and don't come out till we say its ok. With shallow minded Americans(or whatever you are) we will never come together. You as your post are a joke.
Well ND does not seem to have a problem with the invitation since they extened it to the President.
So who does? Well it seems like some readers here in Boston, the once home of the independent mind, have a problem.
It's one thing to invite him to speak, but another thing to honor him with an award.
A fetus is a human person, in an early stage of development. There are millions being killed around the world every year through abortion. President Obama wants to increase abortions.
Should a Catholic institution give him an award? No. If Catholics are convinced that abortion kills human beings, how could we award someone who is promoting this? Respect him, yes, but award him an honor, no.
P.S.: Aren't you glad that you and I weren't aborted so we could have this discussion?
Bravo to j0646! At my ND Commencement I had to suffer with George HW Bush who supported the death penalty and war. And does any Catholic care to object to the fact that ND has a large ROTC program where young people are taught to murder? It is sad to see that Catholicism only seems to support life before birth.
I am a 65-year old woman who came from a very religious family and was educated in Catholic schools. I have been away from the Church for many many years now, and a controversy like makes me realize why I am no longer a practicing Catholic. It is heartening however to see how many "thinking" individuals have responded to this msg board.
In the interest of academic freedom and support of the "battle of ideas" President Obama should be permitted to speak at ND. However, he should not be given any awards or recognition. As we are taught, we always love the sinner but condemn the sins. Giving President Obama any awards is akin to awarding his positions and the sins of promoting abortions, improper fetal tissue research using conceived human lives, etc. Giving an award sends an inconsistent message. The Church as God's teaching organization must be clear in its message. The Church must be certain that Catholics and non-Catholics clearly understand God' pro life mesage and that rejection of the pro choice idea is morally mandated by God.
Anne, I am an ND grad (though much older than you....1965). I agree with what I think you are saying: that the Catholic Church is very, very selective in its moral outrage, Remember the Terri Schiavo situation three or four yrs ago? Yet thousands of African children die every year from poisoned water and other preventable diseases, and, well, outrage from the Vatican? Um, not so much!!
A sickening decision by Notre Dame.
Everyone knows it is the Catholic Church that stands alone in defending the principle of the inherent dignity of all human life; it is why so much hatred is directed against it. Realise everyone, if infanticide and feticide are extended - what happens to you when you are vulnerable? A civil society cannot be built on such hideous principles, it brutalises women and in time makes a society callous. When the State gets it so badly wrong - the Church is needed to remind us of our rights against Leviathan.
Everyone, Catholic and non-Catholic has been let down by this decision.
Perhaps word "university" should be removed from "Our Dame" name?
Replaced by "auto de Fe".... a mideval statement of their beliefs, and "Renounce All Faiths, Ye whom Enter Here" ?
Surely Nuestra Dama fanatics, the Spanish Inquisition will soon follow at Nuestra Dama, la No-Apostolica ?
Martin says: "Everyone knows it is the Catholic Church that stands alone in defending the principle of the inherent dignity of all human life; it is why so much hatred is directed against it." Huh??? The Catholic Church stands alone at times, like when it was the biggest protector, over DECADES, of pedophiles over the children on whom they preyed ever exposed to the public. By no objective measure is the church a defender of the " . . . inherent dignity of all human life . . ." It didn't defend the children from lecherous priests and didn't defend the 6 million Jews (the religion of Jesus Christ) being murdered in the camps, and it didn't ever take a position of impact on the starving and tortured around the world. But the church, and it's defenders here, sure care about the non-living. If people believe that "life" begins at conception - a minority view in our country - they are free to do so. Some folks who hold the Catholic view even believe that birth control is "sin". I don't believe either.
And, Martin, speak for yourself and avoid the use of "everyone". I am not let down by NDs decision. I'm a happily "lapsed" Catholic and words like yours make me even happier with my decision. I don't miss listening to hateful and biased words on Sundays. I don't miss priests telling me how to cast my vote for candidates based on abortion views by threatening harm to my "immortal soul". I don't miss being in a community where kids are taught in catechism classes that theirs is the "one true religion". Even my family members who have not officially "lapsed" rarely go to mass anymore, citing both the priest scandal and the out-of-touch, meaningless sermons as their reasons.
I now belong to a community that speaks of love and compassion and inclusion, and makes serious efforts to improve the lives of folks in our community and city. It is spiritual and alive - changing with the needs of members and the world. It's a living thing that is relevant to daily life, reminding us of the Golden Rule. There are no rules or imposition of "mortal sin" for church attendance, it's voluntary. The attendance is high as well as other gatherings throughout the week to address spiritual, social, and charitable issues with programs almost daily giving people the opportunity to "live" their spirituality all week long. It is NOT a religion that ignores a troubled world and forces it's children to memorize it's rules without question, then live by those rules without challenge.
