Round one: Obama, McCain clash on economy, foreign policy
By Scott Helman and Susan Milligan, Globe Staff
Senators John McCain and Barack Obama, meeting on a debate stage for the first time last night, clashed over the root causes of the crisis gripping the nation's financial system, with McCain blaming greed and incompetent government oversight and Obama trying to pin the meltdown on a laissez-faire approach to the private sector that McCain has long championed.
Facing each other from wooden podiums on a stark stage at the University of Mississippi, McCain and Obama sought to demonstrate economic leadership to a country that badly wants it with the markets shaky, financial giants going under nearly every day, and Washington haggling over an emergency $700 billion bailout plan to stave off a deep recession.
In their 90-minute, free-wheeling encounter, they also engaged sharply over who had shown the best judgment on the Iraq war and when it was appropriate to meet with leaders of rogue nations. McCain sought to tag Obama as naive on foreign affairs, but Obama gave as good as he got, accusing McCain of focusing myopically on Iraq and losing sight of the real culprit in the war on terror -- Al Qaeda.
Though the debate was supposed to focus mainly on foreign policy, Obama and McCain spent more than a half hour at the outset exchanging criticism of each other’s records and economic plans for the country.
Obama said the current crisis was "the final verdict on eight years of failed economic policies," linking McCain with what he said was a Republican philosophy that the "market can always solve everything and that the less regulation we have the better off we're going to be."
"We're also going to have to look at, how is it that we shredded so many regulations?" Obama said, though the last Democratic president, Bill Clinton, signed some of the deregulation measures.
McCain, seeking to avoid that stain, blamed government regulators, whom he said were asleep at the switch, and he again expressed a populist fury at Wall Street executives.
"Somehow in Washington today, and I'm afraid on Wall Street, greed is rewarded, excess is rewarded, and corruption — or the failure to carry out our responsibilities — is rewarded," he said.
Given the cost of the bailout, McCain floated the idea of freezing government spending except on defense, veterans, and a few other "vital" programs he did not specify.
Obama opposed a general spending freeze, saying that some programs, such early childhood education, are worthy investments. "The problem with a spending freeze is you're using a hatchet where you need a scalpel," Obama said.
McCain went after Obama for requesting hundreds of millions of dollars in congressional earmarks, a practice McCain has long fought against. "That kind of thing is not the way to rein in runaway spending in Washington, D.C.," McCain said.
But Obama said it was ‘‘hard to swallow’’ McCain’s complaints about spending when the GOP had been in power the last eight years and had grown the national debt by several trillion dollars.
"John, it’s been your president -- who you said you agree with 90 percent of the time -- who presided over this increase in spending, this orgy of spending, and enormous deficits,’’ the Democrat said.
The highly anticipated debate, their first head-to-head clash of the general election, was nearly eclipsed by the wrangling over the Bush administration’s controversial bailout bill, which has transfixed Washington. Until late yesterday morning, it was unclear whether the debate would even happen.
McCain announced Wednesday afternoon that he would suspend his campaign and devote himself to the bailout negotiations, and that he wanted the debate postponed "until we have taken action to address this crisis." But Obama rejected his offer to put the debate off, and McCain said yesterday that he would fly to Mississippi in light of what his campaign called "significant progress toward a bipartisan agreement."
Last night’s debate — 48 years to the day when John F. Kennedy and Richard M. Nixon squared off in the first-ever televised debate — was the first of three between Obama and McCain scheduled over the next three weeks. They are set to meet for a town hall-style forum at Belmont University in Nashville on Oct. 7, and for a debate on domestic issues at Hofstra University in Hempstead, N.Y., on Oct. 15. The vice presidential candidates, Senator Joe Biden of Delaware and Governor Sarah Palin of Alaska, are slated to debate just once, on Thursday at Washington University in St. Louis.
The latter two-thirds of last night's debate focused on foreign policy.
On Iraq, Obama offered a harsh critique of McCain’s original championing of the war, which Obama opposed from the start. "When the war started, you said it was going to be quick and easy," he said. "You said we knew where the weapons of mass destruction were. You were wrong. You said that we were going to be greeted as liberators. You were wrong. You said that there was no history of violence between Shia and Sunni, and you were wrong."
By focusing nearly all its energy on the war in Iraq, Obama said, the United States had left itself less safe.
"In the meantime, [Osama] bin Laden is still out there," Obama said. "He is not captured. He is not killed. Al Qaeda is resurgent."