I believe all religions are "true" and have value, but I don't believe they are "sacred". I have discovered that I can take the values and lessons of the church with me without the constant threat of "sin" and damnation. I just am amazed that so many people can sweep the transgressions of the church under the carpet. I'm further amazed that people give even a single penny to support an institution that, through policy and practice, supported pedophiles over their victims. It would be doing so still today if not for the courage of a few that lead to the revelation of the depth and longevity of the problem and law suits. Most of the leaders during those years are still in place. They have the nerve to allow parish priests to interfere with public elections by attacking pro-choice candidates. That's particularly offensive on the national level where those politicians aspire to represent thousands and millions of constituenets of all religions. It's that attitude that once made Catholic candidates a risking choice for many in the pre-JFK years. With all of the problems facing the country and world, people would actually run candidates by an abortion litmus test before voting? Sadly, yes, Perhaps the same few who would demonize our President who represents more than Catholics and, as the president of the many, holds the opinion that it is a woman's right to choose from all options including the lawful medical procedure; an opinion shared by the vast majority of Americans of all religions - including Catholics.
NObama should NOT be at any church, let alone at a Catholic Church.
This man allows new born babies who survived abortion to die. He supports murder. He supports states that support the destruction of Israel.
Kick him OFF campus. No fake degree for this fake Christian. No speach. No Entry.
I am a current senior at the University of Notre Dame (not Notre Dame University) and I ao so excited to have President Obama as our speaker. It is such an honor. For all of you radicals who say that we should renig our invitation you are crazy. Just because a man may have a different point of view in than the Catholic Church, we shouldn't ever listen to him?? That makes no sense at all. And for those of you who say that he shouldn't recieve any awards but be allowed to speak, you are also wrong in my opinion but I do applaud you for at least being somewhat open minded. I don't see what is wrong with giving him an honory degree. ND gives hundreds of non-Catholics degrees every year. And for the person who said that we should treat him kindly but condem his sins, I thought God was the one who was suppose to give judgement and not us sinners ourselves?
For all of you who think that Notre Dame is a bunch of Catholic radicals, for the most part we aren't. True the majority of the student body is Catholic, but the majority of students also realize there is more to the Catholic faith than anti-abortion.
I personally am with the Catholic church on the idea of abortion, but I voted for Obama. Like a few other posters have said, Obama while supporting women's right to choose also cares about other Christian ideals of charity, volunteerism, and serving those less fortunate than you. President Obama is well aware of the Catholic Church's stance on abortion and he will not even bring it up in his speech. He is not an idiot or the anti-Christ as some of you believe. He is an intelligent, well-educated leader of the free world.
President Obama speaking is more of an issue with the radical Catholic groups than it is at the University. To show this, a few students tried to start a facebook group trying to convince the University to renig its invitation and out of the 50 or so people in the group I think 4 were actual graduating seniors. I know that myself and all of my friends are actually excited to have the President of the United States speaking at our graduation.
As a current student at the Our Lady's University, I can honestly say that many of us here are genuinely conflicted about Fr. Jenkins' decision to invite President Obama to speak at commencement this year. On the one hand, we must respect the office of President of the United States, and it is an honor for our beloved campus to host the leader of the free world. Of course, there is a substantial population like myself, who can not and will not tolerate the Notre Dame imprimatur being given to someone whose views on the sanctity of life are so dramatically at odds with the position of the Church and the university. Myself and eight other students, with more co-signing literally by the hour, have submitted a letter to Fr. Jenkins, asking to make a public, vocal statement that the university strongly disapproves with the President's actions. I invite you to read it on my student Web site, http://www.nd.edu/~pbrown6/ObamaVisitLetter.html. God bless all of you who still wish the best for a university that was and hopefully will still remain one of the premier Catholic institutions in America.
Father Jenkins knew that this invitation would spark controversy. He has what he wanted. What I want to know is whether he was listening to the Holy Father during his last visit to the United States when he addressed the University Presidents and other representatives? Maybe Father Jenkins slept through that one...he certainly didn't get the message. If a Catholic University or college doesn't want to accept the Church teaching on such a fundamental issue such a this, well, that's their prerogative. But then I think it is also the prerogative of the Church to renounce that identification, which is exactly what should be done!
BigBome, with all respect, you miss the point. President Obama espouses views and seeks to enforce public policies on core Catholic issues that the Church teaches to be profoundly wrong and which, if engaged in by Catholics, would constitute grave sin. Notre Dame professes to be a Catholic university. No Catholic university should award such a person an honorary degree and feature him as its Commencement speaker. To do so lends a certain moral equivalency to – if not tacit approval of – a clearly anti-Catholic message. Notre Dame’s decision is inconsistent with its core mission as a Catholic educational institution, and makes the Catholic Church’s mission in the world that much more difficult.
I can't believe the ignorance of Catholics who condone giving an honorary degree to this guy. Some of the drivel I read is unbelievable. One idiot came up with 670K killed in IRAQ. Where did you get that loony number? The view? Even if you disagree with the war, anyone with an IQ above a glass a water knows it was intended to protect us and the world from terror.