McCain said the next president wouldn’t have to deal with the genesis of the war, but instead ‘‘how we leave, when we leave, and what we leave behind.’’
He also accused Obama of refusing to acknowledge the success of the surge of 30,000 additional troops last year, even likening what he called Obama's "stubbornness" to President Bush.
"We need more flexibility in a president of the United States than that," McCain said. Obama laughed incredulously.
The candidates exchanged sharp jabs over Obama's expressed willingness to meet with rogue leaders without preconditions. Obama stood by his position, saying that by refusing to meet with the leaders of Iran and North Korea, the Bush administration had only encouraged them further down the path of nuclear proliferation.
McCain attacked Obama using the example of Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad,cq who has called Israel a "stinking corpse."
"You legitimize those comments," McCain said. "This is dangerous. It isn't just naive. It's dangerous."
Polls have consistently shown that voters trust McCain, 72, more to handle issues of national security. He said at another point, "I honestly don't believe that Senator Obama has the knowledge or experience" to serve as commander-in-chief.
McCain cited as an example Obama's position that the US should strike terrorist leaders in Pakistan unilaterally if Pakistan were unable or unwilling to do so. "You don't do that," McCain said. "You don't say it out loud."
But Obama turned the critique back on McCain by taking a shot at his temperament, saying, "Coming from you, who have in the past threatened extinction for North Korea and sung songs about bombing Iran, I don't know how credible that is."
Obama, 47, argued that, despite his mere 3 1/2 years in Washington, he has shown the right judgment to be commander-in-chief.
Seeking to connect emotionally with viewers in what may turn out to be the most-watched presidential debate in history, both candidates showed off memorial bracelets given to them by family members of fallen servicemen. But the two bracelets neatly represent their different positions on the war in Iraq.
McCain, who wears a bracelet given him by the mother of Matthew Stanley, a 22-year-old from Wolfeboro, N.H., killed near Baghdad in December 2006, recalled that she told him this: "Promise me one thing, that you'll do everything in your power to make sure that my son's death was not in vain.''
Obama said he had a bracelet of his own, given to him by a distraught mother in Green Bay, Wisc. She had a different message.
"She asked me, can you please make sure another mother is not going through what I'm going through?''
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I was surprised how the debate's undertone was stability/experience vs. change/vision. It was a bit like watching my father and brother go at it. How does someone choose between his Dad (who has simply lived life longer and tends to be wiser) or his brother (who is his peer and wants an America for his generation too!)? I kind of wished "Mom" (aka Hillary) jumped in during the debate and declared that the world needs both stability and change!!
They both did ok....not great, just ok - Can't wait for the Joe Biden Parah Salin
Just LOOK around YOU !
Piss-Poor State-Craft...
A Bungled Economy...
Is this the America you remember growing up?
So where does the Buck Stop NOW ?
Why would America REWARD complete Republican failure ?
We wont.
While neither candidate gave any real clear, straight-forward answers, Senator McCain did provide the most substance regarding each issue. His experience and knowledge really imbued his answers tonight. I would say each candidate preformed well; however, I would have to say that McCain faired the best.
We can not afford to have Obama
Sen. McCain is to the right of Mr.Bush. His demeanor was frightening and I'm afraid instead of disengaging from Iraq, he would get us into another war with Iran. He looked ashen at the end with his eyes wide open and full of anger. He seems to hate Sen. Obama and has no respect for him. He never looked once at Sen. Obama and failed to make a case for the Trickle Down Economic Policy he subscribes to and which has got us into this current mess. God save us if he is electe president.
I'll grant McCain that he is a nasty little in-fighter that was able to yank Barrack's chain more than once. Barrack would do well to let those jabs just slide on by. They are beneath him, beneath the electorate, and beneath the next President of the United States.
Pakistan was not a failed state when Gen. Musharraf staged a military coup.
McCain definitely won this one. He got under Obama's skin and had Obama focusing on the aspects of the issue he brought up. When you fight a battle on the ground of your own choosing, you do tend to win.
I predicted that Obama is not ready to be President base on tonights debate.He seems losts all throughout the debate and on the defence most of the time.Even the economic issue Mccain came on strong and sincere to fix it if he is lucky enough to be elect President.
McCain has sold his sole for this election. He use to have such integrity, now he is just a Carl Rowe shell.