One of you objected to condemning Obama's sin. We are obligated not to judge sinners but we are OBLIGED by our faith to condemn sin. Learn you faith, and oh by the way you probably won't learn it at ND.
Who are these Catholic haters who claim it is the doctrine of the Church to condone pedophiles. Tell me where is says that in the Cathechism. bad people did bad things. The church never condoned these horrible sins and crimes.
More idiots say the church supported the Nazis. More lies.
Obama supports the murder of unborn children and he should not get an honorary degree.
As a student at Notre Dame, I am embarrassed that many people within Notre Dame are protesting our invitation to President Obama to deliver the commencement address. For the most part, students here are excited to hear the President speak; but admittedly, many people object to it. Objecting to a particular speaker's views on a set of issues (abortion, gay rights, stem cell research) is not a good reason, especially at a university, to ignore what the speaker has to say. It makes me wonder why such close-minded people even attend college. I hope that the rest of the world doesn't think that all people from Notre Dame are opposed to Obama speaking here-- the dissenters are a group of staunch social conservatives that judge people by their stances on a small subset of issues. Their views on those issues are probably unfiltered by independent thought and reflection and instead informed by a blind adherence to Catholic Teaching. That's not to say that one can't arrive at contrary positions to President Obama's through independent reflection, but I'm sure people that actually think about these issues would welcome a discussion about it.
As a priest I am happy to hear that President Obama will address the graduating class at Notre Dame. After all he is no stranger to Catholics. Some of his elementary education was in a Catholic school. As a community organizer he has worked with Catholic communities in Chicago.
As a lawyer it is great to know that Notre Dame will give our president an honorary Doctor of Law degree. He certainly deserves it for his continuing efforts to insure that we once again fully implement and observe the provisions of the Constitution.
As for the one trick pony anti-sex sect of the Church let them exercise their right to scream and yell. On election day 52% of voting Catholics rejected this group. These same Catholics will support Notre Dame's invitation to President Obama.
Hey George McCartin...
You may or may not be a priest....But you certainly are a heretic.
The 52% of pro-Obama Catholics you refer to are heretics as well - The deadwood of the Church.
Say, I have an idea - why don't you start your own church? It has worked so well for the 3000 (and counting) protestant denominations.
Why would you guys want Obama, the anticrist to speak at Notredame ? Unless you want him to explain, all the different ways to " KILL AN UNBORN BABY "
Also get him to explain why he is destorying this country and how he is taking from Whites and giveth to the BLACKS.
I am outraged that President Obama was invited and any Catholic should be. According to Fr Jenkins he is being honored for he's leadership abilities. This is a President who within his first 50 days of office has reversed and inacted legislation that is in direct conflict with the core tenates of our Church. To honor him with an honorary law degree is to honor the laws he reversed or enacted against the innocent babies and yes I say babies because the Catholic church considered life to begin at conception. Fr Jenkins has responded in Catholic forums that it is because of Obama's anti-life stand that it's important to have him speak - that it would be the beginning of a dialog. What bunk!!! A commencement speaker doesn't have dialog! If he was invited to a townhall setting I would have no objection. That type of setting allows for different view points to be discussed. As the leader of our church has said himsef life trump everything else!!!! We DO NOT give honorary degrees in law from CATHOLIC instutions to people who create laws to murder innocent babies period!!!
Bishop D'Arcy has stated that he will not attend commencement. Good for him.
Many catholics who voted for Obama did not know his radical stances
on issues such as partial birth abortion, assisted suicide or embryonic
stem cell research. Now that it is in the media the outrage is growing!
I know its up to people to know before you vote..but the main stream media covered up many of Obama's very liberal and radical views. I think it would be wise to rescind the invitation. Obama opposes all the catholic church teachings
Obama is the most anti-catholic President we have ever elected.
Politicians do not keep Catholic universities running, Catholic donors do.
I advise any Catholics that donate to this universtity to speak with their dollars...or lack thereof.
Notre Dame should not have President Obama speak. The university while trying to please the current administration, breaks their committment to faith in Catholic beliefs and the founders of Notre Dame.
I'm an alumnus of Notre Dame class of 1990.
I'm a supporter of the University including Sorin Society which is composed of the highest donors to the University of Notre Dame.
I'm a nephrologist (kidney doctor dealing with life/death everyday).
I'm highly disappointed in the University's appointment of Obama to give the commencement address.
When someone asked me where I went to college, I have always been proud to say "I went to the University of Notre Dame" . I have always perceived my Alma Mater as an institution with the highest standards. I am quite ashamed at the University's decision.
This does not send a good pro-life message to current students, future students of Notre Dame, as well as students of other Christian/Catholic universities.
I regrettably have immediately withdrawn my funding toward the University of Notre Dame.
Chris Westervelt
Hattiesburg MS
It's shameful that the university would even consider someone to place such an honor on ... a man who is openly pro-choice, has made it our country's policy to fund millions of dollars' worth of abortions in Mexico, and has no regard for the innocent unborn.