Four winners tonight. The moderator was excellent. Senators McCain and Obama were strong. The forth winner would be us -- America. We needed a good night this week. They gave us one.
McCain showed and inflexibility concerning Iraq and would keep the troops there 'til we win.
Such a policy will continue to sap the economic strength and therefore the military strength of the US; a point Obama made.
Obama seemed more practical and less driven by ideology.
The debate showed clearly rhe difference beyween the two candidates.
One wa salmost haughty and telling his opponent that he does not understand, Obamah was always courteous, even when disagreeing with McCain. He did it almost 12 times.
Senator Obama's very cerebral argument for what is in the best interest of the American people was far superior to Senator McCain's very visceral 'war' mongering, 'fear' mongering and 'hate mongering approach.
Considering Senator McCain's passion for Israel, he should be running for prime minister of Israel to replace Olmert who just resigned because of corruption probes. McCain seems to have Israel's best interest at heart, not America's!
Iran has not attacked another country in hundreds of years, unlike Israel. McCain want to Bomb, Bomb, Bomb Iran, Podhorets wrote, "The Case for Bombing Iran." Hillary want to obliterate Iran (70 million people) and many neocons have advocated for America to bomb Iran.
Yet they misrepresent what Ahmadinejad stated about Israel! Have they no sham? At long last have they no decency?
Chagrined
Having served over 28 years in the US Air Force, including my time in Vietnam, I have to agree with the mother in Green Bay, Wisc. If McCain is elected we can count on spending many more years in Iraq. We can no longer afford to be the world's policeman. We need to bring most of our sons and daughters home. Too many lives have already been ruined with little to show for it. Too many billions of our dollars have been wasted because McCain and Bush lied to us. Enough is enough. We can't just get out but at least we could cut back and transfer the troups to Afganistan that need to go there.
Try round one McCain. Obama was almost always on the defensive. McCain wiped the floor with Obama on foreign policy and experience. There was a 10 minute (boring) lull arguing about conditions of diplomacy with Iran. Other then that Obama was either agreeing with McCain or playing catch up. McCain was comfortable and in control. Obama is a great speaker, but that's were it ends. First debate goes to McCain.
Obama did a great job of presenting the facts in a clear and concise way, while stating what he would do to change the state of both our economy and our foreign policies. McCain on the other hand, rambled down history lane, was weak, and presented a picture of the same old, same old.
"Obama gave as good as he got, ..." is not reportage, but is instead a value judgment for your readers to make.
"Obama said it was 'hard to swallow' McCain's complaints about spending when the GOP had been in power the last eight years and had grown the national debt by several trillion dollars." Could we have some perspective as to contrapuntal facts? During almost all of the first two years of this Administration, Democrats controlled the Senate. During the latter half of this term, Democrats have controlled both Houses. On top of that, because of the nature of the Senate, a political party, to exercise actual control, must have 60 votes. I looked it up, and the Republicans haven't had 60 votes in the Senate in my lifetime, and I qualify for Senior's discounts.
In omitting such relevant facts, which may legitimately go to create or strengthen perceptions as to Senator Obama's naivete, you do your readers a disservice. When you tell them your opinion, however, you go from journalistic inadequacy to egregious malpractice. Please stop.
I suppose the question most voters must ask is, "Do we want to take this American Experiment to the failed Socialist plan? Socialism has never worked and tribalism only effective in a very small local area. People are enthusicastic to elect a black to be president because he is black, only. People from all lands want to be Americans at any cost not the other way around. Why would parents want their children to inherit the regimes of Iran, North Korea, or Somalia just to have a goverment check in their mailbox. The "me" society has never known hardship so I guess the American made elite can take charge of the dumb asses that are willing to be slaves and commit their children to the same. Ask the people in those places if life is good! I feel sorry for the Socialist supporters. They will inherit the wind.
McCain comes off as mean and small, he never even looked at Obama. We need a leader that is level headed and thoughtful. McCain had no answers, he talked in circles and sometimes made no sense. Often he just retold old stories we have all already heard. We get it, you have been around a long time and have a lot of stories to tell. We need a leader who thinks about the world as a whole and looks beyond constant conflict. McCain can only see enemies, he is haunted by his own experience. We need a new perspective. McCain is dangerous.
The most powerful line of the night was during the exchange in which McCain attempted to hammer Obama on the surge in Iraq. Obama, with a wry smile, commented that McCain seems to think the war started in 2007 and not 2003. He then went on to list instance after instance after instance where McCain, like Bush, had been dead wrong in his assessment of the Iraq war in the four years before the surge, then pointed out that the war in Afghanistan against the people who actually did attack the US on 9-11 was in danger of failing after years of neglect. McCain tried to paint the debate on foreign policy as an issue of experience. Obama succeeded in making it an issue of judgment.
Did anyone notice John McCain didn't look at Obama ever, If someone can't look at me ever then I think they have a issues, maybe some integrity issues?
What do nothing candidates. That is the best the demonuts and repugnuts can do? Come on...We need leaders not politicians.
Excuse me Obama, but Bush is your President to! Unless like your wife you swear legions to some other country.
McCain, who wears a bracelet..."Promise me one thing, that you'll do everything in your power to make sure that my son's death was not in vain.''
Obama said he had a bracelet of his own..."She asked me, can you please make sure another mother is not going through what I'm going through?''
Selfless vs. Selfish - a recurring theme when comparing Republicans and Democrats.
Experience matters most BUT using the experience in wrong decisions is dangerous too. So far, both parties have done well. No one really edged another. They are still vague on financial issues and the war issue. No clear solution but a lot of planning and suggestion (to me).
Right now, i stand neutral. I still need to see more "juice" in what they're talking about to convince me to vote to the next Pres of the USA, Maybe the 2nd debate might let me pick one.
Obama is a gentleman, a scholar and came from nothing economically. His reality is the American Dream. McCain is so out of touch with the average American's dream it is rediculous!!! I would much rather have a person who is compassionate and gentle and the first in his class at Harvard Business Law School who specialized in
Constitutional Law and came from no economic means than a "War"
hero who was shot down over Vietnam (because of his own fault) and
uses that to prove he should be president and was 894 out of 899 in his class at Indianapolis. Philosophically John McMcain is a hot headed, unhappy person who doesn't always think clearly. I don't fault his patriotism but I don't respect his true voting on Veterans and he is one. It is so clear to me!!
While the king pins are wrestling around in the ring, deploring each other's baggage, and chest butting each other, the audience (if they really think they have one) is sorry for having paid the ticket price to attend this charade.
What more can plain people expect and how incredulous can those in power be to all for whom they believe they represent? They are both loosers. I want my ticket money back. I'll buy a pint of gasoline with it!
Obama's a bit naive on the subject of the war and its origins. It's all but written across the front of the White House that the "War On Terror" was about oil. "9/11" was monstrous and uglier than I care to mull over in detail. But it wasn't terrorism; terrorists claim their acts.
..and not in vhs tapes left in caves featuring home video of presidential family friends going, "Yeah, that's right! I did it. .....9/11, I mean!"
But Obama's clearly the more cerebral of the two. Sometimes i can SEE McCain's I.Q. dropping one frightening point at a time. When he doesn't look as though he were stupid, he looks like a con artist. It bothers me.
McCain spanked Obama like a red haired step child.
Obama even knows McCain will be our next POTUS.
1. Protect the Nation
2. Shore up our economy.
3. Bring our Troops home, safe and victorious.
John McCains Top 5 Best quotes:
1. The next president of the United States is not going to
have to address the issue as to whether we went into Iraq
or not. The next president of the United States is going to
have to decide how we leave, when we leave, and what we
leave behind. That's the decision of the next president of
the United States.
2. I'm not going to set the White House visitors schedule
before I'm president of the United States.
I don't even have a seal yet.
3. I looked into Mr. Putin's eyes, and I saw three letters,
a "K," a "G," and a "B."
4. I don't think I need any on-the-job training.
I'm ready to go at it right now.
5. I guarantee you, as president of the United States,
I know how to heal the wounds of war, I know how to
deal with our adversaries, and I know how to deal with
our friends.
Mr Obama's Best Quote:
1. I got a bracelette too!!
Obama repeatedly showed better judgment.
Putting ones stick where ones mouth should be is dangerous, because it will only encourage others to shove it right down ones throat. Bush has already set the ball rolling for a WW3. The question is, will the next US president stop the ball or just let it roll on?
McCain's frequently condescending claims that Obama is "naive" and "doesn't understand" reminded me of Gore's condescending tisks and loud exhales.
What McCain doesn't understand is we don't want someone making mistakes like Iraq to begin with.
They are the same, the debates are just a show to make us think that they are different.
They are all thieves and they will take, take, take, take...........as long as we let them, wake up my fellow lazy, complacent, big screen watching, SUV driving, hand-out receiving American slobs. We are getting screwed if we allow them to pass this as is!
We get the government we deserve and we give them Carte Blanche. The administration is only a figure head...the real thieves are the life long members of our Congress and Senate
Lets talk about the connection of Senator Obama and
Senator McCain to former US Congressional Democratic 2004
candidate Jeff Bootstraps Fisher whose proof of election fraud is now being talked about in the movie by HBO called RECOUNT y even won an EMMY.
In the movie RECOUNT HBO mentions ChoicePoint Software et BayPoint School.
So lets see what happens when you take that information e insert Jeff Fisher with Obama und McCain when doing an internet search.
Last night I was at Princeton University handing out over 1000 flyers that has Al Gore y I, Jeff Fisher on it et creating World Peace. Very soon our other partner (Richard Branson) will be arriving in Boston (October 2008) Quincy Market shopping e talking with WE THE PEOPLE. RON PAUL und Dennis Kucinich y Mike Gravel et even Cynthia Ann McKinney will be there as well. They are all part of the Dream Team.
Jeff Fisher posting from Philadelphia now.
I will be in Harrisburg Sunday afternoon.
I have met someone who wants to run for Governor (Democrat) to replace Governor Edward Rendell.
They are Hebrew and are about Peace and are in support of informing others how horrible AIPAC is as well.
So Senator McCain. How much more blood from young men and women are you willing to pour into the sand to keep the death of Matthew Stanley from being 'in vain'. How many more have to die for that? And then when you're on to Iran because they have oil too?
Yet, Afghanistan, the heart of the matter is no big deal to you.
I think Stanley's death would be given more meaning if we actually "got" bin Laden and showed terrorists that they would be hunted down, not allowed to operate for many years so that our government can use them as an excuse to invade oil rich nations.
Obama is so unsure of himself. Only the truly far left and socialists thought he beat McCain.
you cannot trust him. put lipstick on a muslim, it; still a muslim.
McCain always likes to say he is amicable and knows how to work accross party lines. Well Friday night's debate, McCain's behavior to a fellow senator by not looking at him and looking through him, if that, was very unprofessional and made McCain look very negative and like a man who cannot just get along with a fellow senator but those in leadership roles in other countries if they disagree with Senator McCain. That is not a man of goodwill!
I'm afraid that - regardless of I may feel about the issues or who 'won' the debate - John McCain showed me why he should NOT be president.
While we may disagree with Obama, there is no excuse for rudeness to a man many Americans do support. How can a man bring our country together if he cannot be civil to his rival? John McCain refused to even glance at Obama let alone address him directly.
When you add to this the historic importance of this event - that 40 years ago 2 people were killed in riots to keep African Americans from attending the University where we now had a debate with the first major party African American nominee - it was important for the white candidate to acknowledge history. Mr. McCain not only didn't acknowledge this historic occasion, he didn't acknowledge the presence of his African-American rival at ALL. When asked by the moderator to address his opponent directly his response was "Do you think I can't hear him?!"
This is not only RUDE, it smacks of blatant racism.
I, personally, was embarrassed and ashamed of McCain's behavior.
McCain (as pointed out this weekend by Obama) has no inkling of what Joe Average is going through. McCain never once has addressed the 6.2% unemployed (and rising) or the 600,000 that have lost their jobs since January of this year. McCain insists that "The Economy is Fundamentally Strong" and his chief financial guru... Phil Gramm, the guy whose 1999 deregulation bill helped melt down Enron and now Wall Street? Well Gramm thinks the American people are a bunch of whiners when it comes to fiscal issues, and McCain wants him for his Secretary of the Treasury? McCain never said in the debate (or elsewhere) that he would cut out the billions of tax credits for the big oil companies either. And on top of that he picked the star of "Clueless in Alaska" as his running mate.
I found Senator Obama the more presidential and intelegent. Senator McCain seems stuck in the past and frankly asleep when it came to the financial aspects of the debate. Obama did more than hold his own and McCain came off as a stuck in the mud, rigided mule refusing to even debate Obama one vrs one. When you don't once directly engage your opponent in a debate when you are allowed to is bad. If McCain can not speak to his American opponent what does that say about his foriegn policies where he to become President